FoM can't be played on an unblocked action. Here's Why! DCI/NRA only!

Follow me here gang. First of all, you have to be using the DCI rules or NRA/GT. A Bum's Rush or other "enter combat with" action is complete if not blocked. Plain and simple! The continue portion of FoM doesn't allow you to override the NRA restriction. FoM on a completed action would result in a repeat action. You might be thinking that you are simply continuing to do an action. This is not the case. This fact is illuminated by the ability to block the action again. Block attempts after previosly declining to block an action are not allowed. Therefore, this must be a new action. In fact, a new action that is using a card of the same name (i.e. Bum's Rush) and violating the NRA prohibition. If it were somehow still continuing the same action then no one would be allowed the opportunity to block having already declined to block when the action was announced the first time. Still doubt it? Notice also the acting minions ability to benefit from the Bum's Rush manuever again. These two points are incontravertable evidence that FoM on an unblocked "enter combat action" is another Bum's Rush action and violation of NRA. It is important to note that the recent ruling on this combo does not overrule the DCI's prohibition against repeat actions. I can, therefore, not allow this combo at my next tournament. The only thing left to fix now is the stealth cycling problem and maybe 2nd Trad. Robert -- ...................................................................... :The opinions expressed here are strictly my own delusional ramblings: :and do not reflect the opinions of The Walt Disney Company. : : : :Robert Goudie robert...@studio.disney.com: :LA Tourney Info - http://www.cs.ucr.edu/~ezix/other/rg/vtourn_1.html: :....................................................................: :Da pony run, he jump he pitch. He t'row my master in da ditch. : :He died and da jury wondered why. Da verdict was the blue tail fly.: :....................................................................:

Robert Goudie wrote: > First of all, you have to be using the DCI rules or NRA/GT. > > A Bum's Rush or other "enter combat with" action is complete if not > blocked. Plain and simple! > > The continue portion of FoM doesn't allow you to override the NRA > restriction. FoM on a completed action would result in a repeat No, it continues the same action. This is why all the action modifiers and reaction cards remain in effect. > action. You might be thinking that you are simply continuing to do an > action. This is not the case. This fact is illuminated by the ability > to block the action again. Block attempts after previosly declining to > block an action are not allowed. They are if allowed by card text (see the Jyhad text on Deflection for an example of this). Form of Mist has card text allowing the continuance of the action to restart the "choose blockers" phase. > Therefore, this must be a new action. > In fact, a new action that is using a card of the same name (i.e. Bum's > Rush) and violating the NRA prohibition. If it were somehow still > continuing the same action then no one would be allowed the opportunity > to block having already declined to block when the action was announced > the first time. Still doubt it? Notice also the acting minions ability > to benefit from the Bum's Rush manuever again. The RT stance on this is that the maneuver is gained from the resolution of the action, and (since card text backs up to the "choose blockers" phase, the action will resolve a second time. But it is still only attempted once (when the acting minion first announced the action). (*) > It is important to note that the recent ruling on this combo does not > overrule the DCI's prohibition against repeat actions. I can, > therefore, not allow this combo at my next tournament. A for effort, but I don't think the argument is vaild. > The only thing left to fix now is the stealth cycling problem and maybe > 2nd Trad. -- L. Scott Johnson (vte...@regency.wizards.com) Official VtES Net.Rep for Wizards of the Coast. (*) - Subject to review by Rules Team

L. Scott Johnson wrote: > > Robert Goudie wrote: [clip] > A for effort, but I don't think the argument is vaild. > I see your points. I guess I was arguing with the presupposition that the action has already been completed. Do you have any knowledge of the RT's opinion on when then Bum's Rush action is considered "complete" and how they see that fitting-in to the BR/FoM question? - Robert ...................................................................... :The opinions expressed here are strictly my own delusional ramblings: :and do not reflect the opinions of The Walt Disney Company. : : : :Robert Goudie robert...@studio.disney.com: :LA Tourny Info -> http://www.cs.ucr.edu/~ezix/other/rg/vtourn_1.html: [ quoted text not captured ]

Robert Goudie wrote: > > L. Scott Johnson wrote: > > > > Robert Goudie wrote: > [clip] > > A for effort, but I don't think the argument is vaild. > > > > I see your points. I guess I was arguing with the presupposition that > the action has already been completed. Do you have any knowledge of the > RT's opinion on when then Bum's Rush action is considered "complete" and > how they see that fitting-in to the BR/FoM question? By their ruling on Form of Mist on an unblocked Bum's Rush, I'd have to say the the Rules Team considers an action "completed" only when another action is begun or when the minion phase ends. They, of course, have not put it in such concrete terms as yet. [ quoted text not captured ]

On Mon, 12 May 1997, Robert Goudie wrote: > I see your points. I guess I was arguing with the presupposition that > the action has already been completed. Do you have any knowledge of the > RT's opinion on when then Bum's Rush action is considered "complete" and > how they see that fitting-in to the BR/FoM question? > > - Robert The action is considered complete if it meets all of it's objectives. So in our play group the Bum's Rush - FoM combo does not work because there is no action to continue with. The fine point is if the vampire is blocked instead of just letting the combat happen, then FoM can be played. (Even if the intended target is the blocker.) Richard | Don't let yourself get in your own way. - Wicker |