Suppose Fatima is equipped with an Assault Rifle and Ivory Bow, and
also has hired a Ghoul Retainer. Suppose further this is a Storyline
event and she's just Blurred with the Rifle at range against Lambach
who had 10 blood and the Eye of Hazimel.
Lambach is going to burn (yay!) but can Fatima play Draught of the
Soul?
On 22 Sep 2003 21:53:35 -0700, jeff...@hotmail.com (Jeff Kuta)
scrawled:
[ quoted text not captured ]
How is Lambach going to burn?
Assuming the Ghoul Retainer uses the Ivory Bow, it happens during
normal strike resolution, sending Lambach to torpor before additional
strikes.
Assuming Fatima is using the Ivory Bow, at any given strike Lambach
will only be taking 1 agg damage, sending him to torpor.
If Lambach was at 3 blood to start, and you did 4 with the rifle and 1
agg with the bow in the initial strikes, Lambach would burn. (X+2=5,
where X=3)
The Ghoul Retainer does not gain any additional strikes of it's
employer.
salem
domain:canberra http://www.geocities.com/salem_christ.geo/vtes.htm
salem expounded:
> On 22 Sep 2003 21:53:35 -0700, jeff...@hotmail.com (Jeff Kuta)
> scrawled:
>
> >Suppose Fatima is equipped with an Assault Rifle and Ivory Bow, and
> >also has hired a Ghoul Retainer. Suppose further this is a Storyline
> >event and she's just Blurred with the Rifle at range against Lambach
> >who had 10 blood and the Eye of Hazimel.
> >
> >Lambach is going to burn (yay!) but can Fatima play Draught of the
> >Soul?
>
> How is Lambach going to burn?
>
> Assuming the Ghoul Retainer uses the Ivory Bow, it happens during
> normal strike resolution, sending Lambach to torpor before additional
> strikes.
>
> Assuming Fatima is using the Ivory Bow, at any given strike Lambach
> will only be taking 1 agg damage, sending him to torpor.
>
> If Lambach was at 3 blood to start, and you did 4 with the rifle and 1
> agg with the bow in the initial strikes, Lambach would burn. (X+2=5,
> where X=3)
Nope. The Ghoul would wound him and Fatima would send him to topor. You
need at least 2 Agg damage to burn someone.
He doesn't burn. Suppose Fatima was grappled by Lambach on 0 blood and
the Retainer was packing a flamethrower -then what? I would say that
Fatima didn't burn Lambach (her retainer did) and so she can't Draught
the Soul.
On Tue, 23 Sep 2003 09:27:08 +0100, Timlagor
<Timlagor...@yahoo.com> scrawled:
>salem expounded:
[snip]
>> If Lambach was at 3 blood to start, and you did 4 with the rifle and 1
>> agg with the bow in the initial strikes, Lambach would burn. (X+2=5,
>> where X=3)>
>Nope. The Ghoul would wound him and Fatima would send him to topor. You
>need at least 2 Agg damage to burn someone.
Nope. :)
He is taking 4 normal and 1 agg all at the same time, the initial
strike resolution phase.
you handle normal first, then agg.
so, he burns 1,2,3 blood for the first 3 points of normal damage. he's
taking another normal damage, he has no blood to heal, so he becomes
wounded. the then wounded Lambach handles the point of agg. when a
wounded vamp takes agg, it must burn a blood or be burned. lambach has
no blood at that point, so he burns.
you just need x+2 damage, where _at least_ 1 is agg, to burn someone.
the damage all has to be being applied at the same time, though.
it's all there in the rulebook.
>He doesn't burn.
Yes he does. :)
> Suppose Fatima was grappled by Lambach on 0 blood and
>the Retainer was packing a flamethrower -then what? I would say that
>Fatima didn't burn Lambach (her retainer did) and so she can't Draught
>the Soul.
I'd be inclined to aggree on that point.
If the retainer and fatima were both doing agg to lambach at the same
time, i guess the acting minion gets to choose which order the agg is
applied, to determine whether fatima or the retainer burns lambach?
[ quoted text not captured ]
salem expounded:
> >He doesn't burn.
>
> Yes he does. :)
Silly of me. Thought you could choose which damage you took first -soon
as I posted it I decided I'd better check.. too late then. I probably
got muddled with prevention which you can choose for.
> > Suppose Fatima was grappled by Lambach on 0 blood and
> >the Retainer was packing a flamethrower -then what? I would say that
> >Fatima didn't burn Lambach (her retainer did) and so she can't Draught
> >the Soul.
>
> I'd be inclined to aggree on that point.
>
> If the retainer and fatima were both doing agg to lambach at the same
> time, i guess the acting minion gets to choose which order the agg is
> applied, to determine whether fatima or the retainer burns lambach?
Dunno. Someone told me that with Horrid Reality (sup) on Illusions of
the Kindred, the acting Meth got to decide which would burn first -if
that's right then presumably the same applies here; seems silly to me
though: you ought to be able to choose the order for your own effects!
[hmm no inverted commas in that sentence ;/}
Timlagor
I try not to be right if I can help it ;)
[ quoted text not captured ]
The flaw in the set-up has already been pointed out.
But, if the flaw is worked out and Lambach burns during the resolution
of Fatima's strike (with or without the help of the retainer), Fatima
can play Draught of the Soul.
--
LSJ (vte...@white-wolf.com) V:TES Net.Rep for White Wolf, Inc.
Links to V:TES news, rules, cards, utilities, and tournament calendar:
http://www.white-wolf.com/vtes/
salem <salem_ch...@yahoo.com> wrote in message news:<nskvmvc8f7stjds6b...@4ax.com>...
[ quoted text not captured ]
Ok. So perhaps the situation can't be as dramatic as I would wish, but
the question is still valid: If a vampire with Quietus employs a Ghoul
Retainer which wields the weapon that causes their opponent in combat
to be burned, may the vampire play Draught of the Soul?
Jeff Kuta wrote:
> Ok. So perhaps the situation can't be as dramatic as I would wish, but
> the question is still valid: If a vampire with Quietus employs a Ghoul
> Retainer which wields the weapon that causes their opponent in combat
> to be burned, may the vampire play Draught of the Soul?
If that vampire was in on the burning, yes.
If the vampire dodges while the Ghoul uses a Bang Nakh in a Dawn Operation,
no (since the vampire didn't "burn another vampire" as required by card
text).
If the vampire punches for 1 and the Ghoul uses a Flamethrower for 2 agg
against a vampire that has only 1 blood and doesn't prevent, then yes.
[ quoted text not captured ]
On 23 Sep 2003, Jeff Kuta wrote:
> Ok. So perhaps the situation can't be as dramatic as I would wish, but
> the question is still valid: If a vampire with Quietus employs a Ghoul
> Retainer which wields the weapon that causes their opponent in combat
> to be burned, may the vampire play Draught of the Soul?
Scott replied to this. Yes, she can play DotS.
David Cherryholmes
Duke Radiology
P.E.T. Facility
(919) 684-7714
david.che...@duke.edu
LSJ <vte...@white-wolf.com> wrote in message news:<3F7036D7...@white-wolf.com>...
> Jeff Kuta wrote:
> > Suppose Fatima is equipped with an Assault Rifle and Ivory Bow, and
> > also has hired a Ghoul Retainer. Suppose further this is a Storyline
> > event and she's just Blurred with the Rifle at range against Lambach
> > who had 10 blood and the Eye of Hazimel.
> >
> > Lambach is going to burn (yay!) but can Fatima play Draught of the
> > Soul?
>
> The flaw in the set-up has already been pointed out.
>
> But, if the flaw is worked out and Lambach burns during the resolution
> of Fatima's strike (with or without the help of the retainer), Fatima
> can play Draught of the Soul.
So I assume that in the Lambach-with-3-blood hypothesis one must
DECLARE that the Retainer is using the rifle and Fatima is using the
Ivory. Is it correct?
I know it seems obvious, but sometimes I get to play against people
who don't care to declare correctly their strikes. They assume it's
enough to burn a vampire, as it is, but in this case the declaration
is a requirement to play another card.
[]s
the_capuchin
the_capuchin wrote:
> So I assume that in the Lambach-with-3-blood hypothesis one must
> DECLARE that the Retainer is using the rifle and Fatima is using the
> Ivory. Is it correct?
The minion must always declare a strike during the choose strikes phase,
of course.
Fatima need not be the one using the Bow, however, since the effects are
applied simultaneously.
[ quoted text not captured ]
LSJ <vte...@white-wolf.com> wrote in message news:<3F707E53...@white-wolf.com>...
> Jeff Kuta wrote:
> > Ok. So perhaps the situation can't be as dramatic as I would wish, but
> > the question is still valid: If a vampire with Quietus employs a Ghoul
> > Retainer which wields the weapon that causes their opponent in combat
> > to be burned, may the vampire play Draught of the Soul?
>
> If that vampire was in on the burning, yes.
> If the vampire dodges while the Ghoul uses a Bang Nakh in a Dawn Operation,
> no (since the vampire didn't "burn another vampire" as required by card
> text).
> If the vampire punches for 1 and the Ghoul uses a Flamethrower for 2 agg
> against a vampire that has only 1 blood and doesn't prevent, then yes.
Thanks for answering in both parts of the thread. Google's delay and all...