Asking on behalf:
> Khin aye:
> >
> > While your predator controls more ready minions than you, you get +1 hand size.
> >
> If the predator brings out an anarch convert and burns it for the convert ability, do i draw a card and immediately discard for hand size adjustments?
>
> Hackerspace sees it in play, so i am inclined to say that Khin does as well, however briefly.
>
Khin Aye
[SV5:PPower1]
Cardtype: Vampire
Clan: Ventrue
Path: Power and the Inner Voice
Group: 6
Capacity: 7
Discipline: dom for POT PRE
Sabbat priscus: While your predator controls more ready minions than you, you get +1 hand size.
Artist: Matheus Calza
Anarch Convert
[TR:U, Anthology:2, Promo-20210310]
Cardtype: Vampire
Clan: Caitiff
Group: ANY
Capacity: 1
Discipline: -none-
Anarch: As the convert enters play, you can remove him from the game to make a non-titled vampire you control Anarch and either gain 1 pool or draw 1 card from your crypt.
Artist: Lawrence Snelly
Suaku
Inceptor Asian Continental Championship
興っ
www.youtube.com/SuakuOz
> the1andonlime wrote:
> Asking on behalf:
>
> > Khin aye:
> > >
> > > While your predator controls more ready minions than you, you get +1 hand size.
> > >
> > >
> >
> > If the predator brings out an anarch convert and burns it for the convert ability, do i draw a card and immediately discard for hand size adjustments?
> >
> > Hackerspace sees it in play, so i am inclined to say that Khin does as well, however briefly.
> >
> Khin Aye
>
> [SV5:PPower1]
> Cardtype: Vampire
> Clan: Ventrue
> Path: Power and the Inner Voice
> Group: 6
> Capacity: 7
> Discipline: dom for POT PRE
> Sabbat priscus: While your predator controls more ready minions than you, you get +1 hand size.
> Artist: Matheus Calza
>
> Anarch Convert
>
> [TR:U, Anthology:2, Promo-20210310]
> Cardtype: Vampire
> Clan: Caitiff
> Group: ANY
> Capacity: 1
> Discipline: -none-
> Anarch: As the convert enters play, you can remove him from the game to make a non-titled vampire you control Anarch and either gain 1 pool or draw 1 card from your crypt.
> Artist: Lawrence Snelly
>
It doesn't, the same way a contested Elder Library doesn't give you a "brief" +1 hand size.
Prince of Paris, France
Ratings Coordinator, Rules Director
> KoRneeshon wrote:
> Hi Ankha, care to elaborate on difference between Khin not being triggered and mentioned Hackerspace being triggered by AC short appearance?
>
Khin doesn’t "trigger". He has a continuous effect based on the number of minions in play.
AC "enters play" effect is a "as played" effect (that’s how crypt cards that are "played" are worded.)
As it is played, it removes itself to do something, so it's never considered to be in play even though it is played, not even for a brief moment.
Timing-wise, this is similar to a contested Elder Library that wouldn't give you +1 hand size, even briefly.
Prince of Paris, France
Ratings Coordinator, Rules Director
OK, makes sense for Khin, but then Hackerspace text says:
This card comes into play with 1 counter for each Anarch you control. After an Anarch comes into play under your control, or after a vampire you control becomes Anarch, add 1 counter to this card. An Anarch you control can use these counters to pay some or all of the blood or pool cost of an equipment they equip.
If AC still triggers HS, it means AC has to come into play for a moment? Otherwise HS should be worded "After an Anarch is played (...)"?
> KoRneeshon wrote:
> OK, makes sense for Khin, but then Hackerspace text says:
>
> This card comes into play with 1 counter for each Anarch you control. After an Anarch comes into play under your control, or after a vampire you control becomes Anarch, add 1 counter to this card. An Anarch you control can use these counters to pay some or all of the blood or pool cost of an equipment they equip.
>
> If AC still triggers HS, it means AC has to come into play for a moment? Otherwise HS should be worded "After an Anarch is played (...)"?
>
> Ankha wrote:
> AC "enters play" effect is a "as played" effect (that’s how crypt cards that are "played" are worded.)
>
Maybe there's room for improvement, but that's how it is.
Prince of Paris, France
Ratings Coordinator, Rules Director
Hackerspace also says "...or after a vampire you control becomes anarch."
Isn't this what triggers Hackerspace in the convert-converts-someone case? Or does Hackerspace trigger twice?
I would personally recommend changing anarch converts text to say:
"As the convert enters play, instead you can remove him from the game to..."
I take notes from how magic handles so called "replacement effects" by using the word "instead". In other words, Event A triggers the ability but the card immediately retcons the situation to say that event B happens instead. So event A never happened even though it triggered the ability. I think Anarch convert would be a perfect candidate for such a wording.
Smoking craters tell no tales.
—Tex talks Battletech
> Bloodartist wrote:
> Hackerspace also says "...or after a vampire you control becomes anarch."
> Isn't this what triggers Hackerspace in the convert-converts-someone case? Or does Hackerspace trigger twice? ...
>
Twice for convert. There's over 20 pages of discussions over the years on this forum related to enters play and so forth but this one boils the original LSJ ruling and Hackerspace to one.
www.vekn.net/forum/rules-questions/74696-hackerspace-question?start=0#75351
Trust in Jan Pieterzoon.