New Preview is up !

Army of Apparition Reaction Usable by a tapped vampire. Chi : Only usable during a referendum. Gain 3 votes. CHI : Only usable when an ally or younger vampire is taking a D action directed at a minion you control. This vampire burns 2 blood to cause the action to en (unsuccessfully). Sha-Ennu anyone ? -- Orpheus ----------- "And crawling on the planet's face Some insects called the Human Race Out of time and out of space And meaning..." The Rocky Horror Picture Show

[ quoted text not captured ] anti pto system - nothing else

Wow, I've been the first to post it ! lol. So it looks like it will be a preview every other day, including week-ends (or at least saturdays)... Now for the card itself : > Army of Apparition The art looks nice, BTW, although the screen resolution is bad. > Reaction > Usable by a tapped vampire. > > Chi : Only usable during a referendum. Gain 3 votes. Nice. Could be used in a Mata Hari and / or Tsunda deck (although with Eldest it would be sort of overkill), just in case... > CHI : Only usable when an ally or younger vampire is taking a D action > directed at a minion you control. This vampire burns 2 blood to cause the > action to en (unsuccessfully). Costly, which is always a bummer in CHI. Let's hope to see another Gabrin-like ability in new vamps. But the effect is solid, of course. Works only on younger is a downer, but as you don't have to be untapped you just have to use your bigger vamp. It could help Spider-Killer, or of course... > Sha-Ennu anyone ? Yes, I concur with myself, ;-) the flexibility of vote reaction / D protection is nice, especially with an 11-Cap (ok, Enkidu still owns him, he'll just need his Sensory, that's all !!). And then, doesn't Sha just *need* a For or Pre skill ? [ quoted text not captured ]

<AcheronNi...@gmail.com> wrote in message news:1188655205.6...@d55g2000hsg.googlegroups.com... > On 1 Wrz, 15:55, "Orpheus" <orpheus...@free.fr> wrote: >> Army of Apparition >> >> Reaction >> Usable by a tapped vampire. >> >> Chi : Only usable during a referendum. Gain 3 votes. >> CHI : Only usable when an ally or younger vampire is taking a D action >> directed at a minion you control. This vampire burns 2 blood to cause the >> action to en (unsuccessfully). > anti pto system - nothing else Errrm, surely you mean, anti pto-rush-sensory-mindrape, not to mention war ghoul-stealing, and not much else ? ;-)

In article <1188655205.6...@d55g2000hsg.googlegroups.com>, AcheronNi...@gmail.com wrote: > anti pto system - nothing else I'm pretty certain that PTO isn't a (D) action, so this wouldn't help. It does help against Rush and, well, counter Sensory Deprivation... Peter D Bakija pd...@lightlink.com http://www.lightlink.com/pdb6/vtes.html "Find hungry samurai." -The Old Man

On 1 Wrz, 16:07, "Orpheus" <orpheus...@free.fr> wrote: > <AcheronNightStal...@gmail.com> wrote in message [ quoted text not captured ] exacly :)

> > CHI : Only usable when an ally or younger vampire is taking a D action > > directed at a minion you control. This vampire burns 2 blood to cause the > > action to en (unsuccessfully). > > Costly, which is always a bummer in CHI. Let's hope to see another > Gabrin-like ability in new vamps. But the effect is solid, of course. Works > only on younger is a downer, but as you don't have to be untapped you just > have to use your bigger vamp. It could help Spider-Killer, or of course... Unfortunately, the cost of the card is technically zero - Path/Gabrin- like effects/other cost reducers won't affect this. The cost of the card is zero; the effect of the card is 'burn 2 blood to end the action.' and there really isn't anyway to reduce the amount of blood burned. -John Flournoy

[ quoted text not captured ] Too bad blood hunts are atomic so AoA can't be played there, but still, tapped vampires can play it and that's not so bad. I'd say burning 2 blood to END an action like Bum's Rush or Temptation to be very nice. The acting minion is tapped and that's it. No Freak Drive for you. Jeff

[ quoted text not captured ] Blood Hunts have referendums. It's not a PA, so why can't AoA be played there?

On Sep 1, 11:11 pm, Jyhad <jy...@storageannex.com> wrote: > On Sep 1, 2:01 pm, Jeff Kuta <jeff.k...@gmail.com> wrote: > > Too bad blood hunts are atomic so AoA can't be played there, but > > still, tapped vampires can play it and that's not so bad. > > Blood Hunts have referendums. It's not a PA, so why can't AoA be > played there? If someone is diablerising within an action when it's not your turn, I'd say you can play AoA in the blood hunt referendum.

[ quoted text not captured ] There is no window for cards to be played during Blood Hunts because they are considered "atomic" meaning minions can't use effects during them. But, Methuselahs may still gain votes from Political Action cards, the Edge, or Masters like Ventrue Headquarters or Vox Senis. Jeff ========== 6.5.6. The Blood Hunt ... When a vampire commits diablerie, a referendum is automatically conducted to determine if a blood hunt will be called on the diablerist. If the referendum passes, a blood hunt is called, and the diablerist is burned. This referendum is not an action, so it cannot be blocked, and action modifiers and reaction cards cannot be played. Otherwise, this referendum is handled just like any other.

JH skrev: [ quoted text not captured ] Nopes, see the part about 'atomic' above. Sten -- More ramblings at http://yapvamp.blogspot.com -- Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com

[ quoted text not captured ] There is still a referendum and the card specifically states that it's played during a referendum. However, the fact that it has the no reactions in it make it useless. Unlike Ventrue HQ which you can tap or the like.

> Blood Hunts have referendums. It's not a PA, so why can't AoA be > played there? Blood Hunts are not an action. You can't play a reaction if there's no action going on.

[ quoted text not captured ] there technically are Blood Hunt actions, but that card is just an analog to War Party and not related to the blood hunt referendums you are talking about. just being a cheeky monkey! :D

[ quoted text not captured ] Blood hunt referendums aren't part of any action, so no action mods/ reactions can be played since there is no action to modifty/react to.

Jyhad wrote: > Blood Hunts have referendums. It's not a PA, so why can't AoA be > played there? Because of explicit rules text: This referendum is not an action, so it cannot be blocked, and action modifiers and reaction cards cannot be played. http://www.white-wolf.com/vtes/rulebook/rulebook.html#sec6_5_6

Peter D Bakija <pd...@lightlink.com> wrote in news:pdb6- A593BF.105...@news-server.stny.rr.com: > In article <1188655205.6...@d55g2000hsg.googlegroups.com>, > AcheronNi...@gmail.com wrote: > >> anti pto system - nothing else > > I'm pretty certain that PTO isn't a (D) action, so this wouldn't help. > > It does help against Rush and, well, counter Sensory Deprivation... > Erm. The card has an inferior version, Pete. DZ AW

In article <Xns999FCBD3618DDat...@207.115.17.102>, atomweaver <atomw...@spamtrap.com> wrote: > Erm. The card has an inferior version, Pete. Uh, gain 3 votes? That isn't saving you from PTO. I figured the OP was assuming you could use the superior to save you from the PTO, not the unferior vote gain. I could be wrong, though... [ quoted text not captured ]

On 3 Wrz, 05:09, Peter D Bakija <p...@lightlink.com> wrote: > In article <Xns999FCBD3618DDatomweaversbcglob...@207.115.17.102>, > > atomweaver <atomwea...@spamtrap.com> wrote: > > Erm. The card has an inferior version, Pete. > > Uh, gain 3 votes? That isn't saving you from PTO. I figured the OP was > assuming you could use the superior to save you from the PTO, not the > unferior vote gain. I could be wrong, though... > > Peter D Bakija > p...@lightlink.comhttp://www.lightlink.com/pdb6/vtes.html > > "Find hungry samurai." > -The Old Man correct - you are wrong :) it is vote deck anti-pto and fatty deck anti-everythin else

Re: Reactions and blood hunts... LSJ wrote: > This referendum is not an action, so it cannot be blocked, and action modifiers > and reaction cards cannot be played. > > http://www.white-wolf.com/vtes/rulebook/rulebook.html#sec6_5_6 So if the reacting vampire were to play a reaction which gained votes in response to, say, a diablerie action (i.e. before the BH has started) would the vamp still have those votes during the BH? For clarity: Player A declares a diablerie action. Player B plays *insert vote gaining reaction here* Player B declines to block Minion is diablerised and a BH ensues.... Player B still has +X votes, or the action has ended and been resolved and thus doesn't have the votes anymore? (I guess the same question applies to Player A playing modifiers like Iron Glare too)

RocketEddy schrieb: [ quoted text not captured ] You can´t play vote gaining reactions during a diablerie action, because all of them have "only usable during a referendum" in their card text. Same applies for modifiers. At least for all the cards I checked, but I don´t think I missed one ;-) -- Johannes Walch

[ quoted text not captured ] There aren't exactly shitloads of vote decks using chimerstry, mainly because there are only two worthville titled vamps with "chi", Sha- Ennu and Tsunda, and they don't combo with each other at all. This might change after the new edition though. Arika can easily get nine votes just with one Bewitching Oration (not to mention Awe, Ventrue HQ etc), so your "3 votes against" will just mean that she voter captivates for 3 blood less - THAT will surely make her controller cry, really.

In article <1188805403.7...@g4g2000hsf.googlegroups.com>, AcheronNi...@gmail.com wrote: > correct - you are wrong :) it is vote deck anti-pto and fatty deck > anti-everythin else I dunno man, I'm not seeing it. If you are relying on the "gain 3 votes" part of the card to save you from PTO, you aren't getting real far--when is PTO ever not pushed through with Awe, in which case the gain 3 votes isn't doing much at all? Instead of the "gain 3 votes", you be better off with Delaying Tactics. Or Confusion of the Eye (if you are Mata Hari...) You know how many Ravnos you are going to have to have untapped or Waked to play "Gain 3 votes" cards to save you from a PTO? Well, ok, I don't have an exact number, but it is likely more than you have... Peter D Bakija pd...@lightlink.com [ quoted text not captured ]

On 3 Wrz, 15:38, Peter D Bakija <p...@lightlink.com> wrote: > In article <1188805403.748582.297...@g4g2000hsf.googlegroups.com>, > > AcheronNightStal...@gmail.com wrote: > > correct - you are wrong :) it is vote deck anti-pto and fatty deck > > anti-everythin else > > I dunno man, I'm not seeing it. If you are relying on the "gain 3 votes" > part of the card to save you from PTO, you aren't getting real far--when > is PTO ever not pushed through with Awe, in which case the gain 3 votes > isn't doing much at all? Instead of the "gain 3 votes", you be better > off with Delaying Tactics. Or Confusion of the Eye (if you are Mata > Hari...) > > You know how many Ravnos you are going to have to have untapped or Waked > to play "Gain 3 votes" cards to save you from a PTO? Well, ok, I don't > have an exact number, but it is likely more than you have... > > Peter D Bakija > p...@lightlink.comhttp://www.lightlink.com/pdb6/vtes.html > > "Find hungry samurai." > -The Old Man you dont need to be untapped to play the card :) - it is good anti-pto not for ravnos but for sha-ennu :) and more than one can be played (and DI to cancel AWE)

[ quoted text not captured ] > (and DI to cancel AWE)- Tekst uit oorspronkelijk bericht niet weergeven - Right, instead of DI-ng the PTO. Or is that to simple? ;-)

[ quoted text not captured ] if you're playing sha-ennu and want him to tap and burn blood Direct on AWE is better :)

In article <1188827978.1...@y42g2000hsy.googlegroups.com>, AcheronNi...@gmail.com wrote: > you dont need to be untapped to play the card :) - it is good anti-pto > not for ravnos but for sha-ennu :) and more than one can be played > (and DI to cancel AWE) Ooohhh. That makes it a bit better. But even then, well, seems like probably not enough to save you most of the time. And if you have the DI for the Awe, why not just DI the PTO? :-) Peter D Bakija pd...@lightlink.com [ quoted text not captured ]

>> > you dont need to be untapped to play the card :) - it is good anti-pto >> > not for ravnos but for sha-ennu :) and more than one can be played >> > (and DI to cancel AWE)- Tekst uit oorspronkelijk bericht niet >> > weergeven - >> >> Right, instead of DI-ng the PTO. Or is that to simple? ;-) I think the "get votes" part can also be seen from a cycling angle : you keep the card in case or a D action but there is no rusher, no Sensorifier and it clucks your deck ? Just call the 3 votes at the first sight of a referendum and you're set : no blood, can be played untapped, it will cycle easy. ------- Orpheus, all for easy cycling.

[ quoted text not captured ] Speaking of which, there must be a deck out there with Mata Hari and a bunch of chi weenies using Elder Kindred Network and cards you can vote to get rid of (Camarilla Threat and Anarch Revolt being some good examples...). best - chris -- Super Fun Cards http://stores.ebay.com/superfuncards/ auct...@superfuncards.com

>> So if the reacting vampire were to play a reaction which gained votes >> in response to, say, a diablerie action (i.e. before the BH has >> started) would the vamp still have those votes during the BH? >> >> For clarity: >> Player A declares a diablerie action. >> Player B plays *insert vote gaining reaction here* >> Player B declines to block >> Minion is diablerised and a BH ensues.... >> >> Player B still has +X votes, or the action has ended and been resolved >> and thus doesn't have the votes anymore? >> (I guess the same question applies to Player A playing modifiers like >> Iron Glare too) > > Yes. Hum, when a question is "is it A OR B" I'm not quite sure what a "Yes" should mean...

On Sep 3, 2:15 pm, "Orpheus" wrote: > >> Player B still has +X votes, or the action has ended and been resolved > >> and thus doesn't have the votes anymore? > >> (I guess the same question applies to Player A playing modifiers like > >> Iron Glare too) > > > Yes. > > Hum, when a question is "is it A OR B" I'm not quite sure what a "Yes" > should mean... I'm assuming he meant "yes, the latter" (meaning that the minions don't have the votes anymore at the BH), but I'm confused too. The original example mentioned a vote gaining reaction card being played in response to a diablerie action - a situation I don't believe is possible, since all such cards are only playable during referenda as of today, IIRC. It's not clear to me if the example was meant to be hypothetical. Abraço, Luiz Mello Brazil VTES NC -- IV Brazilian National Championship Vitória, October 12th to 14th, 2007 http://cbr2007.vtesbrasil.com

[ quoted text not captured ] I was answering the first question, and just assumed that the "for clarity" part was merely clarity, not alteration. The question: >>> So if the reacting vampire were to play a reaction which gained votes >>> in response to, say, a diablerie action (i.e. before the BH has >>> started) would the vamp still have those votes during the BH? The answer: >> Yes.

[ quoted text not captured ] How is it possible that you would gain votes by playing a reaction card in a diablerie action under the current card set? I don't see how this is applicable. Comments Welcome, Norman S. Brown, Jr XZealot Archon of the Swamp

[ quoted text not captured ] A hypothetical reaction similar to Those Who Endure Judge. The ruling applies equally to such action modfiers (although Those Who Endure has explicit reminder text to this effect).

On Sep 4, 9:11 am, LSJ <vtes...@white-wolf.com> wrote: [ quoted text not captured ] Tapping a vampire with Census Taker on her is the closest that I could come up with. Vegas gNat

[ quoted text not captured ] Sure. But that could be done during the blood hunt referendum as well, so the issue of sneaking it in early isn't as interesting as it would be for a true reaction card effect.