Gemini's Mirror vs. Additional Strikes

A situation is happening at a JOL game. Meth A (acting) controls a Renegade Garou who just entered combat with his prey's ( Meth B ) Roger Farnsworth. A: Weighted Walking Stick. B: Gemini's Mirror at OBF. A: No more pre-range. B: No more pre-range. A: No maneuvers. B: No maneuvers. A: Hands for 2. B: Rolls for GM: tails. Strike fizzles. A: Additional strike, hands for 2. B: Rolls for GM: heads. Behind You! to dodge. * At this point, the game stops. Is the play legal? Should B have declared a strike at the same time as A's first hand strike? Should it have been: <after determine range> A: Hands for 2. B: Rolls for GM: tails. Strike fizzles, but I hands for 1 anyways. A: Additional strike, hands for 2. B: Rolls for GM: heads. I am a sitting duck with no additional strikes. Relevant card texts: Renegade Garou Werewolf with 3 life. 2 strength, 0 bleed. Renegade Garou gets an additional strike each round and an optional maneuver each combat. He may enter combat with a minion controlled by another Methuselah as a +1 stealth action. If Renegade Garou has 2 or fewer life during your untap phase, he gains 1 life from the blood bank. Gemini's Mirror Strike: dodge, with an optional maneuver. Only usable before range is determined. For each strike made against this vampire, flip a coin. If it's tails, the strike has no effect on this vampire. This lasts until heads is flipped or combat ends. A vampire can play only one Gemini's Mirror at superior each combat. Behind You! Only usable on the first round of combat. Maneuver. Strike: dodge. Advocate of Good-looking Deck Posts pulledfangs.blogspot.com :vtes: Manila V:tES

B should have declared a strike in the 'choose strike' phase, yes. Gemini's mirror is flipped in the 'resolve strikes' phase. In this instance though, there's no saving Roger. Roger doesn't have an additional strike. Even if he had chosen Behind You in the initial choose strike phase, it won't protect him from the Garou's additional strike, only the Garou's initial strike. Roger would need to gain an additional strike from somewhere, and then choose Behind You as that additional strike, to be saved from the Garou's additional strike. -- salem

> CryWolf wrote: > A situation is happening at a JOL game. > > Meth A (acting) controls a Renegade Garou who just entered combat with his prey's ( Meth B ) Roger Farnsworth. > > A: Weighted Walking Stick. > B: Gemini's Mirror at OBF. > A: No more pre-range. > B: No more pre-range. > This is also wrong. Should have been: A: Weighted Walking Stick. A: No more pre-range. B: Gemini's Mirror at OBF. A: No more pre-range. B: No more pre-range. Prince of Paris, France Ratings Coordinator, Rules Director

Salem and Ankha are right. Correct order is as follows: A - WWS. A - no more pre-range B - sup' Gemini's mirror A - no more pre-range B - no more pre-range A - no maneuver B - no maneuver {A - no pre-strikes B - no pre-strikes} A - declare strike: WWS B - declare strike: Dodge Flip a coin. Since B dodged, the only effect is that it might end the Gemini's flipping. Resolve strikes A - gain 1 additional strike B - no additional strike A - declare additional strike: WWS Flip a coin if tails were flipped. Resolve A's additional strike

Sorry for intervening, but is the acting minion not obliged to play play all of his pre-range cards (that he wants to play of course) before the blocking minion does so? So the acting can go like: A - Carrion Crows and Drawing Out The Beast B - Carrion Crows A - Oh, in that case I shall have a Flesh of Marble too Is that correct? NC of Hungary ///

> Malachy wrote: > Sorry for intervening, but is the acting minion not obliged to play play all of his pre-range cards (that he wants to play of course) before the blocking minion does so? > > So the acting can go like: > > A - Carrion Crows and Drawing Out The Beast > B - Carrion Crows > A - Oh, in that case I shall have a Flesh of Marble too > > Is that correct? > That is correct. That's how the sequencing rule works. Rulebook 1.6.1.5 wrote: > > Sequencing. If two or more players want to play a card or effect, the acting Methuselah plays first. At every stage, the acting player always has the opportunity to play the next card or effect. So after playing one effect, she may play another and another. Once she is finished, the opportunity passes to the defending Methuselah (in the cases of directed actions and combat), then to the rest of the Methuselahs in clockwise order from the acting Methuselah. Note that if any Methuselah uses a card or effect, the acting Methuselah again gets the opportunity to play the next effect. > Non-acting minion can't play Torn Signpost + Carrion Crows without letting the acting play Flesh of Marble. And even if non-acting has played Torn Signpost + Carrion Crows Crows + Flesh of Marble, acting still gets an opportunity to play Alpha Glint.

Pascal Ninjaed me! ---- Banging trashcans, breaking windows We'll wake you up tonight We like the good time, we scream and shout And that's what fun's about

I find, from experience, that statements like "until both have passed the impulse" really confuses new (and sometimes existing) players. Such statements only leave no room for misinterpretation when combined with the knowledge that (assuming A is the acting minion): - B cannot play or pass until A passes - Once B plays on the impulse, A gets the impulse back without B ever having the need (or opportunity) to pass Suaku Inceptor Asian Continental Championship 興っ www.youtube.com/SuakuOz

> the1andonlime wrote: > I find, from experience, that statements like "until both have passed the impulse" really confuses new (and sometimes existing) players. > Y'er absolutely right. I'll remove the statement. ---- Banging trashcans, breaking windows We'll wake you up tonight We like the good time, we scream and shout And that's what fun's about