... he gets back from GenCon on the 24th. Undoubtedly, Tom has a zillion
unanswered questions piled up on his list, so maybe some of you 'veteran'
(4 or 5 days) players out there can help him out with these questions:
1. Player A taps a minion to bleed Player B. Player B declines to
block thinking he can sacrifice 1 pool this turn and try to block someone
else. Player A laughs evilly and plays "Conditioning" (action mod.) to
bleed B for 4 points. Does player B get another chance to block? Or
does this work like Howl from Beyond in Magic (if you don't block, you
can get hosed by fast effects)?
2. Vampire A is blocked by Vampire B. Both have 3 blood counters.
Vampire B's owner plays Trap (B gets to press for at least 3 combat
rounds, etc.). In the first round, Vampire B pulls Claws of the Dead
(does aggravated damage) and puts Vampire A into torpor with 2 blood
counters left; B loses 1 point to A's normal hand attack. Now, B presses
for another round of combat. Which of the following is correct:
a. B can't, A goes to the torpid vampire section and combat ends.
b. B can, but can't knock off any more blood from A unless he has
card that gives aggravated damage (i.e. torpid vampires are
immune to 'normal' damage).
c. B can, and he can continue to bleed A dry with 'normal' damage
but cannot KILL Vampire A.
d. B can, and hell, since he's right there, he can diablerize A!
I'm rooting for option (c). Option (d) sounds cool but it's not B's turn
so he shouldn't be able to perform the 'action' of encountering a torpid
vampire.
3. If one of your minions goes into torpor this turn and you have
untapped minions, can you immediately try to 'rescue' him with one of
your other minions? Or, do you have to wait until next turn?
4. If you 'rescue' an untapped vampire from torpor, can you use him this
turn? The 'rescuer' taps, but the rules don't say that the torpid
vampire taps - and I assume he doesn't since he's not doing anything
himself. Or, does he have "summoning sickness" (for lack of a better term)?
I checked the rules and the FAQ (thanks, Roberto, for posting it) and
couldn't find the answers.
Vano Chu chuvano@stein.u.washington.edu (206) 543-1462
"Seattle: Where pennies are almost a dime-a-dozen!"
In rec.games.deckmaster chuvano@u.washington.edu (Vano Chu) writes:
>... he gets back from GenCon on the 24th. Undoubtedly, Tom has a zillion
>unanswered questions piled up on his list, so maybe some of you 'veteran'
>(4 or 5 days) players out there can help him out with these questions:
We'll try. :)
>1. Player A taps a minion to bleed Player B. Player B declines to
>block thinking he can sacrifice 1 pool this turn and try to block someone
>else. Player A laughs evilly and plays "Conditioning" (action mod.) to
>bleed B for 4 points. Does player B get another chance to block? Or
>does this work like Howl from Beyond in Magic (if you don't block, you
>can get hosed by fast effects)?
You can get hosed. Section 13.3.1, last paragraph: "Once a Methuselah
has passed an opportunity to block an action, he or she cannot attempt
to block it later, regardless of whether other blocking attempts have
been made, or whether the action has been modified. A successful block
(see next section) taps the blocking minion.
>2. Vampire A is blocked by Vampire B. Both have 3 blood counters.
>Vampire B's owner plays Trap (B gets to press for at least 3 combat
>rounds, etc.). In the first round, Vampire B pulls Claws of the Dead
>(does aggravated damage) and puts Vampire A into torpor with 2 blood
>counters left; B loses 1 point to A's normal hand attack. Now, B presses
>for another round of combat. Which of the following is correct:
> a. B can't, A goes to the torpid vampire section and combat ends.
> b. B can, but can't knock off any more blood from A unless he has
> card that gives aggravated damage (i.e. torpid vampires are
> immune to 'normal' damage).
> c. B can, and he can continue to bleed A dry with 'normal' damage
> but cannot KILL Vampire A.
> d. B can, and hell, since he's right there, he can diablerize A!
>I'm rooting for option (c). Option (d) sounds cool but it's not B's turn
>so he shouldn't be able to perform the 'action' of encountering a torpid
>vampire.
The rules have nothing to say about this so far as I've been able to
tell. If anyone can point me to rules on this, I'd be most grateful.
I'm really not sure which makes most sense, although it does seem like
it should be possible to destroy a vampire through combat a bit more
easily than you can do right now. This one is going to have to wait
for some sort of official ruling though, unless someone has better
eyes than me and can find some sort of reference in the current rules.
(See also question about what happens when a single strike does both
normal and aggravated damage.)
>3. If one of your minions goes into torpor this turn and you have
>untapped minions, can you immediately try to 'rescue' him with one of
>your other minions? Or, do you have to wait until next turn?
Yes. Encountering the vampire is an action, and there are no
limitations on when actions may be taken other than "during your
turn." In fact, if the vampire wasn't tapped and had blood counters,
it could immediately tap to rescue itself!
>4. If you 'rescue' an untapped vampire from torpor, can you use him this
>turn? The 'rescuer' taps, but the rules don't say that the torpid
>vampire taps - and I assume he doesn't since he's not doing anything
>himself. Or, does he have "summoning sickness" (for lack of a better term)?
You can use him, so far as I can tell. At least, there's no rule
against it. Though unless the previously torpid vampire had sustained
aggravated damage, he's going to have to hunt as his first action.
I'll agree that these questions could all use some further
clarifications...
Rollie
In article <333ddm$gv6@news.u.washington.edu>,
Vano Chu <chuvano@u.washington.edu> wrote:
>... he gets back from GenCon on the 24th. Undoubtedly, Tom has a zillion
>unanswered questions piled up on his list, so maybe some of you 'veteran'
>(4 or 5 days) players out there can help him out with these questions:
>
>1. Player A taps a minion to bleed Player B. Player B declines to
>block thinking he can sacrifice 1 pool this turn and try to block someone
>else. Player A laughs evilly and plays "Conditioning" (action mod.) to
>bleed B for 4 points. Does player B get another chance to block? Or
>does this work like Howl from Beyond in Magic (if you don't block, you
>can get hosed by fast effects)?
I'll answer my own question. Found this in the book somewhere that once
you pass up a chance to block, you don't get another chance even if your
opponent uses nasty modifiers.
Vano Chu chuvano@stein.u.washington.edu (206) 543-1462
In article <33aook$2hp@rosie.next.com>, rollie@next.com (Matt Rollefson) writes:
|>
|> >2. Vampire A is blocked by Vampire B. Both have 3 blood counters.
|> >Vampire B's owner plays Trap (B gets to press for at least 3 combat
|> >rounds, etc.). In the first round, Vampire B pulls Claws of the Dead
|> >(does aggravated damage) and puts Vampire A into torpor with 2 blood
|> >counters left; B loses 1 point to A's normal hand attack. Now, B presses
|> >for another round of combat. Which of the following is correct:
|> > a. B can't, A goes to the torpid vampire section and combat ends.
|> > b. B can, but can't knock off any more blood from A unless he has
|> > card that gives aggravated damage (i.e. torpid vampires are
|> > immune to 'normal' damage).
|> > c. B can, and he can continue to bleed A dry with 'normal' damage
|> > but cannot KILL Vampire A.
|> > d. B can, and hell, since he's right there, he can diablerize A!
|> >I'm rooting for option (c). Option (d) sounds cool but it's not B's turn
|> >so he shouldn't be able to perform the 'action' of encountering a torpid
|> >vampire.
|>
|> The rules have nothing to say about this so far as I've been able to
|> tell. If anyone can point me to rules on this, I'd be most grateful.
|> I'm really not sure which makes most sense, although it does seem like
|> it should be possible to destroy a vampire through combat a bit more
|> easily than you can do right now. This one is going to have to wait
|> for some sort of official ruling though, unless someone has better
|> eyes than me and can find some sort of reference in the current rules.
|> (See also question about what happens when a single strike does both
|> normal and aggravated damage.)
I believe the vampire *immediately* goes into torpor because I have a card
that allows the vampire to remain in play until the end of combat even if
it has taken aggravated damage and that card wouldn't make sense if the
vampire goes into torpor after combat anyway. A first strike that does
aggravated damage would send the vampire into torpor before he could do any
damage (I think).
--
Roberto Ullfig - ullfig@fnrobo.fnal.gov
Vano Chu <chuvano@u.washington.edu> wrote:
>1. Player A taps a minion to bleed Player B. Player B declines to
>block thinking he can sacrifice 1 pool this turn and try to block someone
>else. Player A laughs evilly and plays "Conditioning" (action mod.) to
>bleed B for 4 points. Does player B get another chance to block? Or
>does this work like Howl from Beyond in Magic (if you don't block, you
>can get hosed by fast effects)?
Player B does not get another chance to block once she has passed up
the opportunity to do so.
>2. Vampire A is blocked by Vampire B. Both have 3 blood counters.
>Vampire B's owner plays Trap (B gets to press for at least 3 combat
>rounds, etc.). In the first round, Vampire B pulls Claws of the Dead
>(does aggravated damage) and puts Vampire A into torpor with 2 blood
>counters left; B loses 1 point to A's normal hand attack. Now, B presses
>for another round of combat. Which of the following is correct:
> a. B can't, A goes to the torpid vampire section and combat ends.
I'm pretty sure that as soon as it's determined that A can't prevent the
damage, A goes into torpor and the combat ends... it doesn't even progress
to the press step. I'll check on that.
>3. If one of your minions goes into torpor this turn and you have
>untapped minions, can you immediately try to 'rescue' him with one of
>your other minions? Or, do you have to wait until next turn?
You can visit it that same turn.
>4. If you 'rescue' an untapped vampire from torpor, can you use him this
>turn? The 'rescuer' taps, but the rules don't say that the torpid
>vampire taps - and I assume he doesn't since he's not doing anything
>himself. Or, does he have "summoning sickness" (for lack of a better term)?
You can use the rescued vampire immediately, assuming it is untapped.
Note that normally vampires will come out with no blood counters on them,
so will have to hunt immediately.
Tom Wylie rec.games.deckmaster Network Representative for
aahz@hal.com Wizards of the Coast, Inc.