So this came up yesterday. I was under the impression that vote changing cards like Michael Luther/kindred manipulation wouldn't work if the vampire in question had abstained. I was told I was wrong by the people I was playing with. Still, I could have sworn seeing those effects played as aforementioned in a NAC game some years back.
So, can you change the votes of a vampire that has abstained thus far (i.e. has cast no votes)?
Only if there is "This can force ... to cast votes"
See justification here www.tomshardware.co.uk/forum/74336-13-distant-friend
Sabbat. If this vampire's bleed is successful, he laughs manicly and untaps.
> Malcolm wrote:
> So, can you change the votes of a vampire that has abstained thus far (i.e. has cast no votes)?
>
Camarilla: You may tap Michael during a referendum to change the votes of a Camarilla vampire to votes of your choice.
No votes =/= "the votes"
i.e. If a vampire abstains, there are no "the votes" to change.
Compare and contrast with Distant Friend:
As above, and you can force the chosen vampire to cast his or her votes when you burn this card.
Kevin M., Prince of Las Vegas
"Know your enemy and know yourself; in one-thousand battles
you shall never be in peril." -- Sun Tzu, *The Art of War*
"Contentment...Complacency...Catastrophe!" -- Joseph Chevalier
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> Malcolm wrote:
> So this came up yesterday. I was under the impression that vote changing cards like Michael Luther/kindred manipulation wouldn't work if the vampire in question had abstained. I was told I was wrong by the people I was playing with. Still, I could have sworn seeing those effects played as aforementioned in a NAC game some years back.
>
> So, can you change the votes of a vampire that has abstained thus far (i.e. has cast no votes)?
>
No. [LSJ 20032105]