Undogdgable strikes and dodges

Hi all, This came up in a game today and I couldn't answer one way or another... If the acting minion has a strike that cannot be dodged (say, from Shadow Feint) can the other minion play a strike dodge anyway (thus attempting and failing to dodge, and getting smacked about by the Assamite)? If so, then if the strike is a "Strike: dodge + <something>" (say, Arms of the Abyss), does the <something> (additional strike) happen, or is it cancelled, since the strike failed? I'm fairly sure that these questions would have come up before and one of you fine people can help me out! :) Cheers!

Hmm, I wonder if by unDOGdgable strike, I was somehow thinkin' of dem fun guys, da wool-ufs?.... "Blargleman" <glen_r...@optusnet.com.au> wrote in message news:3f51ca17$0$6524$afc3...@news.optusnet.com.au... [ quoted text not captured ]

"Blargleman" <glen_r...@optusnet.com.au> wrote in message news:3f51ca17$0$6524$afc3...@news.optusnet.com.au... > Hi all, > > This came up in a game today and I couldn't answer one way or another... > > If the acting minion has a strike that cannot be dodged (say, from Shadow > Feint) can the other minion play a strike dodge anyway Nope. "Cannot dodge" also means cannot play a 'strike : dodge' card, or use a special ability like 'may burn one blood for a dodge' . *Note that if the 'dodge cancelling' card is played after the dodge itself , the dodge is still played but for no effect -although other stuff on the card count. Ex : superior Vampiric speed versus Scorpion sting, the dodge from the Vampiric speed has no effect but the "optional press" is still in effect. (this should answer your other question)

In message <3f51ce51$0$26820$79c1...@nan-newsreader-01.noos.net>, Reyda <true_...@hotmail.com> writes: >*Note that if the 'dodge cancelling' card is played after the dodge itself , >the dodge is still played but for no effect -although other stuff on the >card count. That should be something like: if the Dodge cancelling card resolves after the Dodge is played The order of playing Scorpion Sting (cannot be dodged) vs Dodge (or any other Dodge strike) is not relevant. Scorpion Sting has not resolved, so its text "Cannot be dodged" is not yet in force. When it *does* resolve, it will still take effect, however, and Scorpion Sting will take effect, despite the Dodge. [LSJ 20010423] http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=3B0A71F6%40MailAndNews.com However, Shadow Feint has *already* resolved (because normal combat cards, unlike strike cards, resolve when played), so its restriction is in force. I can't find an explicit ruling from LSJ on Shadow Feint on this[0], but in general, if something cannot be done, you cannot attempt it. So Shadow Feint should prevent Dodges being played. [0] Most of them appear to be explaining how First Strike works. -- James Coupe PGP Key: 0x5D623D5D Lucky that my breasts are small and humble, EBD690ECD7A1FB457CA2 So you don't confuse them with mountains. 13D7E668C3695D623D5D

This is more in line with what I thought... if it hasn't resolved yet, it cannot yet affect what you are doing (or attempting to do). It still isn't an 'answer' as such (to a non-strike card 'cannot be dodged'). I assumed that this question should have come up before. Perhaps it hasn't. This also doesn't answer the second part: does the <something> that is part of the dodge (that subsequently failed) + <something> still happen? There is no rule in the book that I can see that says that a failed dodge attempt cancels the card and its affects. Does Acrobatics (at sup) that gets hit by a Scorpion Sting (for example) still have an additional strike? If not and the card was 'cancelled' can I then play, say, a Blur? LSJ? Might need your call on this one! :) Cheers! "James Coupe" <ja...@zephyr.org.uk> wrote in message news:GPiJyDQw8dU$Ew...@gratiano.zephyr.org.uk... [ quoted text not captured ]

On Mon, 1 Sep 2003 11:33:47 +1000, "Blargleman" <glen_r...@optusnet.com.au> wrote: >This is more in line with what I thought... if it hasn't resolved yet, it >cannot yet affect what you are doing (or attempting to do). It still isn't >an 'answer' as such (to a non-strike card 'cannot be dodged'). I assumed >that this question should have come up before. Perhaps it hasn't. What question? Common Usenet etiquette states that you respond beneath the portion of the post to which you are replying. The first paragraph I read in this message is yours, and what you wrote makes no sense unless I read another page and a half of text. Please follow common etiquette in the future and cease this top posting. >This also doesn't answer the second part: does the <something> that is part >of the dodge (that subsequently failed) + <something> still happen? Of course. Strikes that cancel the dodge effect must explicitly state that they are cancelling the other effect to do so. The additional strike still happens if you use superior Arms of the Abyss and your opponent uses superior Scorpion Sting. >There is no rule in the book that I can see that says that a failed dodge attempt >cancels the card and its affects. Correct. >Does Acrobatics (at sup) that gets hit by a Scorpion Sting (for example) still have an additional strike? Absolutely. >If not and the card was 'cancelled' can I then play, say, a Blur? Moot. >LSJ? Might need your call on this one! :) He's in Atlanta, about 3 hours away from home, so will not see this until Monday night. In any case, he has already answered this question many times. For example: LSJ 2001-10-12 http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=3BC6C4E2.F4BC5CE2%40white-wolf.com LSJ 2001-06-13 http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=3B280BDC.413BC0AE%40white-wolf.com LSJ 2000-08-14 http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=8n8uvk%24u3i%241%40nnrp1.deja.com Any time you have questions like this, you can find the answers yourself in 2-3 minutes by following these steps: 1) Start here: http://groups.google.com/groups?q=rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad 2) Type in the name of the card, a space, and then author:vte...@white-wolf.com 3) Add a dot to Search only in rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad. 4) Click on Google Search. 5) When you get the results, click on Sort by date at the right to get the most recent results at the top of the list. Skim thru the results until you find the answers you need. Carpe noctem. Lasombra http://www.TheLasombra.com

James Coupe wrote: > However, Shadow Feint has *already* resolved (because normal combat > cards, unlike strike cards, resolve when played), so its restriction is > in force. > > I can't find an explicit ruling from LSJ on Shadow Feint on this[0], but > in general, if something cannot be done, you cannot attempt it. So > Shadow Feint should prevent Dodges being played. > > [0] Most of them appear to be explaining how First Strike works. Shadow Feint doesn't prohibit the minion from choosing "dodge" as his strike. It just notes that the strikes from the minion cannot be dodged. That is, the dodge will not protect the dodging minion. http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=3B0A71F6%40MailAndNews.com http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=8n8uvk%24u3i%241%40nnrp1.deja.com -- LSJ (vte...@white-wolf.com) V:TES Net.Rep for White Wolf, Inc. Links to V:TES news, rules, cards, utilities, and tournament calendar: http://www.white-wolf.com/vtes/

The Lasombra wrote: > Any time you have questions like this, you can find the answers > yourself in 2-3 minutes by following these steps: > > 1) Start here: > http://groups.google.com/groups?q=rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad > > 2) Type in the name of the card, a space, and then > author:vte...@white-wolf.com My fingers are lazy, so I just use "author:LSJ". Also, for some multi-word card names, surrounding the card name in quotes might help narrow the search. [ quoted text not captured ]