Jyhad to V:TES changes

Does anyone have a comprehensive list of the changes to the rulebook (in function, not just in wording) from the Jyhad rulebook to the current rulebook? For example, "if a predator is ousted the same turn that his or her prey is, the predator gets the ante and victory point..." (p.40) Or, "Encounter Vampire in Torpor" listed as an action type. (p.22) ____________ If nobody has such a list, then I shall try to compile one. --Brian

firstco...@aol.com (Brian) wrote: > Does anyone have a comprehensive list of the changes to the rulebook > (in function, not just in wording) from the Jyhad rulebook to the > current rulebook? > > For example, "if a predator is ousted the same turn that his or her > prey is, the predator gets the ante and victory point..." (p.40) That's 18.1 in Jyhad, 10 in 1995 V:TES. No change. > Or, "Encounter Vampire in Torpor" listed as an action type. (p.22) Right: http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=44i826%24967%40darkstar.UCSC.EDU > ____________ > > If nobody has such a list, then I shall try to compile one. Functional changes (from Jyhad to "advanced" 1995 VTES): Note: these are just the changes I can think of. This is (probably) not a comprehensive list. 1) Vote pushing made explicit (Jyhad rules could be read in another way). 2) Aggravated damage 3) Allowing steal blood effects to burn a vampire (oversight in the advanced rules that was quickly errataed). 4) Equipment, Retainer, and Ally cards were identified as Action cards in Jyhad, but not in 1995 VTES 5) Some parts of the 1995 rules tried to effect the (D) symbol errata, but the success of the new text in accomplishing the goal is debatable. 6) Vampires at capacity can't hunt in 1995 VTES 7) Paralyze was ostensibly dropped (but included in section 22). 8) 1995 VTES: Retainers can only be targetted when the range is long, and may now be damaged by opposing retainers as well. 9) 1995: MooTs only cost a MPA, not your whole master phase. 10) 1995: Action modifiers are only playable on one's own turn 11) 1995: Combat ends ends combat when played (before strike resolution) 12) 1995: No blood is burnt for a blocked "leave torpor" action 13) 1995: Omitted the "each round starts at close" rule (quickly errataed) 14) 1995: The methuselah calling a vote automatically received one vote (even if no PA card was used) 15) 1995: Some players claimed that the 1995 rules didn't delay the replacement of action modifiers and reaction cards until after the political action 16) Jyhad: Stolen blood was kept until the end of the *turn*, even in excess of capacity. 17) Jyhad: The minion phase is optional 18) 1995: Inadventently prohibited self-contesting (and was quickly errataed) -- L. Scott Johnson (sjoh...@math.sc.edu) http://www.math.sc.edu/~sjohnson

"L. Scott Johnson" <sjoh...@math.sc.edu> wrote in message news:ae2501$385lb$1...@ID-99714.news.dfncis.de... > firstco...@aol.com (Brian) wrote: > > Does anyone have a comprehensive list of the changes to the rulebook > > (in function, not just in wording) from the Jyhad rulebook to the > > current rulebook? > > > > For example, "if a predator is ousted the same turn that his or her > > prey is, the predator gets the ante and victory point..." (p.40) > > That's 18.1 in Jyhad, 10 in 1995 V:TES. No change. I think he meant "from Jyhad rulebook to current rulebook" rather than "to 1995 VTES rulebook". But you're probably right that it didn't change with the VTES printing (I don't have a 1995 rulebook in front of me). It's hard to say if they ever meant to say "same turn" in the Jyhad rulebook; "same time" makes a lot more sense, since in 18.1 it also said "when your prey is ousted you earn six blood points from the blood bank" and adhering to the "same-turn" rule might mean you'd have to retroactively return that six pool and be ousted instead. > > If nobody has such a list, then I shall try to compile one. > > Functional changes (from Jyhad to "advanced" 1995 VTES): > Note: these are just the changes I can think of. This is (probably) > not a comprehensive list. A rulebook-by-rulebook list (Jyhad to VTES to Sabbat rulesheet to Sabbat War rulebook to Final Nights rulebook to (eventually) Camarilla rulebook) would be interesting, but I'm not sure if that's what he meant to propose? He might've been interested just in Jyhad vs current-rulebook changes. Josh bookish

> I think he meant "from Jyhad rulebook to current rulebook" Yes, I did. > rather than "to 1995 VTES rulebook". But you're probably > right that it didn't change with the VTES printing (I don't > have a 1995 rulebook in front of me). > > It's hard to say if they ever meant to say "same turn" in > the Jyhad rulebook; "same time" makes a lot more sense, > since in 18.1 it also said "when your prey is ousted you > earn six blood points from the blood bank" and adhering > to the "same-turn" rule might mean you'd have to > retroactively return that six pool and be ousted instead. I think it makes sense as written in Jyhad. I think it meant: "If a predator is ousted the same turn that his or her prey is, the predator gets the ante and victory point..." Translation: You can only get 1 vp per turn. Other players will collect if you try. "...but /does not get the six blood points/." Translation: When you're out, you're out. Your prey dying this turn will NOT put you back in the game. Although, I'm not sure that rule would have made sense with all the table-switching that's possible--A ousts B, then switches C and E, and ousts E. Better the way it is now. > > > If nobody has such a list, then I shall try to compile one. > > > > Functional changes (from Jyhad to "advanced" 1995 VTES): > > Note: these are just the changes I can think of. This is (probably) > > not a comprehensive list. > > A rulebook-by-rulebook list (Jyhad to VTES to Sabbat > rulesheet to Sabbat War rulebook to Final Nights rulebook > to (eventually) Camarilla rulebook) would be interesting, > but I'm not sure if that's what he meant to propose? He > might've been interested just in Jyhad vs current-rulebook > changes. Exactly. Around here, we get people playing with old rules sometimes. Bob still says things like "Stanislava will attempt to encounter Iliana in torpor", Logan still doesn't bleed out prey and grandprey in the same turn. And I'm sure we've experienced all kinds of different interpretations on when Theft of Vitae drains off from that "can stolen blood be used to heal damage?" thing. I myself never knew I could hit a retainer with it, since the last time I checked was Jyhad rules (which only allowed ranged _damage_ to hit retainers). Pedantic, maybe, but I'm curious. --Brian