Card ideas for Final Nights. Mainly Assamites.

Here is the clans: Assamite: actually quite weak in combat. Little intercept. No deflect. No bleed. Ravnos: Expensive. Many cards cost. Poor cousin to Gangrel. Setites: Only have two Serpentis cards worth to play with. Worst selection of vampires in the game. Giovanni: Lasombra also have dom+pot, but have obt instead of nec. Nuff said. Card ideas: * One single, very popular card, makes combat very difficult for Assamites: "Drawing out the Beast". Also all other weapon and distance decks are useless against a deck that uses DotB. How about a card that makes a vampire immune to all/some effects from animalism. Assamites only or maybe Celerity (which also will benefit other decks with weapons). * Also a card that makes Assamites able to commit diablere. A master maybe. * I still waiting for a good card that negates S:CE other than IG. I'm into making weapons better. How about a combatcard (it will cost much blood. Three?) that only allows weaponstrikes? For Assamites or Celerity. Maybe too powerful? * More Assamite cards that benefits a contracted Assamite. IMO Haven Uncovered are better than Contract. * A "path" card for Ravnos! They really need it. * An Setite action card that gives two corruption counters to a minion who already has at least one. * A setite who can pay an amount of blood to put a Corruption counter on another vampire as an +1 stealth action. To powerful? Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/

bobby_doc <bobb...@my-deja.com> writes: > Card ideas: > * One single, very popular card, makes combat very difficult for > Assamites: "Drawing out the Beast". Not necessarily. An Assamite deck going for it could use something like The Khabar: Honor, instead. With Sideslip (superior), and only one DotB playable per combat, an Assamite can survive against such a deck and do some damage. > Also all other weapon and distance decks are useless against a deck > that uses DotB. Not entirely true. (Though true to the extent that DotB is an effective way of scuppering them.) If a deck is *exclusively* concerned with *exclusively* ranged damage, yes. However, a potence "lids" deck could use some Thrown Gate and Sacrament of Carnage, too. Usable at close range, so not such a problem. > How about a card that makes a vampire immune to all/some effects from > animalism. Assamites only or maybe Celerity (which also will benefit > other decks with weapons). Some problems: 1) That could get complicated. Is intercept an effect against me? How about environmental damage? 2) If the problem is DotB, a card that cuts off a whole class of cards just to get DotB is kind of like babies and bathwater. 3) Theme. You need some way to work the card in as a sensible card. If the problem (for the deck) is range setting, a card that allowed, say, a permanent Cailean style ability is an option, maybe. Spatial Awareness Action +1 stealth 2 blood Put this card on the acting vampire. This vampire may not play cards before range is determined in the first round of any given combat. This vampire may burn 1 blood during the Establish Range step of combat (skip the rest of the step). [I'm thinking about: 1) it being a powerful ability 2) Shadow Step and Ruins of Villars Abbey, Belgium both existing (hence a potential downside to the card)] If the problem is the damage, you already have a number of options - Flak Jackets and Leather Jackets for everyone, Sideslip for anyone with Celerity (Assamites included, and with the limit to DotB, 1 Sideslip is enough). Celeritous Toreador gun decks also have Resplendent Protector at their disposal. > * Also a card that makes Assamites able to commit diablere. A master > maybe. This is a likely possibility, theme-wise. (I'd also explicitly stipulate *all* Assamites, not just yours.) > * I still waiting for a good card that negates S:CE other than IG. There already are some. However, don't get too hung up on the idea of "negating" S:CE, or you'll get all hot and bothered over nothing. Psyche! can be useful if a person is playing light S:CE (and works for the Assamites, of course) though if they're playing heavy S:CE, you may well do badly. Telepathic Tracking is working wonders combat wise (and decks will re-adjust to it in time) even though it doesn't "negate" S:CE, it provides some options. > I'm into making weapons better. How about a combatcard (it will cost > much blood. Three?) that only allows weaponstrikes? For Assamites or > Celerity. Maybe too powerful? Possibly. However, it also works on guns - which isn't necessarily a good thing. Assamites, with their hired contract killer archetype (but much neutered in 3rd Edition) have always, for me, thematically evoked the melee weapon thing. Maybe if it worked only on melee weapons (I can cope with you using a Bastard Sword, but an Assault Rifle seems unfair....) It also (in your version) provides excellent combat defence - play it against a vampire with no equipment and they can't do anything! (So a Gangrel claw deck is killed, a Brujah hand damage deck is killed, an Island of Yiaros theme deck is killed, a Nosferatu Obf-Pot deck is killed (though they have the chance for Disguised Weapon, of course), a Giovanni Bruise and Bleed deck is killed, a Lasombra Political Struggle/Combat deck is killed.) You'd need to provide *something* for the opposing vampire to do, or it would kill all non-weapon decks dead. Under IG, a vampire *can* still strike for hands for 1. > * More Assamite cards that benefits a contracted Assamite. IMO Haven > Uncovered are better than Contract. Definitely a hope of mine. S:CE "preventers" (by making S:CE unplayable (least favourite), difficult (better), expensive (good) and so on) could feature here - it shows the benefit of proper planning. > * A "path" card for Ravnos! They really need it. Yup. If a "Path of Paradox" style card doesn't appear in Final Nights, I'll be very, very disappointed. > * An Setite action card that gives two corruption counters to a minion > who already has at least one. Blood cost it, too, and you have a potential idea. The problem with this would be weenie hordes being able to over-run all decks in their path. (And Setite Embrace-Corrupt hordes are eminently playable.) An alternative to a blood cost would be a capacity restriction: Uber-Corruption Requires Setite Only playable by a vampire who has a capacity greater than four etc. etc. > * A setite who can pay an amount of blood to put a Corruption counter > on another vampire as an +1 stealth action. To powerful? Not excessively so, properly costed. Since it would be blocked under "No Repeat Actions" (same inherent action on a vampire), it couldn't be repeated, even if you tried to "break" it with Freak Drive. It would provide a (minor) way for a Setite deck to become less library intensive (since most things they do require transients, with no permanents) and it puts a *huge* pointer above that vampire's head - "Here, kick me! Banish me! Rush me! Kill me! I must die!" -- James Coupe | PGP Key 0x5D623D5D Standard disclaimers apply to this post. Full written details available upon request. Your statutory rights are not affected.

"James Coupe" <jr...@srcf.ucam.org> a écrit dans le message news: 2wvgqpz...@kern.srcf.societies.cam.ac.uk... > bobby_doc <bobb...@my-deja.com> writes: 'snip) > > How about a card that makes a vampire immune to all/some effects from > > animalism. Assamites only or maybe Celerity (which also will benefit > > other decks with weapons). reaction card : Inner peace. Assamite. play when entering combat. Opposing vampire cannot play cards requiring Animalism for the duration of this combat. it sounds cool 'cause it's only usable as a defence, therefore not overpowered. > > * Also a card that makes Assamites able to commit diablere. A master > > maybe. > > This is a likely possibility, theme-wise. (I'd also explicitly > stipulate *all* Assamites, not just yours.) you already have Sacrifice of the lamb (?) ad vulnerability. > > * I still waiting for a good card that negates S:CE other than IG. > > There already are some. However, don't get too hung up on the idea of > "negating" S:CE, or you'll get all hot and bothered over nothing. > > Psyche! can be useful if a person is playing light S:CE (and works for > the Assamites, of course) though if they're playing heavy S:CE, you > may well do badly. combat card : Haqim's will Assamite 2 blood 2 damage. If combat ends before strike resolution, opponent takes this two damage after combat ends. cost balances the "catatonic" like power. > > * More Assamite cards that benefits a contracted Assamite. IMO Haven > > Uncovered are better than Contract. Master card : Grand Contract 1 pool put this card on a ready minion and choose an assamite the chosen assamite can burn a blood to enter combat with the chosen minion as a +1 stealth D Action. If not blocked, the minion with the contract on him cannot play "strike: combat ends" during that combat. any methuselah can burn a grand contract by giving 2 pool to the Methuselah controlling it. pool gain is nice, and it would prevent S:CE in a nice way > > * An Setite action card that gives two corruption counters to a minion > > who already has at least one. > > Blood cost it, too, and you have a potential idea. The problem with > this would be weenie hordes being able to over-run all decks in their > path. (And Setite Embrace-Corrupt hordes are eminently playable.) An > alternative to a blood cost would be a capacity restriction: > > Uber-Corruption > Requires Setite > Only playable by a vampire who has a capacity greater than four or maybe the contrary ? a corruption cards that put two counters on a minion if he has no counters ? that would be a good starter ! > > * A setite who can pay an amount of blood to put a Corruption counter > > on another vampire as an +1 stealth action. To powerful? > > Not excessively so, properly costed. Since it would be blocked under > "No Repeat Actions" (same inherent action on a vampire), it couldn't > be repeated, even if you tried to "break" it with Freak Drive. > > It would provide a (minor) way for a Setite deck to become less > library intensive (since most things they do require transients, with > no permanents) and it puts a *huge* pointer above that vampire's head > - "Here, kick me! Banish me! Rush me! Kill me! I must die!" Khadija Kebir SER pre OBF capacity 8 as a D action, Khadija can put a corruption counter on a minion controlled by your prey.... blah blah... Khadija gets -1 bleed on bleeding actions reyda

"Reyda" <re...@noos.fr> writes: > reaction card : Inner peace. > Assamite. > play when entering combat. > Opposing vampire cannot play cards requiring Animalism for the duration of > this combat. Because of the problems with the old TB wording, I'd suggest "before combat is entered" or something, rather than "when entering combat". > it sounds cool 'cause it's only usable as a defence, therefore not > overpowered. True, but it then stops them using Carrion Crows and stuff, which seems wrong. Why does your inner peace stop my birds pecking you? Like I say, if DotB is the problem, isolate what it is in DotB that is the problem and fix that via cards - don't just hose viable deck strategies. That way, you even fix it on any other cards and disciplines it's a problem on. <Diablerie card> > > This is a likely possibility, theme-wise. (I'd also explicitly > > stipulate *all* Assamites, not just yours.) > > you already have Sacrifice of the lamb (?) ad vulnerability. You do. Like I say, due to the storyline changes, it seems likely, however. A potential card: Ritual Broken Master Put this card in play. Whilst this card is in play, disregard card text on Assamite vampires restricting their ability to commit diablerie. [This card may be burned as a (D) action, which costs 2 blood. If the vampire taking the action has Thaumaturgy, the action costs zero blood.] [If a Blood Hunt is called against an Assamite who commits diablerie, this card casts an additional vote in favour of not burning the vampire.] [Or something.] (I like the Thaumaturgy bonus - vampires with Thaumaturgy would find it easier to put the ritual back.) > combat card : Haqim's will > Assamite > 2 blood > 2 damage. If combat ends before strike resolution, opponent takes this two > damage after combat ends. Haqim's Will Quietus Combat card 2 blood Inferior: [Strike: +2 hand damage] or [Maneuver, with an optional additional strike this round.] Superior: Play this card during the Choose Strike step after both minions have chosen strikes. Cancel this minion's strike; he does not strike during this Strike Resolution. The opposing minion takes two damage. (The inferior is intended to be something relatively inoffensive, but possible if the vampire isn't playing it at superior - like inferior Thoughts Betrayed is playable, but superior is much better.) (Use of the word minion at superior, because of Talaq. At superior, I do it this way cos it's kinda fun *and* it gets rid of the problems of "What if they play Telepathic Tracking to continue combat? Does the damage stay or go?" in a nice, clear way. And it does what you want.) (And it doesn't hose S:CE, but rovides a nice (but expensive) way to do things even when it is played and does what it does.) > Master card : Grand Contract > 1 pool > put this card on a ready minion and choose an assamite > the chosen assamite can burn a blood to enter combat with the chosen minion > as a +1 stealth D Action. > If not blocked, the minion with the contract on him cannot play "strike: > combat ends" during that combat. > any methuselah can burn a grand contract by giving 2 pool to the Methuselah > controlling it. > > pool gain is nice, and it would prevent S:CE in a nice way Fairly cheap, though slow (two master phases, Parthenon ahoy). The pool and the S:CE effect is a fair amount. I like both effects, and have various ideas about implementing both (e.g. the Haqim's Will card we're both toying with), but I don't want to see a card that does too much at once. The "jigsaw" like mechanism of V:TES, where individual cards combine to do different things, so you can have a really mainstream deck or a really weird one piecing together Quietus and Protean, say, is one of my favourite things about the game. Flexibility rules. > > Uber-Corruption > > Requires Setite > > Only playable by a vampire who has a capacity greater than four > > or maybe the contrary ? > a corruption cards that put two counters on a minion if he has no counters ? > that would be a good starter ! Possibly. Another potential restriction would be to *only* allow it to be used against weenies, so that a player can save themself from it by using big vampires. This also gives the nod to big vampires, who are often underused because of the power of weenies, without being excessive - after all, you can still use Corruption Embrace hordes as you always did. e.g. Vulnerability of the Naive Requires Setite 1 blood Action [No stealth?] Put two Corruption counters on a vampire who has less than four capacity [etc.] > Khadija Kebir > SER pre OBF > capacity 8 > as a D action, Khadija can put a corruption counter on a minion controlled > by your prey.... blah blah... > Khadija gets -1 bleed on bleeding actions Hmm.... Something is screaming "SER THA obf pre" at me. I'd like small obf, simply to stop stealth being *too* easily got on the action. THA also strikes me as nice. It used to be a Setite discipline (many, many moons ago, when they were still warriors - they had POT THA PRE, I think). And it matches well with Kemintiri, providing a potential common theme as the quaternary discipline for Setites. And you could decide that's what's helping him corrupt people, or something. A nice piece of artwork with someone conjuring gold in their hand, by the artist who did Talley (it strikes me as that sort of thing.) [Do I sound like I get even remotely obsessive about new cards?] But then I wouldn't limit the bleeds. 7 capacity would seem fairly fair, since it only has 4 points of "real" disciplines. [ quoted text not captured ]

> > Card ideas: > > * One single, very popular card, makes combat very difficult for > > Assamites: "Drawing out the Beast". > > Not necessarily. An Assamite deck going for it could use something > like The Khabar: Honor, instead. With Sideslip (superior), and only > one DotB playable per combat, an Assamite can survive against such a > deck and do some damage. I have seen this app. 16532 times ;-) Torn, Carrion Crows, DotB, IG, and later maybe some or all of these ---- Skin of Steel, Disarm, Claws, Taste, Pulled Not much for a poor Assamite to do. > Spatial Awareness > Action > +1 stealth > 2 blood > Put this card on the acting vampire. This vampire may not play cards > before range is determined in the first round of any given combat. > This vampire may burn 1 blood during the Establish Range step of > combat (skip the rest of the step). I guess you mean burn a blood to make it long distance. I like it! > > * A setite who can pay an amount of blood to put a Corruption counter > > on another vampire as an +1 stealth action. To powerful? > > Not excessively so, properly costed. Since it would be blocked under > "No Repeat Actions" (same inherent action on a vampire), it couldn't > be repeated, even if you tried to "break" it with Freak Drive. > > It would provide a (minor) way for a Setite deck to become less > library intensive (since most things they do require transients, with > no permanents) and it puts a *huge* pointer above that vampire's head > - "Here, kick me! Banish me! Rush me! Kill me! I must die!" :-) Bobby_Doc [ quoted text not captured ]

On Mon, 05 Feb 2001 13:53:47 GMT, bobby_doc <bobb...@my-deja.com> wrote: >> > Card ideas: >> > * One single, very popular card, makes combat very difficult for >> > Assamites: "Drawing out the Beast". >> >> Not necessarily. An Assamite deck going for it could use something >> like The Khabar: Honor, instead. With Sideslip (superior), and only >> one DotB playable per combat, an Assamite can survive against such a >> deck and do some damage. > >I have seen this app. 16532 times ;-) >Torn, Carrion Crows, DotB, IG, >and later maybe some or all of these ---- Skin of Steel, Disarm, Claws, >Taste, Pulled >Not much for a poor Assamite to do. Note that if you are playing POT/ANI/FOR, then there isn't much for almost any other combat deck to do. Range locked at close. You grab them so it's hand strikes or bust. You prevent all their stuff with Skin of Steel, so their hand strikes mean diddly. Some Gangrel can do this, and the Nosferatu Law Firm is notorious for variations on it. But it's hardly an Assamite-only hoser. ------------ Dead Chicken Animalism Unique Equipment 2 pool The minion with this card may take a +1 stealth action to wave Dead Chicken over his or her library. If this action is successful, look at the top 7 cards in your library. Take one into your hand, and discard down to your hand size. Replace the remaining 6 cards on top of your library in their original order. -- Derek "Oh, cool... TABLE ACTIONS!" -- M. Perlman

What is White Wolf (and LSJ's) position on player-suggested card ideas these days? I remember it was discouraged for (somewhat paranoid IMHO) legal reasons under Wizards. But I do enjoy reading and offering up ideas. Is the policy now: a) Yeah, please do. We'll probably read them, think about it, maybe playtest it, and if we like it maybe include it some day. b) Sure, if you you want. But the design team has plenty of ideas on their own thank-you-very-much and isn't really soliciting suggestions. or c) Please don't. We're worried about possible legal and copywrite hassles. [ quoted text not captured ]

On Tue, 06 Feb 2001 02:26:38 GMT, bswai...@my-deja.com wrote: >What is White Wolf (and LSJ's) position on player-suggested card ideas >these days? I remember it was discouraged for (somewhat paranoid IMHO) >legal reasons under Wizards. But I do enjoy reading and offering up >ideas. Is the policy now: > >b) Sure, if you you want. But the design team has plenty of ideas on >their own thank-you-very-much and isn't really soliciting suggestions. As I understand it, this is the current stance adopted by the design team. Which is why I confine my posted "cards" to things along the lines of Can Of Beans (see other thread)... stuff that is too ridiculous to be serious. =) [ quoted text not captured ]

Derek Ray <lor...@yahoo.com> wrote: > bswai...@my-deja.com wrote: > > >What is White Wolf (and LSJ's) position on player-suggested card > >ideas these days? I remember it was discouraged for (somewhat > >paranoid IMHO) legal reasons under Wizards. But I do enjoy reading > >and offering up ideas. Is the policy now: > > > >b) Sure, if you you want. But the design team has plenty of ideas on > >their own thank-you-very-much and isn't really soliciting > >suggestions. > > As I understand it, this is the current stance adopted by the design > team. Correct. > Which is why I confine my posted "cards" to things along the > lines of Can Of Beans (see other thread)... stuff that is too > ridiculous to be serious. =) -- LSJ (vte...@white-wolf.com) VTES Net.Rep for White Wolf, Inc. Links to revised rulebook, rulings, errata, and tournament rules: http://www.white-wolf.com/vtes/ [ quoted text not captured ]