sonja blue (LSJ)

in an old thread . http://groups.google.com/group/rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad/browse_frm/thread/1bb4399b2fe1b938/2354ab67650c953a?lnk=st&q=&rnum=1&hl=en there is a discussion on sonja blue contesting i gain 4 pool then both are burned per sonja special, and lsj did confirm this. doesn't this contradicts this ruling still shown in the ruling section of the vtes site.. "# Incoming copies of contested cards do not enter play prior to being contested. Any effect the new copy of the contested has for being in play is not activated prior to the contest. [RTR 20030519] "? from this it seems that the new sonja does not enter play, i do not gain 4 pool and the old sonja alone burns. but then also scarce vampires have been ruled to pay before contesting... confused...... Andrea

andrea....@infinito.it wrote: > in an old thread . > > http://groups.google.com/group/rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad/browse_frm/thread/1bb4399b2fe1b938/2354ab67650c953a?lnk=st&q=&rnum=1&hl=en > there is a discussion on sonja blue contesting > i gain 4 pool then both are burned per sonja special, and lsj did > confirm this. > > doesn't this contradicts this ruling still shown in the ruling section > of the vtes site.. > "# Incoming copies of contested cards do not enter play prior to being > contested. Any effect the new copy of the contested has for being in > play is not activated prior to the contest. [RTR 20030519] "? No. The ruling says that no effect of the card-in-play is applied before contesting. Sonja's "gain 4" effect is not an effect of her card-in-play. It is an effect generated by the play of the card. [ quoted text not captured ]

On Aug 29, 4:08 pm, LSJ <vtes...@white-wolf.com> wrote: > andrea.la.ma...@infinito.it wrote: > > in an old thread . > > >http://groups.google.com/group/rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad/browse_f... > > there is a discussion on sonja blue contesting > > i gain 4 pool then both are burned per sonja special, and lsj did > > confirm this. > > > doesn't this contradicts this ruling still shown in the ruling section > > of the vtes site.. > > "# Incoming copies of contested cards do not enter play prior to being > > contested. Any effect the new copy of the contested has for being in > > play is not activated prior to the contest. [RTR 20030519] "? > > No. > > The ruling says that no effect of the card-in-play is applied before contesting. > Sonja's "gain 4" effect is not an effect of her card-in-play. It is an effect > generated by the play of the card. Ok but then her text says "If Sonja leaves play, remove her from the game." the entering one is never IN PLAY per RTR 20030519 so only the old one burns.... Andrea

[ quoted text not captured ] Ah. Yes, I thought you were asking about the 4 pool. The "both are removed" is in error. (Reversal) The incoming copy is not removed. She contests the other (which is removed), and becomes ready (the contest won) on your next untap phase.

[ quoted text not captured ] Hi I've playing a Sonja deck (or many variations of) for a while now. It does fairly well most of the time. When my Diamond Thunderbolt get Sudden Reversed or when it's just not in my hand when needed, I won't hesitate to bring out another Sonja to previously gain 4 pool and burn both, and bring her out again next round. More or less this has worked pretty good. With this, I see all kind of potential abuse, especially in the area that my deck has the biggest problem (Sonja sitting in torpor). LSJ, what is the official word on employing the "Bakija Gambit" with regards to Sonja Blue? Mark

BlackPrince wrote: > LSJ, what is the official word on employing the "Bakija Gambit" with > regards to Sonja Blue? Same as with any other vampire: It is legal to make the transfers, and it is not optional to bring her out when counters demand it.

[ quoted text not captured ] Wait... how does that work? Someone else has your Sonja blue. You bring out your sonja blue, it never hits play because it contests right? [you do not gain the 4 pool] The first sonja blue leaves play do to contesting and then burns. Next turn you win the contesting and the second one comes into play. So why would they both burn? > > With this, I see all kind of potential abuse, especially in the area > that my deck has the biggest problem (Sonja sitting in torpor). > Doesn't card text of sonja blue not care where sonja is sitting? Whether in controlled/region or torpor, the predator can spend 1 pool to move sonja to her ready region. Sonja doesn't move around the table? Heh, if you are playing votes you should play Peace of Khetamon. :) > LSJ, what is the official word on employing the "Bakija Gambit" with > regards to Sonja Blue? > > Mark- Hide quoted text - > > - Show quoted text -

adam....@gmail.com wrote: > Wait... how does that work? Someone else has your Sonja blue. You > bring out your sonja blue, it never hits play because it contests > right? [you do not gain the 4 pool] The first sonja blue leaves play > do to contesting and then burns. Next turn you win the contesting and > the second one comes into play. So why would they both burn? Somebody else has a copy of Sonja. You *play* (influence out) your copy, and gain 4 pool. Your copy does not enter play (though it was still played - for comparison, bleed action cards are played but are not put in play, i.e. they do not "enter play" either). Their copy of Sonja burns, but as your copy never entered play it cannot *leave* play and thus remains unremoved. In your next untap phase, your copy of Sonja enters play. HTH :) Ed.