Shambling Hordes
Zombie 3 life, 0 bleed, 0 strength
When Shambling Hordes enters play, remove an ally or vampire in your ash heap from the game or burn Shambling Hordes. Shambling Hordes gets +1 strength for each life counter it has..... and can enter combat with a ready minion as a direct action.
If you were to play Shambling Hordes for 3 blood, giving it 3 life and 3 strength, but do not have an ally or vampire in your ash heap to remove from game, Shambling Hordes is burned. Can you then play Pressing Flesh?
Pressing Flesh
+1 stealth action
Choose an ally that was burned from play. Move that ally from the ash heap to your ready region with this card and life equal to its starting life. This ally is a zombie instead of what it used to be, gets -1 bleed, cannot gain life, and may play cards that require basic Fortitude as a vampire.
If this is possible, can the new Shambling Hordes act when it comes back into the ready region since it wasn't a recruit action.?
Looks like legal play to me.
An ally in the ready region can act and the Hordes is a legal target for PF.
But would you need to burn another target in the ash heap when Shambling returns to play? Would it just burn again?
As a side note: I wonder if you’re technically required to track how much bleed the ally has if it’s recycled multiple times.
Or does Pressing Flesh set bleed to -1 rather than decrement it?
The 'enters play' clause in Shambling Hordes will also trigger with Pressing Flesh, so you still need to remove one ally or vampire from the ash heap to avoid burning the Hordes again.
Otherwise, it would work - Pressing Flesh is not a recruit action and therefore the 'can't act' rule does not apply.
The text of Shambling Hordes says "remove an ally or vampire in your ash heap from the game or burn Shambling Hordes.". Does this mean you can choose not to remove one from your Ash Heap and burn the Hordes instead?
Prince of Bonn, Germany
> Yomyael wrote:
> The text of Shambling Hordes says "remove an ally or vampire in your ash heap from the game or burn Shambling Hordes.". Does this mean you can choose not to remove one from your Ash Heap and burn the Hordes instead?
>
Yes, you can choose to burn the Hordes even if you have an ally or vampire in the ash heap to remove.
> skimflux wrote:
>
> > Yomyael wrote:
> > The text of Shambling Hordes says "remove an ally or vampire in your ash heap from the game or burn Shambling Hordes.". Does this mean you can choose not to remove one from your Ash Heap and burn the Hordes instead?
> >
> Yes, you can choose to burn the Hordes even if you have an ally or vampire in the ash heap to remove.
>
That's pretty neat.
It allows Pressing Flesh to bring Hordes into play (and sticking) in the ready region, allowing it to act the turn it's recruited.
If in the first time the Hordes come to play with 4 lifes = NEC, when you bring him back with Pressing Flesh he comes with the same lifecounters, 4? cause his starting life was 4, right?
ps: forget about THA by Pressing Flesh.
> nergalmcl wrote:
> If in the first time the Hordes come to play with 4 lifes = NEC, when you bring him back with Pressing Flesh he comes with the same lifecounters, 4? cause his starting life was 4, right?
> ps: forget about THA by Pressing Flesh.
>
For such purposes, the inferior version is always used, no?
> Snodig wrote:
>
> > nergalmcl wrote:
> > If in the first time the Hordes come to play with 4 lifes = NEC, when you bring him back with Pressing Flesh he comes with the same lifecounters, 4? cause his starting life was 4, right?
> > ps: forget about THA by Pressing Flesh.
> >
> For such purposes, the inferior version is always used, no?
>
Mhhmmmm..... good question.
In the General Rulings on this site (www.vekn.net/general-rulings), there is one for retainers:
> Retainers:
>
> If a retainer which requires a Discipline to be employed is brought into play by a means other than "Employ Retainer", treat it as if it were brought into play with the basic version of the Discipline. [RTR 19960221]
>
But there is nothing under the heading "Allies"....
"It was a perfect plan - until it had contact with reality"
---
Hardy Range
Playgroup Tradition Compliance Manager
nice, so this will also work with war ghouls?
War Ghoul
[Ally] Ally
[Tzimisce] Tzimisce
[3 Pool]
Ghoul with 5 life. 4 strength, 0 bleed.
When War Ghoul enters play, burn an ally or retainer you control. She can enter combat with any ready vampire controlled by another Methuselah as a action. She may prevent 1 damage each round. Tap and burn War Ghoul to burn any location; you cannot use this ability during combat.
> ed1234 wrote:
> nice, so this will also work with war ghouls?
>
> War Ghoul
> [Ally] Ally
>
> [Tzimisce] Tzimisce
>
> [3 Pool]
>
> Ghoul with 5 life. 4 strength, 0 bleed.
> When War Ghoul enters play, burn an ally or retainer you control. She can enter combat with any ready vampire controlled by another Methuselah as a action. She may prevent 1 damage each round. Tap and burn War Ghoul to burn any location; you cannot use this ability during combat.
>
Weird. The Ghoul doesn't explicitly say that you can't attempt the action or that there would be any consequence if there is no ally or retainer for the Ghoul to consume. Whatever happens if you attempt the action with no allies or retainers?
Of course we all know how it's supposed to work, but just wondering... I never caught that about the current wording.
> If you have no other allies and no retainers in play when War Ghoul is recruited, then you burn War Ghoul to satisfy card text. [RTR 19961113]
>
"Oh, to the Hades with the manners! He's a complete bastard, and calling him that insults bastards everywhere!"
-Nalia De-Arnise
garourimgazette.wordpress.com/
www.vekn.net/forum-guidelines
If War Ghoul enters play with nothing to burn, War Ghoul burns as soon as it enters play - just like you quoted.
What are you wondering about?
You can attempt the action, and it will burn once successful.
> Snodig wrote:
> I wonder if you’re technically required to track how much bleed the ally has if it’s recycled multiple times.
> Or does Pressing Flesh set bleed to -1 rather than decrement it?
>
Anyone know the answer to this?
Modedit\\ Please try to keep from double posting.
There's nothing to track. When the ally is moved to the ash heap, Pressing Flesh's -1 bleed is cleared, so the next Pressing Flesh on the same ally does just what the first Pressing Flesh did.
> Snodig wrote:
> If War Ghoul enters play with nothing to burn, War Ghoul burns as soon as it enters play - just like you quoted.
>
> What are you wondering about?
> You can attempt the action, and it will burn once successful.
>
Just wishing for 100% clear card text. Now it's, like, 92% clear. The info is there, but is up for interpretation.
Iz all. Ruling's fine.
"Oh, to the Hades with the manners! He's a complete bastard, and calling him that insults bastards everywhere!"
-Nalia De-Arnise
garourimgazette.wordpress.com/
www.vekn.net/forum-guidelines