Rutor's Hand question

I have a question concerning the Rutor's Hand card. Superior version says that aggravated damage can be prevented. Since Tremere are not very adept in preventing damage, can it be prevented by following cards: Flak Jacket ? Leather Jacket ? Guardian Angel ? Can Merill Molitor turn this 1 aggravated damage to normal ? Braddock

In article <8ebj1u$s11$1...@as102.tel.hr>, "Braddock" <ek-...@elektrokem.tel.hr> wrote: > I have a question concerning the Rutor's Hand card. > Superior version says that aggravated damage can be prevented. > Since Tremere are not very adept in preventing damage, can it be prevented > by following cards: > Flak Jacket ? > Leather Jacket ? > Guardian Angel ? I would say not for these, as the text refers to damage caused by combat. Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Before you buy.

Braddock wrote: > > I have a question concerning the Rutor's Hand card. > Superior version says that aggravated damage can be prevented. > Since Tremere are not very adept in preventing damage, can it be prevented > by following cards: > Flak Jacket ? > Leather Jacket ? > Guardian Angel ? No, since those cards are only usable in combat (as all damage prevention cards are supposed to be). Rutor's Hand has errata explaining how the damage can be prevented: Rutor's Hand [DS] - Action (tha) (1) * A vampire cannot have more than one Rutor's Hand. [RTR 23-JUN-1998] * To prevent the damage from Rutor's Hand (superior version), you must burn three blood (in addition to the cost of the action). This is errata. (No other methods of preventing the damage can be used.) [RTR 23-JUN-1998] > Can Merill Molitor turn this 1 aggravated damage to normal ? No, since his special ability is only usable in combat. -- LSJ (vte...@white-wolf.com) V:TES Net.Rep for White Wolf, Inc. Links to revised rulebook, rulings, errata, and tournament rules: http://www.geocities.com/vtesrep

In article <390978E4...@white-wolf.com>, LSJ <vte...@white-wolf.com> wrote: > Braddock wrote: > > > > I have a question concerning the Rutor's Hand card. > > Superior version says that aggravated damage can be prevented. > > Since Tremere are not very adept in preventing damage, can it be prevented > > by following cards: > > Flak Jacket ? > > Leather Jacket ? > > Guardian Angel ? > > No, since those cards are only usable in combat (as all damage prevention > cards are supposed to be). > > Rutor's Hand has errata explaining how the damage can be prevented: > > Rutor's Hand [DS] - Action (tha) (1) > * A vampire cannot have more than one Rutor's Hand. [RTR 23-JUN- 1998] > * To prevent the damage from Rutor's Hand (superior version), you must > burn three blood (in addition to the cost of the action). This is > errata. (No other methods of preventing the damage can be used.) > [RTR 23-JUN-1998] But a Blood Tears of Kephran can prevent a superior Rutor's damage anyway. Is right? And if it is, why keep still that RT ruling on Rutor's hand (the one "burn 3 blood to prevent..")? Thanks Aemilianus, Prince of Rome > > Can Merill Molitor turn this 1 aggravated damage to normal ? > > No, since his special ability is only usable in combat. > > -- > LSJ (vte...@white-wolf.com) V:TES Net.Rep for White Wolf, Inc. > Links to revised rulebook, rulings, errata, and tournament rules: > http://www.geocities.com/vtesrep > [ quoted text not captured ]

>> LSJ <vte...@white-wolf.com> wrote: >> * To prevent the damage from Rutor's Hand (superior version), you >> must burn three blood (in addition to the cost of the action). This >> is errata. (No other methods of preventing the damage can be used.) >> [RTR 23-JUN-1998] > tetragr...@my-deja.com wrote: > But a Blood Tears of Kephran can prevent a superior Rutor's damage > anyway. Is right? No. Not unless you're playing with NJL rules which, in Rome, is highly unlikely. Notice the use of the word "must" and his explicit statement, "No other methods of preventing the damage can be used." > And if it is, why keep still that RT ruling on Rutor's hand (the > one "burn 3 blood to prevent..")? Because it ain't. Noal McDonald Priscus of Farmington Hills, MI National Jyhad League -- "What you cannot enforce, do not command." -- Socrates [ quoted text not captured ]

tetragr...@my-deja.com wrote: > LSJ <vte...@white-wolf.com> wrote: > > Rutor's Hand [DS] - Action (tha) (1) > > * A vampire cannot have more than one Rutor's Hand. [RTR 23-JUN- > 1998] > > * To prevent the damage from Rutor's Hand (superior version), you > must > > burn three blood (in addition to the cost of the action). This is > > errata. (No other methods of preventing the damage can be used.) > > [RTR 23-JUN-1998] > > But a Blood Tears of Kephran can prevent a superior Rutor's damage > anyway. Is right? No. See above: "No other methods of preventing the damage can be used." [ quoted text not captured ]

>No, since those cards are only usable in combat (as all damage prevention >cards are supposed to be). How about Blood Tears of Kephran? Halcyan 2

In article <3909D596...@white-wolf.com>, LSJ <vte...@white-wolf.com> wrote: > tetragr...@my-deja.com wrote: > > LSJ <vte...@white-wolf.com> wrote: > > > Rutor's Hand [DS] - Action (tha) (1) > > > * A vampire cannot have more than one Rutor's Hand. [RTR 23- JUN- > > 1998] > > > * To prevent the damage from Rutor's Hand (superior version), you > > must > > > burn three blood (in addition to the cost of the action). This is > > > errata. (No other methods of preventing the damage can be used.) > > > [RTR 23-JUN-1998] > > > > But a Blood Tears of Kephran can prevent a superior Rutor's damage > > anyway. Is right? > > No. See above: "No other methods of preventing the damage can be used." Thanks, but my question remains unanswered: why to keep such rule text's errata, when that errata was made sensless later with the introduction of Blood Tears of Kephran? Your thoughts? Regards Aemilianus, Prince of Rome. > -- > LSJ (vte...@white-wolf.com) V:TES Net.Rep for White Wolf, Inc. > Links to revised rulebook, rulings, errata, and tournament rules: > http://www.geocities.com/vtesrep > [ quoted text not captured ]

On Fri, 28 Apr 2000 tetragr...@my-deja.com wrote: > Thanks, but my question remains unanswered: > why to keep such rule text's errata, > when that errata was made sensless later with the introduction of > Blood Tears of Kephran? The errata was issued *way* after Blood Tears had been available. -- James Coupe | PGP Key 0x5D623D5D "But I don't have the right to be with you tonight, so please leave me alone with no saviour in sight. I will sleep safe and sound with nobody around me."

> Rutor's Hand has errata explaining how the damage can be prevented: > > Rutor's Hand [DS] - Action (tha) (1) > * A vampire cannot have more than one Rutor's Hand. [RTR 23-JUN-1998] > * To prevent the damage from Rutor's Hand (superior version), you must > burn three blood (in addition to the cost of the action). This is > errata. (No other methods of preventing the damage can be used.) > [RTR 23-JUN-1998] > That is alright. But why are you saying "This is errata", right after? It is confusing when i am translating this and understand the rules. For me, it seems that the vampire burns 3 bloods to prevent the dammage. And right after that, you can't, cause this is errata. Sorry if i don't understand this clearly, but sometimes it ain't that easy to translate game mechanics if the wording seems inappropriate after translation. GP41

On Sat, 29 Apr 2000, GP41 wrote: > That is alright. But why are you saying "This is errata", right after? > It is confusing when i am translating this and understand the rules. It is to make it clear that this is errata. In some cases, a ruling or a clarification will be issued where the situation is ambiguous. That is not the case here. Damage can be prevented, but how, under normal circumstances? So this isn't a ruling or a card interpretation - it's making it extra, extra explicit that it's errata. > > For me, it seems that the vampire burns 3 bloods to prevent the > dammage. And right after that, you can't, cause this is errata. Why does telling you that something is errata mean you can't do it? All it does is tell you that it is errata. [ quoted text not captured ]

GP41 wrote: > > Rutor's Hand has errata explaining how the damage can be prevented: > > > > Rutor's Hand [DS] - Action (tha) (1) > > * A vampire cannot have more than one Rutor's Hand. [RTR 23-JUN-1998] > > * To prevent the damage from Rutor's Hand (superior version), you must > > burn three blood (in addition to the cost of the action). This is > > errata. (No other methods of preventing the damage can be used.) > > [RTR 23-JUN-1998] > > > > That is alright. But why are you saying "This is errata", right after? > It is confusing when i am translating this and understand the rules. > > For me, it seems that the vampire burns 3 bloods to prevent the > dammage. And right after that, you can't, cause this is errata. > > Sorry if i don't understand this clearly, but sometimes it ain't that > easy to translate game mechanics if the wording seems inappropriate > after translation. Mistranslation, it sounds like: "Errata" is the term applied to changes to the card text (or rule text) to mean something that it didn't mean before. The "This is errata" above means that "this is a change to card text". [ quoted text not captured ]

In article <390D6DF5...@white-wolf.com>, [ quoted text not captured ] Again, do we have to keep this change? I think that the blood Tears of Keprhan makes it (the change on Rutor's Hand) obsolete and unnecessary. Just my thought. Regards Aemilianus, Prince of Rome. > > -- > LSJ (vte...@white-wolf.com) V:TES Net.Rep for White Wolf, Inc. > Links to revised rulebook, rulings, errata, and tournament rules: > http://www.geocities.com/vtesrep > [ quoted text not captured ]

tetragr...@my-deja.com wrote: > Again, do we have to keep this change? > I think that the blood Tears of Keprhan makes it (the change on Rutor's > Hand) obsolete and unnecessary. > Just my thought. Blood Tears is not the solution - it is an oversight. It merely forgot to limit its damage prevention ability to combat. It should have errata, except for the fact that the omission doesn't have any actual effect on game play (thanks to the errata fixing the problem of "how do I prevent non-combat damage?" on Rutor's Hand). [ quoted text not captured ]

On Mon, 01 May 2000 15:12:18 GMT, tetragr...@my-deja.com wrote: >Again, do we have to keep this change? >I think that the blood Tears of Keprhan makes it (the change on Rutor's >Hand) obsolete and unnecessary. Unfortunately, Blood Tears of Kephran is a card found in a low-availability set (Ancient Hearts). Blood Tears is equipment, meaning that a SEPARATE action must be taken to equip Blood Tears before being able to equip Rutor's Hand. That's two +1 stealth actions being taken by a clan that does not have easy access to any sort of stealth, BEFORE ever getting a useful card. This is too slow. The Tremere have enough problems as it is, and Rutor's Hand helps to fix one of those problems admirably. Four blood for a vampire with a built-in Freak Drive every turn is quite appropriate - or you can play it at inferior, and have someone else handy to fish the vampire back out of torpor. (Another action, but this way Blythe can get a Hand.) The errata was issued -after- Blood Tears of Kephran was printed, so the errata takes Blood Tears' existence into account. -- Derek Deafness never kept composers from hearing the music. It only stopped them hearing the distractions.

On Mon, 1 May 2000 tetragr...@my-deja.com wrote: > Again, do we have to keep this change? > I think that the blood Tears of Keprhan makes it (the change on Rutor's > Hand) obsolete and unnecessary. I note again that the errata was issued after the release of Blood Tears Also, it is clear that the intent was to allow some form of way of avoiding torpor. [ quoted text not captured ]