Predator's Communion

The superior text of Predator's Communion is this: "Only usable by a tapped vampire when a vampire is acting. This reacting vampire untaps." I have a few little timing questions about this card. 1) Can this card be played during a referendum? (In order to facilitate a Delaying Tactics, or to lessen the blow of a Domain Challenge, or whatever) Card text implies "yes" (a vampire is still acting). 2) Can this card be used after a successful block? (during the timing window when one would play Cats Guidance or Fast Reaction) I'm not sure of this one. Is the "acting vampire" still considered to be acting, at this time? I would think "yes" but am just looking for confirmation.

Jozxyqk skrev: > The superior text of Predator's Communion is this: > "Only usable by a tapped vampire when a vampire is acting. This > reacting vampire untaps." > > > I have a few little timing questions about this card. > > 1) Can this card be played during a referendum? (In order to > facilitate a Delaying Tactics, or to lessen the blow of a Domain > Challenge, or whatever) Card text implies "yes" (a vampire is > still acting). In general, reaction cards cannot be played during a referendum. Reaction cards playable during referendums have "rule breaking" text in line with "only playable during a referendum" or "also playable during a referendum". The same is true for action modifiers. I have to admit that I'm unable to find WHERE this rule is written though, but, unfourtenately, this is not exactly an uncommon situation for V:TES. :) The "when a vampire is acting" is not only a clarification, it's also a specification. Predator's Communion is useless when you get rushed by a War Ghoul as it is not a vampire. > > 2) Can this card be used after a successful block? (during the > timing window when one would play Cats Guidance or Fast Reaction) > I'm not sure of this one. Is the "acting vampire" still considered > to be acting, at this time? I would think "yes" but am just looking > for confirmation. Yes. As long as action modifiers are playable you may play reaction cards (insofar as they are legal to play in the first place depending on type of action and card text). You could, for example, respond to a Freak Drive after having declined to block an inoffensive action. Sten During -- Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com

[ quoted text not captured ] No to both. Action Modifiers and Reaction cards generally can be played only before action resolution. Explicit card text ("after blocking" or "during a referendum") is needed to overcome that. (Or being a Wake).

LSJ skrev: > > No to both. Action Modifiers and Reaction cards generally can be played > only before action resolution. Explicit card text ("after blocking" or > "during a referendum") is needed to overcome that. (Or being a Wake). > Doh, that's what you get for not reading the entire question. I should be allowed to play it after declining to block a bleed though. At least as long as bleed modifiers (both Action Modifiers and Reaction cards, including "bounce" cards) are playable. Then there's the matter of the actual wording of the card. It DOES state "when a vampire is acting", which actually includes the entire action, but I guess designers intent was for that sentence to be a restriction, ie NOT usable when a non-vampire is acting. What is a Wake? Ie, where are the cards listed that belongs to the group "Wake"? (Ok, third edition may rectify this, but other attributes are actually being printed, like Frenzy, Grapple, Mortal and so on. Forced Awakening, Wake with Evening's Freshness and Helena all lack such a printed attribute.) [ quoted text not captured ]

Sten Düring wrote: > LSJ skrev: > > No to both. Action Modifiers and Reaction cards generally can be played > > only before action resolution. Explicit card text ("after blocking" or > > "during a referendum") is needed to overcome that. (Or being a Wake). > > Doh, that's what you get for not reading the entire question. > > I should be allowed to play it after declining to block a bleed though. > At least as long as bleed modifiers (both Action Modifiers and Reaction > cards, including "bounce" cards) are playable. So long as it's before resolution, sure. > Then there's the matter of the actual wording of the card. It DOES > state "when a vampire is acting", which actually includes the entire > action, but I guess designers intent was for that sentence to be a > restriction, ie NOT usable when a non-vampire is acting. Reaction cards in general are usable when another Methuselah's minion is acting. So, yes, "when a vampire is acting" is a restriction, without resorting to intent. > What is a Wake? Ie, where are the cards listed that belongs to the > group "Wake"? A reaction card that enables a tapped minion to play reaction cards as if untapped. It is not a game term, just one used to describe that class of cards.

LSJ skrev: > >> What is a Wake? Ie, where are the cards listed that belongs to the >> group "Wake"? > > A reaction card that enables a tapped minion to play reaction cards as > if untapped. > It is not a game term, just one used to describe that class of cards. > Ok, I do suggest that it be formalized as a game-term. There are a few specials attached to "wake cards", of which I assume there are exactly two. The definition above is simple and explicit, but for new players a few lines on the Rulings Page on the WW website would be good. Document it as a "class of cards" if that is preferable. Special rules I know of are: Playable anytime during an action (but not during referendum, correct, incorrect?). Playable "as card is played". Finding these special rules is quite a daunting task. For example, the query "wake playable as card is played" on the usenet archive doesn't seem to yield the one single posting where "Wake cards" were suddenly changed to overrule 1.4 and 1.6.1.5. In this very thread I learn that "Wake cards" are playable after an action resolves but before it ends. Searching for "wake playable after action resolves" gives very little directly. Sure, learning that you can wake and Fast Reaction kind of hints at it :) Same goes for "reaction cards not playable after action resolves". Written that way, a new player, reading the rulesbook can easily see that Deflection, and Conditioning for that matter, are illegal to play after a player declines to block, if that new player had been taught the rule mentioned in this thread. (Matching the rule here with 6.2.3) So another suggested addition to the Rulings Page. The basics here is that I feel that, as a new base set is being released, as much as could easily be clarified where it is easy to find is important. Base sets should, hopefully, bring in several new players who could shy away from the game if they feel that rules are arbitrarily created on a webforum called Google Groups :) [ quoted text not captured ]