I'm trying to put together a Lasombra deck. In looking at some of the
cards, several questions came up.
1. Lisette Vizquel- "Lisette gets +1 intercept against any vampire who
attempts diablerie." How does this work?
Does this mean that she gets the intercept for the rest of the game vs.
vampires who at some point have attempted diablerie? or
Does she gain the intercept only during an attempted diablerie? in which
case
Can she attempt to block "any vampire" even if they are not diablerizing a
vamp of her controller?
2. Antonio Delgado- "If Antonio performs a successful political action,
untap him at the end of the turn."
Does the vote have to pass in order to be considered a "successful
political action"? or Does the fact that the action is not blocked and
the referrendum comes to vote designate success?
3. Political Struggle- The acting vamp "gains X votes, where X is the
number of non-contested votes the vampire with this card has"
What happens if these votes are contested at a later time, does the acting
vamp then lose those votes?
4. Sabbat Threat- "Called by a Prince or Justicar" What ?!?! The
leaders of the Sabbat cannot call for a Sabbat Threat? Has there been an
errata for this? If not, can there be?? This makes no sense.
As you may guess, I'm trying to make a bruise/vote deck. So far it hasn't
worked very well. Most of the effective vote cards require a
prince/justicar. The votes out of the Sabbat expansion are weak when
compared to the camarilla votes. Any suggestions would be greatly
appreciated...
"Chris Michalek" <CMi...@aol.com> writes:
>I'm trying to put together a Lasombra deck. In looking at some of the
>cards, several questions came up.
>
>1. Lisette Vizquel- "Lisette gets +1 intercept against any vampire who
>attempts diablerie." How does this work?
>Does this mean that she gets the intercept for the rest of the game vs.
>vampires who at some point have attempted diablerie? or
>Does she gain the intercept only during an attempted diablerie? in which
>case
She gets +1 intercept against any diablerie attempt.
>Can she attempt to block "any vampire" even if they are not diablerizing a
>vamp of her controller?
As diablerie attempts against vampires controlled by another player are (D)
actions, she can normally attempt to block only diablerie attempts against
vamps of her controller, or by a prey/predator diablerizing his own, _unless_
she also plays an Eagle's Sight, I'd say.
>
>2. Antonio Delgado- "If Antonio performs a successful political action,
>untap him at the end of the turn."
>Does the vote have to pass in order to be considered a "successful
>political action"? or Does the fact that the action is not blocked and
>the referrendum comes to vote designate success?
By the rules, I think this is an unblocked political action. I don't know what
happens if the vote is unblocked but somehow cancelled.
That is, unless there was a ruling/erratum on that, but I don't remember too
many rulings since Sabbat came out :(
>
>3. Political Struggle- The acting vamp "gains X votes, where X is the
>number of non-contested votes the vampire with this card has"
>What happens if these votes are contested at a later time, does the acting
>vamp then lose those votes?
I don't think Political Struggle should be affected, but I'm not sure on this
one.
>
>4. Sabbat Threat- "Called by a Prince or Justicar" What ?!?! The
>leaders of the Sabbat cannot call for a Sabbat Threat? Has there been an
>errata for this? If not, can there be?? This makes no sense.
>
CCG view: it has "Prince/Justicar" on it, so only Princes and Justicars can
call it. No problem.
World of Darkness view: "Sabbat Threat" is a vampire trying to convince his
Camarilla buddies that the Sabbat is really a threat, I'd say, and not really
the Sabbat vamps taking any kind of action, so it should only be called by
Camarilla elders.
One question you left out: what's the word on the two Prisci (Gratiano and
the other I forget) that have an additional vote (Gratiano having one during
the Prisci vote) ? What happens if they lose Priscus status, etc ?
>As you may guess, I'm trying to make a bruise/vote deck. So far it hasn't
>worked very well. Most of the effective vote cards require a
>prince/justicar. The votes out of the Sabbat expansion are weak when
>compared to the camarilla votes. Any suggestions would be greatly
>appreciated...
>
Well... you might try a Writ of Acceptance or use a dummy Camarilla member,
but that somehow defeats the idea of the Lasombra politics (although using
Lasombras as recipients for Cardinal Benedictions and a Camarilla vampire
like Volker (the Puppet Prince) or Vasilis (Traitor of Don Cruez: make him
Brujah Justicar :) as a Camarilla puppet would be fun - probably not
very effective, but fun).
I haven't tried a Sabbat political deck yet, but the Sabbat votes don't seem
too effective in the damage-dealing division, although vote accumulation seems
easy enough (with Cardinal Benediction not being limited clan-wise, and the
Prisci vote bringing 3 votes, possibly for a single Priscus). That's why I'd
probably try a dual-sect deck.
---
Philippe Duchon
duc...@labri.u-bordeaux.fr
"Chris Michalek" <CMi...@aol.com> writes:
>1. Lisette Vizquel- "Lisette gets +1 intercept against any vampire who
>attempts diablerie." How does this work?
>Does this mean that she gets the intercept for the rest of the game vs.
>vampires who at some point have attempted diablerie? or
>Does she gain the intercept only during an attempted diablerie? in which
The latter. She gets +1 intercept during the diablerie action.
>case>Can she attempt to block "any vampire" even if they are not diablerizing a
>vamp of her controller?
Not without the aid of Eagle's sight or somesuch. Having intercept does
not grant you the opportunity to attempt to block.
>2. Antonio Delgado- "If Antonio performs a successful political action,
>untap him at the end of the turn."
>Does the vote have to pass in order to be considered a "successful
>political action"? or Does the fact that the action is not blocked and
>the referrendum comes to vote designate success?
This hasn't been ruled on.
I'd guess that the vote must pass for this effect to happen.
>3. Political Struggle- The acting vamp "gains X votes, where X is the
>number of non-contested votes the vampire with this card has"
>What happens if these votes are contested at a later time, does the acting
>vamp then lose those votes?
No. The X is set when the Political Struggle resolves. It won't change.
>4. Sabbat Threat- "Called by a Prince or Justicar" What ?!?! The
>leaders of the Sabbat cannot call for a Sabbat Threat? Has there been an
>errata for this? If not, can there be?? This makes no sense.
It works fine. The Sabbat can say that they're working in cahoots
with one of the Methuselahs (or his minions) - but until a Kindred
with status in the Camarilla says so, who's going to believe the
Sabbat scum?
No errata has been issued. And I don't think any is needed.
--
L. Scott Johnson (sjoh...@math.sc.edu) | Freedom means choosing
http://www.math.sc.edu/cgi-bin/sjohnson/home | your burden.
Graphics Specialist and V:tES Rulemonger. | -- Hephzibah Menuhin
Chris Michalek (CMi...@aol.com) wrote:
: I'm trying to put together a Lasombra deck. In looking at some of the: cards, several questions came up.: 1. Lisette Vizquel- "Lisette gets +1 intercept against any vampire who: attempts diablerie." How does this work?
: Does this mean that she gets the intercept for the rest of the game vs.
: vampires who at some point have attempted diablerie? or
: Does she gain the intercept only during an attempted diablerie? in which: case
Dunno.
: Can she attempt to block "any vampire" even if they are not diablerizing a
: vamp of her controller?
On the last part, I would assume her ability does not give her special
blocking abilities, but if she used another card to allow her to block
(eagle's sight) then she would still have +1 intercept
: 2. Antonio Delgado- "If Antonio performs a successful political action,: untap him at the end of the turn."
: Does the vote have to pass in order to be considered a "successful
: political action"? or Does the fact that the action is not blocked and
: the referrendum comes to vote designate success?
?
: 3. Political Struggle- The acting vamp "gains X votes, where X is the: number of non-contested votes the vampire with this card has"
: What happens if these votes are contested at a later time, does the acting
: vamp then lose those votes?
?
: 4. Sabbat Threat- "Called by a Prince or Justicar" What ?!?! The: leaders of the Sabbat cannot call for a Sabbat Threat? Has there been an
: errata for this? If not, can there be?? This makes no sense.
This card is from the original set, designed before a Sabbat expansion
was even anticipated. The card treats the Sabbat merely as a dangerous
force that only the most powerful vampires can influence against their
enemies (thus Princes and Justicars--IC members did not exist). The card
title no longer makes sense with the Sabbat expansion, but there is no
other reason to fix the card. It is quite clear about what it does, and
it is not broken.
John Whelan
: As you may guess, I'm trying to make a bruise/vote deck. So far it hasn't[ quoted text not captured ]
In article <01bc01bb$6b385fa0$bed2...@CMichale.byu.edu>, "Chris Michalek"
<CMi...@aol.com> wrote:
>As you may guess, I'm trying to make a bruise/vote deck. So far it hasn't
>worked very well. Most of the effective vote cards require a
>prince/justicar. The votes out of the Sabbat expansion are weak when
>compared to the camarilla votes. Any suggestions would be greatly
>appreciated...
>
I must congratulate you on your attempts at experimentation. This is what I
plan to do with a Lasombra deck, once I get off my butt and build new decks.
Some ideas:
1. Sabbat threat - Try the other card 'Camarilla Threat' from the Sabbat
expansion. It causes any player discarding a card at the end of their turn (ie
during the Discard phase) to burn 1 pool.
2. Try this combo - Political Seizure and Thanks for the Donation. What does
it do? PS is a master card that is put into play and contests a location
(unique or not). When the location is given up by the other player, instead,
the PS card is burned and you get control of the location card. Thanks for the
Donation is a Dominate action that puts the card into play and causes your
prey to pay the contesting cost for one of your cards. However, I think it can
be burned as a directed action.
3. For combat, you got Potence, but try getting your claws on some
Entombments. It's a rare (which may be a good thing) Obtenabration combat card
that burns an ally as a strike or, at superior, sends a vampire to torpor as a
strike.
>>As you may guess, I'm trying to make a bruise/vote deck. So far it hasn't
>>worked very well. Most of the effective vote cards require a
>>prince/justicar. The votes out of the Sabbat expansion are weak when
>>compared to the camarilla votes. Any suggestions would be greatly
>>appreciated...
>>>I must congratulate you on your attempts at experimentation. This is what I
>plan to do with a Lasombra deck, once I get off my butt and build new decks.
>
>Some ideas:
>
>1. Sabbat threat - Try the other card 'Camarilla Threat' from the Sabbat
>expansion. It causes any player discarding a card at the end of their turn
(ie
>during the Discard phase) to burn 1 pool.
That seems nice, but be sure that you won't burn too much pool that way
yourself.
Other nice votes are Transfer of Power (gain 1 pool from every player who has
more pool than you) and Political Stranglehold (each meth. gains 3 pool per
vampire of 8 cap and more). I know the first one doesn't beat Parity Shift,
and the other is good only in a deck with big vamps, but do remember that KRC
and Conservative Agitation do not need princes.
>2. Try this combo - Political Seizure and Thanks for the Donation. What does
>it do? PS is a master card that is put into play and contests a location
>(unique or not). When the location is given up by the other player, instead,
>the PS card is burned and you get control of the location card. Thanks for
the
>Donation is a Dominate action that puts the card into play and causes your
>prey to pay the contesting cost for one of your cards. However, I think it
can
>be burned as a directed action.
It works just wonderfully. But be sure to load your deck with these cards, as
they are best used in combo (a Thanks for the Donation is pretty useless by
itself). And be sure to keep some stealth to help this action, as your prey
will do everything to block it (especially if he owns the contested card).
The only way one can get rid of PS is by yielding the card, but unfortunatly,
the Thanks for the Donation may indeed be burned by a D action.
>3. For combat, you got Potence, but try getting your claws on some
>Entombments. It's a rare (which may be a good thing) Obtenabration combat
card
>that burns an ally as a strike or, at superior, sends a vampire to torpor as
a
>strike.
And don't forget Arms of the Abyss, for dodge and an additional strike. It's
so nice to see a Tremere play cauldron of blood for 5 to somebody who isn't
quite there, then comes out of the shadows for a high potence strike.
And if you really want to use prince votes, add Constanza Vinti and Donal
O'Connor to your crypt. They cost a lot, but they are princes, camarilla and
have Dominate and Potence.
Philippe Richer