Submission - Long-term plan

Name: Long-term plan Cardtype: Master Cost: 1 pool Put this card into play, tapped. Tap and burn during your master phase to have 2 master phase actions instead of 1 this turn. Prince of Paris, France Ratings Coordinator, Rules Director

Why would this be worth a card slot and a pool? Sabbat. If this vampire's bleed is successful, he laughs manicly and untaps.

A bit too expensive, and with the fact it comes tapped you cant us eit right away. Maybe something with multiple uses like 3-5 counters?

yeah, it seems a bit pricey for a pool and a card slot. either ditch the pool cost, or go as blackday suggests and give it multiple, finite uses.

without dabbling into how good or bad this design is, i am now at a point i want to throw torches and pitchforks at anything that has potential to create more master phases, and thus aid in further progressing "VTES: The masters solitaire" type of decks

Gaining master phase actions is one easy way to abuse the game. But anyway, the card as it is not profitable enough. Trifle it. I am death. Paul Kersey, Death Wish

Trifle it, make it unique, add in you have to burn any ashur tablets in play to play it, make it cost x pool where x is how many copies of it are in your graveyard. Then ban parthenon. And liquidation. Girls style decks are still winning, just like they did before liliths was banned. Reinstate a modified liliths and make this the new parthenon, maybe meta will return to normal......

What about : Name: Souvenir from Athens Cardtype: Master Trifle. You gain an additional master phase action. Only one Souvenir from Athens can be played each turn. ... to keep it simple. Would that be overpowered ?

We don't need to push the game stronger into the Master Phase. It would be much better to push the game back towards minion interactions. So I don't think your card (or the original card) does much for the game overall. Retired Baron of Sydney, Australia, 418

Exactly what Juggernaut said. If you have a proposal that add master phase in any way or shape, forget it immediatly. Simple as that.

Put 3 counters on it... and any minion can burn the counters as a D action ...

> Ohlmann wrote: > If you have a proposal that add master phase in any way or shape, forget it immediatly. Simple as that. > Oh, I don't know. I could imagine creating a powerful card that - as a balancing factor - gave my predator or prey an additional master phase action next turn.

> Oh, I don't know. I could imagine creating a powerful card that - as a balancing factor - gave my predator or prey an additional master phase action next turn. > I doubt that would be that much of a drawback... Sabbat. If this vampire's bleed is successful, he laughs manicly and untaps.

> kombainas wrote: > > > Oh, I don't know. I could imagine creating a powerful card that - as a balancing factor - gave my predator or prey an additional master phase action next turn. > > > I doubt that would be that much of a drawback... > I agree. Here we go with real drawback: Tap this card to gain an extra masterphase action. While this card is tapped, any methuselah may burn 2 blood or 2 conviction on any minion they control(ready or otherwise) to cancel a master card you play as it is played . If they do, you burn one pool. If yoi control this card and the parthenon at the start of your minion phase, and they are both tapped, burn the parthenon and 6 pool, and this card does not untap as normal during your next untap phase." Ok, now im ok printing another mmpa card, if it reads like that.

> kombainas wrote: > > > Oh, I don't know. I could imagine creating a powerful card that - as a balancing factor - gave my predator or prey an additional master phase action next turn. > > > I doubt that would be that much of a drawback... > And yet it works really well on Wash, which is pretty darned good.

A cost of one pool for a second master phase action on a single turn? I don't think so. Banking a master phase action is not all that great. If that was all it did, It should not have a cost. "Long-Term Plan" Master. Unique. Put this card in play. You may bun this card during your master phase to have two master phase actions instead of one. The only thing a card such as this is useful for is filler. It helps you fill your quota of master cards if you have fewer copies of the cards you are using than you need. If you look at "Ashur's Tablets" you GAIN 3 pool for 3 master phase actions (in addition to the other effects.) using that as a guide, I would make such a card: "Withhold Favor" Unique Master. Put this card in play. Burn this card during you master phase to have two master phase actions (instead of one) and gain one pool. Hey look at that, it's an "Ascendance." Whoohoo, At least it's on par with Ashur's... oh, wait it's not. Independent Futurist. Contrarian (titled, X votes where X is the number of votes as the acting minion.) Target Vitals is always the better combat card.

Edit: all references to ltp were supposex to be to direwolfs withheld favor. I misread. Oops. Its not a good idea to give mmpa decks more cards to get mpas. Anson wasnt broken until girls deck came along, even with liquidation and tablets. Now, mpas are takimg the place of minion actions, which isnt what the game is supposed to do. No more cards or minions should grant mpas. EVER. Other than triflez, obviously. Its a step away from the xore of the game, minion interactions. Direwolf, your card is, as stated, wallpaper for normal decks. Tablets is a perfect card if tbey add "minion" before cards and after 13. But, even a throw away mpa maker is game breaking for girls decks. Turn one, parthenon, tap, ltp. Move beads. Turn two, burn ltp, zillahs, zillahs, tap parthenon, zillahs.. moce beads. Flip Anksynia and cybele. Welcome to timeoutville. Later in the game, as soon as you want, villein aksynia, play ltp, tap parthenon to play wider view, use cybele to play jake washington. Gain pool from wider view. Next turn, villein cybele, burn ltp, play liquidation and 3 tablets. Lets recap. 22 pool spent. Quickly. 23 with wider view. 2 gained from ltp, so 21. 2 from widr view. 19. Assuming both minions were left 1 bead, villein 8 and 7. 4 pool spent. 3 liquidation, 1 pool. 3 from tablets, -2. Its turn 5, girls dexk has 32 pool and both key minions plus parthenon. And jake washington. Or if instead of him tjey played another liquidation, 35 pool. Its not 100% likely, but its easily possible. So, a card lile that should never see print. "Gain more master phase actions" should be not printed anymore. Instead, " if this action is sucessful, this minion may untap" should be added to an action card everytime we even consider strengtbening the master phase. If you wouldnt want deep song or govern to be a triflexaction, no more master phases are needed.

> jamesatzephyr wrote: > > > kombainas wrote: > > > > > Oh, I don't know. I could imagine creating a powerful card that - as a balancing factor - gave my predator or prey an additional master phase action next turn. > > > > > > > > I doubt that would be that much of a drawback... > > > And yet it works really well on Wash, which is pretty darned good. > I agree 4 billion% that wash granting the person whose master phase you tried to bone an extra mpa is an adequate drawback for a trifle sudden. But you also do not replace it until your next untap. And you can only target yiur predator or prey. Only two of those drawbacks would be what i deem NECISARY. but, even all 3 drawbacks and itz a very useful card, optimal for stealthbleed, infact. But its not an appropriate drawback for a master card that grants mpas. But i believe i misread what james was getting at. Did you mean a card that grants you and someone else extra mpas, or a carx that oes something badass for a reduced cost, but also grants your prey orxpredator mpas? Like: Captain kickass. Pander G6 Capacity 5 [CEL][FOR][POT] Sabbat. Captain kickass may enter combat with any ready camarilla vampire controlled by your predator orxprey as a action. In combat against a titled camarilla vampire, captain kickass gets +1 strength, may prevent 1 non aggravated damafe each round, and may burn a blood to gain an additional strike once eaxh combat. While captain kickass is ready, yoir prey gets an additional master phase action. While he is in torpor, yoir predator gains an additional master phase action. Over the top, but thats what you meant, right? Or maybe: Mindf#@£ Action Dem chi 2 blood. Chi: tap a minion dem chi: put this card on a minion controlled by you prey. The minion with this card cannot block any minion with dementation and chimestry unlesz he or she moves all of thief blood or life (it becomez blood) to the acting vampire with dem chi. While the minion with this card is ready, its controller gains an additional master phaze action. Burn this card if the minion sucessfully blocks a vamoire with dem chi and is still ready at the end of the action. DEM CHI as above, but @+1 stealth. Still over the top, but what you meant?

> ReverendRevolver wrote: > But i believe i misread what james was getting at. Did you mean a card that grants you and someone else extra mpas, or a carx that oes something badass for a reduced cost, but also grants your prey orxpredator mpas? > Potentially either - the "something badass" could be you getting an extra master phase action of some sort, or effectively doing so. Giving someone else extra master phase actions that they can't plan for during deck-building is potentially pretty neat. A vote that goes into play gives me something pretty darned good, but my prey gets some compensatory benefit while it's in play? It might be an interesting avenue for exploring alternatives to the obvious damage votes (KRC, ConAg, Parity Shift etc.) - maybe a vote went into play (unique) that had a perpetual 'steal pool' effect like Gambit Accepted, or something like that. But I would also caution against a blanket "no more master phase action enhancers". Some could be tightly controlled not to stack with other options. Others could be restricted to control their use. Would I object to cards such as: BillyBob the Money Guy 6 cap, Ventrue Antitribu AUS FOR dom Bishop. When BillyBob is ready, you receive an extra master phase action each turn, usable only to play Investment cards or to move counters from them. I Want It Now, Dammit Master Choose a master card by name. Search your library for that card (shuffle afterwards) and play it immediately as if you had an extra master phase action. Next turn, skip your master phase. If you cannot play the chosen card, burn 2 pool. Only one I Want It Now, Dammit can be played per game. Scarlet Onslaught Event During his or her master phase, each Methuselah gains an additional master phase action, usable only to play a Trophy. ? I'm not saying any of these are super, super great, but I don't think these are particularly exacerbating the MMPA problem - and might make other deck styles more viable, which a blanket design ban would have issues with.

> jamesatzephyr wrote: > > Scarlet Onslaught > Event > During his or her master phase, each Methuselah gains an additional master phase action, usable only to play a Trophy. > Interesting off the cuff idea above. Time for me to chime in (again) with respect to MMPA and Red List. Change the Red List "mark" rule to: Red List: Any Methuselah may use a master phase trifle action to mark a Red List minion for the current turn. When you are anvil, be patient; when a hammer, strike. pckvtes.wordpress.com @pckvtes

Then again, they aren't MPA cards. It's like saying that something that an Hunting ground give multi acting on the basis that it allow to do the same as hunting and then untapping. What I care for is the huge number of people that believe that there is somehow a way to create a card that hand out MPA without banning anything existing and without creating problems.

@Ohlmann: And every card we create that increases the power of the Master Phase pushes the game further and further away from minion interaction. Retired Baron of Sydney, Australia, 418

> Juggernaut1981 wrote: > @Ohlmann: > > And every card we create that increases the power of the Master Phase pushes the game further and further away from minion interaction. > Only mostlyan issue. Not all mastercards allow for solitaire. Trophies, many powerbases, the rack.... allow for minion interaction. We just need to no allow more cybele/nana/parthenon stuff.