Gratiano power (LSJ)

Gratiano is Priscus and he gets one additional vote during the prisci sub-referendum. But is this speciale hability lost (the 1 vote in prisci sub- referendum) if Gratiano change is title ? Example : Gratiano take the title of Cardinal. He have 3 votes with this title. But can he cast the 1 votes from his speciale hability in the prisci sub-referendum ? -- Richard Labrecque Also know has : Khaleph Alendis, High Priest of Maizerets VEKN Setite Prince of Beauport http://www.oricom.ca/melkor/khaleph/ Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/

Khaleph Alendis <kha...@hotmail.com> wrote: > Gratiano is Priscus and he gets one additional vote during the prisci > sub-referendum. > > But is this speciale hability lost (the 1 vote in prisci sub- > referendum) if Gratiano change is title ? No, since card text doesn't tie the ability to his priscocity. -- LSJ (vte...@white-wolf.com) VTES Net.Rep for White Wolf, Inc. Links to revised rulebook, rulings, errata, and tournament rules: http://www.white-wolf.com/vtes/ [ quoted text not captured ]

On Thu, 11 Jan 2001 16:39:08 GMT, LSJ <vte...@white-wolf.com> wrote: >Khaleph Alendis <kha...@hotmail.com> wrote: >> Gratiano is Priscus and he gets one additional vote during the prisci >> sub-referendum. >> >> But is this speciale hability lost (the 1 vote in prisci sub- >> referendum) if Gratiano change is title ? > >No, since card text doesn't tie the ability to his priscocity. Is "priscocity" a real word? =) -- Derek Goon-of-the-Month club member "In a MAN's game, you tap things that block." -- F. Scott, 2001

"LSJ" <vte...@white-wolf.com> wrote in message news:93knja$ace$1...@nnrp1.deja.com... > Khaleph Alendis <kha...@hotmail.com> wrote: > > Gratiano is Priscus and he gets one additional vote during the prisci > > sub-referendum. > > > > But is this speciale hability lost (the 1 vote in prisci sub- > > referendum) if Gratiano change is title ? > > No, since card text doesn't tie the ability to his priscocity. > This means that Gratiano can have a total of 6 votes (if there are no other prisci), 8 with legendary vampire!!!!!!!! [ quoted text not captured ]

In article <8%o76.137795$MA1.4...@afrodite.telenet-ops.be>, jeroen rombouts <jeroen....@pandora.be> wrote: >This means that Gratiano can have a total of 6 votes (if there are no other >prisci), 8 with legendary vampire!!!!!!!! 7 if no other Prisci, 9 with Legendary, if he becomes Regent. And 3 of those votes aren't even cancelable with Telepathic Vote Counting/Demonstration. gomi -- PART II: WHAT DOSE DIRECT X 8.00 HAEV THAT TEH OTHARS DIDANT NOT INCLUDE? many things, stuped!!! but they dont work -Jeff K.

In article <uiur5toihblmda12l...@4ax.com>, Derek Ray <lor...@yahoo.com> wrote: > On Thu, 11 Jan 2001 16:39:08 GMT, LSJ <vte...@white-wolf.com> wrote: > > >Khaleph Alendis <kha...@hotmail.com> wrote: > >> Gratiano is Priscus and he gets one additional vote during the prisci > >> sub-referendum. > >> > >> But is this speciale hability lost (the 1 vote in prisci sub- > >> referendum) if Gratiano change is title ? > > > >No, since card text doesn't tie the ability to his priscocity. > > Is "priscocity" a real word? =) You are so Priscocious. BTW, Isn't it also true that while Gratiano retains his one vote in the Pricus subvote. It still requires a Pricus to call the Pricus vote. In other words, If Gratiano becomes a Cardinal and there are no other Pricus in play then Gratiano's special has no effect. Comments Welcome, Norman S. Brown Jr. XZealot Archon of the Swamp [ quoted text not captured ]

In article <8%o76.137795$MA1.4...@afrodite.telenet-ops.be>, "jeroen rombouts" <jeroen....@pandora.be> wrote: > > "LSJ" <vte...@white-wolf.com> wrote in message > news:93knja$ace$1...@nnrp1.deja.com... > > Khaleph Alendis <kha...@hotmail.com> wrote: > > > Gratiano is Priscus and he gets one additional vote during the prisci > > > sub-referendum. > > > > > > But is this speciale hability lost (the 1 vote in prisci sub- > > > referendum) if Gratiano change is title ? > > > > No, since card text doesn't tie the ability to his priscocity. > > > > This means that Gratiano can have a total of 6 votes (if there are no other > prisci), 8 with legendary vampire!!!!!!!! > No, he doesn't get the 3 pricus votes for the pricus block because he is not a pricus. Comments Welcome, Norman S. Brown Jr. XZealot Archon of the Swamp [ quoted text not captured ]

In article <8%o76.137795$MA1.4...@afrodite.telenet-ops.be>, "jeroen rombouts" <jeroen....@pandora.be> wrote: > > "LSJ" <vte...@white-wolf.com> wrote in message > news:93knja$ace$1...@nnrp1.deja.com... > > Khaleph Alendis <kha...@hotmail.com> wrote: > > > Gratiano is Priscus and he gets one additional vote during the prisci > > > sub-referendum. > > > > > > But is this speciale hability lost (the 1 vote in prisci sub- > > > referendum) if Gratiano change is title ? > > > > No, since card text doesn't tie the ability to his priscocity. > > > > This means that Gratiano can have a total of 6 votes (if there are no other > prisci), 8 with legendary vampire!!!!!!!! > No, he doesn't get the 3 pricus votes for the pricus block because he is not a pricus. Comments Welcome, Norman S. Brown Jr. XZealot Archon of the Swamp [ quoted text not captured ]

<X_Ze...@email.msn.com> wrote in message news:93l9c8$sdl$1...@nnrp1.deja.com... > In article <8%o76.137795$MA1.4...@afrodite.telenet-ops.be>, > "jeroen rombouts" <jeroen....@pandora.be> wrote: > > > > "LSJ" <vte...@white-wolf.com> wrote in message > > news:93knja$ace$1...@nnrp1.deja.com... > > > Khaleph Alendis <kha...@hotmail.com> wrote: > > > > Gratiano is Priscus and he gets one additional vote during the prisci > > > > sub-referendum. > > > > > > > > But is this speciale hability lost (the 1 vote in prisci sub- > > > > referendum) if Gratiano change is title ? > > > > > > No, since card text doesn't tie the ability to his priscocity. > > > > > > > This means that Gratiano can have a total of 6 votes (if there are no > other > > prisci), 8 with legendary vampire!!!!!!!! > > > > No, he doesn't get the 3 pricus votes for the pricus block because he > is not a pricus. according to another post he does. look for Totengraber's post: Question: Prisci Block. LSJ's answer: there is always an prisci block sub-referendum, even with no priscus on the table. [ quoted text not captured ]

In article <93l9cm$sdr$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>, <X_Ze...@email.msn.com> wrote: >In article <8%o76.137795$MA1.4...@afrodite.telenet-ops.be>, >> This means that Gratiano can have a total of 6 votes (if there are no >other >> prisci), 8 with legendary vampire!!!!!!!! >No, he doesn't get the 3 pricus votes for the pricus block because he >is not a pricus. Strictly speaking, no one vampire has "the three pricus (sic) votes", since it's a bloc vote. But if there are no Prisci on the table except for ex- Priscus Gratiano, his special ability (which remains absent his Priscus title) gives him a vote (the only vote) in the Prisci sub-referendum, and therefore control over the disposition of the 3 votes of the Priscus bloc. They're not 'his' votes, since he's not casting them directly, but he does have effective control over their disposition in the absence of any Prisci. gomi i have no joke here, i just like saying 'pricus bloc' [ quoted text not captured ]

In article <93l7e4$qff$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>, <X_Ze...@email.msn.com> wrote: >You are so Priscocious. BTW, Isn't it also true that while Gratiano >retains his one vote in the Pricus subvote. It still requires a Pricus >to call the Pricus vote. In other words, If Gratiano becomes a Cardinal >and there are no other Pricus in play then Gratiano's special has no >effect. Not true. 6.3.3 reads in part: "The Prisci Block: The prisci [...] as a group have three votes. During a referendum, the prisci block of three votes is cast 'for' or 'against' the referendum according to the prisci sub-referendum. Each ready priscus provides one vote for this sub-referendum, and no other votes may be used in this sub-referendum. Each vote is either 'for' or 'against' the main referendum. Whichever side has the greater number of votes in the sub-referendum gains three votes in the main referendum. If the sub-referendum is tied, the prisci abstain from the main vote. As prisci cast their votes in the sub- referendum, the prisci block of three votes may shift between 'for,' 'against' (sic*) and 'abstain' (as the majority in the sub-referendum changes)." Nothing about requiring a Priscus to have a Prisci vote. Ordinarily, only Prisci get to vote in it, but Gratiano's special overrides that. If there are no Prisci, you still have a Priscus subvote in every referendum, but it's a null section. In other news, I just finished reading Clan Novel: Tremere and am taking up a collection to buy Eric Griffin a vatload of whiskey. I'm hoping that if we can get and keep him drunk enough, he'll stop writing. Well, only CN:Nosferatu left. The series is 3 for 12 so far (Setite, Ravnos, half of Lasombra, half of Assamite), which is pretty sad. Sure am glad I'm borrowing these instead of actually shelling out money for such low-quality stuff. Hey, there's an idea -- we can replace him with Eddie Griffin(+)! That would be vastly amusing. gomi * what does white wolf have against the serial comma? would it have killed them to put a comma after 'against'? + in recent release 'Double Take,' with the funny, talented Orlando Jones, who was in the okayish 'Office Space'. Don't hold his UPN show against Griffin -- he can actually be funny. [ quoted text not captured ]

> >This means that Gratiano can have a total of 6 votes (if there are no other > >prisci), 8 with legendary vampire!!!!!!!! > > 7 if no other Prisci, 9 with Legendary, if he becomes Regent. And 3 of those > votes aren't even cancelable with Telepathic Vote Counting/Demonstration. > Not to mention how many he will have after completing the classical "Political struggle on inner circle-Arms of the Abyss- Entombment"-combo a few times... love that one... [ quoted text not captured ]

In article <93lokd$a3l$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>, [ quoted text not captured ] BTW: What happens if someone (god forbid) pulls a pulitical struggle on Gratiano: a) he gets 2 prisci votes as gratiano has 2 prisci votes b) he gets 1 prisci votes as the extra vote is just a specail ability c) he gets no votes at all, since prisci votes aren't "real" votes anyway The same question for Genevieve, can i struggle her extra-vote? [ quoted text not captured ]

In article <93lp9v$akb$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>, hen...@my-deja.com wrote: > BTW: What happens if someone (god forbid) pulls a > pulitical struggle on Gratiano: > a) he gets 2 prisci votes as gratiano has 2 prisci votes > b) he gets 1 prisci votes as the extra vote is just a specail ability > c) he gets no votes at all, since prisci votes aren't "real" votes > anyway C is the correct answer. "Prisci in general have zero votes (for effects that operate based on the number of votes a vampire has). [RTR 19970630]" from: http://www.white-wolf.com/vtes/rulings.html > The same question for Genevieve, can i struggle her extra-vote? You may only gain the extra vote. You don't gain anything for her Prisci status, you only gain her extra vote. Carpe Noctem. Lasombra http://lasombra.tripod.com http://legbiter.tripod.com http://vekn_clans.tripod.com [ quoted text not captured ]

go...@best.com (Gomi no Sensei) wrote: > jeroen rombouts <jeroen....@pandora.be> wrote: > >This means that Gratiano can have a total of 6 votes (if there are no > >other prisci), 8 with legendary vampire!!!!!!!! > > 7 if no other Prisci, 9 with Legendary, if he becomes Regent. And 3 > of those votes aren't even cancelable with Telepathic Vote > Counting/Demonstration. His vote in the sub-referendum will be canceled/changed by any effect that cancels/changes his votes, such as Telepathic Vote Counting. -- [ quoted text not captured ]

In article <93ltvi$ehl$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>, LSJ <vte...@white-wolf.com> wrote: >go...@best.com (Gomi no Sensei) wrote: >> 7 if no other Prisci, 9 with Legendary, if he becomes Regent. And 3 >> of those votes aren't even cancelable with Telepathic Vote >> Counting/Demonstration. >His vote in the sub-referendum will be canceled/changed by any >effect that cancels/changes his votes, such as Telepathic Vote >Counting. Groovy -- I had thought, for some reason, that such effects didn't apply to Priscus 'votelets.' Thanks for the correction. [ quoted text not captured ]

In message <93lk49$1iuh$1...@nntp1.ba.best.com>, Gomi no Sensei <go...@best.com> writes >* what does white wolf have against the serial comma? would it have killed >them to put a comma after 'against'? In a list of things (e.g. this, that and the other) you don't put a comma before the "and". -- James Coupe | PGP Key 0x5D623D5D "What's wrong with wanting more? If you can fly -- then soar! With all there is, why settle for just a piece of sky?"

James Coupe wrote: > > In message <93lk49$1iuh$1...@nntp1.ba.best.com>, Gomi no Sensei > <go...@best.com> writes > >* what does white wolf have against the serial comma? would it have killed > >them to put a comma after 'against'? > > In a list of things (e.g. this, that and the other) you don't put a > comma before the "and". I don't know what they're teaching in the U.K. but in the U.S. they state that such a comma is optional. I usually see it more often than not and always use it, myself. Fred

>> In a list of things (e.g. this, that and the other) you don't put a >> comma before the "and". > >I don't know what they're teaching in the U.K. but in the U.S. they state >that >such a comma is optional. I usually see it more often than not and always >use it, myself. > I'll agree that most Americans think of it as optional, though I'd have to take the opposite view and say that I see it less often (and see it absent more often). I, myself, never use it and am sometimes distressed when I see other people use it! No offense, but I personally find it to be an annoyance. =) Halcyan 2

In message <3A5FAB3F...@netcom.com>, Frederick Scott <fre...@netcom.com> writes >I don't know what they're teaching in the U.K. but in the U.S. they state that >such a comma is optional. I usually see it more often than not and always >use it, myself. Whilst people use commas all over the place, there seems to be a stylistic tendency to not use a comma before the "and". This alters, somewhat, when you start enumerating lists with semi-colons (most often found when one of the elements contains a comma, or where the use of the comma might be somewhat confusing). It seems to be most common for publishers to *not* use the comma before the "and", and publishers tend to define one house-style and stick to it, so that when you pick up a copy of The New York Times, you know you are reading The New York Times and not, for example, the Daily Planet based solely on its style, regardless of content. [ quoted text not captured ]

Halcyan 2 wrote: > > >> In a list of things (e.g. this, that and the other) you don't put a > >> comma before the "and". > > > >I don't know what they're teaching in the U.K. but in the U.S. they state > >that such a comma is optional. I usually see it more often than not and > >always use it, myself. > > > > I'll agree that most Americans think of it as optional, though I'd have to take > the opposite view and say that I see it less often (and see it absent more > often). I don't recall whether you're American or come from some minor English-speaking country. (Hey, joke, JOKE!) If you're American, you're clearly a comma-aversive prone to hysterical denial of final word list commas. That's the only way I can understand it. > I, myself, never use it and am sometimes distressed when I see other people use > it! No offense, but I personally find it to be an annoyance. =) Well, likewise - and as you might expect - I find it grating to see that last comma in a list missing. Par for the course, everything thinking their way is the aesthetically correct one. While we're at, how about those extra 'u's in words like "color"? If the Brits are going to insist on inserting an extra silent letter, why can't it be something exotic? A 'q', 'x', or 'z' perhaps? Maybe a second 'l', but only at the end of the word and then only after a dash. Now *that* would demonstrate that the British truly have a sense of humor! Fred

>I don't recall whether you're American or come from some minor >English-speaking >country. (Hey, joke, JOKE!) If you're American, you're clearly a >comma-aversive >prone to hysterical denial of final word list commas. That's the only way I >can >understand it. Well, I guess then I'm a comma-aversive prone to hysterical denial of final word list commas! =) >While we're at, how about those extra 'u's in words like "color"? If the >Brits >are going to insist on inserting an extra silent letter, why can't it be >something >exotic? A 'q', 'x', or 'z' perhaps? Maybe a second 'l', but only at the end >of the >word and then only after a dash. Now *that* would demonstrate that the >British >truly have a sense of humor! My favorite is the reversal of the 'e' and the 'r' for words like metre and centre (instead of meter and center). And don't the British have billion and trillion reversed (compared to the U.S.)? Didn't we already have a discussion like this a while ago? Comparing American / British words? Halcyan 2

In article <20010113051053...@ng-fl1.aol.com>, Halcyan 2 <halc...@aol.com> wrote: >And don't the British have billion and trillion reversed (compared to the >U.S.)? Not reversed as such, but the British system is more comfortable, as it's consistent. The US uses 'billion' when it means 'thousand million': one (10^0) ten (ten ones) (10^1) hundred (ten tens) (10^2) thousand (ten hundreds) (10^3) million (a thousand thousands) (10^6) US-billion (a thousand millions) (10^9) UK-billion, US-trillion (a million millions) (10^12) US-quadrillion (a thousand UK-billions) (10^15) US-quintillion (a million UK-billions) (10^18) US-sextillion (a thousand million UK-billions) (10^21) UK-trillion, US-septillion (a UK-billion UK-billions) (10^24) The difference between the systems is that the US adds an ordinal ('tri' to 'quad,' for example) every 3 powers of 10 (as in 10^6 to 10^9), and the UK system only adds an ordinal when the power of 10 is twice that of the old ordinal (10^6 to 10^12, then to 10^24). Since you already have perfectly good names for the smaller numbers, the UK system is to my mind more elegant, if only because you only have to go up to UK-trillion for any discussion of magnitudes outside the more rarefied realms of science, whereas you have to get into goofy-sounding names like "septillion" to accomplish the same with the US system. [ quoted text not captured ]

In article <3A5FAB3F...@netcom.com>, Frederick Scott <fre...@netcom.com> wrote: >I don't know what they're teaching in the U.K. but in the U.S. they state that >such a comma is optional. I usually see it more often than not and always >use it, myself. For instance, in the following sentence: "This book is dedicated to my parents, Ayn Rand and God." It's pretty clear that a comma after "Ayn Rand" would drastically change the meaning of the sentence. One sentence is ambiguous and can be interpreted to mean that the writer's parents are Ayn Rand and God. With the comma in place, the sense of the sentence as enumerating three distinct entities to thank (parents/Ayn Rand/God) rather than a single set (parents=Ayn Rand & God). The serial comma: just a good idea, not the law. But a good idea nonetheless. gomi [ quoted text not captured ]