Ash heap question (LSJ)

Eric Pettersen wrote: > > When a vamp is "temporarily controlled" (Malk Dementia, Mind Rape) and is > burned, whose ash heap does the burned vamp go into? > --- > Eric Pettersen > pett "at" cgl "dot" ucsf "dot" edu (NeXTmail capable) It goes to its owner ash-heap. > Cards that go into an ash heap, hand, or library always go into > their owner's ash heap, hand, or library. [RTR 970425] Anthony Barker.

Eric Pettersen wrote: > > When a vamp is "temporarily controlled" (Malk Dementia, Mind Rape) and is > burned, whose ash heap does the burned vamp go into? we had a naughty person in our playgroup stealing other people's vampires and then burning them and redeeming and possessing and stuff, so we asked lsj, who asked the rules team, and they said:[paraphrased] burned cards go into their OWNER'S ashheap. (regardless of controller). Part of the gold and shiny rule of card ownership or something...to stop people going "oh well, ill just shuffle this tomb, which i disputed territorried away from another player and then got burned to my ash heap, back into my deck. oops." -- + ....salem christ.... + + --k94...@bohm.anu.edu.au-- + +++ http://www.geocities.com/SunsetStrip/Stage/5848/ +++ +..the way the rain comes down hard..that's how i feel inside..+

Anthony Barker wrote: > It goes to its owner ash-heap. > > > Cards that go into an ash heap, hand, or library always go into > > their owner's ash heap, hand, or library. [RTR 970425] heeeeey... what happens if i trade a vote in my hand to another methuselah via succubus club. then in their turn they play the vote card, and the vote is not blocked. if i now play "delaying tactics" which says return the card to the hand, does that mean it goes back to _my_ hand???? [ quoted text not captured ]

LSJ wrote: [snip] > > Note that Carlotta could exchange a Succubus-traded card in your > hand for one in your library (violating the rule on returning > cards to the library by explicit card text). Doesn't Carlotta exchange cards in your hand for library cards in your _ash heap_ not your library? > > However, attempting the same thing with Whispers of the Dead > wouldn't work, since the template used by WotD doesn't override > the rule. (Actually, Carlotta's text may just be an oversight - > I'll run it by the RT). Since WotD says to 'discard' whereas Carlotta says to 'exchange'. Imogen also says to 'exchange'. So basically a card only reverts to its owner while going to an ash-heap, library, or hand and doesn't get returned if it can somehow avoid this process (such as through explicit card text). Thus if the card ends up in someone else's ash heap, library, or hand (e.g., Carlotta and Imogen), it stays there until something else happens to move it back. Is this correct? Anthony Barker.

see...@bottom.of.msg wrote: > Anthony Barker wrote: > > It goes to its owner ash-heap. > > > Cards that go into an ash heap, hand, or library always go into > > > their owner's ash heap, hand, or library. [RTR 970425] > heeeeey... > what happens if i trade a vote in my hand to another methuselah via > succubus club. > then in their turn they play the vote card, and the vote is not blocked. > if i now play "delaying tactics" which says return the card to the hand, > does that mean it goes back to _my_ hand???? No, because card text explicitly overrides that. Note that Carlotta could exchange the Succubus-traded card in your hand for one in your library (violating the rule on returning cards to the library by explicit card text). However, attempting the same thing with Whispers of the Dead wouldn't work, since the template used by WotD doesn't override the rule. (Actually, Carlotta's text may just be an oversight - I'll run it by the RT). If that card Carlotta moved to your library is later burned by Dirtly Little Secrets, then it moves from your Library to the owner's ash heap (since DLS doesn'toverride the rule). However, your Predator's Imogen could move the Succubus-traded card from your hand to your Ash Heap, since she uses an "exchange" template similar to Caroltta's. Once in your Ash Heap, the card could be returned to your hand by Carlotta's ability or by Whispers of the Dead. In general, you should keep careful track of cards that your trade from your hand with Succubus Club, so that the Golden Rule is not violated. I'll run Carlotta and Imogen by the RT in the hopes of getting them to "discard" the appropriate card rather than "exchanging" it. But the text on Delaying Tactics is appropriate, I believe. OK so far? -- L. Scott Johnson (vte...@wizards.com) Official VtES Net.Rep for Wizards of the Coast. (*) - Subject to review by Rules Team -------------------==== Posted via Deja News ====----------------------- http://www.dejanews.com/ Search, Read, Post to Usenet