rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad

[VtES][PR] Full Rulebook, 1 of 2

17 messages from 8 participants · 28 September 1995 – 05 October 1995
original thread on Google Groups

aa...@cats.ucsc.edu

/* ** This is the rulebook for V:TES as it appears in the initial printing. ** Attached at the end are two sections: one listing the rules changes ** between Jyhad and V:TES, and one listing the inevitable errata. */ Vampire 3.1 Overview of Vampire: The Eternal Struggle Vampire: The Eternal Struggle is a trading card game in which two or more players take on the roles of ancient vampires. These ancient vampires, known as Methuselahs, are considered mere legend by younger vampires. Younger vampires think that they pursue their own ends... even as they're used by one Methuselah to destroy the influence of another. Throughout the world, Methuselahs manipulate their minions to frustrate the designs of their enemies. These battles, sometimes covert and subtle, sometimes open and spectacular, are collectively known as the Jyhad. Caught in the throes of this never-ending war, the Methuselahs fight skirmish after skirmish in their eternal struggle. Overview of Deckmaster Card Games The Object of the Game Your goal is to destroy the influence held by rival Methuselahs. Influence is symbolized by blood counters, the primary currency in the game. When a player's blood pool is out of blood counters, that Methuselah is bereft of influence and ousted from the game. As Methuselahs are ousted, players earn victory points; the winner is the player with the most victory points at the end of the game. SECTION ONE: Elements of the Game 1. Equipment Needed Cards: Each player has two decks: a crypt and a library. The cards in your crypt represent the vampires you hope to control; the cards in your library represent the tools you need to wage war against other Methuselahs. Each player must have at least twelve cards in her crypt and forty cards in her library. Each player may add up to ten cards to her library for each player in the game. Thus, in a six-player game, each player may have a minimum of forty library cards and a maximum of one hundred; in a two-player game, each player can have from forty to sixty library cards. Blood Counters: Blood counters are an integral part of the game. You'll need at least forty of them. Your personal blood pool consists of thirty counters, and you'll need at least ten to help fill the communal "blood bank". Any convenient items, such as pennies, glass beads, or stones, can be used as blood counters. When you burn one of your blood counters, you return it to the blood bank. (Technically, you can also "pay" or "spend" blood counters, but counters that are thrown into the blood bank are still considered "burned".) The blood counters in a Methuselah's blood pool are referred to as pool; the blood counters on a vampire card are referred to as blood. The Edge Counter: The Edge is a symbol showing that your vampires have seized enough power for you to have an advantage over other Methuselahs. Choose an object to represent the Edge-any small object, such as a coin or an ankh, will do. A player who successfully "bleeds" another Methuselah and reduces his victim's blood pool gets the Edge. (For more details, see Minion Phase, Section 4.4; for further rules on this, see Section 6.3.) 2. Important Terms in the Game Tapping and Untapping Cards: The concept of tapping and untapping is a unique feature in Deckmaster games. During the course of play, you tap cards by turning them 90 degrees. This procedure indicates that the card has been activated to perform a particular action and cannot be used again until it is untapped. Untapping a card restores it to its original position; this indicates that the card is reset and can be tapped again to take another action at a later time. Your untapped minions may block, take actions, or play reaction cards. Burn: When a card is burned, it's removed from the play area and thrown in your discard pile. This pile is also known as the ash heap. Blood counters can also be burned: they're returned to the blood bank. Burned cards or counters are no longer considered to be "in play". 3. Overview of the Cards. Each amber-backed vampire card has numbers, words, and symbols that describe that vampire. These elements reveal the vampire's name, blood capacity, clan, vampiric powers (called "Disciplines"), and any political positions the vampire may hold. All of these terms are defined in the Glossary. Sometimes a vampire also has one or more special abilities; these are listed in a box on the bottom of the card. The vampires you use with your deck are the minions you hope to eventually control. Blood Capacity: The blood capacity symbol can be found centered on a red blood drop on the lower-right corner of a card. A number between one and ten appears on the symbol. The capacity reflects: - the relative age of the vampire, - the number of blood counters you must invest in order to "control" the vampire, and - the maximum strength the vampire has to heal wounds or perform other actions. A vampire with a larger capacity than another vampire is said to be older, and one with a smaller capacity is said to be younger. The number of blood counters a vampire has can't exceed the vampire's blood capacity. Clan: Vampires belong to different "clans". A vampire's clan symbol can be found on the upper-left corner of his or her vampire card. Some library cards can't be played unless you control a member of a particular vampire clan, and some library cards only affect vampires of a particular clan. Appendix B has more information about the various clans. Disciplines: These are the supernatural powers possessed by vampires. The lower-right corner of a vampire card has a group of symbols representing the Disciplines known by that vampire. These symbols determine which minion cards a vampire is able to use. When you want to play a minion card, compare the Discipline symbol on your vampire to the symbol on the card. If they're the same, the vampire can use that card. Note: The following Disciplines will be included in future Vampire expansion sets. [Necromancy, Chimerstry, Serpentis, and Quietus.] 3.1.1. Squares and Diamonds Each Discipline symbol is in the shape of a square or a diamond. A square- shaped symbol means that you can use the plain-type (Roman) text at the top of a minion card requiring that Discipline; you can also use any other text that appears at the top of the card. A diamond-shaped symbol means that a vampire has the superior version of that Discipline. A vampire with a superior Discipline can use either the plain-type or boldfaced text on a minion card requiring that Discipline. 3.2. Library Cards There are two types of library cards: master cards and minion cards. Master cards are played by Methuselahs. Minion cards are used by the vampires and allies you control. (Both vampires and allies are minions.) Master cards have a gray stone background; different types of minion cards in Vampire have different backgrounds to help you tell them apart. Playing the Cards: You play a card by placing it anywhere in the playing area (described in Section 4.1) or on one of your minions. The card is then considered to be in play. Some cards have an immediate effect and are burned after they're used, while other cards require either you or a vampire you control to burn blood counters when you play the card. Important rule: Unless a card says otherwise, whenever you play a library card, you immediately draw another library card and place it in your hand. Cost of Playing Cards: Each library card has one or more symbols on its left side. There might be a symbol for the card type, a Discipline symbol, a drop of blood surrounding a number, or a clan symbol. A drop of blood on a card will have a number on it letting you know how much blood must be burned when you play that card. Solid black blood drop: If the blood drop is solid black, the Methuselah pays that number of blood counters to the blood bank to play the card. The Methuselah must "burn" pool. Black blood drop with a white circle: If the card has a black blood drop with a white circle, the vampire using the card pays the blood counters to the blood bank. The vampire must "burn" blood. (There's also another way to tell the symbols apart: the Methuselah's symbol is in the lower-left corner, while the vampire's symbol is halfway up the left-hand side.) Discipline symbols: A minion card may include a Discipline symbol. (See Section 3 for a list of Disciplines and their symbols.) If there's a Discipline symbol on the card, the vampire playing the card must have the same Discipline. Obviously, if the card doesn't have a Discipline symbol, then using the card doesn't require one. Clan symbols: Sometimes a card has a clan symbol. (See Appendix B for a description of the clans and their symbols.) If it's a master card, you may only use the card if you have a "ready" vampire of that clan. (A ready vampire is one who is controlled and in your active area.) If the card is a minion card, only vampires of that clan may use the card. 3.2.1. Master Cards Master cards are cards played by a Methuselah. These cards represent some of the awesome powers you can bestow upon your minions or unleash upon the world. Master cards are played during your "master phase" and take effect the moment they're put into play. (The master phase is described in Section 6.2.) There are many different types of master cards, but the three most common ones are location cards, Discipline cards, and out-of-turn cards. Locations: A location is a place controlled by you and your minions. Location cards give your vampires long-term advantages in play. Locations stay in play and may be used repeatedly. Some library cards (such as Arson) can eliminate locations from play. Disciplines: Discipline cards are played on a vampire to give her new Disciplines or enhance the Disciplines she already knows, increasing the level of a Discipline from "basic" to "superior". In addition, a Discipline card increases a vampire's blood capacity by one. You may not play a Discipline card on a vampire who already has a superior level in that Discipline. A vampire doesn't immediately fill the extra blood capacity-she must still hunt before she can gain the extra blood. Discipline cards remain on your vampire until the vampire is burned. Out-of-turn: Out-of-turn cards can only be played when it is not your turn. If you play this type of card, you lose your "master phase action" during the master phase of your next turn. (The phases of a turn are described in Section 6.3.) Once you've played an out-of-turn master card, you can't play another one until after your next turn. 3.2.2. Minion Cards As a Methuselah, you use intrigue, worldly political maneuvers, and the exercise of supernatural abilities to influence less-powerful vampires, ignorant mortals, and other creatures. These minions are pawns in the eternal struggle. Minion cards represent the actions and intrigue your minions use to destroy the pawns of your fellow Methuselahs and drain your enemy's influence. They're used during your "minion phase" (described in Section 6.3.), although reaction cards (a type of minion card) can be played when it isn't your turn. Some types of minion cards can only be used by vampires. These include cards that require a minion to have a particular Discipline, cards that require a vampire from a particular clan, and cards that begin a political action. Other minion cards can be used by any minion, including allies. The general types of minion cards are listed below. Action cards: Action cards describe specific actions your untapped minions may take. On your turn, you can play one action card for each minion who takes an action. There are other minion phase actions a minion can take without playing an action card. Note: An action card taps the minion using it. Action modifier cards: These cards are played after your minion takes an action. They enhance an action. For instance, if your minion is taking a "bleed" action to drain the blood pool of another Methuselah, you could play an action modifier card designed to increase the amount of pool you drain. Action modifier cards may only be used when it is your turn. Important rule: A minion cannot use two identical action modifier cards to affect the same action. Equipment cards: These are tools you give your minions to aid them when they engage in combat. There isn't a limit to the number of equipment cards a minion can have. A minion attempts to take control of equipment by performing an "equip" action during the minion phase. Political cards: These are action cards that represent the political intrigue inherent in vampire society. Vampires may use these to cause events in the game that may benefit or harm Methuselahs or their minions. A "voting action" occurs when a vampire "calls" a vote by playing this type of card. (This is described under Vampire Politics in Section 7). Retainer cards: Minions employ retainers to protect themselves and maintain their worldly interests. Retainers cannot take actions, use equipment, or deal damage. A retainer is linked to the minion who has "employed" him. He assists that minion by lending her special abilities. A minion controls a retainer after she has performed an "employ retainer" action; there is no limit to the number of retainers a minion may employ. Ally cards: Vampires are not the only creatures you may influence to do your bidding. Allies are mortals (or supernatural beings) who also serve you. Unlike retainers, allies can act independently of vampires, use equipment, and inflict damage. They must, however, be brought into play by a vampire performing a "recruit ally" action. (See Minion Actions, Section 6.4) Combat cards: These are used by minions during the combat sequence of the game (see Combat, Section 8). Reaction cards: Your untapped minions may use these cards to counter actions taken by the minions of other Methuselahs. You may only play reaction cards when it is not your turn. A minion cannot use two identical reaction cards to react to an action. Note: A reaction card does not tap the minion using it. SECTION TWO: The Basic Game All of the Kindred hid from one another And from the humans that surrounded them. In hiding we remain today, For the Jyhad continues still. -The Book of Nod The Basic Game is designed to introduce you to the world of Vampire while teaching you a simplified set of rules. Once you've mastered the Basic Game, feel free to move on to the Advanced Game, which includes additional provisions for Advanced Combat Rules, diablerie, contested cards, and other devious complications. Although the Basic Game is a complete game in and of itself, only the Advanced Game has the full version of the rules. 4. Game Environment and Terminology 4.1. The Playing Area There are two regions in front of each player in which cards are played: the active region and the inactive region. Your vampires and allies are collectively referred to as minions. A minion in the active region is said to be ready and is also considered controlled. A vampire in the inactive region is said to be uncontrolled. 4.2. Setting Up the Game Step 1. Decide who is the Predator and Prey of each player: In The Eternal Struggle, each Methuselah is both hunting and hunted. After you've sat down to play, look at the player to your left. This is the player you hope to oust from the game: your prey. Next, look to the player on your right. This is the player who hopes to oust you: your predator. In a two-player game, your opponent is both your predator and prey. Step 2. Organize your pool: Take the thirty counters you're using as blood counters and place them in an area you can easily reach. These counters make up your blood pool. Your pool represents the resources and influence you have available for carrying out your manipulations. Take the counters you have left over, preferably at least ten, and place them in an area where everyone can reach them. The excess counters collectively serve as the blood bank. Be sure there is an ample supply-the bank cannot run out of counters. Blood counters that are burned are returned to the blood bank. Step 3. Prepare your deck: Before the game begins, you'll have a chance to look through your deck. Some players prepare their decks more than other players, but as long as your deck has the right number of cards, it's playable. Eventually, you'll learn to adjust your deck to make it work more efficiently. For the Basic Game, there's another step you should go through when you prepare your deck. There are some words and phrases that are used in the Advanced Game that do not apply to the Basic Game. Remove cards that use these words or phrases: intercept, maneuver, additional strike, press, torpor, diablerie, paralyze, and ante. You should also remove any cards that say "Only usable at long range" or "Not usable in the first round of combat." When you play under the basic rules, if you draw a library card that has one of these words or phrases, you may set it aside and draw to replace it. If a card from your crypt has any of these words or phrases, you can still use the card-just ignore the text that includes those words or phrases. The basic rules for inflicting damage have been simplified as well. All cards do standard ("non-aggravated") damage. Treat all instances of "aggravated damage" as "normal damage" and remove any cards that affect or inflict aggravated damage. If an amount of damage includes the letter "R", ignore that letter (1R becomes "1", 2R becomes "2", and so on). The letter "R" refers to ranged damage, a concept that isn't used in the Basic Game. Disregard the word "ranged" on strike cards. In addition, if you encounter any cards that do not seem to work under this set of rules or seem overly confusing, remove them as well. If you encounter one of these cards during play, you may discard it and draw a new card. Your objective should be gaining fluency with the basic rules; later, after you've read the rules for the Advanced Game, you can look at these cards again to make sure you understand them. Now you're ready to begin playing. Separate your crypt cards from your library cards. Shuffle both sets of cards and allow the player to your right to cut the two decks. Place your library and your crypt in front of you. Once your decks have been prepared, your two decks have been shuffled, the blood bank is ready, and your blood pool is within reach, you can begin to draw cards. Step 4. Place four vampires in the inactive region: Take the top four vampires from your crypt and place them face down in front of you. This becomes the "inactive region". You may look at these cards. These are the initial vampires you will attempt to control during your "influence phase". During the game, you'll have the opportunity to move more vampires out of your crypt and into your inactive region. (This is described under Influence, Section 9). Step 5. Draw seven library cards into your hand: Take the top seven cards from your library and place them in your hand. Remember, whenever you play or discard a library card, you immediately draw another library card and place it in your hand. However, if your library runs out of cards, you have to continue with just the cards you're holding and ignore any cards that allow you to draw additional cards. Step 6. Begin the game: The players decide who goes first. If more than two people are playing, turns proceed clockwise around the playing area. (The Breakdown of the Phases of the Game appears in Section 5.) 4.3. The Ash Heap-The Discard Pile Cards that are burned or discarded are placed face up next to the library. This pile of cards is known as the ash heap. Your ash heap may be examined by any player. 4.4. The Edge Whenever a player successfully bleeds another Methuselah (see Minion Phase, Section 6.3), that player "gets the Edge". There is only one Edge counter, so if one player gets it while another player has it, the second player has to forfeit it. During his or her untap phase, the player who has the Edge takes one counter from the blood bank and places it in his or her pool (see Untap Phase, Section 6.1). The Edge can also be useful during political actions. 5. Breakdown of the Phases of the Game Each turn has five phases in the game: untap, master, minion, influence, and discard. 1) Untap Phase: Untap any minions and/or master cards you have in the playing area. There are two other events that may occur during this phase: - If you have the Edge, take a blood counter from the blood bank and place it in your pool. - Certain master cards may take effect during this phase. 2) Master Phase: This is the phase when you play your master cards. Technically, you receive one master phase action during this phase, which you can then use to play a single master card. 3) Minion Phase: Each untapped minion in your active region may take a minion phase action. When a minion takes an action, you tap it. The action might involve playing one or more minion cards. 4) Influence Phase: This is the phase when you may exert your power as a Methuselah upon vampires in your inactive region. Your influence phase actions are known as transfers. By spending your transfers, you may: - transfer pool to the vampires in your inactive region, - transfer blood counters from your inactive vampires to your pool, or - spend all your transfers to move a vampire from your crypt to your inactive region. These three options are described in Section 9. 5) Discard Phase: Under the Basic Rules, you may discard up to two cards from your hand and draw to replace them. (If you have to discard cards that don't apply under these rules, that doesn't count against your two discards at the end of your turn.) 6. Descriptions of the Phases 6.1 The Untap Phase At the beginning of your turn, untap any tapped cards. Once the cards are untapped, they can be used during your turn. Some cards in play may cause some or all players to perform actions during your untap phase. Any cards requiring you to take an action or actions during your untap phase take effect after you've untapped your cards. If more than one card requires you to take an action, you may choose the order in which these actions take place. If you have the Edge, you may take one blood counter from the blood bank and place it in your pool. Note: Untapping is mandatory. You must untap all of your tapped cards during this phase. 6.2. The Master Phase During your master phase, you receive one master phase action, which you may use to play a master card. If you do not use this master phase action by the end of the master phase, you lose it. If you play a master card that permits you to do something during the master phase, you can take that action as soon as you play the card. 6.3. The Minion Phase The minion phase is the most involved part of the game. Each of your ready vampires and allies may take one action. The procedure is as follows: 1) To show that you want one of your minions to take an action, tap it. This minion is called the acting minion. 2) Announce to the other players the action your minion is taking. You may have to play an action card to reveal your minion's action. 3) You may decide to modify the action. Other Methuselahs may have an opportunity to block the action. 4) If the action isn't blocked, resolve it. You may have to burn blood at this time. A minion may take one of the following actions without playing an action card: - bleeding, - hunting, - employing a retainer, - recruiting an ally, or - equipping. Employing a retainer, recruiting an ally, or equipping a minion does not require an action card, but it does require the use of a retainer, ally, or equipment card. (This is explained further in Minion Actions, Section 6.4.). A minion of another player may attempt to block your minion's action. (Detailed rules on blocking are in Section 6.3.2.) Action modifier cards enhance, alter, or embellish actions. This type of card can be played before or after a block is declared. If you're directing this action against another Methuselah, and he's declared that he won't block, he can't decide to block it later, even if you play an action modifier card. Important rule: In the Basic Game, the only standard minion phase action that can be blocked is bleeding. However, many of the actions that result from playing action cards can be blocked. If an action your minion takes is blocked by an opponent's minion, the action doesn't occur-combat automatically begins between them. 6.3.1. Directed and Nondirected Actions There are two types of actions minions can perform: directed and nondirected. Directed Actions: These are actions that directly affect another Methuselah, one of her minions, or a card a Methuselah controls. An action directed against another Methuselah may only be blocked by the minions of that Methuselah. Cards that involve directed actions have a "D" in the card text. The only directed action in the Basic Game that does not require a card is bleeding. Nondirected Actions: These are actions that are not directed against a Methuselah or one of his minions. Hunting, equipping a minion, recruiting an ally, and employing a retainer are examples of nondirected actions. These actions cannot be blocked in the Basic Game. 6.3.2. Blocking an Action During a Methuselah's turn, you may have the opportunity to block one of her minions. For instance, if your predator uses a minion to attempt to bleed you (and reduce the size of your blood pool), you can try to block that minion's action. Remember, in the Basic Game, you may only block directed actions targeted at you or one of your cards. To block an action, you simply tap one of your untapped minions and declare that he is blocking the action. You cannot block actions that are targeted at another player or one of his minions. Note: If an action requires you to burn blood or pool, the blood counters are not burned until the actions succeeds without being blocked. If you cannot burn blood counters for the action at that point, the action fails. Stealth: Stealth is the ability of vampires to avoid being blocked when they perform actions. In the Basic Game, an action card with the phrase "+1 stealth" (or, technically, "+X stealth") cannot be blocked. (If the top of a Jyhad card has the phrase +1 stealth or the top of a Vampire card has the phrase +1 stealth action, both the basic and superior versions of that action are at +1 stealth). Also, there are some action modifier cards that can be used to give your minion stealth. If you play any of these during the action, the action becomes unblockable. Rules of Thumb for Blocking: 1) If an action is blocked, any cards used by the acting minion are burned, and the cost in blood or pool for playing the cards is ignored. 2) Once a Methuselah has passed up the opportunity to block an action, he cannot attempt to block it later, regardless of whether other blocking attempts have been made or whether the action has been modified with an action modifier card. 6.4. Minion Actions Possible minion phase actions in the Basic Game are described below. Bleed (no card required): Bleeding is one of the most fundamental directed actions in the game. A minion controlled by a Methuselah attempts to reduce the blood pool of another Methuselah. The term "bleed" is actually a metaphor. It describes meddling in the affairs of Methuselahs by paying bribes, burning down property, spreading rumors, and so on. To have one of your minions commit a bleed action: 1) Tap the minion and announce to your prey that your minion is attempting to bleed. 2) If your prey's minions cannot block, or are unsuccessful in their attempts to stop you, your prey burns one pool. There are also cards that allow your minions to bleed your prey for more than one pool. Your predator will attempt to bleed you out of the game. She will try to send her minions past yours and reduce your blood pool; your minions can block these actions to defend you. You then have the opportunity to attempt to send your remaining minions past your prey's minions. If you succeed in getting through, you can then bleed your prey. You may do damage to your opponent's minions, but you want to ultimately bleed other Methuselahs out of the game. Important rule: Whenever a minion successfully bleeds a Methuselah, the controller of that minion "gets the Edge". Hunt (no card required): The hunger for blood is the horrid price of immortality each vampire must endure, and a vampire must hunt to appease that hunger. Hunting is the action a vampire takes to replenish part of his blood supply. To have one of your vampires hunt: 1) Tap the vampire and announce that he is hunting. This is a +1 stealth action: It cannot be blocked in the Basic Game. 2) The vampire gains one blood counter from the blood bank. Note: An untapped vampire in the active region with no blood must hunt as his next action. This action must occur before any of your other minions take minion phase actions. If more than one of your vampires needs to hunt, you may choose the order in which they hunt, as long as they all hunt. Also, a vampire with a number of blood counters equal to his maximum capacity cannot hunt. Employ Retainer (retainer card required): Retainers are the helpers of your minions. A retainer grants additional abilities to a single minion and cannot act independently. For the Basic Game, ignore the life points on a minion card-they are only important in the Advanced Game. For a minion to employ a retainer: 1) Tap a vampire and announce that she is employing a retainer. This is a +1 stealth action: It cannot be blocked in the Basic Game. 2) Put the retainer card you have chosen from your hand on the vampire. Both vampires and allies can recruit retainers. Recruit Ally (ally card required): This action allows you to bring an ally into play. Allies should be treated as vampires in most ways. Unlike retainers, allies may take independent actions, such as blocking and bleeding. They also have life points, which are roughly equivalent to a vampire's blood counters, save for the fact that an ally cannot burn them to use Disciplines or hunt to replace them. To bring an ally into play: 1) Tap the vampire and announce that she is recruiting an ally. This is a +1 stealth action: It cannot be blocked in the Basic Game. 2) Place the ally card in the inactive region. An ally cannot take an action on the turn he is recruited. When the ally is brought into play, he is placed in your inactive region to indicate that he cannot act. At the end of your turn, allies in your inactive region are moved to your active region. If an ally is burned during the course of play, any other cards placed on it are burned as well. Equip (equipment card required): You may give your minions equipment to aid and protect them. There is no limit to the number of equipment cards a minion can have. To equip a minion: 1) Tap the minion and announce that you are equipping him. This is a +1 stealth action: It cannot be blocked in the Basic Game. 2) Take the equipment card you have chosen from your hand and put it on the minion. One of your minions can take equipment from another minion you control. To transfer equipment: 1) Tap the minion and announce that she wants to take equipment from one of your other minions. More than one equipment card can be transferred, but all of the equipment cards must be transferred from the same minion. This is a +1 stealth action: It cannot be blocked in the Basic Game. 2) Take the desired equipment card and place it on the acting minion. If you're transferring more than one piece of equipment, move the applicable cards. 7.Vampire Politics Politics and intrigue are as critical to vampires as hunting and feeding. Like mortal society, vampire society has its own laws, creeds, and customs. Politics come into play when one of your vampires uses a political card. To play a political card: 1) Tap a vampire and announce that she is calling a vote. Any political cards called at +1 stealth (or +X stealth) are unblockable in the Basic Game. 2) Read aloud what the vote will be about (as printed on the card) and place it on the vampire who called the vote. If any choices need to be made by the player whose minion called the vote, they must be made now. 3) Players vote for or against the terms of the vote. The players use votes available to them through their minions and cards. Once a vote has been cast, it cannot be changed. 4) Each player declares his or her votes (see below). Any vampire may abstain from voting. A player may vote both for and against the terms of the vote by using different minions and/or cards. (If you absolutely need a time limit for voting in your games, the players can agree to wait fifteen seconds after the last vote has been cast before tallying the results of the vote.) 5) If the vote passes, the effects of the card take place. Tallying the Votes: If your vampire called the political action, you automatically receive one vote. For each Primogen, Prince, and Justicar you have in the active region, you receive extra votes. You can cast: - 1 vote for each ready Primogen, - 2 votes for each ready Prince, and - 3 votes for each ready Justicar. A vampire may hold only one political position at time; thus, a vampire cannot be a Justicar and a Prince. However, a vampire may yield, or be forced to yield, her current position for another as a result of a political card. Example: Tatiana Romanova of Clan Toreador is the Prince of Houston. The player controlling her plays the Toreador Justicar political card on her, and voting begins. The vote is successful. Tatiana is no longer the Prince of Houston, but now holds the position of Toreador Justicar! If you have the Edge, you can receive a vote by burning the Edge. If this happens, the Edge is uncontrolled. Any Methuselah can burn extra political cards for extra votes. Each burned political card is worth one vote. If you burn an extra political card, ignore the effects printed on the card and throw it into your ash heap. You can't, however, draw new cards until the political action is finished. There are other cards you can use to cast more votes. Remember, though, that you can only play action modifiers if one of your vampires is the acting minion, and you can only play reaction cards if another Methuselah's vampire is the acting minion. 8. Combat If one of your minions is blocked, that minion's action is considered unsuccessful. Any cost in blood or pool to take the action is ignored; if you were required to burn blood to take the action, you don't lose the blood. Any cards you used to take the action are burned. The blocking minion is tapped, and combat begins between the two "opposing" minions. 8.1. Basic Combat Sequence Each round of combat has the following phases: 1) Choose your strike. Each player chooses how her minion will strike: with one of her weapons, with her bare hands, or with a special attack listed on a combat card. 2) Check damage. This is a three-step process. During each of the steps listed below, the player controlling the acting minion always goes first. - Figure out the amount of damage you're inflicting, adding in damage modifiers, - announce the amount of damage you're inflicting, and then - play any applicable damage reduction cards. Once a player makes a choice during a phase (even if the choice is to not play a card), that player may not alter his choice. 8.1.1. Strikes and Damage Choose your strike: Each minion has one strike each round of combat. That strike can be an attack from a combat card, a strike with a weapon, or a bare-handed attack. The player with the acting minion decides how he strikes first. Then the blocking minion decides what his strike will be. In the Basic Game, there is only one round of combat, and only one strike card may be used each round of combat. Note: Some strike cards have the words "dodge" or "combat ends" on them. While this may seem like a contradiction in terms, the word "strike" is used to describe a particular card type. It's a type of card that explains what your minion does in a round of combat. Hand damage: When a minion strikes with his hands, he does an amount of damage equal to the total hand damage from equipment, combat cards, and other modifiers. Important rule: Once you've committed a minion to performing a particular strike, you cannot change your mind. The minion executes the strike. Announce the amount of damage inflicted: Damage is simultaneously dealt between the two minions engaged in combat. A normal unaided hand attack causes one point of damage. For each point of damage your minion takes, burn a blood counter (or "life" counter, in the case of an ally). If a vampire has suffered more damage than he can take (that is, if he received an amount of damage in excess of the amount of blood on his card), he is burned. An ally who loses all of his life counters is burned. Note: In the Basic Game, treat aggravated damage exactly like regular damage. Play damage prevention cards: During the Check Damage phase, you may play damage prevention cards (like Skin of Rock) if you are able to do so. You may play these cards one at a time until all the damage is prevented or you have no more damage prevention cards in your hand. You cannot play more damage prevention cards if all of the damage has been prevented. Extra damage prevention is lost, and it can't be applied against future strikes. Example: If a vampire is dealt three points of damage, you can play one card that prevents two points of damage and immediately play another card that prevents one point of damage. You could not play any more damage prevention cards-all of the damage has been prevented. The extra points of damage prevention would be lost. 8.2. Allies and Combat Allies are allowed to use strike cards in combat. Of course, the ally performing the strike must meet the requirements listed on the strike card. Strike cards include "dodge" cards, "combat ends" cards, and cards that inflict damage (such as Lucky Blow). This rule reflects the way some vampires regard the allies they control-they're deadly in combat, but they're also expendable... 8.3. Special Combat Effects Here's a list of special combat effects you'll find on a number of vampire and library cards. +N Hand Damage: Add N points of damage to a minion's hand or melee weapon damage. Destroy Equipment: This effect will burn a minion's equipment card. If there is more than one piece of equipment on a minion, the player controlling the destroying minion chooses which one is affected. However, the equipment can still be used on the turn it's destroyed... unless the equipment was destroyed before it could be used (see First Strike, listed below). Sometimes the effect may specify a weapon, in which case a particular weapon must be burned. Steal Equipment: This effect is like "destroy equipment" except that it forces a piece of equipment out of the hands of one minion and into the hands of the minion who used this effect. The equipment can still be used on the turn it is stolen... unless the equipment was stolen with First Strike (see below) before it could be used. The stolen equipment may not be used by the minion stealing it until the next round of combat. The minion using this effect keeps the equipment at the end of combat. First Strike: The damage inflicted by a minion with First Strike is resolved before the strike of the opposing minion begins. (Thus, if an opposing minion is burned by First Strike, he will not get a strike.) If both minions have First Strike, the effect is canceled and damage is resolved normally. Example: Cassandra is attacking Andreas with First Strike. Cassandra is using a Potence card and has +1 damage; Andreas has no extra damage and only 1 blood point left. Before Andreas can damage Cassandra, Cassandra does 2 points of damage to Andreas, burning him. Cassandra therefore receives no damage. Dodge: A "dodge" deals no damage, but it prevents the effect of the opponent's strike that round, even if the opponent's strike was delivered with First Strike. Combat Ends: This effect ends combat immediately before any damage is dealt or a strike card's effects take place. If the acting minion's strike is "combat ends", the blocking minion may still use a strike card, but this strike will have no effect. Note that "combat ends" is not affected by a dodge and cancels a First Strike. Steal Blood: This effect is like "steal equipment" except that it forces blood (or life, in the case of allies) from another minion and feeds the vampire who used this effect. This is not considered damage, so the effect cannot be prevented with damage prevention cards. If the stolen blood exceeds the capacity of the vampire stealing it, the excess is moved to the blood bank. If all of the vampire's blood is stolen, the vampire is burned. If an ally loses all his life points, the ally card is burned. A vampire cannot steal more blood than the opposing minion has at that time. Example: Later in the game, Cassandra attempts to bleed and is blocked by Eliza of Clan Tremere. Eliza vows to avenge Andreas' demise. Cassandra is attacking with her bare hands and has 3 blood points. Eliza plays a Thaumaturgy card that allows her to steal 3 points of blood. Cassandra does 1 point of damage to the Tremere, but Eliza steals 3 points of blood from Cassandra. Cassandra has no blood left, so she'll have to hunt next turn. Eliza was at full blood capacity, so the excess blood goes to the blood bank. The stolen blood will also heal the vampire immediately. This blood can be burned by damage that is not dealt with First Strike. Example: Eliza and Cassandra meet again. This time Eliza has 1 blood and Cassandra has 4. Eliza strikes using a Thaumaturgy card that allows her to steal 3 blood. Cassandra strikes with her hands and plays a combat card to increase her hand damage to 2. Eliza takes 2 damage and steals 3 blood from Cassandra. Eliza can use the stolen blood to absorb the damage and is not burned. 9. Influence Methuselahs vehemently seek to dominate vampire society, but most younger vampires are reluctant to defer to the whims of the ancients. The Methuselahs must exert their extraordinary command of Disciplines and resources to entice their younger brethren to do their bidding. The influence phase allows you to move vampires into your inactive region and place them under your control. During the influence phase, you use a type of "influence phase action" known as a transfer. Transfers are not represented by tangible markers, like blood counters, but they do usually translate into blood counters from your pool. When you move blood counters from your pool to a vampire, they become blood points for that vampire. When you move blood counters from a vampire to your pool, they become pool. During your influence phase, you may: 1) move blood counters from your pool to your uncontrolled vampires, 2) take blood back from uncontrolled vampires who already have blood on them, or 3) move the next vampire card in your crypt to your uncontrolled region. The cost for these actions is listed below. 1) At the cost of one transfer, you may move one blood counter from your blood pool to an uncontrolled vampire in your inactive region. 2) For two transfers, you may move one blood counter from an uncontrolled vampire in your inactive region back to your blood pool. 3) By spending all four transfers, you may take a vampire off your crypt and place her in your uncontrolled region. If you do this, you must also burn one pool. Putting Vampires into Play: At the end of your influence phase, any vampire in your inactive region with a number of blood counters equal to his or her blood capacity is now considered controlled. The vampire is turned face up and placed in your active region. The blood counters are kept on the ready vampire. These blood counters are a measure of the vampire's present strength, which may increase and decrease throughout the game. At the beginning of the game, players do not receive the usual four transfers. Instead, the player who goes first may only spend one transfer during her influence phase. The second player may spend up to two transfers, the third player may spend up to three, and the fourth player may spend the usual four transfers. Of course, if there are only two or three players, the number of transfers allowed increases by one each turn until a player is allowed to spend four. 10. Ending the Game In a two-player game, the last Methuselah with pool remaining wins. As soon as a Methuselah is out of blood counters, the game is over. If more than two Methuselahs are playing, the game continues after the first Methuselah is out of pool. A Methuselah is ousted as soon as she no longer has pool. When this occurs, her predator earns a victory point and gains six pool. If a predator is ousted the same turn her prey is ousted, the predator gets the victory point, but does not get six blood points. The last Methuselah remaining in the game also gains an additional victory point. The winner of the game is the player with the most victory points at the end of the game. 10.1. Running Out of Cards and Withdrawing from the Game If you've exhausted your library and begin your turn with less than a full hand, you have the option of withdrawing from the game. To exercise this option, you must announce your intent to withdraw during your untap phase. For the withdrawal to succeed, you have to meet two conditions: - your minions can't enter combat until your next untap phase, and - you and your minions can't lose or burn blood before your next untap phase. If you survive until your next untap phase while meeting these conditions, you successfully withdraw. If you lose a single blood point (even if you regain it later), your withdrawal fails. If you successfully withdraw, you receive one victory point to add to any victory points you've already gained. Your predator does not get a victory point or pool for your withdrawal. 11. The Golden Rule of Card Ownership Your cards are never transferred to another player permanently as a result of card play. If you are ousted from the game, the cards you began the game with are immediately returned to you. If you have any of your opponents' cards, they are returned to their respective owners and placed in the appropriate ash heaps. 12. The Golden Rule for Cards Whenever the cards contradict the rules, the cards take precedence. ____________________________________________________________________________ agl...@acorn.co.uk, moderator of rec.games.trading-cards.announce. postings for this group: tradin...@acorn.co.uk email about this group : trading-ca...@acorn.co.uk.

Shane Travis

You know, I could have _sworn_ Tom said... ==== From: aa...@cats.ucsc.edu (Thomas R Wylie) Subject: Vampire: the Eternal Struggle rulebook Date: 27 Sep 1995 19:14:54 GMT Earlier today I sent the V:TES rulebook off to be posted to rec.games.trading-cards.announce. I am not crossposting it here ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ because it is roughly 100K, and I figured that a) two copies would waste too much space on news servers, and b) it would needlessly expire articles here on any server that expires based on disk usage. ==== What happened to change your mind? Shane H.W. Travis | I try to take one day at a time, tra...@duke.usask.ca | but sometimes several days attack at once. Saskatoon, Saskatchewan | -- Ashleigh Brilliant

Thomas R Wylie

Shane Travis <tra...@duke.usask.ca> wrote: >You know, I could have _sworn_ Tom said... > >==== >From: aa...@cats.ucsc.edu (Thomas R Wylie) >Subject: Vampire: the Eternal Struggle rulebook >Date: 27 Sep 1995 19:14:54 GMT > >Earlier today I sent the V:TES rulebook off to be posted to >rec.games.trading-cards.announce. I am not crossposting it here > ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ >because it is roughly 100K, and I figured that a) two copies would waste too >much space on news servers, and b) it would needlessly expire articles here >on any server that expires based on disk usage. > >==== > > >What happened to change your mind? I did not crosspost it here, the moderator of trading-cards.announce did. This is actually fine, since the fact that it's actually crossposted means that only one copy (each) of the files exists on any sane news server. Had I made a clumsy crosspost by posting the rules here separately, two copies would have existed (even if I split the rules identically), which would have been bad. Tom Wylie rec.games.trading-cards.* Network Representative for aa...@cats.ucsc.edu Wizards of the Coast, Inc.

L. Scott Johnson

I just noticed that the outline numbering is... interesting 6. Descriptions of the Phases 6.1 The Untap Phase 6.2. The Master Phase 6.3. The Minion Phase 6.4. Minion Actions 7.Vampire Politics 9. Influence I would have imagined that The Influence Phase would have been 6.4, since it follows the Minion Phase (6.3). 6.4 Minion Actions is not a phase, so would not be a sub-heading of 6. Descriptions of the Phases, probably better to label it 6.3.1 or to put it after 6.: a separate category like Politics and Combat. Also, calling a vote *is* an action, but is not described under 6.4 Minion Actions (where every other action-class is described). But, the rules themselves are clearer. -- L. Scott Johnson (sjoh...@math.sc.edu) | These opinions are mine and http://www.math.sc.edu/~sjohnson | are subject to card text. Graphics Specialist and Jyhad Rulemonger. |

Chad Ray McDaniel

sjoh...@math.scarolina.edu (L. Scott Johnson) writes: >aa...@cats.ucsc.edu writes: >>7.Vampire Politics >>Any Methuselah can burn extra political cards for extra votes. Each burned >>political card is worth one vote. If you burn an extra political card, >>ignore the effects printed on the card and throw it into your ash heap. You >>can't, however, draw new cards until the political action is finished. >>There are other cards you can use to cast more votes. Remember, though, >>that you can only play action modifiers if one of your vampires is the >>acting minion, and you can only play reaction cards if another Methuselah's >>vampire is the acting minion. >This unfortunate wording makes it easy to miss the fact that Action Modifiers >and Reaction cards cannot be replaced. >(You do mean that *no* cards can be replaced, right? Not just that PAs burned >for votes may not be replaced?) >--- >It also states that Reaction cards can only be used in response to another >Methuselah's acting Minion, which the Rules Team has ruled as too broad - >Reaction cards are not to be played in response to other Methuselah's actions >taken on one's own turn. >Granted, this rule is silly, but you may as well be consistent. >(Reaction = Re(sponse to an )action? Nah!) i've had a problem with how cards such as dread gaze and bewitching oration are used. first some relavent Rules Team Ruling: ---- 11) Can Scorn of Adonis be played after the vote has started/ended, or must it be played before the terms of the vote are stated? It must be played before the terms of the vote are stated. Only cards which say "Usable during a political action" may be used while a vote is going on. Note that one version of Business Pressure says it can only be used while during a political action, while the other does not; the first version is correct, and both should be played that way. ---- Q: If I throw in another card from my hand for one vote, do I replace it right away -- thus possibly getting another vote card? A: (Sec. 17.1, "Voting") No; cards do not get replaced until the vote is concluded. ---- So, as i interpret this,it goes like this: Let's say i play a Disputed Territory (and replace it) and once it goes unblocked i play a Bewitching Oration before i set the terms of the vote. Now i must replace BO because we are not yet in the vote-casting phase that overrides the standard replace-cards rule, but if i wait until vote casting to play BO then i cannot replace it. I guess what I am unclear about is what does "Only usable durring a political action" mean for cards like BO. Does it just reiterate the rule of: ---- You cannot play a modifier which doesn't match the action being modified. For example, you can only use Bonding during a bleed. ---- or does it mean that the vote has to actually be happening (ie. after terms of vote have been and after the preparatory step.)? Political actions are odd because they are the only actions that have sub-phases once the action is succesful. I suppose encountering a vampire in torpor has the sub-phase of deciding what to do with it; but that's pretty minor. -- -chad -- -chad

Shane Travis

Chad Ray McDaniel (ch...@unhinged.engr.sgi.com) wrote: : i've had a problem with how cards such as dread gaze and bewitching : oration are used. first some relavent Rules Team Ruling: <bobbit> : So, as i interpret this,it goes like this: Let's say i play a Disputed : Territory (and replace it) and once it goes unblocked i play a : Bewitching Oration before i set the terms of the vote. Now i must : replace BO because we are not yet in the vote-casting phase that : overrides the standard replace-cards rule, but if i wait until vote : casting to play BO then i cannot replace it. Incorrect: see below. : I guess what I am unclear about is what does "Only usable durring a : political action" mean for cards like BO. Does it just reiterate the : rule of: ---- You cannot play a modifier which doesn't match the : action being modified. : For example, you can only use Bonding during a bleed. ---- or does : it mean that the vote has to actually be happening (ie. after terms of : vote have been and after the preparatory step.)? There are two distinct phases during the vote: the playing of the Political Action card, and the actually tallying of the votes (often referred to on this group as The Referendum). The Bewitching Oration has been ruled that it can only be played during the Referendum portion of the action, and thus is not replaced. The rationale is this: these cards all say 'Only usable DURING a political action' (emphasis mine). Until the vote has successfully be called (i.e. not blocked and terms set) one is concievably not 'in' the political action sub-phase (= referendum). : Political actions are odd because they are the only actions that have : sub-phases once the action is succesful. I suppose encountering a : vampire in torpor has the sub-phase of deciding what to do with it; : but that's pretty minor. When encountering a vampire in torpor, the DT has ruled that one must declare what one is going to do when initiating the action. Thus, 'Attempting to encounter Roxanne in Torpor' is no longer a legal action: one must say either 'Attempting to Diablerize Roxanne' or 'Attempting to rescue Roxanne'. (Yes, I know that this isn't what the rulebook says: has that ever stopped the DT before?) [ quoted text not captured ]

L. Scott Johnson

ch...@unhinged.engr.sgi.com (Chad Ray McDaniel) writes: >sjoh...@math.scarolina.edu (L. Scott Johnson) writes: >>(You do mean that *no* cards can be replaced, right? Not just that PAs burned >>for votes may not be replaced?) >i've had a problem with how cards such as dread gaze and bewitching >oration are used. first some relavent Rules Team Ruling: >---- 11) Can Scorn of Adonis be played after the vote has >started/ended, or must it be played before the terms of the vote are >stated? > It must be played before the terms of the vote are stated. >Only cards which say "Usable during a political action" may be used >while a vote is going on. Note that one version of Business Pressure >says it can only be used while during a political action, while the >other does not; the first version is correct, and both should be >played that way. ---- >Q: If I throw in another card from my hand for one vote, do I replace >it right away -- thus possibly getting another vote card? A: >(Sec. 17.1, "Voting") No; cards do not get replaced until the vote is >concluded. ---- >So, as i interpret this,it goes like this: Let's say i play a Disputed >Territory (and replace it) and once it goes unblocked i play a >Bewitching Oration before i set the terms of the vote. Now i must >replace BO because we are not yet in the vote-casting phase that >overrides the standard replace-cards rule, but if i wait until vote >casting to play BO then i cannot replace it. "Only during a political action" means: after terms are set, before voting is completed (votes tallied, whatever). During a Political Action, you do not replace any cards. You may not, therefore, play BO (or any other "only during PA" card) before the terms are set, therby denying you the opportunity to replace the card early. >I guess what I am unclear about is what does "Only usable durring a >political action" mean for cards like BO. Does it just reiterate the >rule of: ---- You cannot play a modifier which doesn't match the >action being modified. > For example, you can only use Bonding during a bleed. ---- or does >it mean that the vote has to actually be happening (ie. after terms of >vote have been and after the preparatory step.)? The latter. [ quoted text not captured ]

Thomas R Wylie

L. Scott Johnson <sjoh...@math.scarolina.edu> wrote: >>Any Methuselah can burn extra political cards for extra votes. Each burned >>political card is worth one vote. If you burn an extra political card, >>ignore the effects printed on the card and throw it into your ash heap. You >>can't, however, draw new cards until the political action is finished. >This unfortunate wording makes it easy to miss the fact that Action Modifiers >and Reaction cards cannot be replaced. Hm, probably so. >(You do mean that *no* cards can be replaced, right? Not just that PAs burned >for votes may not be replaced?) Right. >It also states that Reaction cards can only be used in response to another >Methuselah's acting Minion, which the Rules Team has ruled as too broad - > >Reaction cards are not to be played in response to other Methuselah's actions >taken on one's own turn. > >Granted, this rule is silly, but you may as well be consistent. Section 3.2.2. also says you can only play reaction cards during your turn. [ quoted text not captured ]

Thomas R Wylie

Shane Travis <tra...@duke.usask.ca> wrote: >When encountering a vampire in torpor, the DT has ruled that one must >declare what one is going to do when initiating the action. Thus, >'Attempting to encounter Roxanne in Torpor' is no longer a legal action: >one must say either 'Attempting to Diablerize Roxanne' or 'Attempting to >rescue Roxanne'. (Yes, I know that this isn't what the rulebook says: >has that ever stopped the DT before?) Actually, the Jyhad rulebook is (what's new?) ambiguous on the issue; at least, the corrected rulebook is. It never actually says you wait until the action is successful before deciding the mode, and it refers to the "action of diablerie." But either a) it says that you decide up front which mode you are in, or b) it has errata to that effect, since it would be ridiculous to have to guess when someone's encountering your vampire whether they're doing so to rescue or to diablerize. In any event, the "encounter in torpor" action doesn't exist in VTES. Rescuing and diablerizing are explicitly listed as separate actions (missed this when summarizing the edition changes earlier). [ quoted text not captured ]

Shane Travis

Thomas R Wylie (aa...@cats.ucsc.edu) wrote: : But either a) it says that you decide : up front which mode you are in, or b) it has errata to that effect, since : it would be ridiculous to have to guess when someone's encountering your : vampire whether they're doing so to rescue or to diablerize. Explain to me _why_ you find it ridiculous? I'll grant you that I don't play V:TM at all, and there may be mitigating factors there to explain this, but how does a vampire going to rescue someone 'look' different than a vampire going to diablerize someone? AFAIK, they carry no extraneous equipment in either case... [ quoted text not captured ]

Gord Culleton

Shane Travis (tra...@duke.usask.ca) writes: > this, but how does a vampire going to rescue someone 'look' different > than a vampire going to diablerize someone? AFAIK, they carry no > extraneous equipment in either case... Ah, all except for the bib with the lobster on it, and the spats to protect the shoes... ;) > Shane H.W. Travis | I try to take one day at a time, > tra...@duke.usask.ca | but sometimes several days attack at once. > Saskatoon, Saskatchewan | -- Ashleigh Brilliant Behind the Beauty, Jere Cracks Appear... Culleton

Alan Eisinger

In article <44idl7$8...@tribune.usask.ca>, Shane Travis <tra...@duke.usask.ca> wrote: >Thomas R Wylie (aa...@cats.ucsc.edu) wrote: > >: But either a) it says that you decide >: up front which mode you are in, or b) it has errata to that effect, since >: it would be ridiculous to have to guess when someone's encountering your >: vampire whether they're doing so to rescue or to diablerize. > >Explain to me _why_ you find it ridiculous? I'll grant you that I don't >play V:TM at all, and there may be mitigating factors there to explain >this, but how does a vampire going to rescue someone 'look' different >than a vampire going to diablerize someone? AFAIK, they carry no >extraneous equipment in either case... > As a V:tM player and fan, I would agree with you, BUT ... Jyhad is not an accurate account of vampiric life. On the subject of torpor, if one wanted to give a realistic interpretation, a Flamethrower would burn any vampire. (torch him, put him in torpor, stand there until he is fried.) This is not the case, however, from a gameplay standpoint. A similar argument applies to encounter/ diablerize/rescue. It doesn't make sense, but if you didn't have to declare, it would detract from gameplay. gnfnrf +44 stealth (D) A Mesuthelah of your choice is ousted.

L. Scott Johnson

[ quoted text not captured ] Declaring your Torpor intentions after block attempts is no more ridiculous nor any more detracting from gameplay than announcing the terms of a vote after all block attempts. -- L. Scott Johnson (sjoh...@math.sc.edu) | These opinions are mine and http://www.math.sc.edu/~sjohnson | are subject to card text. Graphics Specialist and V:tES Rulemonger. |

Thomas R Wylie

Shane Travis <tra...@duke.usask.ca> wrote: >: But either a) it says that you decide >: up front which mode you are in, or b) it has errata to that effect, since >: it would be ridiculous to have to guess when someone's encountering your >: vampire whether they're doing so to rescue or to diablerize. >Explain to me _why_ you find it ridiculous? I'll grant you that I don't >play V:TM at all, and there may be mitigating factors there to explain >this, but how does a vampire going to rescue someone 'look' different >than a vampire going to diablerize someone? AFAIK, they carry no >extraneous equipment in either case... I don't find it ridiculous from the standpoint of V:TM simulation, but from a V:TES game balance perspective. If you're going to be messing with my minions, I should know just what you're going to be doing to them before deciding whether I want to do anything about it. While specific exceptions can be made, and there's arguably a general exception (referendums), this should not be one of those exceptions. Besides, if we we wanted it to strictly simulate V:TM, we'd have it such that only vampires with auspex would know the vampire's plans, since they could scan the aura for diabolist tendencies. [ quoted text not captured ]

L. Scott Johnson

In article <44pb8d$b...@newsbf02.news.aol.com>, CurtAdams <curt...@aol.com> wrote: >tra...@duke.usask.ca (Shane Travis) writes: >>There are two distinct phases during the vote: the playing of the >>Political Action card, and the actually tallying of the votes (often >>referred to on this group as The Referendum). The Bewitching Oration has > >>been ruled that it can only be played during the Referendum portion of >>the action, and thus is not replaced. > >>The rationale is this: these cards all say 'Only usable DURING a >political >>action' (emphasis mine). Until the vote has successfully be called (i.e. >>not blocked and terms set) one is concievably not 'in' the political >>action sub-phase (= referendum). > >However a number of cards make no sense unless "political action" includes >the runup phase; e.g. Natasha , whose +1 stealth on political actions is >pretty useless if it doesn't work until after the vote has been >successfully called. So there's no reason in cards or rules not to play >BO prior to declaring the vote. Natasha does not have "+1 stealth, only usable during a political action", she has "+1 stealth on political actions", which is quite different. (and useful). (What other cards make no sense? Only Natasha seems to be able to be misinterpretted, IMHO). -- ----- L. Scott Johnson (lsc...@crl.com) | The opinions expressed are mine Graphics Specialist and V:tES Rulemonger | and subject to card text

Keith Rohrer

In article <44le0p$a...@darkstar.UCSC.EDU>, Thomas R Wylie <aa...@cats.ucsc.edu> wrote: > >Shane Travis <tra...@duke.usask.ca> wrote: >>: But either a) it says that you decide >>: up front which mode you are in, or b) it has errata to that effect, since >>: it would be ridiculous to have to guess when someone's encountering your >>: vampire whether they're doing so to rescue or to diablerize. You don't guess, you send your potential blocker to observe. If the acting vampire decides your torpid vampire is crunch'n'munch, the blocker will attempt to stop the diablerie. Rescues, on the other hand, would go unhindered. >I don't find it ridiculous from the standpoint of V:TM simulation, but >from a V:TES game balance perspective. If you're going to be messing with >my minions, I should know just what you're going to be doing to them before >deciding whether I want to do anything about it. While specific exceptions >can be made, and there's arguably a general exception (referendums), this >should not be one of those exceptions. Keith -- Disclaimer: Despite the fact that I disclaim any connections between the opinions expressed here and any other person, group, or entity which has not licensed said opinions, my opinions are in fact not connected with any other person, group, or entity which has not licensed them.

Keith Rohrer

In article <44i7aq$8...@darkstar.UCSC.EDU>, Thomas R Wylie <aa...@cats.ucsc.edu> wrote: > >L. Scott Johnson <sjoh...@math.scarolina.edu> wrote: >>It also states that Reaction cards can only be used in response to another >>Methuselah's acting Minion, which the Rules Team has ruled as too broad - >> >>Reaction cards are not to be played in response to other Methuselah's actions >>taken on one's own turn. >> >>Granted, this rule is silly, but you may as well be consistent. > >Section 3.2.2. also says you can only play reaction cards during your turn. You can only play reaciton cards during your turn?!? Waitaminnit, let me trade some unsuspecting fool all my Wake With Evening's Freshnesses. :-) But you meant "You may only play reaction cards when it is not your turn", which is what 3.2.2 says. [ quoted text not captured ]