A few rules Qs

This first one is probably answered by [LSJ 20-08-2001] but I wanted to check since timing isn't specified in the question that was answered there: If Demonstration (or similar) is used to cancel a vampire's votes during a referendum, and that vampire later gains more votes, are those votes canceled as well? ("pre-canceled" in a sense?) Does "cancel a vampire's votes" then mean "force that vampire to abstain from voting, nullifying any votes he/ she has already cast"? Can Jake Washington's life counter be moved off him by Goth Band? Or does he not actually have a life counter and his life is represented only by cardtext? If that's the case, is it impossible for him to gain life (assuming there were some card that would give it to him)? This last one, I find the argument dubious at best, but one of the players in my group wanted me to ask. :-) Can Heidelberg be used to move location-equipment from one minion to another? The reasoning is this: Heidelberg says it can be used to transfer "equipment cards" (etc). A loquipment card is (arguably) an equipment *card* even while it's in play (its text says that it doesn't count as equipment, but just as an ally in the ash heap is still an ally *card*, a loquipment in play may still be an equipment card). Therefore it may be movable? He draws an analogy to master cards in play: Goth Band wouldn't be able to move counters at all if master cards, once played from the hand, didn't remain master cards while in play. I think this analogy fails in that masters all have the word "Master" at the start of their rules text, where loquipment cards do not have the word "Equipment" at the start of their rules text. thanks, Josh glad that logic at least managed to answer two of three questions correctly from our last play session before looking up answers online

Joshua Duffin wrote: > > This first one is probably answered by [LSJ 20-08-2001] but > I wanted to check since timing isn't specified in the question > that was answered there: > > If Demonstration (or similar) is used to cancel a vampire's > votes during a referendum, and that vampire later gains more > votes, are those votes canceled as well? ("pre-canceled" in Yes. > a sense?) Does "cancel a vampire's votes" then mean "force > that vampire to abstain from voting, nullifying any votes he/ > she has already cast"? Yes. > Can Jake Washington's life counter be moved off him by Goth > Band? Or does he not actually have a life counter and his > life is represented only by cardtext? If that's the case, is > it impossible for him to gain life (assuming there were some > card that would give it to him)? He's not a master card while in play. [LSJ 21-JUN-2001] > This last one, I find the argument dubious at best, but one > of the players in my group wanted me to ask. :-) Can Heidelberg > be used to move location-equipment from one minion to another? No. It's not equipment while in play. > The reasoning is this: Heidelberg says it can be used to transfer > "equipment cards" (etc). A loquipment card is (arguably) an > equipment *card* even while it's in play (its text says that it > doesn't count as equipment, but just as an ally in the ash heap > is still an ally *card*, a loquipment in play may still be an > equipment card). Therefore it may be movable? > He draws an analogy to master cards in play: Goth Band wouldn't > be able to move counters at all if master cards, once played > from the hand, didn't remain master cards while in play. I Correct. > think this analogy fails in that masters all have the word "Master" > at the start of their rules text, where loquipment cards do not > have the word "Equipment" at the start of their rules text. The problem is that "equipment card" means, for a card in play, a "card that represents equipment". -- LSJ (vte...@white-wolf.com) V:TES Net.Rep for White Wolf, Inc. Links to revised rulebook, rulings, errata, and tournament rules: http://www.white-wolf.com/vtes/

"LSJ" <vte...@white-wolf.com> wrote in message news:3CB5AD3D...@white-wolf.com... > Joshua Duffin wrote: > > Can Jake Washington's life counter be moved off him by Goth > > Band? Or does he not actually have a life counter and his > > life is represented only by cardtext? If that's the case, is > > it impossible for him to gain life (assuming there were some > > card that would give it to him)? > > He's not a master card while in play. [LSJ 21-JUN-2001] Ah, neglected to look that one up. That's because the card, while in play, "represents a mortal ally" and therefore is no longer a master card? So all master cards that go into play *default* to remaining master cards, but if their text says they become something else, they cease to be master cards and aren't affectable by Goth Band? > > think this analogy fails in that masters all have the word "Master" > > at the start of their rules text, where loquipment cards do not > > have the word "Equipment" at the start of their rules text. > > The problem is that "equipment card" means, for a card in play, > a "card that represents equipment". So using "cardtype" as determinable from the upper left corner of a card (or the background color) is only meaningful for cards that are not in play, and cards in play that have no contradictory instructions? thanks again, Josh

Joshua Duffin wrote: > > "LSJ" <vte...@white-wolf.com> wrote in message > news:3CB5AD3D...@white-wolf.com... > > Joshua Duffin wrote: > > > > Can Jake Washington's life counter be moved off him by Goth > > > Band? Or does he not actually have a life counter and his > > > life is represented only by cardtext? If that's the case, is > > > it impossible for him to gain life (assuming there were some > > > card that would give it to him)? > > > > He's not a master card while in play. [LSJ 21-JUN-2001] > > Ah, neglected to look that one up. That's because the card, > while in play, "represents a mortal ally" and therefore is > no longer a master card? So all master cards that go into > play *default* to remaining master cards, but if their text > says they become something else, they cease to be master cards > and aren't affectable by Goth Band? Sure. There's no general rule, really, just a general rule made up to handle the Jake case. All other master cards in play are, conveniently enough, still master cards. Jake probably should've had the "and doesn't count as a master card" text on him. > > > think this analogy fails in that masters all have the word "Master" > > > at the start of their rules text, where loquipment cards do not > > > have the word "Equipment" at the start of their rules text. > > > > The problem is that "equipment card" means, for a card in play, > > a "card that represents equipment". > > So using "cardtype" as determinable from the upper left corner > of a card (or the background color) is only meaningful for cards > that are not in play, and cards in play that have no contradictory > instructions? Sure. Zip Gun is an equipment card, not a combat card, while in play. [ quoted text not captured ]