The War Ghoul Shift

1. How do you intend to oust? Parity Shift plus War Ghoul's then bleed. 2. How do you intend to keep from being ousted? Parity Shift plus War Ghoul and intercept from Maris and Unmasking 3. What do you want your ready region to look like (ie, how many guys are you planning on getting out)? Maris or Rachel then a smaller Tzimisce then get more votes with third vamp with Legendary Vampire on the Third one, pump out Allies. 4. What do you want your average turn to look like? Vote or bleed with the Malk's and and the Tzimisce getting allies or bleeding, War Ghouls doing their thing. 5. What's your metagame like? How do your opponents play? On JOL were this will be played first, combat and vote. 6. What problems have you observed with the deck in play?Haven't played it yet. 3x Rachel Brandywine 10 prince 3x Maris Streck 9 justicar 2x Lady Zara Slatikov 8 bishop 1x Ana Rita Montana 5 2x Guedado 4 1x Piotr Andreikov 2 Library [90 cards] Master [21] 3x Animalism 2x Information Highway 3x Legendary Vampire 3x Lilith's Blessing 4x Perfectionist 6x Villein Action Modifier [17] 5x Animal Magnetism 6x Cloak the Gathering 2x Forgotten Labyrinth 2x Lost in Crowds 2x Veil the Legions Ally [12] 5x Underbridge Stray 7x War Ghoul Equipment [6] 1x Bowl of Convergence 1x Heart of Nizchetus 4x Helicopter Event [3] 1x Anthelios, The Red Star 2x Unmasking, The Political Action [6] 6x Parity Shift Reaction [16] 2x Enhanced Senses 3x Eyes of Argus 3x My Enemy's Enemy 4x On the Qui Vive 4x Telepathic Misdirection Retainer [3] 3x Owl Companion Combat [6] 6x No Trace Don't expect this to be super competitive but it could be fun.

I see some similarities. www.thelasombra.com/decks/shifty-war-ghouls.htm which was inspired by Rom Ghouls www.thelasombra.com/decks/twd.htm#2k9peacemakerparis

> Pullen wrote: > 1. How do you intend to oust? Parity Shift plus War Ghoul's then bleed. > I like how this deck doesn't include Charisma. Was that on purpose, so you could pay full-price for the WGs so Parity Shift would work better, or did you just forget to put it in? Kevin M., Prince of Las Vegas "Know your enemy and know yourself; in one-thousand battles you shall never be in peril." -- Sun Tzu, *The Art of War* "Contentment...Complacency...Catastrophe!" -- Joseph Chevalier Please visit VTESville daily! vtesville.myminicity.com/ Facebook: www.facebook.com/groups/129744447064017 Kevin M., Prince of Las Vegas "Know your enemy and know yourself; in one-thousand battles you shall never be in peril." -- Sun Tzu, *The Art of War* "Contentment...Complacency...Catastrophe!" -- Joseph Chevalier Please visit VTESville daily! vtesville.myminicity.com/ Facebook: www.facebook.com/groups/129744447064017

It's an interesting deck. I like the Underbridge Stray / War Ghoul combination. You should consider adding some Vagabond Mystics (works well with both those cards). I'd also suggest changing some Owls for retainers with no requirements so they can also be played by the Ghouls. Your master card package is lacking both Charisma and Fame, Charisma is debatable depending on how good you expect your pool gen to be, but I'd definitely suggest finding room for Fame. Also, speaking of pool gen, I'm not convinced you will ever be able to afford your Helicopters in this deck. Anyway, good luck, looks like a fun deck.

> KevinM wrote: > > > Pullen wrote: > > 1. How do you intend to oust? Parity Shift plus War Ghoul's then bleed. > > > I like how this deck doesn't include Charisma. Was that on purpose, so you could pay full-price for the WGs so Parity Shift would work better, or did you just forget to put it in? > It was on purpose, with the Villein, Lilith's Blessing combo in their and Parity Shift, I didn't think I needed more pool gain, that and once I get the War Ghouls in play I should be able to protect my pool pretty well. > Mael wrote: > It's an interesting deck. > I like the Underbridge Stray / War Ghoul combination. You should consider adding some Vagabond Mystics (works well with both those cards). I'd also suggest changing some Owls for retainers with no requirements so they can also be played by the Ghouls. > Your master card package is lacking both Charisma and Fame, Charisma is debatable depending on how good you expect your pool gen to be, but I'd definitely suggest finding room for Fame. > Also, speaking of pool gen, I'm not convinced you will ever be able to afford your Helicopters in this deck. > Didn't go with the unique retainers because I see them all the time I don't feel like contesting with then, but now that I think about it, bleeding with one or two would help so yeah, they will most likely go in. And I don't know why but I just plain forgot about the Vagabond Mystics. As for Fame, didn't have room in the master card section and pool and blood gain was more important. Thank you for the help.

-3 Animal Magnetism -3 Animalism +3 Telepathic vote counting +3 Old Friends You already have vote push in your Disciplines, so why waste master actions on disciplines? -6 No Trace You will not get blocked and you have allies to block rushes. Your stars will never see a combat.

Emilliano Imeroni has a similar deck. His differences, afaik, are: - no Lady Zara, Rachel Brandywine. Focus on Maris + small Tzims who can hunt with vessels. - A key card of his deck was Anathema. It proves out to be great fun with Warghouls. What the heck is Anthelios doing in there? All of your Master cards are put in play, so there's none you can retrieve to replay. And if you think of it as "Well, if I get Wash'd, I can get it back" , just think of what the guy who played Wash might be able to get back. Stay with Unmasking + FBI. And, eventually, depending on your grouping choice, Scourge. You're definitely missing the cards that'll give Maris more blood. You need a couple of Jakes in there. Giant's Blood. And perhaps, a Coven. Not a huge fan of the 2 Enhanced Senses, given that only your high-caps have AUS. Here's Emiliano's decklist: www.secretlibrary.info/index.php?deck=view&id=4974

Parity Shift is not a valid ousting plan, unless you're planning to go under 10 pools, which is dangerous. Prince of Paris, France Ratings Coordinator, Rules Director

> Adonai wrote: > I see some similarities. > > www.thelasombra.com/decks/shifty-war-ghouls.htm > > which was inspired by Rom Ghouls > www.thelasombra.com/decks/twd.htm#2k9peacemakerparis > Yes, the idea it's similar to the deck I used to win PeaceMaker Tournament in Paris(originally I got the idea from Johannes). I need to update the deck but I don't have time to focus on that... > Ankha wrote: > Parity Shift is not a valid ousting plan, unless you're planning to go under 10 pools, which is dangerous. > You're right, I used Neonate Breach on my deck to add some ousting power as well, I think we can add 1 Kine Resources Contested and one or two more Sudario Refraction for getting the right cards in the rigth moment.

Charisma is a lousy card unless you are recruiting multiple allies with the same minion each turn. Perfectionist is preferable. If you already have Perfectionist then Blood Doll/Vessel is the other part.

> XZealot wrote: > Charisma is a lousy card unless you are recruiting multiple allies with the same minion each turn. Perfectionist is preferable. If you already have Perfectionist then Blood Doll/Vessel is the other part. > I think I'll have to agree with you on Charisma. In many cases Ascendence would be just as good, which is a bad place to start. Be careful when you fight the monsters, lest you become one. -Friedrich Nietzsche brandonsantacruz.blogspot.com/

I also think that Charisma is one of the most overrated cards in the game.

I don't think Charisma is that hard to analyze. Sure, there's some confusion / frustration around the card, because it's harder to get than it needs to be - it's really strange that clan-specific staples like Hunting Grounds were uncommon, when Charisma - a staple for deck categories that cross clan boundaries - is rare. But, for the sake of analysis, we should ignore rarity. So, what remains? Well, the only thing Charisma is going to do for you is to save you blood or pool. In nearly all circumstances, pool > blood, so it's easier to look at the pool side, as that's where it's likely to be best. Then, it's simple. If you expect to play X allies while Charisma is in play, it's worth X. Clearly, if you're only expecting to play one ally, Ascendance is better than Charisma. If you plan to play 2 most of the time, maybe 3, then it's also pretty weak - comparable with stuff like Dummy Corporation and strictly weaker than Dreams of the Sphinx. If you're planning to play 3+, then it starts looking pretty decent - up there with tier 1 stuff like Liquidation and Tend the Flock. If you plan to play an ally a turn for the rest of the game, it's quite good - like a free Arcane Library. I think most War Ghoul decks end up in the first couple of categories - either 1-2 ghouls are going to dominate the table, or someone at the table is "ghoul-proof", due to combat permanents etc, and any number isn't going to help you much. Similarly with stuff like Renegade Garou decks - even with Charisma, more than 2 Garou will be really painful to your pool. The decks where Charisma shines are the ones that play lots of 1-2 pool allies. Like Sebastian Goulet / Shadow Court Satyr decks. Or Escaped Mental Patient decks. Or Black Hand decks that try to swarm with Marijava Thuggees. Or Khazar's Diary decks, that want to drop one each of the cheap unique allies like Carlton, Mylan, etc and gain Diary counters when they go to the ask heap. Or Erictho Outcast Mage decks. For these types of deck, the card is gold. There's also the issue of when you'll draw the Charisma. If you are running one copy, and it shows up just after you recruited your "workforce" of two War Ghouls, a Dummy Corporation would probably have been a better draw. And if your deck relies on the allies to function, you won't be able to wait for the Charisma to show up. Not to mention that additional copies are also dead draws... Overrated? Possibly. Played in decks that don't really warrant it? Certainly. A great card in the correct deck? Absolutely! ... if you really want to talk about a card that is overrated and frequently played in the wrong decks, Powerbase: Montreal is a much better target IMHO.

> finbury wrote: > I think most War Ghoul decks end up in the first couple of categories - either 1-2 ghouls are going to dominate the table, or someone at the table is "ghoul-proof", due to combat permanents etc, and any number isn't going to help you much. Similarly with stuff like Renegade Garou decks - even with Charisma, more than 2 Garou will be really painful to your pool. > > The decks where Charisma shines are the ones that play lots of 1-2 pool allies. Like Sebastian Goulet / Shadow Court Satyr decks. Or Escaped Mental Patient decks. Or Black Hand decks that try to swarm with Marijava Thuggees. Or Khazar's Diary decks, that want to drop one each of the cheap unique allies like Carlton, Mylan, etc and gain Diary counters when they go to the ask heap. Or Erictho Outcast Mage decks. For these types of deck, the card is gold. > I think this is a great point, which I agree with. It's like comparing it to a Black Cat deck, they don't want to get Assault Rifles and Flamethrowers, they usually go for .44 magnums and sport bikes instead. it's about getting a 50% or 100% reduction on cheap cards, rather than a 20%-25% reduction on expensive ones. it's one less pool either way, but in the long run the higher discount means more goodies. another thing is how Charisma can only affect one vampire, so you'd better do all your recruitment with that one minion. sometimes that's perfect for a star like Sebastian Goulet or Zhenga. but for other decks, if you don't really care who gets the ally in play because everyone meets requirements, then Charisma is not so efficient and reduces your flexibility.