Dual Form and simultaneous torporing

What happens if a Dual Formed vampire and its creator go to torpor at the same time (say by Edged Illusion). Does the controller get to choose which one burns? Do they both burn? If you get to choose what if they are controlled by different Methuselahs? Chris.

Chris, ===== [PRO] This acting vampire`s capacity is reduced by 1. Put this card in play, tapped. It becomes a non-unique vampire with the same clan, capacity and Disciplines as the acting vampire. You may move up to 2 blood from the acting vampire to this vampire. If either minion leaves the ready region, the other is burned. ===== Note that "If either minion leaves ... " It doesn't matter if their leaving is simultaneous or not, if either of them leaves, the other is burned. Also note that it is a chain reaction event ... If Vamp A dual forms to make A and A2, then A2 dual forms to make B1 and B2 and B2 is torpored, that burns B2 and B1. Since either of B1 and B2 has been burnt (removed from ready region), A2 burns, and thus A burns. David

chr...@comcen.com.au wrote: [ quoted text not captured ] The controller chooses which one is burned. They are not both burned (no loop-back). If they are controlled by different Methuselahs, then 1.6.1.5 means that the controller who is first clockwise from the acting Methuselah chooses. -- LSJ (vtesr...@TRAPwhite-wolf.com) V:TES Net.Rep (remove spam trap to reply) Links to V:TES news, rules, cards, utilities, and tournament calendar: http://www.white-wolf.com/vtes/

So, if there is no loop-back, does that mean that if eight dual forms had been created from various dual forms from one vampire (say Enkidu), that only the two that are directly linked are affected when one leaves the ready region? So, in other words, if you manage to torpor/burn one, the one that created that specific dual form burns and the others are safe? Minion A (Enkidu; 9 cap) ---> Minion B (7 cap clone of A) ---> Minion C (5 cap clone of B) ---> Minion D (5 cap clone of C) #1 So, if D is sent to torpor, C burns. But, since C is not ready, B burns? Then since B is not ready, A (original Enkidu) burns? #2 If not, then if B is torpored, do both A and C burn?

In message <1123269390....@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>, mrjay1000 <mrja...@yahoo.com> writes: >So, if there is no loop-back, does that mean that if eight dual forms >had been created from various dual forms from one vampire (say Enkidu), >that only the two that are directly linked are affected when one leaves >the ready region? No, you're confusing loop-back with chain reactions. Loop-back is the situation where both vampires are around in the ready region, say Enkidu and his lil buddy. Enkidu goes to torpor. The Lil Buddy notices Enkidu go to torpor. So Lil Buddy burns. Then Enkidu notices Lil Buddy burns. So Enkidu burns. Note: this DOES NOT happen, but this is loop-back. One vampires becomes unready, their Dual Form's text notices this, the other burns - and there you stop. Chain reactions are where various vampires are interlinked by Dual Forms. These works as normal. Each separate copy of Dual Form prevents loop-back, but you do get a domino effect. >Minion A (Enkidu; 9 cap) ---> Minion B (7 cap clone of A) ---> >Minion C (5 cap clone of B) ---> Minion D (5 cap clone of C) > >#1 So, if D is sent to torpor, C burns. But, since C is not ready, B >burns? Then since B is not ready, A (original Enkidu) burns? Right. >#2 If not, then if B is torpored, do both A and C burn? This happens too. For example: http://groups-beta.google.com/group/rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad/msg/98 0a4fa54a331d22 **** >>- Vamp A creates A1. If either leaves the ready region, the other one burns. >>- A creates A2. Then, if A goes to torpor, A1 and A2 both go to torpor. No. If A goes to torpor, A1 and A2 burn. **** All the interlinked pairs are handled, but each Dual Form can only burn one vampire. -- James Coupe PGP Key: 0x5D623D5D YOU ARE IN ERROR. EBD690ECD7A1FB457CA2 NO-ONE IS SCREAMING. 13D7E668C3695D623D5D THANK YOU FOR YOUR COOPERATION.