rules questions: anyone?

Undead Persistence: Can this card be used in combast even if the vampire has no blood? If so, doesn't this give a vampire who has no blood a free strike with no extra damage on him?

Boon Sian Chang wrote: > > Undead Persistence: > > Can this card be used in combast even if the vampire has no blood? If so, doesn't this give a vampire who has no blood a free strike with no extra damage on him? Yes. Undead Persistence has no cost, so can be used in either the inferior or the superior mode at no cost. I don't quite follow the second sentence. An empty vampire, if he takes any damage, can use inferior Undead Persistence to gain a press and delay going to torpor, yes. If the press remains uncanceled (the opposing minion doesn't press to end), then a second round of combat will occur, during which both combatants will be able to strike. The opponent's strike will likely have no effect, since the vampire is empty and is protected from going to Torpor. The vampire will still end up in Torpor at the end of the combat. If this counts as getting "Free" strike, then I guess it is. -- L. Scott Johnson (vte...@regency.wizards.com) Official VtES Net.Rep for Wizards of the Coast. (*) - Subject to review by Rules Team

In article <5hbvsj$a...@ds2.acs.ucalgary.ca>, bsc...@acs3.acs.ucalgary.ca (Boon Sian Chang) writes: > >Undead Persistence: > >Can this card be used in combast even if the vampire has no blood? If so, >doesn't this give a vampire who has no blood a free strike with no extra >damage on him? > Yes it can be used if a vampire has no blood (inferior, of course). As for the free strike, that is wrong, the vamp still suffers damage next round, so if that damage is aggravated then he will be burnt. Otherwise the vampire just takes a licking and keeps on ticking. Chance Chance "If you think you can, you're right. If you think you can't, you're right!" -- Henry Ford

I'm a little unsure of the wording for TRAP, as well as for Undead Persistence. Both basically say combat continues until 3 rounds of combat pass with no cards being played. What does this mean, exactly? I know Trap has a press to continue combat each round, so I'm assuming it keeps both vampires in combat for at least 3 rounds after the last card was played. But Undead Persistence only has one press, so how does it continue combat for another 3 rounds? Or am I reading this wrong?

L. Scott Johnson wrote: > > Boon Sian Chang wrote: > > > > Undead Persistence: > > > > Can this card be used in combast even if the vampire has no blood? If so, doesn't this give a vampire who has no blood a free strike with no extra damage on > > Yes. Undead Persistence has no cost, so can be used in either the > inferior or the superior mode at no cost. > > I don't quite follow the second sentence. > > An empty vampire, if he takes any damage, can use inferior Undead > Persistence to gain a press and delay going to torpor, yes. > > If the press remains uncanceled (the opposing minion doesn't press > to end), then a second round of combat will occur, during which > both combatants will be able to strike. The opponent's strike > will likely have no effect, since the vampire is empty and is > protected from going to Torpor. > > The vampire will still end up in Torpor at the end of the combat. > > If this counts as getting "Free" strike, then I guess it is. > > -- > L. Scott Johnson (vte...@regency.wizards.com) > Official VtES Net.Rep for Wizards of the Coast. > (*) - Subject to review by Rules Team Just as a point of interest Undead Persisstance at the superior doesn't prevent said vampire from Burning from aggro dam does it??

>Just as a point of interest Undead Persisstance at the superior >doesn't prevent said vampire from Burning from aggro dam does it?? At superior, of course it does, because it prevents damage. At inferior, which was the subject, no, it don't, because burning and going to torpor are different things. --- Liam Burke "Only a Malkavian would attack Cthulhu with laughing gas..." -overheard

Boon Sian Chang wrote: > > I'm a little unsure of the wording for TRAP, as well as for Undead Persistence. Both basically say combat continues until 3 rounds of combat pass with no cards being played. What does > this mean, exactly? I know Trap has a press to continue combat each round, so I'm assuming > it keeps both vampires in combat for at least 3 rounds after the last card was played. Correct. > But > Undead Persistence only has one press, so how does it continue combat for another 3 rounds? It does not. It has only one press built in, so other presses would be reuired to have the combat continue for three rounds. The easiest Way to do this is with a Trap. [ quoted text not captured ]

Karl Innes wrote: > Just as a point of interest Undead Persisstance at the superior > doesn't prevent said vampire from Burning from aggro dam does it?? No. If you take aggravated damage that you don't prevent and cannot burn blood for, you are burned. Undead Persistence's protection from Torpor will not save you from the ash heap. [ quoted text not captured ]

Boon Sian Chang wrote: > > I'm a little unsure of the wording for TRAP, as well as for Undead Persistence. Both basically say combat continues until 3 rounds of combat pass with no cards > this mean, exactly? I know Trap has a press to continue combat each round, so I'm assuming > it keeps both vampires in combat for at least 3 rounds after the last card was played. But > Undead Persistence only has one press, so how does it continue combat for another 3 rounds? > Or am I reading this wrong? > > The minor version of Undead persistance allows you to remain active until three rounds of combat are resolved without either player using any cards, or until the combat ends. (When one of these two conditions is met the vamp goes to torpor. Ie: if you cannot press to continue the combat ends, and the vampire goes to torpor) It only provides ONE press, so without other sources to press the combat, UP cannot keep the combat going for any more than 2 rounds. ( the original combat and the one pressed combat.) It simply allows you to perservere IF you can keep the combat going. Trap automatically provides a press to continue during each press phase. This continues until three rounds pass without any cards being played by any Meth. (they need not be consecutive rounds.) If you want to take full advantage of the card Undead Persistance try using it in conjuntion with Trap. This can cause loooong cambats where your tiny vamps with fort can drag big vamps into torpor with them. Just watch out for aggro damage, UP won't protect you from being burnt. Hope this helps, Karl

Karl Innes wrote: > > Trap automatically provides a press to continue during each > press phase. This continues until three rounds pass without any cards > being played by any Meth. (they need not be consecutive rounds.) The *do* need to be consecutive rounds. Trap provides a press for the round if a card has been played in this round or in the round before this round or in the round before that. [ quoted text not captured ]

Uh-oh. I just got another degenerate deck idea after reading this posting. How about a weenie fortitude deck with a TON of Undead Persistences. Tiny little vamps with 1 or 2 cap, who bleed like only a weenie horde can. If combat occurs, use as many UPs as necessary to drag the opposing minion to hell with you. Maybe sprinkle the deck with a few other damage prevention cards in case of aggravated damage... Nick >Boon Sian Chang wrote: >> >> I'm a little unsure of the wording for TRAP, as well as for Undead Persistence. Both basically say combat continues until 3 rounds of >combat pass with no cards >> this mean, exactly? I know Trap has a press to continue combat each round, so I'm assuming >> it keeps both vampires in combat for at least 3 rounds after the last card was played. But >> Undead Persistence only has one press, so how does it continue combat for another 3 rounds? >> Or am I reading this wrong? >> >> The minor version of Undead persistance allows you to remain >active until three rounds of combat are resolved without either player >using any cards, or until the combat ends. (When one of these two >conditions is met the vamp goes to torpor. Ie: if you cannot press to >continue the combat ends, and the vampire goes to torpor) > It only provides ONE press, so without other sources to press >the combat, UP cannot keep the combat going for any more than 2 rounds. >( the original combat and the one pressed combat.) It simply allows you >to perservere IF you can keep the combat going. > Trap automatically provides a press to continue during each >press phase. This continues until three rounds pass without any cards >being played by any Meth. (they need not be consecutive rounds.) > If you want to take full advantage of the card Undead [ quoted text not captured ]

Good Idea I had a simular idea when I put my deak together, I put in 3 young vamps in (2 G1 and 1 G2) The idea is to get thouse three out frist while I work on the 3 G10's and start the bleed going, but you are really blood thursty. Michael O'Connor Michael....@prodigy.com http://pages.prodigy.com/CrazyMike