KoT Spoilers from the NAC in Montreal

Please? Pretty please? With a tied down antediluvian on top?

[ quoted text not captured ] http://www.sabbatinfrance.org/newforum/viewtopic.php?t=1530&start=275 go back n forth if ye can read that. there's the toreador precon Tiago

[ quoted text not captured ] Here are some spoilers found hunting around for them on Presence mostly. Preston posted most of them. Heroic Might Cost 3 +3 Stealth Action pot: This vampire gains +1 strength and burn equipment as a strike. POT: As above except the vampire gains +2 strength and can strike for 2R. Horseshoe Action pot: Do 1 damage to a ready minion POT: Do 2 damage to a ready minion Rego Motus Combat- Cost 1 tha: Prevent 2 damage from the opposing minions strike THA: As above, but prevent 4 damage. Rafael de Corazon Cardtype: Vampire Clan: Toreador Group: 4 Capacity: 11 Discipline: AUS CEL DOM OBF PRE Camarilla Inner Circle Member. Any vampire contesting Rafael's title must yield during his or her untap phase. +2 bleed. best - chris -- Super Fun Cards www.superfuncards.com *NEW Website!* auct...@superfuncards.com

[ quoted text not captured ] Dunno why no one else replied. Probably all busy going back home or tired for Montrealers who spent the week there. Here is a small preview then... Confirmed reprints in boosters: Aching Beauty Approximation of Loyalty Arms Dealer Assault Rifle Aura of Invincibility Backstep Camera Phone Can't Take it with You Caseless Rounds Change of Target Concealed Weapon Desert Eagle Diversity Dragon's Breath Rounds Elysium: The Arboretum Empowering the Puppet King Fast Hands Fifth Tradition: Hospitality, The Finding the Path First Tradition: The Masquerade, The Forced Vigilance Fourth Tradition: The Accounting, The Frontal Assault Glancing Blow Graverobbing Harass Heart of Nizchetus, The High Ground Hostile Takeover Indomitability Life in the City Malkavian Justicar On the Qui Vive Powerbase: Chicago Powerbase: Montreal (in Ventrue Preconstructed) Reins of Power Rumors of Gehenna Scattershot Second Tradition: Domain, The Seduction Sixth Tradition: Destruction, The Soak Stutter-Step Summoning, The Tension in the Ranks Third Tradition: Progeny, The Toreador Grand Ball Unmasking, The Uptown Hunting Ground Ventrue Headquarters Warzone Hunting Ground Zillah's Valley New cards Library -------- Agate Tasliman Equipment Only usable by a vampire with capacity 4 or more. The vampire with this equipment may tap it before votes are cast in a referendum to gain 1 vote in that referendum. A vampire may have only one Agate Talisman. Arcane Appraiser Ally, Toreador Unique ghoul with 1 life, 0 strength, 1 bleed Arcane Appraiser may move an equipment card from a vampire in torporl to a ready minion you control as a +1 stealth (D) action. If a second copy of a unique equipment card you control woul enter play, it is burned instead. The Becoming 2 blood Action +1 stealth action. Requires a non-sterile vampire. Put this card in play. It becomes a 0-capacity vampire of the same clan as the acting vampire. Move up to 1 blood from the acting vampire and up to 3 Discipline cards from your hand to this vampire. This vampire cannot act this turn. If this vampire has no capacity- increasing Discipline cards, burn him or her. Dark Influences 2 pool Master: out of turn. Cancel a minion card as it is played. No cost is paid. That card cannot be played again for the remainder of the turn. Put this card in play. The next card played that would cancel another Methuselah's minion card as it is played is canceled (no cost) and this card is burned instead. Ephor 1 pool Master, Ventrue Unique Master. Put this card on a Ventrue with capacity 8 or more. This Ventrue gets +1 intercept and 1 additional vote. This Ventrue may force any vampire to yield a contested title as a +1 stealth (D) action. Eyes of Argus Reaction, aus aus: Only usable during a (D) action directed at you (or a card you control). +2 intercept AUS: Only usable by a tapped vampire. This vampire can play reaction cards and attempt to block as if untapped until the current action is concluded. Fleetness 1 blood Action, cel +1 stealth action cel (D) Bleed CEL (D) Enter combat with a tapped minion. This acting vampire gets an optional maneuver during this combat. Force of Personality 1 blood Action Modifier/Combat, pre pre: Combat - Strik: combat ends PRE: Action Modifier - Only usable as the action is announced. Vampires must burn a blood to attempt to block this action. Non-zombie allies cannot block this action. Light Intensifying Goggles Electronic Equipment This minion gets an optional maneuver on the first round of combat. You may move any aim card this minion uses to this card (even if it is canceled). This minion may play an aim card on this equipment as if from your hand. Remove that aim card from the game. Mouthpiece Action Modifier, dom dom: +1 bleed. You cannot play another action modifier to increase this bleed. DOM: Only usable by a ready vampire other than the acting minion. The acting minion may play cards that require basic Dominate as a vampire for the remainder of this action. Neonate Breach Political Action, 1 vote Select one or more Methuselah. Successful referendum means each chosen Methuselah burns 1 pool plus 3 additional pool if he or she controls a ready vampire of capacity 4 or less. Perfect Paragon 1 blood Action Modifier, pre pre: Only usable during a referendum. This vampire gains 3 votes. PRE: Allies and younger vampires get -1 intercept when attempting to block this action. Scourge Political Action, 1 vote Requires a titled vampire. Choose a vampire of the same sect. If this referendum is successful, put this card on the chosen vampire.and untap this acting vampire. The vampire with this card may enter combat with a vampire with capacity 4 or less or with an ally as a +1 stealth (D) action. Torrent 2 blood Combat, cel cel: Additional strike. CEL: Strike: combat ends. If this vampire was blocked while performing an action, the ation continues as if unblocked. Vampires ---------- Honest Abe 2, Bru, Group 4 pre Camarilla. Paul Calderone 4, Bru, Group 5 cel pot pre Camarilla. Tara 6, Bru, Group 5 cel POT PRE Camarilla. Prince of San Diego Sabbat. Viktor, The Night General 9, Gan, Group 5 obf ANI CEL PRE PRO Independant. +1 stealth Dr. Solomon Grey 2, Pan, Group 5 dom pre Camarilla. Burn 1 pool when you move Solomon from your uncontrolled region to your ready region. Masdela 5, Tor, Group 5 aus cel pre POT Camarlla. Allanyan Serata 9, Tor, Group 5 ani AUS CEL OBT PRE Camarilla. Primogen.+1 strength Andrew Stuart 5, Tre, Group 4 AUS DOM THA Camarilla. When Andrew plays a card that required Thaumaturgy, reveal the top card of your library (before drawing to replace). If it also required Thaumaturgy, the card is canceled and Andrew burns 1 blood. Claus Wegener 5, Tre, Group 5 aus for tha DOM Camarilla. Gerald Windham 9, Tre, Group 5 AUS DOM FOR THA Camarilla. If Gerald has no title, he gets an additional vote for each ready titled vampire controlled by another Methuselah. +1 stealth. Lord Ephraim Wainwright 6, Tre, Group 5 for pre AUS THA Camarilla. When Ephraim plays an action card, you may search your library for another copy of that card and move it to your ash heap. If the action succeeds, move the card to your hand. Bulscu 8, Ven, Group 5 dom pot pre AUS FOR Camarilla. If you control the Edge, Bulscu can steal a loation or an equipment in play that costs 3 or less pool or blood as a (D) action. Emily Carson 5, Ven, Group 5 for pre DOM Camarilla. Primogen. During your discard phase, you may burn the Edge to untap Emily. Jack Tredegar 2, Ven, Group 5 pre Camarilla. Joseph DiGiaccomo 6, Ven, Group5 aus dom for PRE Camarilla. Joseph untaps whenever any Methuselah puts a master: location in play. Victor Donaldson 6, Ven, Group 5 for pre DOM Camarilla. Prince of Atlanta. If a Golconda you play is canceled, you may move that card from your ash heap top your library (shuffle afterward) I have a few more, so I'll post more as sooon as I can. Hope this helps give a glimpse. Good set in my opinion and from the reactions I saw at the 2 draft events.

Thanks Fred! fred_g...@sympatico.ca wrote: > On Oct 26, 3:26 am, Blooded Sand <sandm...@gmail.com> wrote: >> > > The Becoming > 2 blood > Action > +1 stealth action. Requires a non-sterile vampire. > Put this card in play. It becomes a 0-capacity vampire of the same > clan as the acting vampire. Move up to 1 blood from the acting vampire > and up to 3 Discipline cards from your hand to this vampire. This > vampire cannot act this turn. If this vampire has no capacity- > increasing Discipline cards, burn him or her. I like. > > Dark Influences > 2 pool > Master: out of turn. > Cancel a minion card as it is played. No cost is paid. That card > cannot be played again for the remainder of the turn. Put this card in > play. The next card played that would cancel another Methuselah's > minion card as it is played is canceled (no cost) and this card is > burned instead. > Looks like an anti-DI card, that is also a DI. Sort of like Vessel to Blood Doll. Suleci is turning in his haven right now, for sure... > Ephor > 1 pool > Master, Ventrue > Unique Master. Put this card on a Ventrue with capacity 8 or more. > This Ventrue gets +1 intercept and 1 additional vote. This Ventrue may > force any vampire to yield a contested title as a +1 stealth (D) > action. > Because the Ventrue needed it. (obligatory: :-) Haven't looked over the rest, but those were my first impressions. [ quoted text not captured ]

Did anyone see a new library card that allows a vampire to become an Inner Circle member? Even DRAFT text to do it? Or are the new IC members' (at least the Ventrue and Toreador) special abilities *really* just anti-Group 2/6/8/... Silver Bullets? (Yes, Hardestadt _could_ make himself Ventrue Justicar or Prince of an easily-contested city, but in the typical case, that special might as well be blank.) Josh Hardestadt + Anarch Secession + Rise of the Nephtali?

fred_g...@sympatico.ca wrote: > Heroic Might Cardtype: Action Cost: 3 blood Discipline: Potence +3 stealth. A minion can only have one Heroic Might. Burn this card if this vampire goes to torpor. [pot]: This vampire gains +1 strength and burn equipment as a strike. [POT]: As above except the vampire gains +2 strength and can strike for 2R. HorseshoeCardtype: Action Discipline: Potence [pot]: Do 1 damage to a ready minion [POT]: Do 2 damage to a ready minion Ponticulus Cardtype: Ally. Cost: 2 Pool Clan: Tremere Unique Wraith with 1 life, 0 strength, 0 bleed.Ponticulus cannot take actions or have or use equipment. He gets +1 intercept during (D) actions against you. He may tap to give any Tremere +1 intercept. He is immune to non aggravated damage. Rego Motus Cardtype: Combat Cost: 1 blood Discipline: Thaumaturgy [tha]: Prevent 2 damage from the opposing minion's strike. [THA]: As above, but prevent 4 damage. White Nights Massacre Cardtype: EventTransient. During your next discard phase, you must burn this card, and you may either burn a vampire in torpor or by tapping a ready werewolf ally you control or discarding a White Nights Massacre from your hand, burn all vampires in torpor. Here are a few more I saw on Path of Blood... [ quoted text not captured ]

On 28 okt, 04:10, librarian <aucti...@superfuncards.com> wrote: > > Dark Influences > > 2 pool > > Master: out of turn. > > Cancel a minion card as it is played. No cost is paid. That card > > cannot be played again for the remainder of the turn. Put this card in > > play. The next card played that would cancel another Methuselah's > > minion card as it is played is canceled (no cost) and this card is > > burned instead. > > Looks like an anti-DI card, that is also a DI. Sort of like Vessel to > Blood Doll. Suleci is turning in his haven right now, for sure... > Uhm, I'm not sure how to read this bit: "The next card played that would cancel *another Methuselah* 's minion card as it is played". Does that mean: 1 - another Methuselah than the one playing the mentioned "next card", or 2 - another Methuselah than "you" (you = the person who played the Dark Influences) ? 1 would cancel anyones DI, 2 would just mess "you" up. btw, Dark Influences abbreviates into DI as well.. a little joke by LSJ?

<zora...@gmail.com> wrote in messagenews:81b610c4-c8e0-4990...@b31g2000prb.googlegroups.com... [ quoted text not captured ] Well, (2) wouldn't necessarily just mess the original "you" up, no. It might cancel some other Methuselah canceling yet another Methuselah's minion card. But I don't think it matters because I'm pretty sure the answer turns out to be (1). (Of course, most of the time I guess on something that seems completely and utterly intuitive to me, I turn out to be wrong, so take that for what it's worth. IADEFINITELYNLSJ!) Fred

On Oct 27, 7:28 pm, fred_ging...@sympatico.ca wrote: > Malkavian Justicar I would presume then that the other 5 Justicar title votes are reprinted as well then. Really hoping that there's an Inner Circle card ala Regent. > New cards > > Library > -------- > > Arcane Appraiser > Ally, Toreador > Unique ghoul with 1 life, 0 strength, 1 bleed > Arcane Appraiser may move an equipment card from a vampire in torporl > to a ready minion you control as a +1 stealth (D) action. If a second > copy of a unique equipment card you control woul enter play, it is > burned instead. Seems contesting is a big thing for this set. Anti-contesting here, Inner Circle nuking titles they would otherwise contest ... > The Becoming > 2 blood > Action > +1 stealth action. Requires a non-sterile vampire. > Put this card in play. It becomes a 0-capacity vampire of the same > clan as the acting vampire. Move up to 1 blood from the acting vampire > and up to 3 Discipline cards from your hand to this vampire. This > vampire cannot act this turn. If this vampire has no capacity- > increasing Discipline cards, burn him or her. Sounds fun! Break out your Kiasyd Absorb the Mind/Mehemet decks! > Dark Influences > 2 pool > Master: out of turn. > Cancel a minion card as it is played. No cost is paid. That card > cannot be played again for the remainder of the turn. Put this card in > play. The next card played that would cancel another Methuselah's > minion card as it is played is canceled (no cost) and this card is > burned instead. An interesting 'fix' for Direct Intervention ... though will it see much play? > Ephor > 1 pool > Master, Ventrue > Unique Master. Put this card on a Ventrue with capacity 8 or more. > This Ventrue gets +1 intercept and 1 additional vote. This Ventrue may > force any vampire to yield a contested title as a +1 stealth (D) > action. Ventrue seem to be coming out from behind their board room desks to deal with matters personally. Intercept, +strength, Potence and other combat disciplines ... nice to see! > Eyes of Argus > Reaction, aus > aus: Only usable during a (D) action directed at you (or a card you > control). +2 intercept > AUS: Only usable by a tapped vampire. This vampire can play reaction > cards and attempt to block as if untapped until the current action is > concluded. And multi-purpose cards seem to be a theme as well. > Fleetness > 1 blood > Action, cel > +1 stealth action > cel (D) Bleed > CEL (D) Enter combat with a tapped minion. This acting vampire gets an > optional maneuver during this combat. Multi-purpose again, with stealth! Brujah bruise/bleed should be happy. > Light Intensifying Goggles > Electronic Equipment > This minion gets an optional maneuver on the first round of combat. > You may move any aim card this minion uses to this card (even if it is > canceled). This minion may play an aim card on this equipment as if > from your hand. Remove that aim card from the game. Neat effect, and like how it doesn't wallpaper IR goggles. > Mouthpiece > Action Modifier, dom > dom: +1 bleed. You cannot play another action modifier to increase > this bleed. > DOM: Only usable by a ready vampire other than the acting minion. The > acting minion may play cards that require basic Dominate as a vampire > for the remainder of this action. Severe ouch. Bleed with weenie, choose not to block because "it's just 1 pool, and your DOM monster is just waiting", then Mouthpiece + Condition. > Neonate Breach > Political Action, 1 vote > Select one or more Methuselah. Successful referendum means each chosen > Methuselah burns 1 pool plus 3 additional pool if he or she controls a > ready vampire of capacity 4 or less. A nice damage vote ... conditional for the big hit, but still usable even if there are no weenies on the table. > Scourge > Political Action, 1 vote > Requires a titled vampire. > Choose a vampire of the same sect. If this referendum is successful, > put this card on the chosen vampire.and untap this acting vampire. The > vampire with this card may enter combat with a vampire with capacity 4 > or less or with an ally as a +1 stealth (D) action. The untap is nice. The rush is a bit weak, though nice for the Independents who don't have access to Archon/Alastor/Templar. > Vampires > ---------- > Tara > 6, Bru, Group 5 > cel POT PRE > Camarilla. Prince of San Diego > Sabbat. Missing text? Or is the Sabbat bit just a cut and paste error? A new Volker, it seems. > Dr. Solomon Grey > 2, Pan, Group 5 > dom pre > Camarilla. Burn 1 pool when you move Solomon from your uncontrolled > region to your ready region. A Camarilla Pander? > Masdela > 5, Tor, Group 5 > aus cel pre POT > Camarlla. > > Allanyan Serata > 9, Tor, Group 5 > ani AUS CEL OBT PRE > Camarilla. Primogen.+1 strength Fighty Toreadors. Seems like Voting and Combat are the themes of this set. > Andrew Stuart > 5, Tre, Group 4 > AUS DOM THA > Camarilla. When Andrew plays a card that required Thaumaturgy, reveal > the top card of your library (before drawing to replace). If it also > required Thaumaturgy, the card is canceled and Andrew burns 1 blood. Not sure about this one. Three superior discplines at capacity 5 is nice, but the drawback makes the Thaumaturgy a bit unusable unless it's in small doses in the deck. Since I play Tremere for Thaumaturgy, doubtful he'll see use in my decks. > Gerald Windham > 9, Tre, Group 5 > AUS DOM FOR THA > Camarilla. If Gerald has no title, he gets an additional vote for each > ready titled vampire controlled by another Methuselah. +1 stealth. Very nice. Another in the line of Tremere +1 stealthers, potential for becoming a big voter, and superior Fortitude. > Lord Ephraim Wainwright > 6, Tre, Group 5 > for pre AUS THA > Camarilla. When Ephraim plays an action card, you may search your > library for another copy of that card and move it to your ash heap. If > the action succeeds, move the card to your hand. A neat effect, if a bit of a gamble. The Presence could see him used in Vote decks, leading to potential double KRC whammies. > Bulscu > 8, Ven, Group 5 > dom pot pre AUS FOR > Camarilla. If you control the Edge, Bulscu can steal a loation or an > equipment in play that costs 3 or less pool or blood as a (D) action. > > Joseph DiGiaccomo > 6, Ven, Group5 > aus dom for PRE > Camarilla. Joseph untaps whenever any Methuselah puts a master: > location in play. More Auspex for Ventrue, leading to more intercepting deck types. Certainly gives the potential for a new type of Ventrue deck. So far, I've been very pleased with the cards, and looking very forward to the set coming out. The Camarilla has been on the back burner for too long now, time to take back the night! Chris, Thrall of Arika

[ quoted text not captured ] Some more posted from the above site: > Villein Master: trifle. Put this card on a vampire you control and move 2 or more blood from that > vampire to your pool. Minion Tap cards cost an additional pool. Villein costs an additional pool to > play on this vampire. The 'vessel' of Minion Tap cards? An interesting card, and can't be cycled as easily as Minion Taps. Can see it being nice for decks that like Minion Taps, but only use one or two. > The Oath > combat/reaction > Play when a vampire gains blood from a Taste of Vitae or steals blood from this vampire. Put an > oath counter on that vampire. This vampire may put another oath counter on that vampire as a (D) > action. A vampire with 2 oath counters from this vampire cannot block or enter combat with this > vampire. A vampire can play only one Oath each round. Interesting for combat defense, if you can survive long enough to Oath them. > Mictlantecuhlti > 10 cap Gangrel > pre pro ANI FOR POT THA > Independent: M is immune to damage from weapons. When he commits diablerie, each of your > other ready vampires gains 1 blood from the blood bank. +1 strength. > > Carlak > 8 cap Brujah > dom pot CEL PRE > Prince of Prague. When votes are tallied during any referendum, Carlak gains 1 blood for each > Methuselah casting no votes in favor and at least 1 vote against the referendum. He gets an > optional press each combat. > > Zelios > 8 cap Nosferatu > pre ANI OBF POT > Camarilla Primogen: If Zelios is ready, you may tap him to pay the pool cost of a location with his > blood instead. +1 strength. > > Harold Tanner > 6 cap Nosferatu > ani dom obf POT. > When Harold is in combat, the controller of the oppising minion plays with an open hand. Chris, Thrall of Arika

On Oct 28, 2:26 pm, Thrall of Arika <christopher.ack...@amec.com> wrote: > > > Villein Master: trifle. Put this card on a vampire you control and move 2 or more blood from that > > vampire to your pool. Minion Tap cards cost an additional pool. Villein costs an additional pool to > > play on this vampire. > > The 'vessel' of Minion Tap cards? An interesting card, and can't be > cycled as easily as Minion Taps. Can see it being nice for decks that > like Minion Taps, but only use one or two. > I like this one. I definitely have a deck or two that will use it - where I only use 2 or 3 Minion Taps because I don't have something like Renewed Vigor or Voter Cap to fill back up. I think this is much more effective than DI2 which is interesting and maybe, just maybe, will decrease the instance of DI in some decks, but doesn't offer that much benefit for the 2 pool cost. > > The Oath > > combat/reaction > > Play when a vampire gains blood from a Taste of Vitae or steals blood from this vampire. Put an > > oath counter on that vampire. This vampire may put another oath counter on that vampire as a (D) > > action. A vampire with 2 oath counters from this vampire cannot block or enter combat with this > > vampire. A vampire can play only one Oath each round. > > Interesting for combat defense, if you can survive long enough to Oath > them. > Absolutely terrible. I can't think of a deck that I would play even 1 or 2 of these in. I'd rather have some sort of combat defense than rely on them fighting me, *not* torporizing, and then Tasting, and *then* on another no stealth (D) action or another Taste of Vitae and another Oath in hand. The resulting effect is strong, but not strong enough for the unlikely chain of events leading up to it. Maybe, just maybe, in combo with Legacy of Caine, but something tells me it's a silly trick that you can only pull off once.

> > Andrew Stuart > > 5, Tre, Group 4 > > AUS DOM THA > > Camarilla. When Andrew plays a card that required Thaumaturgy, reveal > > the top card of your library (before drawing to replace). If it also > > required Thaumaturgy, the card is canceled and Andrew burns 1 blood. So right now their are 8 5 cap vamps in group 3-4 that have superior DOM, this is #9. Auspex is also common among them with 5 of the 9 have some level of it.

On Oct 28, 12:03 pm, "Frederick Scott" <nos...@no.spam.dot.com> wrote: > <zoramu...@gmail.com> wrote in messagenews:81b610c4-c8e0-4990...@b31g2000prb.googlegroups.com... [ quoted text not captured ] Option 1 doesn't make a lot of sense... the Methuselah playing the "next card" will always be playing it to cancel another Methuselah's card, so that detail wouldn't be mentioned... it'd just be "the next card to cancel a minion card is cancelled". I think it is number option 2. The effect in question comes after "Put this card in play", so "another Methuslah" would refer to someone other than the controller of DI2 (which would typically be the player who played the master card). But, IDNHCIH and IANLSJ also. Brent Ross

>>> Andrew Stuart >>> > > 5, Tre, Group 4 >>> > > AUS DOM THA >>> > > Camarilla. When Andrew plays a card that required Thaumaturgy, reveal >>> > > the top card of your library (before drawing to replace). If it also >>> > > required Thaumaturgy, the card is canceled and Andrew burns 1 blood. JFC!! What the hell is with printing useless Tremere. Why are they even printing this idiot? Is anyone ever going to use him, that doesn't want to lose? I am quite frankly sick and tired of these clown Tremere vampires being printed that look great when you see their discipline spread, yet have this retarded gimpoid disadvantage. I am not even going to quote past examples, as I have no wish to sully my keyboard by typing their names. I would prefer this guy be Tremere, have not so awesome a discipline spread, AND NOT BE TOTALLY FUCKING USELESS. Tremere happen to be my favourite clan, always have been, and yet WW keep printing these retards. In the words of the great Lo-Pan "This really pisses me off to no end!" -Tim W. (recently unretired V:TeS player)

In article <SoONk.9212$sc2....@news-server.bigpond.net.au>, tim <ti...@bigpond.net.au> wrote: > >>> Andrew Stuart > >>> > > 5, Tre, Group 4 > >>> > > AUS DOM THA > >>> > > Camarilla. When Andrew plays a card that required Thaumaturgy, reveal > >>> > > the top card of your library (before drawing to replace). If it also > >>> > > required Thaumaturgy, the card is canceled and Andrew burns 1 blood. > What the hell is with printing useless Tremere. Why are they even > printing this idiot? Is anyone ever going to use him, that doesn't want > to lose? He is a 5 cap with AUS, DOM, of which currently zero exist. If you are making a deck where a 5 cap with AUS, DOM is going to be good (I hear that both DOM and AUS are pretty strong...), he is going to be gold. Sure. Don't use him in a deck that uses a lot of Thaumaturgy. Which is really easy--use him as a 5 cap with AUS, DOM, and he is awesome. Peter D Bakija pd...@lightlink.com http://www.lightlink.com/pdb6/vtes.html "It's too bad she won't live! But then again, who does?" -Gaff

[ quoted text not captured ] As I have already noted, he goes in great with mid cap DOM vamps, this vampire is a solid 5 cap VAMPIRE, yes he's probably not a great Tremere, so what. Think outside the box. 1x Banjoko DOM obt pot 5 Lasombra:3 1x Black Lotus DOM aus obf ser 5 Follower of Set:4 1x Catherine du Bois DOM for obf pre 5 Ventrue:3 1x Dame Hollerton DOM OBT myt 5 Kiasyd:4 1x Donatello Giovanni DOM aus pot pre 5 Giovanni:4 1x Ermenegildo, The Rake DOM OBT pot 5 Lasombra:4 1x Esoara DOM aus for pot 5 Tremere antitribu:4 1x Jephta Hester DOM FOR aus 5 Ventrue antitribu:4

"bwross" <bwr...@mail.com> wrote in message news:46663f27-747d-42a2...@l77g2000hse.googlegroups.com... > On Oct 28, 12:03 pm, "Frederick Scott" <nos...@no.spam.dot.com> wrote: > > <zoramu...@gmail.com> wrote in message > > news:81b610c4-c8e0-4990...@b31g2000prb.googlegroups.com... > > > On 28 okt, 04:10, librarian <aucti...@superfuncards.com> wrote: > > > > > Dark Influences > > > > > 2 pool > > > > > Master: out of turn. > > > > > Cancel a minion card as it is played. No cost is paid. That card > > > > > cannot be played again for the remainder of the turn. Put this card in > > > > > play. The next card played that would cancel another Methuselah's > > > > > minion card as it is played is canceled (no cost) and this card is > > > > > burned instead. > > > > > > Looks like an anti-DI card, that is also a DI. Sort of like Vessel to > > > > Blood Doll. Suleci is turning in his haven right now, for sure... > > > > > Uhm, I'm not sure how to read this bit: "The next card played that > > > would cancel *another Methuselah* 's minion card as it is played". > > > Does that mean: > > > 1 - another Methuselah than the one playing the mentioned "next card", > > > or > > > 2 - another Methuselah than "you" (you = the person who played the > > > Dark Influences) ? > > > > > 1 would cancel anyones DI, 2 would just mess "you" up. ... > But I don't think it matters because I'm pretty sure the answer turns > out to be (1). ... > Option 1 doesn't make a lot of sense... the Methuselah playing the > "next card" will always be playing it to cancel another Methuselah's > card, so that detail wouldn't be mentioned... Eh? Tangle Atropos' Hand. Red Herring. It's possible to cancel your own minion card. > it'd just be "the next > card to cancel a minion card is cancelled". Nope. That wording was necessary to acheive a certain effect, even for #1. Fred

On Oct 28, 10:28 pm, "Frederick Scott" <nos...@no.spam.dot.com> wrote: > "bwross" <bwr...@mail.com> wrote in message > > Option 1 doesn't make a lot of sense... the Methuselah playing the > > "next card" will always be playing it to cancel another Methuselah's > > card, so that detail wouldn't be mentioned... > > Eh? Tangle Atropos' Hand. Red Herring. It's possible to cancel Those are all "Cancel the action". That action may have involved a card, or may not have... doesn't matter because these do not cancel minion cards. But you are right that there are ways to cancel your own minion cards now... Andrew Stuart can have that happen, or Blood of Sandman your own vampire and start canceling Wakes. I'm still positive that "another Methuselah" means "other than the controller of this card, now that it's in play", given the wording we've seen. Brent Ross

<fred_g...@sympatico.ca> a écrit dans le message de news:41ef04d6-ecaa-46cc...@y79g2000hsa.googlegroups.com... Here is a small preview then... Confirmed reprints in boosters: [snip list of reprints and spoilers] thanks for the list. Did anyone see a Parity Shift in boosters and /or starters ? Stone

On 28 okt, 03:28, fred_ging...@sympatico.ca wrote: > Vampires > ---------- > Honest Abe > 2, Bru, Group 4 > pre > Camarilla. > ...Lincoln? What was the art like?

> > >>> Andrew Stuart > > >>> > > 5, Tre, Group 4 > > >>> > > AUS DOM THA > > >>> > > Camarilla. When Andrew plays a card that required Thaumaturgy, reveal > > >>> > > the top card of your library (before drawing to replace). If it also > > >>> > > required Thaumaturgy, the card is canceled and Andrew burns 1 blood. > > > JFC!! > > > What the hell is with printing useless Tremere. Why are they even > > printing this idiot? Is anyone ever going to use him, that doesn't want > > to lose? > > > I am quite frankly sick and tired of these clown Tremere vampires being > > printed that look great when you see their discipline spread, yet have > > this retarded gimpoid disadvantage. I am not even going to quote past > > examples, as I have no wish to sully my keyboard by typing their names. > > > I would prefer this guy be Tremere, have not so awesome a discipline > > spread, AND NOT BE TOTALLY FUCKING USELESS. > > > Tremere happen to be my favourite clan, always have been, and yet WW > > keep printing these retards. > > > In the words of the great Lo-Pan "This really pisses me off to no end!" > > > -Tim W. (recently unretired V:TeS player) > > As I have already noted, he goes in great with mid cap DOM vamps, this > vampire is a solid 5 cap VAMPIRE, yes he's probably not a great > Tremere, so what. Think outside the box. I concur to some extent with Tim... Yes, he can be played in Aus/Dom or Aus or Dom decks, but his special makes his superior THA almost completely worthless to the point that he'll hardly ever be seen in a Tremere deck, which means that he is an overpriced vampire, because one of his disciplines is negligible. As to "Think outside the box", it's not that simple. This guy is one of a very finite set of group 4/5 Tremere. This set is supposed to cater for Camarilla in the later groups, yet here is a vampire that really can't be used with their clan, subsequently making the Tremere in these groups harder to play (they're one down already). His special is really too counter-productive. It would have been better if his disadvantage was something like "Thaumaturgy cards cost Andrew 1 extra blood to play". Or limiting his disad to once per turn instead of EVERY THA card that he plays. --> J grail_pbem "at" hotmail.com http://www.geocities.com/grail_j

I see a future for Sebastian Goulet & His Black Spiral Buddies! ;) =========== [ quoted text not captured ]

On Oct 28, 6:18 pm, Chris Berger <ark...@ugcs.caltech.edu> wrote: > Absolutely terrible. I can't think of a deck that I would play even 1 > or 2 of these in. I'd rather have some sort of combat defense than > rely on them fighting me, *not* torporizing, and then Tasting, and > *then* on another no stealth (D) action or another Taste of Vitae and > another Oath in hand. The resulting effect is strong, but not strong > enough for the unlikely chain of events leading up to it. > > Maybe, just maybe, in combo with Legacy of Caine, but something tells > me it's a silly trick that you can only pull off once. Flesh of Marble comes to mind. -- David Cherryholmes

On Oct 29, 6:04 am, J <grai...@hotmail.com> wrote: > I concur to some extent with Tim... > Yes, he can be played in Aus/Dom or Aus or Dom decks, but his special > makes his superior THA almost completely worthless to the point that > he'll hardly ever be seen in a Tremere deck, which means that he is an > overpriced vampire, because one of his disciplines is negligible. Except that he isn't overpriced, as he is a 5 cap with 6 points in disciplines. And 5 caps only get 5 points in abilities. So he is getting THA instead of tha, but with a disadvantage to balance it out. Which means he is a 5 cap with DOM, AUS (which is very strong in and of itself) who has conditional THA in a pinch. If you put him in a deck that only uses DOM, AUS (or just DOM--no one ever does well with mono DOM after all...), he is a really good 5 cap vampire. If you put him in a deck with a lot of Thaumaturgy, and expect to use the Thaumaturgy a lot, you probably aren't going to get much good use out of him. Sure. He isn't going to go in a lot of traditional Tremere decks. But an AUS, DOM deck with a couple Thumaturgy cards mixed in (like a few Magic of the Smith or Rutor's Hand)? He is gold. He's like Beatrice Oracle Tremblay--she is an Imbued who is horrible in Imbued decks. But completely freaking awesome in non Imbued decks. > As to "Think outside the box", it's not that simple. This guy is one > of a very finite set of group 4/5 Tremere. Sometimes you get weird vampires. Ingram Frizer is a really questionable !Nosferatu (he is the only one in that group pairing with AUS I'm pretty sure). But a good vampire in general. > This set is supposed to > cater for Camarilla in the later groups, yet here is a vampire that > really can't be used with their clan, subsequently making the Tremere > in these groups harder to play (they're one down already). His > special is really too counter-productive. Not all Tremere decks have to use tons of Thaumaturgy. I hear Dominate is strong. -Peter

On Oct 29, 7:48 am, Peter D Bakija <p...@lightlink.com> wrote: > On Oct 29, 6:04 am, J <grai...@hotmail.com> wrote: > > > I concur to some extent with Tim... > > Yes, he can be played in Aus/Dom or Aus or Dom decks, but his special > > makes his superior THA almost completely worthless to the point that > > he'll hardly ever be seen in a Tremere deck, which means that he is an > > overpriced vampire, because one of his disciplines is negligible. > > Except that he isn't overpriced, as he is a 5 cap with 6 points in > disciplines. And 5 caps only get 5 points in abilities. So he is > getting THA instead of tha, but with a disadvantage to balance it out. > Which means he is a 5 cap with DOM, AUS (which is very strong in and > of itself) who has conditional THA in a pinch. If you put him in a > deck that only uses DOM, AUS (or just DOM--no one ever does well with > mono DOM after all...), he is a really good 5 cap vampire. If you put > him in a deck with a lot of Thaumaturgy, and expect to use the > Thaumaturgy a lot, you probably aren't going to get much good use out > of him. > How much Thuam do people put in their "lots of Thaum" decks? Like 45 cards, max? Even that seems a bit much, but I don't know. If it's 45, then you have approximately a 50% chance of getting a Thaum card canceled. Considering he's playing it at superior which he doesn't really have a right to do, and he has AUS DOM, that seems pretty fair. How strong do Tremere players want their vamps to be? Does each one have to be Muaziz? He'll be great in a Gargoyle deck, since he won't be expected to do much fighting.

> http://www.sabbatinfrance.org/newforum/viewtopic.php?t=1530&start=275 > > go back n forth if ye can read that. there's the toreador precon > > Tiago I can read French ok and I went thru all 21 pages in the thread and didn't see the Toreador precon. Can you help me find that (or just copy and paste it here)? Thanks!

On Oct 29, 8:56 am, Chris Berger <ark...@ugcs.caltech.edu> wrote: > How much Thuam do people put in their "lots of Thaum" decks? I'd figure enough to make it so that if this guy plays a Thaumaturgy card, he has a reasonable chance of shooting himself in the foot. So I certainly wouldn't want to use him in a deck with a lot of Thaumaturgy, no. But in mono DOM, or DOM, AUS? Fantastic. Heck, play DOM, AUS and have a couple Magic of the Smith to go get, like, the Bowl or the Ivory Bow? Probably going to be totally worth it. > He'll be great in a Gargoyle deck, since he won't be expected to do > much fighting. Also totally good--a 5 cap in a Slave Gargoyle deck with DOM, AUS? There isn't going to be much Thaumaturgy. He is great at bouncing. And getting guys out cheap with Govern. And going to bleed for 6 where if he is blocked, the blocker gets smushed by Cedric the Entertainer. -Peter

On Oct 29, 12:47 am, tim <t...@bigpond.net.au> wrote: > What the hell is with printing useless Tremere. Indeed. > Is anyone ever going to use him, that doesn't want to lose? You need to accept the concept of losing withe th Tremere, I think. > > I am quite frankly sick and tired of these clown Tremere vampires being > printed I concur. Lets start a petition. > yet have this retarded gimpoid disadvantage. ...usually denoted by a pentagram in a box. > > Tremere happen to be my favourite clan, There are therapy groups available. Trying building a !salubri deck and gradually weaning yourself onto more and more playable clans. >and yet WW keep printing these retards. They need to stop print tremere, this is true. > In the words of the great Lo-Pan "This really pisses me off to no end!" > Best film ever. GreenO -the cheque's in the mail.

[ quoted text not captured ] Sure, that'll keep you alive, but still. If you're going to play The Oath, you'll want "more than a few" - right? I mean, I can't see this being very useful as a prayer card... - and then what happens in the sizeable percentage of games where you never run into Tastes or steals- blood effects? They're completely dead cards. Reactive effect that relies on particular specific card plays by an opponent to even leave your hand = not feasibly playable. IMNSHO. - D.J.

On Oct 27, 8:53 pm, librarian <aucti...@superfuncards.com> wrote: > Horseshoe > Action > pot: Do 1 damage to a ready minion > POT: Do 2 damage to a ready minion Does not combo well with Grenade. Oh, well. Close enough. Jason

[ quoted text not captured ] Well, almost. -Peter

Rego Motus is so gonna be in my !Tremere deck! No more Agro-poke-go-to-torpor :) On the other note - no THA reprints, huh? Where's Shotgun ritual, Blood to Water, Cauldron of Blood, Seeds of Corruption, Mirror Walk, Rutor's Hand? Where??

> Mouthpiece > Action Modifier, dom > dom: +1 bleed. You cannot play another action modifier to increase > this bleed. > DOM: Only usable by a ready vampire other than the acting minion. The > acting minion may play cards that require basic Dominate as a vampire > for the remainder of this action. I was thinking Sebastian Goulet/Jacob Femor Renegade with Garou/Ossian/ Black Spiral Buddy who are Govern/Conditioning/Graverobbign deck that would be fantastic. What do you guys think? Comments Welcome, Norman S. Brown, Jr XZealot Archon of the Swamp

I think I've already posted exactly that idea in the Spoilers thread, Norman. :) (Yes! For once I got there first!) - Dave [ quoted text not captured ]

On Oct 29, 9:35 am, Meej <dj...@comcast.net> wrote: > Reactive effect that relies on particular specific card plays by an > opponent to even leave your hand = not feasibly playable. IMNSHO. Very much metagame dependent. Perhaps in blind tourneys where combat is very much the poor cousin to the other two legs of the triangle, it can look like a dicey proposition. But in my weekly games? Or (last I checked) the blood bath that is Australia or [insert fighty metagame here]? Op-cost looking pretty low to me. And the payoff is rather large: can't block me, can't rush me, take *that*, combat deck. I'm not trying to overplay the usefulness of the card, but I guess I don't think it stinks. -- David Cherryholmes

On Oct 29, 10:44 am, XZealot <xzea...@cox.net> wrote: > > Mouthpiece > > Action Modifier, dom > > dom: +1 bleed. You cannot play another action modifier to increase > > this bleed. > > DOM: Only usable by a ready vampire other than the acting minion. The > > acting minion may play cards that require basic Dominate as a vampire > > for the remainder of this action. > > I was thinking Sebastian Goulet/Jacob Femor Renegade with Garou/Ossian/ > Black Spiral Buddy who are Govern/Conditioning/Graverobbign deck that > would be fantastic. > > What do you guys think? > Won't work with Govern and Graverobbing, because Mouthpiece is an action modifier. Mouthpiece seems alright, and it has some flexibility at inferior, but I can't think of a good situation where I'd rather use it over Empowering the Puppet King. Conditioning is okay - takes 2 cards and moves the blood cost to the acting minion for an extra +1 bleed, but not spectacular or anything. Most of the time, I'd rather use Empowering and take the combo reliance out of it. Any other dominate modifiers that would make it better? Maybe Sleeping Mind, but I don't feel like it's worth a blood and 2 cards if you can't also use Seduction.

On Oct 29, 11:44 am, XZealot <xzea...@cox.net> wrote: > > Mouthpiece > > Action Modifier, dom > > dom: +1 bleed. You cannot play another action modifier to increase > > this bleed. > > DOM: Only usable by a ready vampire other than the acting minion. The > > acting minion may play cards that require basic Dominate as a vampire > > for the remainder of this action. > > I was thinking Sebastian Goulet/Jacob Femor Renegade with Garou/Ossian/ > Black Spiral Buddy who are Govern/Conditioning/Graverobbign deck that > would be fantastic. > > What do you guys think? That was my basically storyline deck in Montreal Norm. It's a fun deck, well it'll be more fun now with Mouthpiece of course, because it was basically just Empowering the Puppet King. cheers shawn

On Oct 29, 11:16 am, stan...@hotmail.com wrote: > On Oct 29, 11:44 am, XZealot <xzea...@cox.net> wrote: > > > I was thinking Sebastian Goulet/Jacob Femor Renegade with Garou/Ossian/ > > Black Spiral Buddy who are Govern/Conditioning/Graverobbign deck that > > would be fantastic. > > > That was my basically storyline deck in Montreal Norm. It's a fun > deck, well it'll be more fun now with Mouthpiece of course, because it > was basically just Empowering the Puppet King. > Explain how. I'm legitimately curious. A lot of people seem excited with Mouthpiece, and I want to know what I'm missing.

> Mouthpiece seems alright, and it has some flexibility at inferior, but > I can't think of a good situation where I'd rather use it over > Empowering the Puppet King. Conditioning is okay - takes 2 cards and > moves the blood cost to the acting minion for an extra +1 bleed, but > not spectacular or anything. Most of the time, I'd rather use > Empowering and take the combo reliance out of it. Any other dominate > modifiers that would make it better? Maybe Sleeping Mind, but I don't > feel like it's worth a blood and 2 cards if you can't also use > Seduction. How about just stack more copies of Mouthpiece, because having two makes them inherantly cycleable? Play Mouthpiece at superior, use that to play it on the acting minion at inferior? With the added bonus of not requiring Untapped like Empowering does, and dropping the Blood cost in exchange for potentially needing two cards. That to my mind is more than worth it. I was thinking Sebastian Goulet / Charisma / Black Spiral Buddies / Mouthpiece / maybe Camera Phones, with a side order of maybe a package of Quick Jab / Fake Out / to discourage blocking. Jacob Fermor should also get a look in, and you've got plenty of Werewolves potentially bleeding for 3. Hell, chuck a couple of pro Masters in and Form of Mist it up just to really hit it home.

Chris Berger <ark...@ugcs.caltech.edu> writes: > On Oct 29, 10:44 am, XZealot <xzea...@cox.net> wrote: > > > Mouthpiece > > > Action Modifier, dom > > > dom: +1 bleed. You cannot play another action modifier to increase > > > this bleed. > > > DOM: Only usable by a ready vampire other than the acting minion. The > > > acting minion may play cards that require basic Dominate as a vampire > > > for the remainder of this action. > > > > I was thinking Sebastian Goulet/Jacob Femor Renegade with Garou/Ossian/ > > Black Spiral Buddy who are Govern/Conditioning/Graverobbign deck that > > would be fantastic. > > > > What do you guys think? > > > Won't work with Govern and Graverobbing, because Mouthpiece is an > action modifier. > > Mouthpiece seems alright, and it has some flexibility at inferior, but > I can't think of a good situation where I'd rather use it over > Empowering the Puppet King. Conditioning is okay - takes 2 cards and > moves the blood cost to the acting minion for an extra +1 bleed, but > not spectacular or anything. Remember that if you're using the garou to bleed, they regenerate the cost of Conditioning right back. And if they're blocked, well, they're garou and combat monsters. Bruise'n'bleed with cardless rush. Mmm, sounds tasty. HG

[ quoted text not captured ] In shoeboxes under beds where they rightly belong. In mint condition, Gathering dust. GreenO -lovin' the reprint strategy

On Oct 27, 4:35 pm, Brum <tiago.br...@gmail.com> wrote: > On 26 Out, 07:26, Blooded Sand <sandm...@gmail.com> wrote: > > > Please? > > > Pretty please? > > > With a tied down antediluvian on top? > > http://www.sabbatinfrance.org/newforum/viewtopic.php?t=1530&start=275 > > go back n forth if ye can read that. there's the toreador precon > > Tiago Again, from the above forum, the Ventrue Precon: Deckname: Ventrue Starter Deck Author: L. Scott Johnson Crypt 2 Jackson Asher 2 dom (4) 2 João Bilé 5 pre DOM FOR When João has no title, he cannot block titled vampires. He gets +1 stealth on actions to put vampires into play. (4) 2 Johannes Castelein 9 DEM DOM FOR PRE Prince of Amsterdam: If a political action card Johannes plays or a referendum he calls is canceled, the Methuselah canceling it burns 2 pool. (4) 2 Gustav Breidenstein 10 aus cel pot DOM FOR PRE Prince of Berlin: Gustav may tap during a referendum to gain 5 additional votes. +1 bleed. (4) 2 Gotsdam, the Tired Warrior 9 ani AUS DOM FOR PRE Gotsdam may end combat as a strike that costs 1 blood. He treats aggravated damage as normal damage in combat. He is immune to frenzy cards. (4) 2 Hardestadt 11 cel pro DOM FOR POT PRE Ventrue Inner Circle: Any vampire contesting Hardestadt's title must yield during his or her untap phase. +1 bleed. +2 strength. (4) Library 1 Social Ladder 2 Esgrima 2 Instability 2 Special Report 2 Vessel 1 Golconda: Inner Peace 1 Powerbase: Montreal 1 Presence 1 Dominate 1 Fortitude 1 Martinelli's Ring 3 Fourth Tradition: The Accounting 1 Dominate Kine 5 Murmur of the False Will 5 Conditioning 3 Aura of Invicibility 4 Seduction 3 Freak Drive 5 Honor the Elders 1 Praxis Seizure: Atlanta 1 Praxis Seizure: Miami 3 Can't Take it with You 6 Kine Resource Contested 1 Reins of Power 2 National Guard Support 4 Majesty 4 Armor of Vitality 6 Soak 2 Haymarker 3 Second Tradition: Domain Chris, Thrall of Arika

> 3 Freak Drive Not having my playgroup upset they can't get hold of the damn things because they started in 3rd Edition? Priceless. I have to say, over here in sunny, sunny Manchester (sic) we're really quite psyched about KoT based on what we've seen. I'm just still shaking my fist at Malks being yet ANOTHER Starter, and the rumours of no Gargoyles for the poor Trem. I wonder if there are any bloodline Vampires in the set (even a token !Lasombra?)

[ quoted text not captured ] I wonder if there's any chance, what with no Tremere starter and a seemingly small amount of thaum reprints, that we might see a small set themed around blood magic next. Something like Tremere, !Tre, Gargoyles, possibly some Assamites, Giovanni, Harbingers, Tzimisce, maybe some other bloodlines, with random token vamps from other clans. Maybe with Rituals? Would be an interesting theme set, and I would like seeing things broken down into functional groups that are not based solely on sect.

[ quoted text not captured ] Well, don't take the list of reprints presented earlier in this thread as the definitive list. There are pleny more cards to go on that list (i.e. only Malkavian Justicar was listed as a reprint, but I'm sure there are the 5 other Justicar vote cards as well). I'm sure there'll be some Tremere goodness. Well, there'd better be, at any rate ... Chris, Thrall of Arika

In message <f9312131-0f9d-49ac...@y71g2000hsa.googlegroup s.com>, Peter D Bakija <pd...@lightlink.com> writes: >> He'll be great in a Gargoyle deck, since he won't be expected to do >> much fighting. > >Also totally good--a 5 cap in a Slave Gargoyle deck with DOM, AUS? >There isn't going to be much Thaumaturgy. Point of pedantry: a quick scan in ARDB suggests that 10 of 11 Visceratika cards have Thaumaturgy fallbacks. Using him to cycle cards in a pinch is possibly going to get nasty. Not that I disagree with your overall point, which is that a 5 cap with AUS/DOM and THA in a pinch is potentially good. My first thought was whether the !Ventrue might like to play. -- James Coupe PGP Key: 0x5D623D5D YOU ARE IN ERROR. EBD690ECD7A1FB457CA2 NO-ONE IS SCREAMING. 13D7E668C3695D623D5D THANK YOU FOR YOUR COOPERATION.

[ quoted text not captured ] It was in the forums, just another thread .. here's the Toreador Precon, from a post on the above site: 2 Sean Andrews 2 cel (4) 2 Tho;as De Lutrius 4 aus cel pre Primogen If Thomas goes to topror, burn 1 pool. (4) 2 Kateline Nadasdy AUS CEL PRE 7 During a political action, Kateline may burn 1 blood to force a non-acting vampire to abstain. (4) 2 Eugene AUS CEL FOR PRE 8 Primogen Once each combat, Eugene may dodge as a strike. (4) 2 Rafael de Corazon AUS CEL DOM OBF PRE 11 Toreador Inner Circle Any vampire contesting Rafael's title must yield during his or her untaps phase. +2 bleed (4) 2 Epikasta Rigastos cel AUS DOM PRE 8 Prince of New York You may move an action card Epikasta plays from your ash heap to your library at the end of the Action (shuffle afterward) (4) 2 Contingency Planning 2 Vessel 1 The Rack 2 Fame 1 Auspex 1 Celerity 1 Presence 6 Pubilc Trust 1 Entrancement 4 Approximation of Loyalty 4 Crocodile's Tongue 3 Suppressing the Fire 4 Kine Resource Contested 1 Praxis Seizure: Houston 1 Praxis Seizure: Washington DC 1 Bowl of Convergence 1 Mark V 5 Beretta 3 Desert Eagle 1 ivory Boz ((Assuming Ivory Bow ... but hey, maybe there is a Charlie's Angels connection going on here ...)) 2 IR Googles 3 Sniper Riffle 6 Pursuit 2 Concealed Weapon 3 Psyche! 3 Taste of Vitae 3 Eagle's Sight 4 Minor Irritation 2 On the Qui Vive 4 Telepathic Misdirection At first, I thought Rafael, the new IC, would be a Gwendolyn .. then saw the superior DOM and OBF. And it seems Toreador really like their guns ... who knew? Chris, Thrall of Arika

On Oct 27, 10:28 pm, fred_ging...@sympatico.ca wrote: > On Oct 26, 3:26 am, Blooded Sand <sandm...@gmail.com> wrote: > > > Please? > > > Pretty please? > > > With a tied down antediluvian on top? > > Dunno why no one else replied. Probably all busy going back home or > tired for Montrealers who spent the week there. > > Here is a small preview then... > > Confirmed reprints in boosters: > > Aching Beauty > Approximation of Loyalty > Arms Dealer > Assault Rifle > Aura of Invincibility > Backstep > Camera Phone > Can't Take it with You > Caseless Rounds > Change of Target > Concealed Weapon > Desert Eagle > Diversity > Dragon's Breath Rounds > Elysium: The Arboretum > Empowering the Puppet King > Fast Hands > Fifth Tradition: Hospitality, The > Finding the Path > First Tradition: The Masquerade, The > Forced Vigilance > Fourth Tradition: The Accounting, The > Frontal Assault > Glancing Blow > Graverobbing > Harass > Heart of Nizchetus, The > High Ground > Hostile Takeover > Indomitability > Life in the City > Malkavian Justicar > On the Qui Vive > Powerbase: Chicago > Powerbase: Montreal (in Ventrue Preconstructed) > Reins of Power > Rumors of Gehenna > Scattershot > Second Tradition: Domain, The > Seduction > Sixth Tradition: Destruction, The > Soak > Stutter-Step > Summoning, The > Tension in the Ranks > Third Tradition: Progeny, The > Toreador Grand Ball > Unmasking, The > Uptown Hunting Ground > Ventrue Headquarters > Warzone Hunting Ground > Zillah's Valley > Hmmm. No Deflection listed there. I hope it gets reprinted in KoT boosters, since it's been out of print for some time (Camarilla edition). It would be nice for newer players to not need a benefactor to get their hands on one of the most powerful commons in the game. -Merlin

On Oct 27, 4:35 pm, Brum <tiago.br...@gmail.com> wrote: > On 26 Out, 07:26, Blooded Sand <sandm...@gmail.com> wrote: > > > Please? > > > Pretty please? > > > With a tied down antediluvian on top? > > http://www.sabbatinfrance.org/newforum/viewtopic.php?t=1530&start=275 > > go back n forth if ye can read that. there's the toreador precon > > Tiago Compiled from the above cited thread, with a few zomg! cards at the end that make me wonder if these are true card texts. > Library Cards: > > Deep Song > ani Bleed at +1 bleed. > ANI Frenzy. (D) Tap a ready vampire controlled by another Methuselah and enter combat with that > vampire. In that combat, that vampire is considered the acting minion. Animalism bleed is nice, and an odd rush to further add to the multi- action type cards. > Scourge of the Enochians > Event. > During your discard phase, you may burn a vampire of capacity 2 or less, and your predator takes > control of this card (even if you do not burn a vampire). More weenie hate. > Crypt Cards: > > Aidan Lyle > 7 cap Tremere > dom AUS CHI THA > Camarilla: Aidan gets an optional press each combat. Superior THA and a built-in press .. yum! > Dr. John Dee > 9 cap Tremere group 4 > chi ANI AUS DOM THA > Camarilla Prince of London: Ventrue in combat with John may not end combat as a strike. During > a referendum, John may burn a card that requires Thaumaturgy from your hand to gain two votes. "Majesty out of this, Ventrue scum!" Of course, with the new "doing the job themselves" Ventrue like Hardestadt ... > Gabrielle di Righetti > 10 cap Tremere > obf pot ANI AUS DOM THA > Camarilla Tremere Justicar: Gabrielle may steal 2 blood (or life) from a ready minion as a +1 > stealth (D) action. > > Graham Gottesman > 7 cap > obf pre tha DOM FOR prince of Miami. > > Miguel Cordovera > 6 cap Tremere > AUS DOM POT THA > Camarilla: During your predator's minion phase, your predator may burn a pool to untap and take > control of Miguel until the end of the minion phase. +1 bleed. Could be just as dangerous to you as your prey. I don't think he'll be one to bring out first. Look to see what your Predator is playing first .. the last thing you need is to help them power-bleed you out. > William Thorbecke > 10 cap Tremere > AUS DOM PRE PRO THA > Camarilla Primogen: During your discard phase, William may burn 2 blood to untap a minion you > control. > > Zane > 5 cap Tremere > aus dom THA > Camarilla Primogen: If Zane is not a prince, he can call a referendum to receive (and contest) the > title held by a prince in play as a +1 stealth political action. Definitely seeing Contesting being brought back into the game. > Lodin (Olaf Holte) > 8 cap > aus pro DOM FOR PRE prince of Chicago can prevent 1 damage from opposing minion's strike > once per combat. Assuming this is a Ventrue > Josef von Bauren > 11 cap Nosferatu > cel ANI DEM OBF POT > Camarilla Nosferatu Inner Circle: You may use a discard phase action to discard a card at random > from your predator or prey's hand. +1 bleed. +1 stealth. > > Bela > 3 cap Malkavain > ani obf pro DEM > Independent: Bela cannot attempt political actions. -1 stealth. > > Blood Mary > 8 cap Malkavian > pre AUS DEM OBF > Camarilla primogen: +1 bleed. > > Gem Ghastly > 6 cap Malkavian > aus DEM OBF > Camarilla Primogen: You and Gem may play cards that require Ventrue as if Gem were a Ventrue. Not seeing a lot of useful cards at the moment for this ability. Ventrue Headquarters, of course, and Political Ally .. as if Malks needed more bleed potential. > Kalila > 3 cap Malkavian > aus obf > Camarilla: Kalila gets +1 strealth when performing a (D) action that targets locations. > > Keller Thiel > 4 cap Malkavian > aus dem > Camarilla: While Keller is ready and untapped, any minino who successfully bleeds you burns 1 > blood or life. A nice little deterrent to being bled. > Lord Fianna > 8 cap Malkavian > cel pro AUS DEM OBF > Camarilla. Red List: Allies cannot block Lord Fianna. +1 stealth. Bleed fast, little Malk, you've got a huge bullseye painted on your chest. > Reiner Stoschka > 7 cap Malkavian > obf AUS DEM THA > Camarilla: While Reiner is ready, master: Discipline cards may be played as trifles. > > Don Cerro > 7 cap Brujah > aus dom for pre pro CEL POT > > Honest Abe > 2 cap Brujah > pre > > Lynn > 3 cap Brujah > cel pot > Camarilla: Lynn cannot have a haven. Any haven that she would receive is burned instead. > > Vidal Jarbeaux > 8 cap Toreador > aus cel obf pot PRE > Camarilla: Vidal can meet the clan, sect, or non-infernal vampire trait (e.g. anarch) requirement to > play any card. He can meet a given requirement only once each game. +1 bleed. Neat ability. Not sure how entirely useful it would be in the long run, but I can see the potential in some ally themed decks. > Count Zaroff > 4 cap Caitiff > cel obf > Camarilla: Once each turn, you may burn a pool to cancel a blood hunt called on Zaroff and return > him to the uncontrolled region. > > Donald Cargill > 1 cap Caitiff > aus > Camarilla: When a referendum called by your predator passes, Donald burns 1 blood. > > Iris Bennett > 1 cap Caitiff > pro > Camarilla: When an older vampire blocks Iris, his or her controller may look at your hand (before > combat, if any). > > Johan Wrede > 1 cap Caitiff group 4 > tha > Camarilla: While Johan is bleeding, any older vampire can burn 1 blood to reduce the bleed > amount by 1. Alrighty then ... sit down, don't drink, and have a gander at the following: > Ashur Tablets > Master. > Put this card in play. If you have three copies in play, remove all copies in play (even controlled by > other Methuselahs) from the game to gain 3 pool and choose up to thirteen cards from your ash > heap. Move one of those cards to your hand and shuffle the others into your library. Pool gain and massive recursion ... with a race to see who can get the effect off first. > Blood of Sandman > costs 2 blood > tha +1 stealth action. (D) Burn an ally. > THA +6 stealth action. (D) Put this card on a ready younger tapped vampire. Reaction cards this > vampire plays while tapped are canceled as they are played. Burn this card if this vampire goes to > torpor. +6 stealth?? I'm really thinking this is a typo or misreading. Virtually no way to block, and makes waking pointless. Yowzers. > Waiting Game > event Transient. > Put this card in play with 10 counters. Whenever a non-anarch vampire takes an action, burn a > counter from this card. Burn this card when it has no counters. During your untap phase, each > anarch burns 1 blood or becomes Camarilla, and each ally burns 1 life. Overrun by Anarchs? Imbued cramping your style? Have no fear! Just hole up for a little while and your problems will disappear! > Mistress Fanchion > 11 cap Tremere > AUS CEL DOM OBF THA VIC > Camarilla Tremere Inner Circle: Mistress Fanchion may search your library (shuffle afterward) for > any minion card and move that card to your hand as a +1 stealth action. +2 bleed. Hard to decide just what way to go with Mistress here ... stealth bleed? Check. Blur theft? Check. Agg Blood Fury/Rage? Check. Nevermind being able to fish for your set up cards right away. Arika may have just lost her Thrall. > Alonso Petrodon > 10 cap Nosferatu > for tha ANI DOM OBF POT > Camarilla Nosferatu Justicar: When Alonso bleeds successfully, each anarch controlled by the > target takes 1 unpreventable damage. +1 bleed. A lot of Anarch hit back in this set, what with Alonso here and Waiting Game. Which isn't a bad thing, as a lot of decks I've seen recently use Anarch Converts just to cycle through crypts, and throw in a bit of anarchy into the decks. Now we'll have to think twice about randomly going anarch. > The Ankou > 10 cap Malkavian > AUS DEM OBF > Camarilla: When any vampire succesfully hunts while The Ankou is ready and untapped, the > Ankou may burn that vampire as a (D) action that turn (even on another Methuselah's turn). I can see some nasty blood drain decks coming out in the near future. > Santaleous > 9 cap Malkavian > AUS CEL DEM OBF > Camarilla. Santaleous gets +1 bleed for each unique hunting ground in play. He may burn 3 blood > to cancel a master card as it is played Rather interesting special, but I think that's going to be overshadowed by the built-in Sudden and anti-DI. Chris, currently still Thrall of Arika

On Oct 29, 6:42 pm, Thrall of Arika <christopher.ack...@amec.com> wrote: > > 2 Rafael de Corazon AUS CEL DOM OBF PRE 11 Toreador Inner Circle Any > vampire contesting Rafael's title must yield during his or her untaps > At first, I thought Rafael, the new IC, would be a Gwendolyn .. then > saw the superior DOM and OBF. And it seems Toreador really like their > guns ... who knew? > Chris, Thrall of Arika Mind Rape with TGB's. Nasty! In fact, MR with Aching Beauty...

[ quoted text not captured ] Howzabout a wall deck with AUS, DOM, Ivories, snipers, and some other stuff like Rutors or name forgotten?

On Oct 29, 1:25 pm, Thrall of Arika <christopher.ack...@amec.com> wrote: > > Santaleous > > 9 cap Malkavian > > AUS CEL DEM OBF > > Camarilla. Santaleous gets +1 bleed for each unique hunting ground in play. He may burn 3 blood > > to cancel a master card as it is played > > Rather interesting special, but I think that's going to be > overshadowed by the built-in Sudden and anti-DI. > I'm already thinking of deck ideas with this guy. Calvin Cleaver, multiple hunting grounds (possibly with Mata Hari - but maybe there's someone else who can give Santa blood like Calvin can? You probably don't need more than 3 or 4 unique hunting grounds in the deck), Anarch Free Press and Hospital Food and Aaron's Feeding Razor, Perfectionist, Final Loosening, Twilight Camp, maybe Forgery, maybe Rave... You get a big stealth bleeder that can cancel master cards like crazy and gain all the blood back.

Thrall of Arika <christoph...@amec.com> wrote: > > Vidal Jarbeaux > > 8 cap Toreador > > aus cel obf pot PRE > > Camarilla: Vidal can meet the clan, sect, or non-infernal vampire trait (e.g. anarch) requirement to > > play any card. He can meet a given requirement only once each game. +1 bleed. Sounds like an accounting nightmare. "Was I an anarch yet this game? Was I a Malkavian yet this game?" Also, can we have a definition of what is a "non-infernal vampire trait"? Is a title a trait? Do "anarch" and "baron" count as different traits? Is flight a trait? (If not, what is it?) Is "ready" a trait (as in "requires a ready vampire")? [probably not] Is "untapped" a trait (as in "requires an untapped vampire")? [probably not] If titles don't count, then I can think of: anarch black hand seraph inquisitor slave red list flight(?) Any others?

On Oct 29, 5:56 am, Chris Berger <ark...@ugcs.caltech.edu> wrote: > On Oct 29, 7:48 am, Peter D Bakija <p...@lightlink.com> wrote: > > > > > On Oct 29, 6:04 am, J <grai...@hotmail.com> wrote: > > > > I concur to some extent with Tim... > > > Yes, he can be played in Aus/Dom or Aus or Dom decks, but his special > > > makes his superior THA almost completely worthless to the point that > > > he'll hardly ever be seen in a Tremere deck, which means that he is an > > > overpriced vampire, because one of his disciplines is negligible. > > > Except that he isn't overpriced, as he is a 5 cap with 6 points in > > disciplines. And 5 caps only get 5 points in abilities. So he is > > getting THA instead of tha, but with a disadvantage to balance it out. > > Which means he is a 5 cap with DOM, AUS (which is very strong in and > > of itself) who has conditional THA in a pinch. If you put him in a > > deck that only uses DOM, AUS (or just DOM--no one ever does well with > > mono DOM after all...), he is a really good 5 cap vampire. If you put > > him in a deck with a lot of Thaumaturgy, and expect to use the > > Thaumaturgy a lot, you probably aren't going to get much good use out > > of him. > > How much Thuam do people put in their "lots of Thaum" decks? Like 45 > cards, max? Even that seems a bit much, but I don't know. If it's > 45, then you have approximately a 50% chance of getting a Thaum card > canceled. Considering he's playing it at superior which he doesn't > really have a right to do, and he has AUS DOM, that seems pretty > fair. How strong do Tremere players want their vamps to be? Does > each one have to be Muaziz? > > He'll be great in a Gargoyle deck, since he won't be expected to do > much fighting. My Thaumaturgy decks average about 30 thaum cards .. so it would be a 1 in 3 chance of having the card negated. And burn a blood on top of it? Nah, I'll pass, for my regular Tremere/Thaumaturgy decks. Though I can certainly see the potential in decks oriented towards Auspex/ Dominate, with perhaps a smattering of Thaum. Chris, Thrall of Arika

Jozxyqk <jfeu...@eecs.tufts.edu> wrote: > If titles don't count, then I can think of: > anarch > black hand > seraph > inquisitor > slave (and "non-slave") > red list > flight(?) > Any others? Another question I have about this guy: Does his "He can meet a given requirement only once each game" include requirements he already meets (like "requires a Toreador")?

In message <fa68eb54-b481-4d1c...@m44g2000hsc.googlegroup s.com>, Thrall of Arika <christoph...@amec.com> writes: >> Gem Ghastly >> 6 cap Malkavian >> aus DEM OBF >> Camarilla Primogen: You and Gem may play cards that require Ventrue as if Gem were a Ventrue. > >Not seeing a lot of useful cards at the moment for this ability. >Ventrue Headquarters, of course, and Political Ally .. as if Malks >needed more bleed potential. Well, I think Ventrue HQ is pretty good on its own. Between that and Telepathic Vote Counting, you could have some fun, without requiring Presence. But, you missed one. Hostile Takeover. Kindred Spirits to fuel pool gain with some Dem vampires, and a scattering of Hostile Takeover. You don't need loads, just one or two could be fine. If there are any new Ventrue with dem/DEM to help out, you might have interesting times. [ quoted text not captured ]

On Oct 29, 2:01 pm, Jozxyqk <jfeue...@eecs.tufts.edu> wrote: [ quoted text not captured ] Sterile Scarce Key possibility: "(Chicago/MC/etc) Circle" -John Flournoy

In message <geabti$95n$1...@aioe.org>, Jozxyqk <jfeu...@eecs.tufts.edu> writes: Thrall of Arika <christoph...@amec.com> wrote: > > Vidal Jarbeaux > > 8 cap Toreador > > aus cel obf pot PRE > > Camarilla: Vidal can meet the clan, sect, or non-infernal vampire trait (e.g. anarch) requirement to > > play any card. He can meet a given requirement only once each game. +1 bleed. >Sounds like an accounting nightmare. >"Was I an anarch yet this game? Was I a Malkavian yet this game?" Since your ash heap is unordered, keep a separate ash-heap for him. >If titles don't count, then I can think of: ... >red list I don't know what "vampire trait" means. Is it "any trait a vampire can have"? Or is it "vampire only"? Ossian is Red List, for example. [ quoted text not captured ]

On Oct 29, 2:02 pm, Thrall of Arika <christopher.ack...@amec.com> wrote: [ quoted text not captured ] Of course, there are some ways to know what the top card(s) on your deck are so that you'll know if you can do it or not. Scrounging, for instance, or Thin-Blooded Seer, or Tapestry of Blood could all work, or in a mix-crypt with several possibilities opened up that way. > Chris, Thrall of Arika

On Oct 29, 12:04 pm, Jozxyqk <jfeue...@eecs.tufts.edu> wrote: [ quoted text not captured ] It would be really funny if other players could play clan hosers on him as if he had any trait. As he is, that is a really strong power.

On Oct 29, 12:01 pm, Jozxyqk <jfeue...@eecs.tufts.edu> wrote: > Thrall of Arika <christopher.ack...@amec.com> wrote: > > > > Vidal Jarbeaux > > > 8 cap Toreador > > > aus cel obf pot PRE > > > Camarilla: Vidal can meet the clan, sect, or non-infernal vampire trait (e.g. anarch) requirement to > > > play any card. He can meet a given requirement only once each game. +1 bleed. > > Sounds like an accounting nightmare. > "Was I an anarch yet this game? Was I a Malkavian yet this game?" > > Also, can we have a definition of what is a "non-infernal vampire trait"? > Is a title a trait? > Do "anarch" and "baron" count as different traits? > Is flight a trait? (If not, what is it?) > Is "ready" a trait (as in "requires a ready vampire")? [probably not] > Is "untapped" a trait (as in "requires an untapped vampire")? [probably not] > > If titles don't count, then I can think of: > anarch > black hand > seraph > inquisitor > slave > red list > flight(?) > > Any others? My guess would be based on the card you wanted to play, which would say "Requires a XX vampire ..." So would include all the clans, Sabbat, Independent, and Laibon, then: Anarch, Black Hand, Inquisitor, Seraph, Red List, as well as Slave, Templar and Sterile (of which there are no cards requiring them). I don't see Titles as being traits, though I have no basis for that currently. Flight wouldn't be a trait, references to Flight make it akin to a Discipline, i.e., "this vampire gains Flight". Ready, Untapped, Uncontrolled, etc. are not traits, they are states that apply to any card, not an inherent key-word associated with a particular vampire. I would also conclude that his ability does not cover those instances of lack of a trait, "non-sterile" for example. As to accounting, well, can see which cards are in play, and maybe make a little secondary discard pile to put in all the used/burned from play cards that his ability was used for. Chris, Thrall of Arika On Oct 29, 12:04 pm, Jozxyqk <jfeue...@eecs.tufts.edu> wrote: > Another question I have about this guy: > Does his "He can meet a given requirement only once each game" include > requirements he already meets (like "requires a Toreador")? His ability says "can", so you don't have to use his ability to play cards. On Oct 29, 12:23 pm, James Coupe <ja...@zephyr.org.uk> wrote: > >If titles don't count, then I can think of: > ... > >red list > > I don't know what "vampire trait" means. Is it "any trait a vampire can > have"? Or is it "vampire only"? > > Ossian is Red List, for example. I would think that the wording is to prevent the use of Imbued and Creed cards. And while Ossian is indeed a Red List minion, this doesn't preclude the fact that there are Red List vampires. Chris, wavering Thrall of Arika

On Oct 29, 3:00 pm, Thrall of Arika <christopher.ack...@amec.com> wrote: > > I don't see Titles as being traits, though I have no basis for that > currently. Flight wouldn't be a trait, references to Flight make it > akin to a Discipline, i.e., "this vampire gains Flight". Ready, > Untapped, Uncontrolled, etc. are not traits, they are states that > apply to any card, not an inherent key-word associated with a > particular vampire. I would also conclude that his ability does not > cover those instances of lack of a trait, "non-sterile" for example. > I'm divided on Titles - I think they might be considered a trait. If I . Flight is definitely a trait. It is emphatically not a discipline, even though it is treated in most ways as though it were. The other things above, I agree with.

On Oct 29, 3:30 pm, Chris Berger <ark...@ugcs.caltech.edu> wrote: > > I'm divided on Titles - I think they might be considered a trait. If > I . Flight is definitely a trait. It is emphatically not a > discipline, even though it is treated in most ways as though it were. > "If I" above was the start of a thought... ;) Was interrupted by some important business and when I came back, forgot where I was. I was just going to say "if I were a judge at a tournament and asked to make a ruling, I would say titles count", though of course that means that LSJ will say the opposite... ;)

On Oct 29, 12:21 pm, Chris Berger <ark...@ugcs.caltech.edu> wrote: > Explain how. I'm legitimately curious. A lot of people seem excited > with Mouthpiece, and I want to know what I'm missing. It's not really that difficult to figure out. Would you rather have your allies bleeding for one or for three? And Buddies will regenerate the cost of playing Conditioning every turn... John Eno

"Merlin" <hallofha...@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message news:3742b184-84d2-4285...@t54g2000hsg.googlegroups.com... > Hmmm. No Deflection listed there. I hope it gets reprinted in KoT > boosters, since it's been out of print for some time (Camarilla > edition). It would be nice for newer players to not need a benefactor > to get their hands on one of the most powerful commons in the game. I don't disagree with your sentiments about Deflection. It's an important card that should be reprinted often. But it was in the Black Hand Tremere precon. Four copies, according to the "Card Text Updates" link on the WW website. Hopefully, it will be a reprint in KoT boosters. Fred

> I don't disagree with your sentiments about Deflection. It's an important > card that should be reprinted often. But it was in the Black Hand Tremere > precon. Four copies, according to the "Card Text Updates" link on the > WW website. Hopefully, it will be a reprint in KoT boosters. It's been a big issue with me since I started up a little more than a year ago. If I stayed with only LotN and TR, the two sets released since I started, I would have only MotfW and Lost in Translation bounce, each of which require fatties to get much use out of. So far I've managed to scrounge 4-5 out of a used box of Jyhad (about 1 booster box), some from trading, and some from charity. I probably don't have more than 12 copies as of today. I'd love it if they printed some in boosters, so that I could more easily trade for them if nothing else.

Jadasc wrote: > On Oct 27, 8:53 pm, librarian <aucti...@superfuncards.com> wrote: > >> Horseshoe >> Action >> pot: Do 1 damage to a ready minion >> POT: Do 2 damage to a ready minion > > Does not combo well with Grenade. Oh, well. Close enough. > > Jason That's hilarious. Will still have to run that deck, if only for giggles on JOL. 12 Horseshoes 6 Grenades 4 Smoke Grenades 4 White Phosporous Grenades I'm thinking weenie pot/obf... Close enough to count... best - chris -- Super Fun Cards www.superfuncards.com *NEW Website!* auct...@superfuncards.com

In article <x2u4FWIp...@gratiano.zephyr.org.uk>, James Coupe <ja...@zephyr.org.uk> wrote: > Point of pedantry: a quick scan in ARDB suggests that 10 of 11 > Visceratika cards have Thaumaturgy fallbacks. Using him to cycle cards > in a pinch is possibly going to get nasty. Sure. So you don't do that :-) Peter D Bakija pd...@lightlink.com http://www.lightlink.com/pdb6/vtes.html "It's too bad she won't live! But then again, who does?" -Gaff

> Mistress Fanchion > 11 cap Tremere > AUS CEL DOM OBF THA VIC > Camarilla Tremere Inner Circle: Mistress Fanchion may search your library (shuffle afterward) for > any minion card and move that card to your hand as a +1 stealth action. +2 bleed. She can be my mistress any day. The ability to go get a Rutor's Hand and maybe a Helicopter as soon as she pops out allows her to do some nasty thing, Perfect Clarity and Soul Decoration is a nice combo to come to mind, in combat she should put some hurt on, man, theirs so much I want to do with her I'm just pissed there's no starter for me to pick up to get her.

On Oct 29, 2:33 pm, Blooded Sand <sandm...@gmail.com> wrote: > Howzabout a wall deck with AUS, DOM, Ivories, snipers, and some other > stuff like Rutors or name forgotten? Sounds pretty much like my idea for an Old Clan Tzimisce deck (ani/aus/ dom and most importantly: absolutely no vic on any vampire in the crypt... it's that final restriction which keeps out all but two weenies from the Tzimisce currently printed). Andrew Stuart is the most cost effective non-weenie printed to date for such a deck. Brent Ross

[ quoted text not captured ] I thought that Old Clan Tzimisce had Protean instead of Vic and that Vic is a disease

On Oct 30, 12:29 am, brandonsantac...@yahoo.com wrote: > I thought that Old Clan Tzimisce had Protean instead of Vic and that > Vic is a disease Nope. Just plain old Dominate (which makes sense, since both Tzimisce and Gangrel are part of the 13 clans... Protean being a clan discipline is tied to Gangrel and thier offshoot Bloodlines). Old Clan Tzimisce are the ones with Kodunic Sorcery (which is their exotic feature). And, yep, they believe that Vicissitude isn't a proper blood power but a disease or parasite that's eventually going to enslave and/or destroy all vampires with it. And they're probably right, unless your GM decides not to use that. Brent Ross

[ quoted text not captured ] I guess it *is* difficult to figure out. There are already ways to have allies bleed for 3 that don't cost life. Sure, it's good for Black Spiral Buddy, if you want to make an ally bruise-and-bleed with a clan that has exactly 2 vampires (3 if you count Sebastien advanced as separate from basic) with superior dominate. For me, when I play my Renegade Garou decks, they usually teter on the edge of not having enough life, and I'd also rather have them rush than bleed most of the time. Without the in-built rush, yes, it's better for the Buddy than the Garou, but it still involves bolting on a discipline, and for all your work is it *that* much better than Empowering? For most allies, which don't regenerate, they can't afford the blood cost as well as your vampire can. I guess I can see that it makes one very specific deck slightly better by using 2 cards to get +2 bleed instead of one card for +1 bleed. But I don't see much use in any other deck, nor any reason to get particularly excited.

[ quoted text not captured ] !Trem and Succubi.....

> > > The Ankou > > 10 cap Malkavian > > AUS DEM OBF > > Camarilla: When any vampire succesfully hunts while The Ankou is ready and untapped, the > > Ankou may burn that vampire as a (D) action that turn (even on another Methuselah's turn). > > I can see some nasty blood drain decks coming out in the near future. The timing of this guys ability (take an action during someone else's turn) makes me wonder. Not to mention, thats REALLY powerful. Yes, he has to be untapped, but that isn't too hard to work around.

[ quoted text not captured ] He does look nasty. But as a 10 cap with no title, 6 points of disciplines and no untap discipline, I don't think it's too crazy. Not to mention you have to actually stealth the burn action through (not difficult for him, but just another thing to think about). He can use Eluding the Arms of Morpheus to untap, but not if it's cross- table. Theoretically, he could Wake, Eagle's Sight, Eluding, then fail to block, but that seems overly complicated. Instances where he desperately wants to burn cross-table seem like they'll be somewhat uncommon anyway (as in, it'll happen occasionally, but is it worth working into your deck for those circumstances?). Metro Underground will be awesome, of course. Powerbase: LA too, if you want to work in an Anarch angle.

[ quoted text not captured ] > !Trem and Succubi.....- Hide quoted text - > > - Show quoted text - !Trem and damned Nephandus (Hugh must be giggling like an idiot) As I noted Chris, I think just stacking Mouthpiece is worth it. Your Vampire doesn't need to be untapped, and it costs nothing. Fine, it's only +1 Bleed, but it means now the BSB's are *hurting* rather than sitting there.

On Oct 30, 8:00 am, Chris Berger <ark...@ugcs.caltech.edu> wrote: > I guess it *is* difficult to figure out. Not really. People get excited when cards are printed that let them bleed for more. That isn't to say that their analyses of those cards are necessarily correct, but I don't think it's tough to see why people are excited. > But I don't see much use in any other deck, nor > any reason to get particularly excited. It certainly cycles more easily than Puppet King, if nothing else. But, yeah, I'm mostly with you on this one in terms of how good the card is. John Eno

On Oct 29, 4:58 pm, "Frederick Scott" <nos...@no.spam.dot.com> wrote: > "Merlin" <hallofhadesco...@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message [ quoted text not captured ] Right on. I was checking Monger for my "sets printed" info. I didn't remember if it was in the older starters, though i was positive it wasn't in the 3E !Tremere starter or the LotN Gio starter, and none of the LoB or KMW starters. I'm hoping that it's just so ubiquitous that those who have seen the KoT boosters glossed it over without thinking about it, and that it's a common in the set. -Merlin

On Oct 30, 10:21 am, Kushiel <invisibleking...@gmail.com> wrote: (Regarding Mouthpiece) > > It certainly cycles more easily than Puppet King, if nothing else. > But, yeah, I'm mostly with you on this one in terms of how good the > card is. > Okay, fair enough. I guess I've been set right on some points in that it's not *terrible*, which was my first reaction. It's just something that I would replace with Puppet King in most decks that *I* would play. It's probably the same reason I don't like Shared Strength. I just don't like a 2 card combo where either card by itself is utterly useless, unless the 2 card combo is really strong. That said, after all the discussion, I will now probably try out the Philippe Rigaud Black Spiral Mouthpiece deck. I'm just not sure you could find somewhere on there that you'd want to put your mouth.

In message <41ef04d6-ecaa-46cc...@y79g2000hsa.googlegroup s.com>, fred_g...@sympatico.ca writes: >Mouthpiece >Action Modifier, dom >dom: +1 bleed. You cannot play another action modifier to increase >this bleed. >DOM: Only usable by a ready vampire other than the acting minion. The >acting minion may play cards that require basic Dominate as a vampire >for the remainder of this action. Assuming the DOM card text is approximately correct, could a Bima with an Obtenebration card on it play Shroud of Absence at inferior? Or, more generally, can "May play cards that require <Discipline> as a vampire" specials stack up, or does each one function independently? [ quoted text not captured ]

James Coupe wrote: > In message <41ef04d6-ecaa-46cc...@y79g2000hsa.googlegroup > s.com>, fred_g...@sympatico.ca writes: >> Mouthpiece >> Action Modifier, dom >> dom: +1 bleed. You cannot play another action modifier to increase >> this bleed. >> DOM: Only usable by a ready vampire other than the acting minion. The >> acting minion may play cards that require basic Dominate as a vampire >> for the remainder of this action. > > Assuming the DOM card text is approximately correct, could a Bima with > an Obtenebration card on it play Shroud of Absence at inferior? Or, > more generally, can "May play cards that require <Discipline> as a > vampire" specials stack up, or does each one function independently? You guessed correctly here: http://groups.google.com/group/rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad/msg/3d4aa6e913ee7940

On Oct 30, 3:19 pm, Shockwave <d_knowles...@hotmail.com> wrote: (Hugh must be giggling like an idiot) This is a NewsGroup Dave, and that is NOT news. Anthony

In message <9glOk.2532$8_3...@flpi147.ffdc.sbc.com>, LSJ <vte...@white-wolf.com> writes: >James Coupe wrote: >> Assuming the DOM card text is approximately correct, could a Bima >>with >> an Obtenebration card on it play Shroud of Absence at inferior? Or, >> more generally, can "May play cards that require <Discipline> as a >> vampire" specials stack up, or does each one function independently? > >You guessed correctly here: > >http://groups.google.com/group/rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad/msg/3d4aa6 >e913ee7940 Curses. :-( [ quoted text not captured ]

On Oct 30, 8:10 am, Chris Berger <ark...@ugcs.caltech.edu> wrote: > On Oct 30, 9:57 am, Rhavas <Anthony.Lun...@gmail.com> wrote: > > > > > The Ankou > > > > 10 cap Malkavian > > > > AUS DEM OBF > > > > Camarilla: When any vampire succesfully hunts while The Ankou is ready and untapped, the > > > > Ankou may burn that vampire as a (D) action that turn (even on another Methuselah's turn). > > > > I can see some nasty blood drain decks coming out in the near future. > > > The timing of this guys ability (take an action during someone else's > > turn) makes me wonder. Not to mention, thats REALLY powerful. Timing does seem to be an issue. I'm going to assume he can act on other methuselah's turns as if he had the Madness Network going. Now the question becomes, it's not written as a "During X, do Y", so can he attempt burn multiple vampires that hunted successfully, provided he can untap? > > Yes, > > he has to be untapped, but that isn't too hard to work around. Babble. > He does look nasty. But as a 10 cap with no title, 6 points of > disciplines and no untap discipline, I don't think it's too crazy. > Not to mention you have to actually stealth the burn action through > (not difficult for him, but just another thing to think about). He > can use Eluding the Arms of Morpheus to untap, but not if it's cross- > table. Theoretically, he could Wake, Eagle's Sight, Eluding, then > fail to block, but that seems overly complicated. Instances where he > desperately wants to burn cross-table seem like they'll be somewhat > uncommon anyway (as in, it'll happen occasionally, but is it worth > working into your deck for those circumstances?). Metro Underground > will be awesome, of course. Powerbase: LA too, if you want to work in > an Anarch angle. Actually, going anarch looks like a way to go. Baronize, Free States Rant and start burning blood off vampires, targeting valuable vampires of your prey. When they hunt, you can start burning if untapped, if not, XTC Lace Blood them, or Elude and fail to block. Final Loosening to make sure their hunts or other blood gains don't give them much. Thirst to keep weenies in the danger zone. Maybe a splash of Thaumaturgy to put in CrimethIncs. Some potential anyway. As to burning cross-table, I can't see that being a large focus. You'll want to use The Ankou on your prey, or possibly on your predator to control bleeding. If you're that concerned, well, stock up on Babble. Chris, Thrall of somebody

[ quoted text not captured ] Hmm, still not sure. I would think that if titles are covered, that they would have been specified, just as Clan and Sect were. I think the fact that they are termed "titles" removes them from also being traits, even though a title is a defining characteristic. Also, if titles were considered traits for this card, could we not then use more specific titles? Play one Second Tradition as the Prince of New York, then a second as Prince of London, etc. I would disagree on Flight being a trait. While it's not a discipline, true, it also isn't a defining characteristic. You can say "Jack Drake is an Anarch (vampire)", you couldn't say "Fidus is a Flight (vampire)". You can say "Fidus has Flight, which allows him to use these flight cards", much like you can say "Fidus has Fortitude, which allows him to use these fortitude cards". My assumption would be that traits are only covered by bold text, though this brings titles back into the spotlight. But then, Clan and Sect are also bold text, and are handled distictly. Chris, Thrall of Arika

On Oct 27, 4:35 pm, Brum <tiago.br...@gmail.com> wrote: > On 26 Out, 07:26, Blooded Sand <sandm...@gmail.com> wrote: > > > Please? > > > Pretty please? > > > With a tied down antediluvian on top? > > http://www.sabbatinfrance.org/newforum/viewtopic.php?t=1530&start=275 > > go back n forth if ye can read that. there's the toreador precon > > Tiago Another recent post from the above thread. > Childling Muse > Cardtype: Retainer > Cost: 1 pool > Clan: Malkavian > Changeling with 1 life. The minion with this retainer gets +1 bleed. Was wondering at the cost of this one, then noticed the distinct lack of "Unique". Chris, Thrall of somebody

On Oct 30, 1:08 pm, Thrall of Arika <christopher.ack...@amec.com> wrote: > > > > > > The Ankou > > > > > 10 cap Malkavian > > > > > AUS DEM OBF > > > > > Camarilla: When any vampire succesfully hunts while The Ankou is ready and untapped, the > > > > > Ankou may burn that vampire as a (D) action that turn (even on another Methuselah's turn). > > > Timing does seem to be an issue. I'm going to assume he can act on > other methuselah's turns as if he had the Madness Network going. Now > the question becomes, it's not written as a "During X, do Y", so can > he attempt burn multiple vampires that hunted successfully, provided > he can untap? > To me, since he doesn't say "at the end of the turn" or "after that methuselah is done acting", it's used immediately, i.e. "When" that vampire hunts successfully, per card text. One could argue that the acting methuselah has the impulse and can continue to take actions until he passes, and that *may* be the correct ruling, but I think that his ability happens in the timing window when the action is successful, and thus before the acting methuselah has the chance to take a new action. I presume there will be a ruling on it at some point. > Hmm, still not sure. I would think that if titles are covered, that > they would have been specified, just as Clan and Sect were. I think > the fact that they are termed "titles" removes them from also being > traits, even though a title is a defining characteristic. Also, if > titles were considered traits for this card, could we not then use > more specific titles? Play one Second Tradition as the Prince of New > York, then a second as Prince of London, etc. > Well, like I said, I'm not certain on this. You may be right. I don't think there's a strict definition of "trait", and so I think title might qualify. On the other hand, it does open up a lot of questions on what counts as the same requirement that he can only meet once. > I would disagree on Flight being a trait. While it's not a discipline, > true, it also isn't a defining characteristic. You can say "Jack Drake > is an Anarch (vampire)", you couldn't say "Fidus is a Flight > (vampire)". You can say "Fidus has Flight, which allows him to use > these flight cards", much like you can say "Fidus has Fortitude, which > allows him to use these fortitude cards". Searching Google Group for flight+trait yields several results. Most of them say that Flight *is* a trait, and one from LSJ implies otherwise, but doesn't, IMO, necessarily say that it is not. I'm not sure what it *is* if not a trait.

In message <8cc99f44-500e-4c9e...@u57g2000hsf.googlegroup s.com>, Thrall of Arika <christoph...@amec.com> writes: >On Oct 30, 8:10 am, Chris Berger <ark...@ugcs.caltech.edu> wrote: >> > > > The Ankou >> > > > 10 cap Malkavian >> > > > AUS DEM OBF >> > > > Camarilla: When any vampire succesfully hunts while The Ankou is ready and untapped, the >> > > > Ankou may burn that vampire as a (D) action that turn (even on another Methuselah's turn). > >Timing does seem to be an issue. I'm going to assume he can act on >other methuselah's turns as if he had the Madness Network going. Now >the question becomes, it's not written as a "During X, do Y", so can >he attempt burn multiple vampires that hunted successfully, provided >he can untap? Leaving aside the exact timing issue, my inclination would be to disallow it multiple times. A minion cannot perform an action with the same action card or via the same card in play (including from the minion's own card text) more than once each turn, even if he untaps. [6.1.6] Action, check. Card in play, check. [ quoted text not captured ]

> Leaving aside the exact timing issue, my inclination would be to > disallow it multiple times. > A minion cannot perform an action with the same action card or via the > same card in play (including from the minion's own card text) more > than once each turn, even if he untaps. [6.1.6] > Action, check. Card in play, check. It is still a strong ablity. Cards I like for the deck lunatic eruption vampiric disease path of death and the soul freak drive FSR not that hard to pass cryptic rider Malk rider clause babble steath WTF? Final Loosening Requires an anarch. [aus] Play when the acting vampire would gain 1 or more blood. The acting vampire and this reacting anarch each gain 1 blood instead. [dem] Gain 4 votes. [for] Only usable when an ally is acting. The action fails and the ally takes 1 damage. Tap this reacting anarch.

On Oct 30, 7:00 pm, James Coupe <ja...@zephyr.org.uk> wrote: [The Ankou] > Leaving aside the exact timing issue, my inclination would be to > disallow it multiple times. > > A minion cannot perform an action with the same action card or via the > same card in play (including from the minion's own card text) more > than once each turn, even if he untaps. [6.1.6] > > Action, check. Card in play, check. Action alone doesn't matter... it's "Action card". A vampire can hunt with the default action as often as they like in a minion phase... but they can't use a specific hunt action card more than once. What matters here is the fact that it's an action given by a card in play (in this case it is the minon's own card text). That's what limits it to once a minion phase. And I'm pretty sure that you don't have to do it right away (it says "that turn" not "immediately")... the sequencing rule tells us exactly how to deal with that. Brent Ross

In message <67007613-fd56-41d4...@e38g2000prn.googlegroup s.com>, bwross <bwr...@mail.com> writes: >On Oct 30, 7:00 pm, James Coupe <ja...@zephyr.org.uk> wrote: >[The Ankou] >> Leaving aside the exact timing issue, my inclination would be to >> disallow it multiple times. >> >> A minion cannot perform an action with the same action card or via the >> same card in play (including from the minion's own card text) more >> than once each turn, even if he untaps. [6.1.6] >> >> Action, check. Card in play, check. > >Action alone doesn't matter... it's "Action card". A vampire can hunt >with the default action as often as they like in a minion phase... but >they can't use a specific hunt action card more than once. > >What matters here is the fact that it's an action given by a card in >play (in this case it is the minon's own card text). That's what >limits it to once a minion phase. Uh, yes. That's what I said. It's an action provided by a card in play. It's important that it's an action, because non-action minion specials aren't restricted by default. So action: check. It's important that it's provided by a card in play. So card in play: check. In the quoted rules text, I'm referring to: A minion cannot perform an ACTION with the same action card or via the same CARD IN PLAY (including from the minion's own card text) more than once each turn, even if he untaps. [6.1.6] For some reason, you seem to think I'm referring to: A minion cannot perform an action with the same ACTION card or via the I don't know why you think that, since it clearly isn't an action card, and I never implied it was. [ quoted text not captured ]

[ quoted text not captured ] Another possibility: Shambling Hordes bleeds you for zero. Would you like to get blocked and fight the Horde, or bled for 2? Either way might be wrong..

The Ankou, 10, AUS DEM OBF, Malkavian Camarilla: When any vampire succesfully hunts while The Ankou is ready and untapped, the Ankou may burn that vampire as a (D) action that turn (even on another Methuselah's turn). Ankou special is clearly during X do Y. If you do not burn the vampire the turn it hunted, you can not burn them. Another good mechanic for him Eurayle Gelasia Mylonas, 6, for pre AUS OBE, Salubri, 4 Independent. Eurayle may untap any minion as an action. If you control the minion, this is a +2 stealth action. Scarce. Spirirt Marionette Heidelberg Castle

In message <29b78af8-253c-4bbc...@c22g2000prc.googlegroup s.com>, mat...@gmail.com writes: >The Ankou, 10, AUS DEM OBF, Malkavian > Camarilla: When any vampire succesfully hunts while The Ankou is >ready and untapped, the > Ankou may burn that vampire as a (D) action that turn (even on >another Methuselah's turn). > >Ankou special is clearly during X do Y. If you do not burn the vampire >the turn it hunted, you can not burn them. "During X do Y" refers to using the *specific* style of wording "During your minion phase, you may do..." which limits the allowed thing to be done once during the giving time. It clearly isn't that (if you disagree, point out the word "during" in the above text), which is what other people have been discussing. It's also pretty clear that it happens during a specific turn ("that turn") and not later. [ quoted text not captured ]

On Oct 31, 4:49 am, James Coupe <ja...@zephyr.org.uk> wrote: > Uh, yes. That's what I said. Yep, I know that... I was agreeing with the conclusion, but not the approach. > It's an action provided by a card in play. It's important that it's an > action, because non-action minion specials aren't restricted by default. > So action: check. It's important that it's provided by a card in play. > So card in play: check. The thing is that it's also not important that it's an action... because actions aren't restricted by default either. Action cards are what's restricted. The check is: "Action card: check". My point is that the checked item is atomic and shouldn't be separated. Brent Ross

On Oct 31, 12:04 pm, bwross <bwr...@mail.com> wrote: > The check is: "Action card: check". Oops... that should be "Card action: check" in this case. Brent

zora...@gmail.com wrote: > btw, Dark Influences abbreviates into DI as well.. a little joke by > LSJ? I would like to come forward as the first advocate of calling this card "DarkEye". As in "You play Govern the Unaligned? Well, I give you the DarkEye."

On Oct 30, 12:13 pm, Chris Berger <ark...@ugcs.caltech.edu> wrote: > On Oct 30, 1:08 pm, Thrall of Arika <christopher.ack...@amec.com> > wrote: > > > > > > > The Ankou > > > > > > 10 cap Malkavian > > > > > > AUS DEM OBF > > > > > > Camarilla: When any vampire succesfully hunts while The Ankou is ready and untapped, the > > > > > > Ankou may burn that vampire as a (D) action that turn (even on another Methuselah's turn). > > > Timing does seem to be an issue. I'm going to assume he can act on > > other methuselah's turns as if he had the Madness Network going. Now > > the question becomes, it's not written as a "During X, do Y", so can > > he attempt burn multiple vampires that hunted successfully, provided > > he can untap? > > To me, since he doesn't say "at the end of the turn" or "after that > methuselah is done acting", it's used immediately, i.e. "When" that > vampire hunts successfully, per card text. One could argue that the > acting methuselah has the impulse and can continue to take actions > until he passes, and that *may* be the correct ruling, but I think > that his ability happens in the timing window when the action is > successful, and thus before the acting methuselah has the chance to > take a new action. I presume there will be a ruling on it at some > point. To me, the fact that it doesn't say "at the end of the turn" means you can do it at any point of the turn, provided the condition has been met. Contrast this to Madness Network, which specifically states that the acting methuselah must be finished with their minion actions before you can start taking actions. Also, consider most cards the impart abilities to other minions that don't necessarily have to be done immediately after the play of that card. For example, Frontal Assault giving minions a rush. They don't have to rush, and you're free to do other actions beforehand. The card merely gives you the ability within a certain window, in this case, during your minion phase. For The Ankou, it's 'that turn when a vampire successfully hunts'. > > Hmm, still not sure. I would think that if titles are covered, that > > they would have been specified, just as Clan and Sect were. I think > > the fact that they are termed "titles" removes them from also being > > traits, even though a title is a defining characteristic. Also, if > > titles were considered traits for this card, could we not then use > > more specific titles? Play one Second Tradition as the Prince of New > > York, then a second as Prince of London, etc. > > Well, like I said, I'm not certain on this. You may be right. I > don't think there's a strict definition of "trait", and so I think > title might qualify. On the other hand, it does open up a lot of > questions on what counts as the same requirement that he can only meet > once. Likewise, I'm not sure either. It just seems to me that a title is more a thing a vampire has, like a piece of equipment or a retainer. I have a feeling that this question was missed during development of the card. It would be nice to have a definition of traits in the new rulebook, but I'm doubting this will be the case. > > I would disagree on Flight being a trait. While it's not a discipline, > > true, it also isn't a defining characteristic. You can say "Jack Drake > > is an Anarch (vampire)", you couldn't say "Fidus is a Flight > > (vampire)". You can say "Fidus has Flight, which allows him to use > > these flight cards", much like you can say "Fidus has Fortitude, which > > allows him to use these fortitude cards". > > Searching Google Group for flight+trait yields several results. Most > of them say that Flight *is* a trait, and one from LSJ implies > otherwise, but doesn't, IMO, necessarily say that it is not. I'm not > sure what it *is* if not a trait. The problem is, is that "Trait" is not a VTES word. There is nothing in the rulebook pertaining to them, and no other card has referred to 'trait'. It's come into common usage as a way to describe attributes like Sterile, Black Hand, etc. This has led me to consider that a trait is a bolded term used or given to minions. And while a title is also bolded, it is something more than a general trait, it's a Title, much like Clan and Sect, while also bolded text, are more than just a general trait and thus were specifically called out. And while Flight isn't a discipline, it's for all intensive purposes treated like one. So I would be inclined to lump it in with Disciplines and Imbued Virtues, which I think parallel's LSJ's thoughts when discussing Flight in regards to Seed of Corruption. On Oct 30, 4:00 pm, James Coupe <ja...@zephyr.org.uk> wrote: > Leaving aside the exact timing issue, my inclination would be to > disallow it multiple times. > > A minion cannot perform an action with the same action card or via the > same card in play (including from the minion's own card text) more > than once each turn, even if he untaps. [6.1.6] > > Action, check. Card in play, check. Very good point, thanks. Should have thought of that myself. Chris, Thrall in need of a home

On Oct 31, 1:44 pm, Thrall of Arika <christopher.ack...@amec.com> wrote: [The Ankou] > To me, the fact that it doesn't say "at the end of the turn" means you > can do it at any point of the turn, provided the condition has been > met. That's how I read it too. That pretty much means that The Ankou typically waits until the end of the minion phase and then selects one of the vampire that hunted (while The Ankou was untapped, if that wasn't the case at the time for some of the hunts) that turn to burn. Of course, there are exceptions... you might want to burn Una immediately after a hunt, rather than let her take umpteen more actions first. Brent Ross

On Oct 31, 3:36 pm, bwross <bwr...@mail.com> wrote: > Of course, there are exceptions... you might want to burn Una > immediately after a hunt, rather than let her take umpteen more > actions first. Except that, as you're not the active player, you're fairly unlikely to have the active player pass at that point to enable you to take that action. Effectively, this would work a lot like Madness Network does, except that (as written), after you've taken the Ankou action, the active player could then take another action, as they're not "done," they just passed priority on to you. Which makes me wonder whether, assuming Madness Network even got reprinted, its text has been altered to put it in the same timing window. Anyone have a KoT Madness Network and ability to post the wording? - D.J.

In message <f8254039-1152-4939...@i20g2000prf.googlegroup s.com>, Thrall of Arika <christoph...@amec.com> writes: >On Oct 30, 4:00 pm, James Coupe <ja...@zephyr.org.uk> wrote: >> Leaving aside the exact timing issue, my inclination would be to >> disallow it multiple times. >> >> A minion cannot perform an action with the same action card or via the >> same card in play (including from the minion's own card text) more >> than once each turn, even if he untaps. [6.1.6] >> >> Action, check. Card in play, check. > >Very good point, thanks. Could you please stop combining several replies into one post? It's not how Usenet works. It is not a web forum. It breaks the functionality of many programs, and makes it harder to track down replies. -- James Coupe PGP Key: 0x5D623D5D YOU ARE IN ERROR. EBD690ECD7A1FB457CA2 NO-ONE IS SCREAMING. 13D7E668C3695D623D5D THANK YOU FOR YOUR COOPERATION.

On Oct 31, 4:39 pm, James Coupe <ja...@zephyr.org.uk> wrote: > In message <f8254039-1152-4939-8c57-e9acd4c0a...@i20g2000prf.googlegroup > s.com>, Thrall of Arika <christopher.ack...@amec.com> writes: > > >On Oct 30, 4:00 pm, James Coupe <ja...@zephyr.org.uk> wrote: > >> Leaving aside the exact timing issue, my inclination would be to > >> disallow it multiple times. > > >> A minion cannot perform an action with the same action card or via the > >> same card in play (including from the minion's own card text) more > >> than once each turn, even if he untaps. [6.1.6] > > >> Action, check. Card in play, check. > > >Very good point, thanks. > > Could you please stop combining several replies into one post? It's not > how Usenet works. It is not a web forum. It breaks the functionality > of many programs, and makes it harder to track down replies. Sure thing, I apologize, I had no idea that my way of posting was being disruptive. I use googlegroups and read posts in chronological order. I was combining replies so as to not be spamming the group, and also in habit from another forum where one wasn't allowed to post back- to-back posts. In any case, if it makes it easier for more users, I'll reply post by post from now on. Chris, Thrall of Arika

On Oct 27, 3:35 pm, Brum <tiago.br...@gmail.com> wrote: > On 26 Out, 07:26, Blooded Sand <sandm...@gmail.com> wrote: > > > Please? > > > Pretty please? > > > With a tied down antediluvian on top? > > http://www.sabbatinfrance.org/newforum/viewtopic.php?t=1530&start=275 > > go back n forth if ye can read that. there's the toreador precon > > Tiago The Brujah and Malkavian precons, from the above thread: Deck Name: "Brujah" Starter Deck (Keepers of Tradition) Created By: L. Scott Johnson Description: "Brujah" Preconstructed Starter Deck from "Keepers of Tradition". Crypt: (12 cards, Min: 14, Max 42, Avg: 6,5) --------------------------------------------- 2x Garret pot pre 3, Brujah 2x Reginald Moore PRE 4, Brujah 2x Herbert Westin pot OBF PRE 5, Brujah 2x Tomaine CEL POT PRE 6, Brujah 2x Jann Berger dem for CEL POT PRE 10, Brujah 2x Adana de Sforza aus CEL OBF POT PRE PRO 11, Brujah Library: (77 cards) --------------------------------------------- Master (10 cards) 1x Celerity 1x KRCG News Radio 2x Major Boon 1x Nod 1x Potence 1x Presence 1x Tension in the Ranks 2x Vessel Action (14 cards) 4x Enrage 2x Entrenching 5x Harass 3x Public Trust Combat (32 cards) 6x Brute Force 3x Immortal Grapple 3x Psyche! 3x Relentless Pursuit 4x Slam 4x Stutter-Step 3x Taste of Vitae 3x Torn Signpost 3x Weighted Walking Stick Equipment (9 cards) 4x Bang Nakh - Tiger's Claws 2x Bundi 1x Drum of Xipe Totec 1x Phased Motion Detector 1x Sengir Dagger Political Action (4 cards) 2x Finding the Path 2x Year of Fortune Reaction (3 cards) 3x On the Qui Vive Combo (5 cards) 5x Resist The Earth's Grasp Garret Cardtype: Vampire Clan: Brujah Group: 4 Disciplines: pot pre Capacity: 3 Camarilla. Reginald Moore Cardtype: Vampire Clan: Brujah Group: 4 Capacity: 4 Disciplines: PRE Camarilla Primogen. Reginald gets +1 strength in combat with Tremere and Tremere antitribu. He cannot block vampires of those clans or attempt actions to enter combat with them. Herbert Westin Cardtype: Vampire Clan: Brujah Group: 4 Capacity: 5 Disciplines: pot OBF PRE Camarilla. When Herbert successfully performs an equip action, you may draw an additional card (discard afterward). Tomaine Cardtype: Vampire Clan: Brujah Group: 4 Capacity: 6 Disciplines: CEL POT PRE Camarilla Primogen. If your prey controls a ready Sabbat vampire, he or she gets +1 hand size while Tomaine is ready. Jann Berger Cardtype: Vampire Clan: Brujah Group: 4 Capacity: 10 Disciplines: dem for CEL POT PRE Camarilla Prince of Monaco. Cards that require Potence cost Jann 1 less blood. +1 bleed. Adana de Sforza Cardtype: Vampire Clan: Brujah Group: 4 Capacity: 11 Disciplines: aus CEL OBF POT PRE PRO Camarilla Brujah Inner Circle Member. Combat cards cost Adana 1 less blood. +2 bleed. A couple of nice Library cards: Drums, Immortal Grapples, Tastes of Vitae. A bit of a combat monster in Adana, especially with access to Protean. And two starter vamps with superior OBF. Finally some stealth options outside Celerity. Deck Name: "Malkavian" Starter Deck (Keepers of Tradition) Created By: L. Scott Johnson Description: "Malkavian" Preconstructed Starter Deck from "Keepers of Tradition". Crypt: (12 cards, Min: 12, Max 42, Avg: 6,83) --------------------------------------------- 2x Cassandra Langely, The Waif dem 2, Malkavian 2x Florentina Lengauer aus OBF 4, Malkavian 2x Morel AUS DEM OBF 6. Malkavian 2x Aleister Crowley aus obf DEM PRE THA 7, Malkavian 2x Tryphosa AUS DEM DOM OBF POT 10, Malkavian 2x Lutz Von Hohenzollern pot AUS DEM OBF PRE 11, Malkavian Library: (77 cards) --------------------------------------------- Master (17 cards) 1x Auspex 1x Bleeding the Vine 1x The Coven 1x Dementation (new art) 2x Effective Management 1x Elysium, The Arboretum 1x Giant's Blood 1x High Museum of Art, Atlanta 4x Life in the City 2x Obfuscate 2x Vessel Action (13 cards) 5x Forgery 6x Kindred Spirits 2x Sleep of Reason Political Action (1 card) 1x Praxis Seizure: Chicago Equipment (5 cards) 3x Cooler 2x Learjet Action Modifier (23 cards) 3x Change of Target 6x Eyes of Chaos 6x Into Thin Air 4x Spying Mission 4x Veil The Legions Reaction (12 cards) 3x On the Qui Vive 2x Poison Pill 2x Shattered Mirror 3x Spirit's Touch 2x Voice of Madness Combat (4 cards) 4x Glancing Blow Action Modifier/Combat (2 cards) 2x Deny Cassandra Langely, The Waif Clan: Malkavian Group: 4 Capacity: 2 Disciplines: dem Camarilla. Florentina Lengauer Clan: Malkavian Group: 4 Capacity: 4 Disciplines: aus OBF Camarilla. Morel Clan: Malkavian Group: 4 Capacity: 6 Disciplines: AUS DEM OBF Camarilla. Aleister Crowley Clan: Malkavian Group: 4 Capacity: 7 Disciplines: aus obf DEM PRE THA Camarilla. Frenzy cards cannot be played on Aleister. Tryphosa Clan: Malkavian Group: 4 Capacity: 10 Disciplines: AUS DEM DOM OBF POT Camarilla Prince of Rome. While Tryphosa is ready, any Malkavian's bleed action costs an additional blood and gets +1 stealth. Lutz Von Hohenzollern Clan: Malkavian Group: 4 Capacity: 11 Disciplines: pot AUS DEM OBF PRE Camarilla Malkavian Inner Circle. While Lutz is ready, your prey burns a pool each time the referendum of a political action passes. +2 bleed. A nice selection of library cards, but nothing to eye-popping. Aleister Crowley is an odd one in the crypt, but certainly has potential joining in mixed crypts. Tryphosa seems pretty killer, giving all bleed actions +1 stealth off the bat for Malkavians. Rather like Lutz, even if you're not voting, you could still end up pinging your prey with other vote decks on the table. Chris, Thrall of Arika

On Oct 27, 3:35 pm, Brum <tiago.br...@gmail.com> wrote: > On 26 Out, 07:26, Blooded Sand <sandm...@gmail.com> wrote: > > > Please? > > > Pretty please? > > > With a tied down antediluvian on top? > > http://www.sabbatinfrance.org/newforum/viewtopic.php?t=1530&start=275 > > go back n forth if ye can read that. there's the toreador precon > > Tiago A more various cards from the above thread: Library: > Old Friends > Cardtype: Action modifier > Discipline: Obfuscate > Cost: 1 blood > Do not replace until your untap phase. > obf: +1 bleed. You cannot play another action modifier to increase this bleed. > OBF: Only usable during a referendum. This vampire gains 2 votes. Not sure on this one. It's pretty costly for the effects given, at 1 blood and reduced hand size until your next turn. +1 bleed is nice, but 2 votes seems a bit meh for superior, and all the associated costs. > Repair the Undead Flesh > action > +3 stealth action > [for] Put this card on this vampire. In combat, this vampire may heal aggravated damage by > burning 3 blood per point healed. Burn this card if this vampire goes to torpor. > [FOR] As above, but burn only 2 blood per point. Easy to get, but is it really worthwhile? I suppose it can help in a pinch, if you happen to not be drawing into your combat prevent. Plus it can help in situations where you couldn't prevent it otherwise. > Tainted Spring > action modifier > animalism > 1 blood. > ani:Only usable when an action to employ or recruit an animal is announced. If this action is > successful, the animal gets +1 strength (for an ally) or inflicts an additional damage (for damage- > dealing retainers). > ANI: As above, and the animal gets an additional starting life. Interesting effect .. could make for some fun theme decks. Murder of Crows hitting for 2R a round is nice too. > Veles' Hunt > Cardtype: Political Action > Clan: Gangrel > Cost: 3 pool > Blood hunt referendum. Choose an ally or younger non-titled vampire controlled by your prey. > Successful referendum means that minion is burned. If this referendum fails or is canceled, no > more Veles' Hunts can be played this game. Well, here you go, the new PtO ... maybe. I'm not sure of the veracity of this one. It's certainly got a more appropriate cost than PtO, with risks of never being able to call it again. But in the right kind of deck, can make things very deadly. > Wrong and Crosswise > reaction > 1 blood > [dem] Reduce a bleed against you by 2. > [DEM] Only usable during a referendum. Gain 4 votes against the referendum. Wow, maybe Malkavians won't need to Telepathic Misdirect ever again. This and Telepathic Counter makes most bleeds fall flat. Crypt: > Don Caravelli > 8 Brujah g5 > aus dom CEL POT PRE > Camarilla: Once each combat involving another vampire you control, Don Caravelli can burn a > blood to give a press to the vampire you control in combat. > > Dmitra Ilyanova > brujah, g5, 9-cap > obf CEL FOR POT PRE > Camarilla Brujha Justicar: Dmitra may call a referendum to distribute 4 blood from the blood bank > among one or more ready vampires as a +1 stealth political action. A bit more Obfuscate, and superior Fortitude. And a nice blood regain ability. > Gracetius > 10 Brujah g5 > ANI CEL POT PRE QUI > Camarilla: When you have the Edge, Gracetius may play reaction cards and attempt to block as if > untapped. +1 strength. > > > Fergus Alexander > 3 Gangrel g5 > pot pro > Camarilla: Fergus can enter combat with a tapped Sabbat vampire as a (D) action. Scrappy little guy. > Lillian > Clan: Gangrel > Group: ? > Capacity: 3 > Disciplines: ani pro > Independent. > > Gunnar > Clan: Gangrel > Group: ? > Capacity: 4 > Disciplines: for PRO > Independent. > > Bernard, the Scourge > Clan: Gangrel > Group: ? > Capacity: 5 > Disciplines: ani for pre pro > Camarilla. Bernard can call a Blood Hunt on a vampire with capacity 4 or less as +1 stealth > political action. Wow, the Gangrel have decided to becomes the judges and jury it seems, with this and Veles' Hunt above. > Rathmere > Clan: Gangrel > Group: ? > Capacity: 5 > Disciplines: ani pro FOR > Independent. Rathmere gets +1 strength in combat with a Sabbat vampire. > > Lisé > Clan: Gangrel > Group: ? > Capacity: 6 > Disciplines: pot pro ANI FOR > Independent. > > Shiloh Marie, Vengeance > Clan: Gangrel > Group: ? > Capacity: 6 > Disciplines: ANI FOR PRO > Independent. Shiloh can enter combat with a younger vampire as a (D) action. During your untap > phase, if Shiloh is ready, another ready vampire you control takes 1 unpreventable damage. > > Talbot > Clan: Gangrel > Group: ? > Capacity: 7 > Disciplines: for ANI NEC PRO > Independent. Talbot may burn a master card from your hand to attempt to enter combat with any > minion as a +1 stealth (D) action. Rush, rush and more rush. > Randall > Clan: Gangrel > Group: ? > Capacity: 8 > Disciplines: ANI AUS FOR PRO > Independent. Randall has 1 vote (titled). Once each minion phase, he may burn 1 blood to prevent > 1 non-aggravated damage done to any other minion in combat. > > Viktor, The Night General > Clan: Gangrel > Group: 5 > Capacity: 9 > Disciplines: obf ANI CEL PRE PRO > Independant. +1 stealth > > Gwyedd > Gangrel 10 g4 > tem ANI DEM FOR POT PRO > Camarilla Primogen: When Gwyedd is performing an undirected action, any younger vampire who > attempts to block and fails is tapped after resolution. Temporis out of clan, and a non-brujah has it. > Mictlantecuhlti > Clan: Gangrel > Group: ? > Capacity: 10 > Disciplines: pre pro ANI FOR POT THA > Independent. Mictlantecuhlti is immune to damage from weapons. When he commits diablerie, > each of your other ready vampires gains 1 blood from the blood bank. +1 strength. Another potential monster, and fitting into the Judge/Jury/Executioner theme the Gangrel seem to have going here. > Fakir al Sidi > 11 Gangrel g4 > abo ANI FOR PRE PRO THA > Independent: Before votes are cast, Fakir may burn 3 blood to cause the referendum of a political > action to fail. He gets an optional press each combat. +1 bleed. +1 strength. > > > Unmada > 10 Malkavian g5 > cel for AUS DEM OBF VIC > Camarilla Malkavian Justicar: While Unmada is ready, you get an additional discard phase action > during your discard phase and +1 hand size. > > > Benjamin Rose > 7 Nosferatu g5 > ani pot AUS OBF > Camarilla Prince of Washington, D.C.: Benjamin can call a referendum to give you +1 hand size > for the remainder of the game as a +1 stealth political action. > > Baron Diudonne > 9 Nosferatu g4 > ANI OBF POT PRO > Camarilla Prince of Brussels: Once during your minion phase when Diudonne successfully > resolves an action, he may burn 1 blood to untap. > > > Sheva Carr > toreador, g5, 4-cap > aus cel dom > Camarilla: Sheva gets +1 strength in combat with a Lasombra. A lot of Dominate spread amongst the Toreador this time around, and a lot whom are fighty too. > Philippe de Marseilles > 7 Toreador g5 > dem pre AUS CEL Camarilla primogen: During your untap phase, if there are any Gehenna cards > in play, you may remove Philippe from the game to gain 6 pool. > > Allanyan Serata > 9 Toreador g5 > ani AUS CEL OBT PRE > Camarailla primogen: +1 strength. > > Montecalme > Toreador 10 g5 > obt AUS CEL DOM PRE > Camarilla Toreador Justicar: Montecalme may call a referendum to burn any location as a +1 > stealth political action. > > > Troius > 8 Tremere g4 > cel AUS DOM THA > Camarilla Prince of Geneva: Troius cannot vote against a blood hunt referendum. +1 strength. Chris, Thrall of Arika

> Adana de Sforza > Cardtype: Vampire > Clan: Brujah > Group: 4 > Capacity: 11 > Disciplines: aus CEL OBF POT PRE PRO > Camarilla Brujah Inner Circle Member. Combat cards cost Adana 1 less > blood. +2 bleed. She gives me wood Bleed for 5 with Legal Blocked Flesh of Marble Hands for 1 Take 1 damage from the opposing minion Blur for Free 1st additional Hands for 1 2nd additional Form of Mist at superior to continue the action Disarm as I have done more damage in combat than the opposing minion. Iron Glare Bleed for 7 with an opposing minion in torpor for 3 blood and 6 cards. Good Stuff

Thrall of Arika wrote: > > Aleister Crowley > Clan: Malkavian > Group: 4 > Capacity: 7 > Disciplines: aus obf DEM PRE THA > Camarilla. Frenzy cards cannot be played on Aleister. > "Miiister Crooowleey..." -- Super Fun Cards www.superfuncards.com *NEW Website!* auct...@superfuncards.com

On Nov 5, 12:09 am, Thrall of Arika <christopher.ack...@amec.com> wrote: > > Repair the Undead Flesh > > action > > +3 stealth action > > [for] Put this card on this vampire. In combat, this vampire may heal aggravated damage by > > burning 3 blood per point healed. Burn this card if this vampire goes to torpor. > > [FOR] As above, but burn only 2 blood per point. > > Easy to get, but is it really worthwhile? I suppose it can help in a > pinch, if you happen to not be drawing into your combat prevent. Plus > it can help in situations where you couldn't prevent it otherwise. Masochism, anyone? > > > Tainted Spring > > action modifier > > animalism > > 1 blood. > > ani:Only usable when an action to employ or recruit an animal is announced. If this action is > > successful, the animal gets +1 strength (for an ally) or inflicts an additional damage (for damage- > > dealing retainers). > > ANI: As above, and the animal gets an additional starting life. > > Interesting effect .. could make for some fun theme decks. Murder of This needs breaking. Really! > > Mictlantecuhlti > > Clan: Gangrel > > Group: ? > > Capacity: 10 > > Disciplines: pre pro ANI FOR POT THA > > Independent. Mictlantecuhlti is immune to damage from weapons. When he commits diablerie, > > each of your other ready vampires gains 1 blood from the blood bank. +1 strength. > > Another potential monster, and fitting into the Judge/Jury/Executioner > theme the Gangrel seem to have going here. This guy is screaming for Talbots/Eye. Maybe even both. Because you assign T/E to him, and he is immune.... Yummy! Black gloves anyone? > > Unmada > > 10 Malkavian g5 > > cel for AUS DEM OBF VIC > > Camarilla Malkavian Justicar: While Unmada is ready, you get an additional discard phase action > > during your discard phase and +1 hand size. Goes well with Benjamin. Must admit, was thinking Ayo Igoli with him and maybe P:LA... "Look, a 6 cap. For free. Instantly. Just add blood!" > > Benjamin Rose > > 7 Nosferatu g5 > > ani pot AUS OBF > > Camarilla Prince of Washington, D.C.: Benjamin can call a referendum to give you +1 hand size > > for the remainder of the game as a +1 stealth political action. Does this stack??? It does not say once per game, and there is no way for anyone to burn it!!! Awesome..... The card giving me joy at the moment though, is this: Enkil Cog Cardtype: Action Modifier Requires a vampire of capacity 10 or more. Unique. Only usable when this vampire successfully bleeds your prey (play after resolution). Put this card on this vampire. During any Methuselah's minion phase, this vampire may tap this card to attempt an action. This vampire has +1 bleed. Now how to get Benjamin Rose an extra 3 cap.... XZealot? Sluggy loves this, so does Arika, fun card all around, definitely gonna be strong as tanks... Enkidu, the possibilities are endless....

On Nov 5, 3:58 am, Blooded Sand <sandm...@gmail.com> wrote: > On Nov 5, 12:09 am, Thrall of Arika <christopher.ack...@amec.com> > wrote: > > > > Mictlantecuhlti > > > Clan: Gangrel > > > Group: ? > > > Capacity: 10 > > > Disciplines: pre pro ANI FOR POT THA > > > Independent. Mictlantecuhlti is immune to damage from weapons. When he commits diablerie, > > > each of your other ready vampires gains 1 blood from the blood bank. +1 strength. > > > Another potential monster, and fitting into the Judge/Jury/Executioner > > theme the Gangrel seem to have going here. > > This guy is screaming for Talbots/Eye. Maybe even both. Because you > assign T/E to him, and he is immune.... Yummy! Black gloves anyone? > But....the Eye of Hazimel isn't a weapon, therefore Mictlantecuhtli would not be immune, correct? Giving him Talbot's Chainsaw though, I totally endorse this idea. Wouldn't do Black Gloves, I'd just pack some sort of Blood Fury/Wolf Claw package. Delicious agg, unpreventable by fortitude? Sign me up! So much delicious trumpy combat potential. -D

[ quoted text not captured ] he also completely needs to be given Enkil Cog. Rush every turn....

[ quoted text not captured ] And with THA, Magic Smith gets him what he needs easily enough. And Rutors/Crimethinc for untaps. And with those untaps, some Biothaums. And with POT, he gets Preternatural.And and and... I really like this guy. Seriously, if only he was !Gangrel. Then you could Gangrel Conspiracy those blood hunts. Morgan Vening

On Oct 27, 3:35 pm, Brum <tiago.br...@gmail.com> wrote: >http://www.sabbatinfrance.org/newforum/viewtopic.php?t=1530&start=275 More from the above site, which has a link to some card scans, and a couple of scans imbedded into the thread on page 34. I have to say, overall, I'm really liking the art of this set. Some are really nice, such as the new art for Dominate. A lot better at generating a darker mood that one should associate with VTES. Also includes some cards posted previously, but with more complete text. > Heroic Might > Cost 3 > +3 Stealth Action > pot: Put this card on this vampire. This vampire gains +1 strength. This vampire may destroy > equipment as a strike. A vampire can have only one Heroic Might. Burn this card if this vampire > goes to torpor. > POT: As above, with an additional +1 strength, and this vampire can strike for 2R damage. Previous listing didn't have the limitations on the card. > Horseshoe > Action > pot: Inflict 1 unpreventable damage to a ready minion > POT: Inflict 2 unpreventable damage to a ready minion Previous listing didn't mention the unpreventable part. > Target Retainer > Cardtype: Combat > Aim. Play when choosing a strike. > You may target a retainer on the opposing minion with this strike (instead of the opposing minion). > Or you may target him or her as usual, but if any damage from this strike is successfully inflicted, > this strike inflicts an additional damage. The opposing minion may discard 2 combat cards to > cancel this card. A minion may only play one aim each strike. New Aim card, which remains useful even if it's primary purpose isn't an available option. > Steadfastness > Cardtype: Reaction > for: Only usable during a directed action at you (or a card you control). +1 intercept. > FOR: Reduce a bleed against you by 1. Haven't seen this posted in this newsgroup. Intercept for Fortitude. > Rego Motus > Combat > Cost 1 > tha: Prevent 2 damage from the opposing minions strike. A vampire may only play 1 Rego Motus > each round. > THA: As above, but prevent 4 damage. Previous listing did not have limitation. > Nocturn Theater > Master > 2 pool > Unique Location. During your untap phase, you may tap this card and a ready vampire you control > to tap a minion controlled by your prey. Any titled vampire may burn this card as a directed action. A bit expensive, but could be a devestating effect, tapping some weenie to tap your prey's main blocker. > Loki's Gift > Action > +1 stealth hunt action. > pro: Gain 1 blood and this card. This vampire can burn this card and 1 blood to gain +1 stealth. A > vampire can have only one Loki's Gift. > PRO: As above, and burn a blood from any vampire. This vampire may burn this card as above, or > may burn it during a referendum to gain 2 votes. A bit of a convoluted way to gain one stealth. But superior does ping a vampire, and the potential for votes for Protean vampires. > Cesar ??? > Clan: Caitiff > Group: 4 > Capacity: 1 > Disciplines: obf > Camarilla: At the end of your minion phase, if there are any Gehenna cards in play and Cesar did > not hunt, he burns 1 blood. > > Ariadne > Clan: Gangrel > Group: 5 > Capacity: 8 > Disciplines: chi ANI FOR PRO > Camarilla. Blood hunts cannot be called on Ariadne. She gains an additional blood when she > successfully hunts. Another 'judge and executioner' for Gangrel. > Slag > Clan: Nosferatu > Group: 5 > Capacity: 4 > Disciplines: ani obf pot > Camarilla. While Slag is ready, any Methuselah playing or discarding a card during a referendum > must show you the card drawn to replace it. A neat little ability. > Ruxandra > Clan: Nosferatu > Group: 5 > Capacity: 5 > Disciplines: ani aus OBF > Camarilla. Ventrue get -1 intercept when Ruxandra is acting. As a discard phase action, you may > tap Ruxandra to discard any number of cards from your hand. Very nice to get rid of hand jam. > Frank Weisshadel > Clan: Tremere > Group: 4 > Capacity: 4 > Disciplines: dom pot tha > Camarilla. > > MacAlister Marshall > Clan: Tremere > Group: 5 > Capacity: 6 > Disciplines: aus dom obf pre THA > Camarilla. Other Tremere get +1 intercept when attempting to block a directed action directed at > MacAlister. > > Tarrence Moore > Clan: Tremere > Group: 5 > Capacity: 4 > Disciplines: aus dom tha > Camarilla > > Portia > Clan: Ventrue > Group: 5 > Capacity: 4? > Disciplines: for pre pro > Camarilla. Portia gets +1 stealth when hunting. If her hunt is blocked, she takes 1 damage before > the range is determined in the first round of the resulting combat. Chris, Thrall of Arika

On Nov 5, 4:00 pm, Morgan Vening <mor...@optusnet.com.au> wrote: > >> > > > Mictlantecuhlti > >> > > > Clan: Gangrel > >> > > > Group: ? > >> > > > Capacity: 10 > >> > > > Disciplines: pre pro ANI FOR POT THA > >> > > > Independent. Mictlantecuhlti is immune to damage from weapons. When he commits diablerie, > >> > > > each of your other ready vampires gains 1 blood from the blood bank. +1 strength. > Seriously, if only he was !Gangrel. Then you could Gangrel Conspiracy > those blood hunts. As it is, you'll just need to give him one Master: Discipline to push his cap to 11, and put Fueled by Heart's Blood into play... - D.J.

On Nov 4, 5:36 pm, Thrall of Arika <christopher.ack...@amec.com> wrote: > AleisterCrowley > Clan: Malkavian > Group: 4 > Capacity: 7 > Disciplines: aus obf DEM PRE THA > Camarilla. Frenzy cards cannot be played on Aleister. Ha! Anyone seen his art to know whether or not he looks like the historical figure? John Eno

On Nov 5, 5:48 pm, Thrall of Arika <christopher.ack...@amec.com> wrote: > On Oct 27, 3:35 pm, Brum <tiago.br...@gmail.com> wrote: > > Horseshoe > > Action > > pot: Inflict 1 unpreventable damage to a ready minion > > POT: Inflict 2 unpreventable damage to a ready minion > > Previous listing didn't mention the unpreventable part. What prevents damage outside combat anyway? > > Target Retainer > New Aim card, which remains useful even if it's primary purpose isn't > an available option. Well, yes. But its primary purpose is to be able to say "I punch you in the bird." - D.J.

On Nov 5, 6:33 pm, Kushiel <invisibleking...@gmail.com> wrote: > Ha! Anyone seen his art to know whether or not he looks like the > historical figure? Yes. He does, although he's hard to recognize without the pyramid hat. (Erich Weiss and "Bela" look like their namesakes, too.) Jason

On Nov 6, 10:05 am, Meej <dj...@comcast.net> wrote: > What prevents damage outside combat anyway? Something does. Leather Jacket, maybe? Or Blood Tears of Kephran? I'm pretty sure there is at least one thing that can be bent to prevent damage that happens not during combat. > Well, yes. But its primary purpose is to be able to say "I punch you > in the bird." Ow! My bird! -Peter

On Nov 6, 10:11 am, Peter D Bakija <p...@lightlink.com> wrote: > On Nov 6, 10:05 am, Meej <dj...@comcast.net> wrote: > > > What prevents damage outside combat anyway? > > Something does. Leather Jacket, maybe? Or Blood Tears of Kephran? I'm > pretty sure there is at least one thing that can be bent to prevent > damage that happens not during combat. > I think Blood Tears was MRP'd to not be able to do that. AFAIK, all damage outside combat is now unpreventable. Even if I'm not wrong, it's still best to have the reminder text to avoid confusion.

Peter D Bakija wrote: > On Nov 6, 10:05 am, Meej <dj...@comcast.net> wrote: >> What prevents damage outside combat anyway? > > Something does. Leather Jacket, maybe? Strike damage. > Or Blood Tears of Kephran? Damage in combat. > I'm > pretty sure there is at least one thing that can be bent to prevent > damage that happens not during combat. Ostensibly Surge could do it, but in practice Surge just allows the expending of the Conviction outside of combat, since non-strike damage done outside of combat is (almost?) always labeled unpreventable. Exception: Rutor's Hand provides a way to prevent its non-strike, non-combat self-damage.

On Nov 6, 11:11 am, Peter D Bakija <p...@lightlink.com> wrote: > On Nov 6, 10:05 am, Meej <dj...@comcast.net> wrote: > > > What prevents damage outside combat anyway? > > Something does. Leather Jacket, maybe? Or Blood Tears of Kephran? I'm > pretty sure there is at least one thing that can be bent to prevent > damage that happens not during combat. Leather Jacket can prevent outside combat, but only damage from an opposing minion's strike. So, it can prevent the damage from Catatonic Fear, but not from Horseshoes. Blood Tears specifies that it can only prevent damage in combat. John Eno

On Nov 6, 10:55 am, Jadasc <jad...@gmail.com> wrote: > Yes. He does, although he's hard to recognize without the pyramid hat. Awesome. The enduring image of him in my head is sans hat, so that's no issue. Theme deck, here I come! John Eno