New cards

Check theese out and see what you think. I have added new card types and new rules to... "(Extra: *)" means "rule that is unsure". Please give me your thoughts about them. I tried to create cards that change the gameplay, cards that brings Vampire back from the Magic: TG trap. New cards: Rob the dead - Rare Combat action Only useable if your minion destroys another minion (Extra:or puts a vampire into torpor.) You may transfer as many equipment cards as you like to your vampire. (Extra:If the Vampire went to torpor, put this card on the minion using this card. The Vampire that went to torpor may attack your minon as a D action. If she/he destroys or sends the vampire with this card on him to torpor then she/he may take back the stealed equipment.) Survivial instincts - Common (Extra: Fortitude?) Combat card - 2 blood This card can not be prevented or canceled by any circumstances by an opponent card. During this combat round the vampire can play any combat cards he normally can, regardless of any card played by his/her opponent. Jyhad: The Eternal Struggle - Uncommon Master card - 4 pool Put this card in play. (Extra: Remove this card from play when used.) (Extra: This card cannot be canceled.) Discard this card at any time to shuffle your ashheap into your library. New card type: Methusalah Clan card - all rare Rule - To make use of this card the crypt may only contain vampires of that clan. (Extra: Theese card is putted directly into play when the game begins). All flaws is a Jyhad version of the Vampie:TM weakness... if you dont agree or have better ideas, correct me. Brujah: Merit: The round after another minion have casted a sucessful vote against you or your minions all your minions may freely attack him as a D action. (Anarch brujahs) Flaw: If one of your minion is blocked you may not use use strike:Dodge (Frenzy) Gangrel: Merit: You are not affected by any votes. Flaw: You may not call any votes (Extra: your votes is halved, round up) Malkavian: Merit: When entering a combat you bring the Malkavian vampirecards closest to this vampire (On the left and right side) into the combat as retainers. On strike resolution the retainers inflict an amount of damage equal to their hand-damage to the opposing minion. If they have a weapon and uses it, they inflict damage equal to that weapons damage. Each round the opposing minion may choose one of the retainers to became the new opponent instead. Flaw: When a vote is called, decide randomly if all your Malkavians vote for or against the vote. (Extra: The vote may not affect you) Nosferatu: Merit: Two Nosferatus can by taking a D action at +1 stealth look at another Methusalahs hand for one round. Flaw: Nosferatus without superior obfuscate may not recruite Allies or Retainers. Toreador: Merit: The Toreador may take a D action against a vampire of the opposite sex to put a love counter on that vampire. When the Toreador enter combat with that vampire burn the love counter and end combat, this is not optional. (Extra: Nosferatu and Nosferatu Antitribu are unnafected by this action) Flaw: The Toreador may not block allies. Or: The Toreador may not block a vampire she have putted a love counter on. Tremere: Merit: All Tremere gains +1 stealth on Actions that aint D actions. Flaw: All vampires around the table may block an Action done by your vampires that is not a D action. Ventrue: Merits: All Ventrue gains one vote on votes that are called against them. Or: Put three bastard swords in a separate deck, you may draw from this deck instead of your real deck anytime that you must draw a new card. (Extra: Ventrue plays no blood for equipping with Bastards Swords) Flaws: Ventrue may only hunt each other turn. Or: All of your vampires will vote for a blood hunt called on one of your minions. Assamite: Merits: All Assamites gains one manouver each combat. Or: Put five contracts in a extra library. You may draw one contract and play it emieditly each other turn. Flaws: None Giovanni Merits: All giovanni pays half the pool for equipment (round down). Flaws: Each other turn a giovanni hunts , take blood from the blood pool instead of the blood bank. Setites: Merits: Each time your setites bleeds your prey for more than 2, gain onee pool. Flaw: The Setites may never gain any adittional votes from cards except prescence. Ravnos: Merits: When your Ravnos kills another vampire, transfer all the equipment on the destroyed vampire to your Ravnos. Flaw: Whenever a equipment is transfered to one of your Ravnos from another methusalahs vampires, that methuslas vampires may freely attack that Ravnos until the Equipment is transfered back to the original owner. The Ravnos may transfer the equipment back as a D action. Tzimisce: Merits: If you destroy another vampire you may put that vampire on you as a retainer. That vampire reicive a blood from the blood bank each untaphase. Or: If you destroy another vampire you may emiedetly bring up an Tzimisce Ally or Tzimisce Retainer in play from your library at no cost. Dont put the destroyed vampire in the ash-heap, put it under that retainer or Ally. Flaw: Each turn one of your vampire reicives a soilloss counter. When the soilloss counters exeeds the vampires current blood the vampire gains -1 hand damage. All soilcounters may be burned with a action by that vampire, (Extra: remove that vampire from play for one round) Lasombra: Merit: (Extra: Lasombra are not affected by Incriminating Videotape.) Lasombra may repeat a vote action takne by another methusalah as a action at +1 stealth. Or: Votes called by Lasombra may not be blocked by Camarilla vampires Flaw: All allies gains +1 intercept against Lasombra hunting. Or: Lasombra can only hunt when their stealth is at +2 (regardless of other vampires attempting to block). Panders: All Panders loose their special text's Or: All Panders gains inferior in one discipline choosen in the start of the game. Weakness: Panders may not reicive a Sabbat title Or: Panders may not reicive more than one Sabbat title.

staffan.bengtsson wrote: > > Check theese out and see what you think. I have added new card types and > new rules to... > "(Extra: *)" means "rule that is unsure". Please give me your thoughts about > them. > I tried to create cards that change the gameplay, cards that brings Vampire > back from the Magic: TG trap. Mostly just cleaning up wording, but some comments, too... > New cards: > > Rob the dead - Rare > Combat action > Only useable if your minion destroys another minion > (Extra:or puts a vampire into torpor.) > You may transfer as many equipment cards as you like to your vampire. I think better wording would be (a la Amaranth, etc.): Not usable by a vampire going to torpor. Usable when this minion sends to torpor or burns the opposing minion. You may transfer any equipment from the opposing minion to this minion. > (Extra:If the Vampire went to torpor, put this card on the minion using this card. > The Vampire that went to torpor may attack your minon as a D action. > If she/he destroys or sends the vampire with this card on him to torpor then > she/he may take back the stealed equipment.) I'd not put in this part; it's a little too wordy and is a very minor effect. > Survivial instincts - Common (Extra: Fortitude?) > Combat card - 2 blood > This card can not be prevented or canceled by any circumstances by an opponent > card. > During this combat round the vampire can play any combat cards he normally can, > regardless of any card played by his/her opponent. Why not just fix Thoughts Betrayed, instead of trumping a trump? > Jyhad: The Eternal Struggle - Uncommon > Master card - 4 pool > Put this card in play. > (Extra: Remove this card from play when used.) > (Extra: This card cannot be canceled.) > Discard this card at any time to shuffle your ashheap into your library. This sounds a little _too_ Mag-ick-y to me... Feldon's Cane, anyone? How about 1 pool, and you yank a card from your ash heap to your hand? The pool cost (hopefully) keeps it from being abused, and doesn't (badly) break the non-Giovanni dynamic of once played, gone. > New card type: > Methusalah Clan card - all rare > Rule - To make use of this card the crypt may only contain vampires of that clan. > (Extra: Theese card is putted directly into play when the game begins). > All flaws is a Jyhad version of the Vampie:TM weakness... if you dont agree > or have better ideas, correct me. Better "rule" text would be: Put this card in play. If you ever control a minion which is not of clan X, burn this card. Also, pool cost? I'd say about 2. Uniqueness? Definitely. > Brujah: > Merit: The round after another minion have casted a sucessful vote against you > or your minions all your minions may freely attack him as a D action. > (Anarch brujahs) If, since your last turn, a minion controlled by your predator or prey has called a successful vote which caused you to lose pool, any minion you control may take a (D) action to attack that minion. > Flaw: If one of your minion is blocked you may not use use strike:Dodge > (Frenzy) Your minions may not Dodge as a strike. (More balancing, IMHO) > Gangrel: > Merit: You are not affected by any votes. If a political action would cause you to lose pool, you may burn this card to make the referendum automatically fail. > Flaw: You may not call any votes (Extra: your votes is halved, round up) Your minions may not vote. > Malkavian: > Merit: When entering a combat you bring the Malkavian vampirecards closest to > this vampire (On the left and right side) into the combat as retainers. On > strike resolution the retainers inflict an amount of damage equal to their > hand-damage to the opposing minion. If they have a weapon and uses it, they > inflict damage equal to that weapons damage. Each round the opposing minion may > choose one of the retainers to became the new opponent instead. This is _way_ too confusing. How about: When one of your minions is in combat, you may burn this card to end combat. Choose a minion controlled by a Methuselah other than the one controlling the opposing minion. Combat begins between the minion chosen and the opposing minion. If you choose a minion you contorl in this way, gain 1 pool. > Flaw: When a vote is called, decide randomly if all your Malkavians vote for or > against the vote. (Extra: The vote may not affect you) Whenever a minion you control casts votes, flip a coin; heads: the votes are cast in favor, tails: the votes are cast against. > Nosferatu: > Merit: Two Nosferatus can by taking a D action at +1 stealth look at another > Methusalahs hand for one round. Too weak. How 'bout: Tap this card to give a Nosferatu you control +1 intercept. If the block is successful, this vampire has an optional maneuver in the first round of combat. > Flaw: Nosferatus without superior obfuscate may not recruite Allies or Retainers. Fine. > Toreador: > Merit: The Toreador may take a D action against a vampire of the opposite sex > to put a love counter on that vampire. When the Toreador enter combat with > that vampire burn the love counter and end combat, this is not optional. > (Extra: Nosferatu and Nosferatu Antitribu are unnafected by this action) Well, since "gender" would have to depend (at least in a few cases) on the interpretation of card art, let's fix this one. How about Makarios' ability? > Flaw: The Toreador may not block allies. > Or: The Toreador may not block a vampire she have putted a love counter on. > > Tremere: > Merit: All Tremere gains +1 stealth on Actions that aint D actions. Too powerful. How about: Tap this card to give a Tremere +1 stealth on the current non-directed action. > Flaw: All vampires around the table may block an Action done by your vampires > that is not a D action. If this card is tapped, all Tremere you control have -1 stealth. > Ventrue: > Merits: All Ventrue gains one vote on votes that are called against them. > Or: Put three bastard swords in a separate deck, you may draw from this deck > instead of your real deck anytime that you must draw a new card. > (Extra: Ventrue plays no blood for equipping with Bastards Swords) I'm real iffy on this whole seperate deck thingy. How about: If a vote would cause you to lose pool, tap this card. All Ventrue you control have +1 vote, and must all vote against. > Flaws: Ventrue may only hunt each other turn. > Or: All of your vampires will vote for a blood hunt called on one of your > minions. If a Ventrue you control hunted last turn, it may not do so this turn. If such a minion must hunt, burn it. > Assamite: > Merits: All Assamites gains one manouver each combat. Tap this card to give an Assamite you control an optional maneuver. > Or: Put five contracts in a extra library. You may draw one contract and > play it emieditly each other turn. > Flaws: None Aww... come on. How 'bout: At the end of the first round of a combat involving one of your Assamites, inflict one point of unpreventable damage on that minion. > Giovanni > Merits: All giovanni pays half the pool for equipment (round down). Tap this card to reduce the cost of a piece of equipment by one-half (round down). > Flaws: Each other turn a giovanni hunts , take blood from the blood pool > instead of the blood bank. If this card is tapped while one of you minions hunts, lose 1 pool. > Setites: > Merits: Each time your setites bleeds your prey for more than 2, gain onee pool. At the end of any turn during which you successfully bled your prey, gain one pool. > Flaw: The Setites may never gain any adittional votes from cards except > prescence. Your minions may not call political actions, nor may they cast votes. > Ravnos: > Merits: When your Ravnos kills another vampire, transfer all the equipment on > the destroyed vampire to your Ravnos. During combat, any Ravnos you control may steal equipment as a strike. > Flaw: Whenever a equipment is transfered to one of your Ravnos from another > methusalahs vampires, that methuslas vampires may freely attack that Ravnos > until the Equipment is transfered back to the original owner. > The Ravnos may transfer the equipment back as a D action. If any of your minions is equipped with a card owned by another Methuselah, minions controlled by that Methuselah may take a (D) action to steal that piece of equipment. > Tzimisce: > Merits: If you destroy another vampire you may put that vampire on you as a > retainer. That vampire reicive a blood from the blood bank each untaphase. If a Tzimisce you control burns a vampire, put enough blood on the Tzimisce to bring it up to full capacity. > Or: If you destroy another vampire you may emiedetly bring up an Tzimisce Ally or > Tzimisce Retainer in play from your library at no cost. Dont put the destroyed > vampire in the ash-heap, put it under that retainer or Ally. > Flaw: Each turn one of your vampire reicives a soilloss counter. When > the soilloss counters exeeds the vampires current blood the vampire gains > -1 hand damage. All soilcounters may be burned with a action by that vampire, > (Extra: remove that vampire from play for one round) During each of your untap phases, put a soilloss [sic?] counter on this card. Any Tzimisce you control which has fewer blood counters than this card has counters gets -1 hand damage. > Lasombra: > Merit: (Extra: Lasombra are not affected by Incriminating Videotape.) > Lasombra may repeat a vote action takne by another methusalah as a action > at +1 stealth. > Or: Votes called by Lasombra may not be blocked by Camarilla vampires This last is probably better. > Flaw: All allies gains +1 intercept against Lasombra hunting. > Or: Lasombra can only hunt when their stealth is at +2 (regardless of > other vampires attempting to block). Better is Lasombra get -2 stealth when hunting. > Panders: All Panders loose their special text's > Or: All Panders gains inferior in one discipline choosen in the start of the > game. During your untap, choose a discipline. Each Pander you control gains that discipline at inferior. > Weakness: Panders may not reicive a Sabbat title > Or: Panders may not reicive more than one Sabbat title. If a Pander you control calls a successful political action, burn that Pander. --------------------- James -- James Hamblin je...@cornell.edu --------------------------------------------------- "Well, Mulder didn't say that it _was_ Alex Trebek, just someone who looked extremely like him." -- Dana Scully, X-Files: "Jose Chung's _From Outer Space_"

In article <6073.6990...@mailbox.swipnet.se>, staffan.bengtsson <staffan....@mailbox.swipnet.se> wrote: > >Jyhad: The Eternal Struggle - Uncommon >Master card - 4 pool >Put this card in play. >(Extra: Remove this card from play when used.) >(Extra: This card cannot be canceled.) >Discard this card at any time to shuffle your ashheap into your library. This one seems a little "Magicky" and it should probably read "Burn this card as a Master Phase action to shuffle all library cards in your ash heap into your library. Shuffle your library afterward. Remove this card from the game when burned. You may only play one Jyhad: The Eternal Struggle per game." Would go nice with my Necromany deck for when things just aren't working out. And you should probably remove the "The card cannot be cancelled" clause... Just my two cents... As a brood of supplements and specials may lurch from the inky loins of a Sunday newspaper, so are there many answers to every question... Hanuman, the Monkey God Kevin Petker petk...@muss.cis.mcmaster.ca -------------------------------------------------------------------------

James Hamblin wrote: > > staffan.bengtsson wrote: > > > > > > Survivial instincts - Common (Extra: Fortitude?) > > Combat card - 2 blood > > This card can not be prevented or canceled by any circumstances by an opponent > > card. > > During this combat round the vampire can play any combat cards he normally can, > > regardless of any card played by his/her opponent. > > Why not just fix Thoughts Betrayed, instead of trumping a trump? I agree. TB is an abomination. I have now removed it from every deck that I play. I'm Thought's Betrayed free!!! In our play group, we are going to change it to only last one round. Then if a press is used, they would have to play another TB... > > > Jyhad: The Eternal Struggle - Uncommon > > Master card - 4 pool > > Put this card in play. > > (Extra: Remove this card from play when used.) > > (Extra: This card cannot be canceled.) > > Discard this card at any time to shuffle your ashheap into your library. > > This sounds a little _too_ Mag-ick-y to me... Feldon's Cane, anyone? > How about 1 pool, and you yank a card from your ash heap to your hand? > The pool cost (hopefully) keeps it from being abused, and doesn't > (badly) break the non-Giovanni dynamic of once played, gone. Yes. The Giovanni don't have alot of advantages... Don't tread on their territory. If this was a Rare necromancy card maybe... I've got a few card ideas that have been floating around in my head for awhile, and may as well get em out now... Stalking the Prey Quietis-cost 1 blood inferior: Enter combat with any minion. This is a +1 Stealth (D) action. Superior: Enter combat with any minion. This is (D) action is unblockable. Night Vision Auspex-costs 1 blood inferior: +1 intercept superior: As above, and if combat occurs this reaction minions strike cannot be dodged. Iron Will Master-costs 2 pool Dominate cards that target a vampire, do not affect this vampire. This would include: Thoughts Betrayed Obedience Pulling Strings Seduction etc... That's just a few ideas I had. Let me know what you think... Chris rho...@medicine.wustl.edu

>Mostly just cleaning up wording, but some comments, too... Thank you for your time. >> Rob the dead - Rare >> Combat action >Not usable by a vampire going to torpor. Usable when this minion sends >to torpor or burns the opposing minion. You may transfer any equipment >from the opposing minion to this minion. Agree on changing the wording... It sounds fair doesnt it? >> Survivial instincts - Common (Extra: Fortitude?) >> Combat card - 2 blood >> This card can not be prevented or canceled by any circumstances by an >> opponent card. During this combat round the vampire can play any combat >> cards he normally can, regardless of any card played by his/her opponent. >Why not just fix Thoughts Betrayed, instead of trumping a trump? It works against Thoughts Betrayed, Fast Reaction, Hidden Lurker and Immortal Grapple. I felt that a such card was needed, and its useful against many other decks. A broken anti-card would be: Iron Will: Master Put this card in a minion, from now on this minion will be unnaffected by effects dealt by Dominate, Prescence and Serpentis. >> Jyhad: The Eternal Struggle - Uncommon >> Master card - 4 pool >> Put this card in play. >> (Extra: Remove this card from play when used.) >> (Extra: This card cannot be canceled.) >> Discard this card at any time to shuffle your ashheap into your library. >This sounds a little _too_ Mag-ick-y to me... Feldon's Cane, anyone? It sure is, but I have seen many other cardgames with this type of card. >How about 1 pool, and you yank a card from your ash heap to your hand? >The pool cost (hopefully) keeps it from being abused, and doesn't >(badly) break the non-Giovanni dynamic of once played, gone. The trouble I have is that all my decks (Especially my Brujah Combat Decks) is 100 cards big, and other decks in my town are up in 200 cards... My Brujah deck can beat some guys in torpor, and then its gone. My Malkavian deck do much more damage to its prey with a 100card deck, and have much bigger chance to kill all preys around the table before the last card in the library are flipped. >> New card type: >> Methusalah Clan card - all rare - All unique, Costs 2 pool >Put this card in play. If you ever control >a minion which is not of clan X, burn this card. (Extra: is putted out before the game begins) Do you feel its correct anyway? To use this type of card? I got the idea from Doomtrooper where you get merits if you use just one Company to base your deck on, it fixed up some "feeling" in the game. Before everybbody just put the biggest-best characters into play. I also checked the Silver Cards in Rage. >> Brujah: >> Merit: >If, since your last turn, a minion controlled by your predator or prey >has called a successful vote which caused you to lose pool, any minion >you control may take a (D) action to attack that minion. More correct, yes. >> Flaw: If one of your minion is blocked you may not use use strike:Dodge >> (Frenzy) >Your minions may not Dodge as a strike. (More balancing, IMHO) Hmm, i wantd to bring the Brujah-bad-temper into a rule. They do avoid strikes when they aint in frenzy... What do you think? >> Gangrel: >If a political action would cause you to lose pool, you may burn this >card to make the referendum automatically fail. If a political action would affect you, you may pay 1 pool to became unnafected of that vote. >> Flaw: You may not call any votes (Extra: your votes is halved, round up) >Your minions may not vote. The trouble was that there are some expensive Princes within gangrel. >> Malkavian: >> Merit: When entering a combat you bring the Malkavian vampirecards closest >> to this vampire (On the left and right side) into the combat as retainers. >> On strike resolution the retainers inflict an amount of damage equal to >> their hand-damage to the opposing minion. If they have a weapon and uses >> it, they inflict damage equal to that weapons damage. Each round the >> opposing minion may choose one of the retainers to became the new opponent >> instead. >This is _way_ too confusing. How about: >When one of your minions is in combat, you may burn this card to end >combat. Choose a minion controlled by a Methuselah other than the one >controlling the opposing minion. Combat begins between the minion >chosen and the opposing minion. If you choose a minion you contorl in >this way, gain 1 pool. I dont think theese cards should be burned... Their purpose is to make it clear that you are playing a Clan deck, and all members of that clan have some merits, and some flaws. And Malkavians keep together... How about this then: Only useable when the Malkavian enter combat: Choose a Malkavian that is not involved in this combat, that Malkavian may during the strike phase burn a blood and choose a strike against the opposing minion. Both Malkavians strikes are considered as one, and the opposing minion may choose to strike against the new Malkavian instead. >> Flaw: When a vote is called, decide randomly if all your Malkavians vote >> for or against the vote. (Extra: The vote may not affect you) >Whenever a minion you control casts votes, flip a coin; heads: the votes >are cast in favor, tails: the votes are cast against. Do you think its a fair rule? It feels Malkavian like to me anyway =) >> Nosferatu: >Tap this card to give a Nosferatu you control +1 intercept. If the >block is successful, this vampire has an optional maneuver in the first >round of combat. Alright! Okay! Very very nice. >> Flaw: Nosferatus without superior obfuscate may not recruite Allies or >> Retainers. >Fine. >> Toreador: >> Merit: The Toreador may take a D action against a vampire of the opposite >> sex to put a love counter on that vampire. When the Toreador enter combat >> with that vampire burn the love counter and end combat, this is not >> optional. >> (Extra: Nosferatu and Nosferatu Antitribu are unnafected by this action) >Well, since "gender" would have to depend (at least in a few cases) on >the interpretation of card art, let's fix this one. How about Makarios' >ability? It must be less useful, or else Makarios ability will became meningless. As a D action a Toreador may take an action to put a seduction counter on a minion in play. When the Toreador make an action that is blocked by the seduced vampire, burn the seduction counter to end combat. >> Flaw: The Toreador may not block allies. >> Or: The Toreador may not block a vampire she have putted a love counter on. >> Tremere: >How about: Tap this card to give a Tremere +1 stealth on the current >non-directed action. AH, Alright! >> Flaw: >If this card is tapped, all Tremere you control have -1 stealth. It feels like the suspicius thoughts about Tremere yes... I like it. >> Ventrue: >How about: If a vote would cause you to lose pool, tap this card. All >Ventrue you control have +1 vote, and must all vote against. I dont like to give Ventrue more votes, but ok, that sounds fair. >> Flaws: Ventrue may only hunt each other turn. >If a Ventrue you control hunted last turn, it may not do so this turn. >If such a minion must hunt, burn it. If such a minion must hunt, send him to torpor. >> Assamite: >> Merits: All Assamites gains one manouver each combat. >Tap this card to give an Assamite you control an optional maneuver. More fair yes. >> Or: Put five contracts in a extra library. You may draw one contract and >> play it emieditly each other turn. >> Flaws: >At the end of the first round of a combat involving one of your >Assamites, inflict one point of unpreventable damage on that minion. If both combatants are ready at the end of the first round of a combat involving one of your Assamites, inflict one point of unpreventable damage on that minion. None of your Assamites may commit diablerie. >> Giovanni >> Merits: >Tap this card to reduce the cost of a piece of equipment by one-half >(round down). More fair, yes. >> Flaws: Each other turn a giovanni hunts , take blood from the blood pool >> instead of the blood bank. >If this card is tapped while one of you minions hunts, lose 1 pool. No, the hunting is first in the turn: If this card is tapped while one of you minions hunts, lose 1 pool. Dont untap this card as normal, a Giovanni must take an action to untap this card. >> Setites: >> Merits: Each time your setites bleeds your prey for more than 2, gain onee >> pool. >At the end of any turn during which you successfully bled your prey, >gain one pool. >> Flaw: The Setites may never gain any adittional votes from cards except >> prescence. >Your minions may not call political actions, nor may they cast votes. They have votes, and they are manipulative bastards... And I just remembered their real flaw... : When a Setite takes aggrevated damage, double that damage or: When a Setite takes aggrevated damage, increase that damage with +1. >> Ravnos: >> Merits: When your Ravnos kills another vampire, transfer all the equipment >> on the destroyed vampire to your Ravnos. >During combat, any Ravnos you control may steal equipment as a strike. It would make Blessing of Durga Syn worthless. Merit: Ravnos are unnafected by votes, and may not cast votes. >> Flaw: >If any of your minions is equipped with a card owned by another >Methuselah, minions controlled by that Methuselah may take a (D) action >to steal that piece of equipment. Sounds ok. >> Tzimisce: >> Merits: If you destroy another vampire you may put that vampire on you as a >> retainer. That vampire reicive a blood from the blood bank each untaphase. >If a Tzimisce you control burns a vampire, put enough blood on the >Tzimisce to bring it up to full capacity. Hmm, sounds fair. >During each of your untap phases, put a soilloss [sic?] counter on this >card. Any Tzimisce you control which has fewer blood counters than this >card has counters gets -1 hand damage. Any tzimisce may take an action to remove 2-3 counters on this card. Hmm, put 3 soilcounters on this card, any minion may take a D action to remove a soilcounter on this card. When the soilcounters are reduced to zero all your Tzimisce vampires looses -1 hand damage. Any Tzimisce vampire may use a action would will be at +2 stealth to put three soil counters on this card, next round dont untap this vampire as normal. >> Lasombra: >> Merit: >> Or: Votes called by Lasombra may not be blocked by Camarilla vampires >This last is probably better. Ok >> Flaw: All allies gains +1 intercept against Lasombra hunting. >> Or: Lasombra can only hunt when their stealth is at +2 (regardless of >> other vampires attempting to block). >Better is Lasombra get -2 stealth when hunting. Then they are nearly unable to hunt. When a Lasombra is hunting tap this card, if this card is tapped all Lasombra get -1 stealth when hunting. >> Panders: All Panders loose their special text's >> Or: All Panders gains inferior in one discipline choosen in the start of >> the game. >During your untap, choose a discipline. Each Pander you control gains >that discipline at inferior. Too good, and to wild. I belive that the first text here is the best. The Panders maybee can have flaws, but not all of them. >> Weakness: Panders may not reicive a Sabbat title >> Or: Panders may not reicive more than one Sabbat title. >If a Pander you control calls a successful political action, burn that >Pander. Hmm, If a Pander you control calls a sucessful political action, send that Pander to torpor... Ehrm, why would Pander ever cast votes? >James Thank you for your time.

Thus saith Chris Rhodes the Unworthy, in the Year of Our Lord Fri, 21 Feb 1997 12:05:17 -0600 : > Iron Will > Master-costs 2 pool > > Dominate cards that target a vampire, do not affect this vampire. > This would include: > Thoughts Betrayed > Obedience > Pulling Strings > Seduction > etc... Hrm... Actually, this is very similar to the dementation action card Blessings of Chaos at superior. I do like it; but BoC seems a bit more useful, and it would steal a Malk-Anti trick, and they have so few compared to regular Malks and others with dominate. Especially since everyone can use the master; it would make dementation less unique, and it is already almost a bad dominate clone. Hardrock -- Hardrock Llewynyth a.g.AB founding member (DNRC) hard...@speakeasy.org http://www.speakeasy.org/~hardrock In his errors a man is true to type. Observe his errors and you will know the man. --Kung Chi'u (Confucious)

Subject: Re: New cards Newsgroups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad References: <6073.6990...@mailbox.swipnet.se> <330D20...@cornell.edu> <11544.699...@mailbox.swipnet.se> Organization: BabelFish Communications Distribution: CDA-protest: fuck shit piss cunt cocksucker motherfucker tits ass abortion Copyright: (C) date of message by D.Harland Subject: Re: New cards Newsgroups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad References: <6073.6990...@mailbox.swipnet.se> <330D20...@cornell.edu> <11544.699...@mailbox.swipnet.se> Organization: BabelFish Communications Distribution: CDA-protest: fuck shit piss cunt cocksucker motherfucker tits ass abortion Copyright: (C) date of message by D.Harland Thus saith staffan.bengtsson the Unworthy, in the Year of Our Lord 22 Feb 97 14:28:53 -500 : > A broken anti-card would be: > Iron Will: > Master > Put this card in a minion, from now on this minion will be unnaffected by > effects dealt by Dominate, Prescence and Serpentis. Again, very similar to superior Blessing of Chaos, which i don't consider broken because it is a discipline card, and a pretty weak discipline at that. > >This sounds a little _too_ Mag-ick-y to me... Feldon's Cane, anyone? > > It sure is, but I have seen many other cardgames with this type of card. > >How about 1 pool, and you yank a card from your ash heap to your hand? > >The pool cost (hopefully) keeps it from being abused, and doesn't > >(badly) break the non-Giovanni dynamic of once played, gone. It still steals the Giovanni thunder. I don't like cards that take clan or discipline unique actions and make them universal. Some actions/ reactions/modifiers can be translated with minor changes to different disciplines, but making them universal...? > The trouble I have is that all my decks (Especially my Brujah Combat Decks) is > 100 cards big, and other decks in my town are up in 200 cards... > My Brujah deck can beat some guys in torpor, and then its gone. > > My Malkavian deck do much more damage to its prey with a 100card deck, and have > much bigger chance to kill all preys around the table before the last card in > the library are flipped. Around where i play, anything over 90 cards is considered way too big, and over 80 cards is rare for anything other than hardcore vote or "going the distance" decks (based on fortitude, damage prevention, and ocassionally adding in Undead Persistence, need to burn lots of Skin of Rock/Indomiti- bility). > >> New card type: > >> Methusalah Clan card - all rare > - All unique, Costs 2 pool > >Put this card in play. If you ever control > >a minion which is not of clan X, burn this card. > (Extra: is putted out before the game begins) No, it can be put out any time. "Can only be played if all vampires you control are of the same clan. If you gain control of a vampire from a different clan, burn this card during your next untap phase. Maybe next influence allowing time for Clan Impersonation? > Do you feel its correct anyway? To use this type of card? I got the idea from > Doomtrooper where you get merits if you use just one Company to base your deck > on, it fixed up some "feeling" in the game. Before everybbody just put the > biggest-best characters into play. > I also checked the Silver Cards in Rage. I think it is a good idea. Gets back to clan decks rather than theme decks. I play both, and think that this sounds like it would work very well. It also rules out the use of caitiff/pander quick-out vampires in otherwise clan decks. > >> Brujah: > >> Merit: > >If, since your last turn, a minion controlled by your predator or prey > >has called a successful vote which caused you to lose pool, any minion > >you control may take a (D) action to attack that minion. > [flaw] > >Your minions may not Dodge as a strike. (More balancing, IMHO) > > Hmm, i wantd to bring the Brujah-bad-temper into a rule. They do avoid strikes > when they aint in frenzy... What do you think? I think not being allowed to dodge at all when the card is in play is a good flaw. > >> Gangrel: > >If a political action would cause you to lose pool, you may burn this > >card to make the referendum automatically fail. > > If a political action would affect you, you may pay 1 pool to became unnafected > of that vote. This sounds good. > >> Flaw: You may not call any votes (Extra: your votes is halved, round up) > >Your minions may not vote. > The trouble was that there are some expensive Princes within gangrel. True, but they are very expensive and not used much as voters IME. You ge to cancel the effects of a vote without haveing to control those expensive princes. > >> Malkavian: When in combat, the opposing minion does not get it's initial strike for that combat. Additional strikes can be used. Or When in combat, a malkavian you control gets +1(+2?)R damage. Or When entering combat, opposing minion enters combat with a minion controlled by another methuselah instead. That minion gets +1(+2?) hand damage. Or When entering combat, malkavian can use any combat cards regardless of restrictions imposed by other cards. eg, no immortal grapple, no TB, etc. *my personal choice* Or When in combat, opposing minion cannot increase hand damage > >Whenever a minion you control casts votes, flip a coin; heads: the votes > >are cast in favor, tails: the votes are cast against. > > Do you think its a fair rule? It feels Malkavian like to me anyway =) Works for me :) > >> Nosferatu: > >Tap this card to give a Nosferatu you control +1 intercept. If the > >block is successful, this vampire has an optional maneuver in the first > >round of combat. > > Alright! Okay! Very very nice. > > >> Flaw: Nosferatus without superior obfuscate may not recruite Allies or > >> Retainers. > > >Fine. Agree with this one completly. > >> Toreador: > As a D action a Toreador may take an action to put a seduction counter > on a minion in play. When the Toreador make an action that is blocked by > the seduced vampire, burn the seduction counter to end combat. A Toreador may take a (d) action to put an entrancement counter on a minion. Entranced vampires pay one blood to attempt to block any toreador you control. Burn the counter on an ally to tap it. Minions can only have one entrancement counter, which can be burned as a -1 stealth action. > >> Flaw: The Toreador may not block allies. A toreador gets -1 intercept against an entranced vampire, and may not block entranced allies. > >> Tremere: > >How about: Tap this card to give a Tremere +1 stealth on the current > >non-directed action. > > AH, Alright! > > >> Flaw: > >If this card is tapped, all Tremere you control have -1 stealth. > > It feels like the suspicius thoughts about Tremere yes... > I like it. Works for me. > >> Ventrue: > >How about: If a vote would cause you to lose pool, tap this card. All > >Ventrue you control have +1 vote, and must all vote against. > > I dont like to give Ventrue more votes, but ok, that sounds fair. No, ventrue have enough votes already. Tap to give a ventrue you control +1 stealth on political action. Or maybe all ventrue you control. > >If a Ventrue you control hunted last turn, it may not do so this turn. > >If such a minion must hunt, burn it. > If such a minion must hunt, send him to torpor. Torpor sounds better. > >> Assamite: > >> Merits: All Assamites gains one manouver each combat. > >Tap this card to give an Assamite you control an optional maneuver. > > More fair yes. > > If both combatants are ready at the end of the first round of a combat > involving one of your Assamites, > inflict one point of unpreventable damage on that minion. Sounds good. > None of your Assamites may commit diablerie. Assamites cannot diablerize anyway. If both combatants are still ready after combat ends, inflict one point of unpreventable damage on the assamite involved. Or, how about about this. Tap this card to allow an assamite you control to diablerize. Assamites cannot vote if a blood hunt is called. > >> Giovanni > >> Merits: > >Tap this card to reduce the cost of a piece of equipment by one-half > >(round down). > > More fair, yes. > > >If this card is tapped while one of you minions hunts, lose 1 pool. > > No, the hunting is first in the turn: > Dont untap this card as normal, a Giovanni must take an action to untap this > card. I like that, and would add: If this card is tapped at the beginning or your turn, lose 1 pool. > >> Setites: > >At the end of any turn during which you successfully bled your prey, > >gain one pool. Yes, this sounds good. Or, after sucessfully bleeding your prey, tap to gain half the pool bled (round up). > or: When a Setite takes aggrevated damage, increase that damage with +1. Yes. > >> Ravnos: > Merit: Ravnos are unnafected by votes, and may not cast votes. > >> Flaw: > >If any of your minions is equipped with a card owned by another > >Methuselah, minions controlled by that Methuselah may take a (D) action > >to steal that piece of equipment. > > Sounds ok. I like it. > >> Tzimisce: > >If a Tzimisce you control burns a vampire, put enough blood on the > >Tzimisce to bring it up to full capacity. > > Hmm, sounds fair. Agreed. During your untap phase, place a soul-loss counter on this card. If the number of counters on this card exceeds the amount of blood on a vampire, the vampire gets -x hand damage, where x is the difference. Any Tzimisce you control can take a -1 steath action to remove a counter from this card. > >> Lasombra: > >> Merit: > >> Or: Votes called by Lasombra may not be blocked by Camarilla vampires I like it. > When a Lasombra is hunting tap this card, if this card is tapped all Lasombra > get -1 stealth when hunting. Or -1 stealth period. > >> Panders: All Panders loose their special text's When this card is played, choose a discipline. All pander you control now have basic of that discipline for the remainder of the game. If the pander already has basic, it now has superior. flaw: discipline cards cannot be played on pander you control. If a pander already has a discipline card played on it, burn the card. > Hmm, If a Pander you control calls a sucessful political action, send that > Pander to torpor... Not a bad idea. > Ehrm, why would Pander ever cast votes? Pander weenie vote deck, with crusades instead of praxis seizures. I've seen it done with caitiff, it is evil. BTW, What about antitribu and caitiff? Should the cards work for antitrib as well as long as they are not played in the same deck? Hardrock -- Hardrock Llewynyth a.g.AB founding member (DNRC) hard...@speakeasy.org http://www.speakeasy.org/~hardrock No good deed goes unpunished. --Clare Boothe Luce -- Hardrock Llewynyth a.g.AB founding member (DNRC) hard...@speakeasy.org http://www.speakeasy.org/~hardrock [Hardrock] Kook Code: V.Fomin+ (Grubor+)*2 Kook Number: 3 Kook Code 2: (Boursy+5)*2 V.Fomin+ (Grubor+10)*2 Snowwolf+ Kook Number v.2: 32 -- Hardrock Llewynyth a.g.AB founding member (DNRC) hard...@speakeasy.org http://www.speakeasy.org/~hardrock "Darkness has covered my Light And has changed my Day into Night..." --Bob Marley and the Wailers "Concrete Jungle"

Mmm. I've thought of some of these myself. A 'Feldon's Cane' would certainly be nice.. Anyone who's continued playing when their library is gone will agree. -j

[ quoted text not captured ] I have, many times, and I disagree. There is a maximum card limit for a reason. A deck with very card-intensive combos pays the price of running out of cards fairly quickly. A combat deck would have nothing to lose by doubling every card in it, which it could do with a "Feldon's Cane"-like card. Very bad idea... [ quoted text not captured ]

On 22 Feb 1997, staffan.bengtsson wrote: [Staffan snipped the original posters. Sorry about lack of clarity] > >> Jyhad: The Eternal Struggle - Uncommon > >> Master card - 4 pool > >> Put this card in play. > >> (Extra: Remove this card from play when used.) > >> (Extra: This card cannot be canceled.) > >> Discard this card at any time to shuffle your ashheap into your library. > >This sounds a little _too_ Mag-ick-y to me... Feldon's Cane, anyone? > It sure is, but I have seen many other cardgames with this type of card. And many other cardgames are substandard. And many other cardgames use Courier for their font. This point is unimportant. For a card [game] to be good, it must be jodged on its own merit from within its own paradigm. Breaking from this idea leads to games with shoddy cohesiveness, a lack of flavor, flaws in gameplay, and other problems. @#$ The Corrupter $#@ @#$ Adrian Lee Sullivan $#@ Truth is as @#$ Game Theory - Coffee - Opinion - Hedonism $#@ subjective as @#$ <http://upl.cs.wisc.edu/~adrian/jyhad> $#@ Reality ... GAT/CS/WS C(+++) USX+ P++ N++ PS++@ PE@ b++(+++) X+++ R+++* r+ z++**?

On 23 Feb 1997, Faethor wrote: > Mmm. I've thought of some of these myself. A 'Feldon's Cane' would > certainly be nice.. Anyone who's continued playing when their library is > gone will agree. It would also certainly be nice to have 5 extra pool when needed. In a game whose paradigm is resource management, such a card takes much of the edge of that problem away. In a game where immediate drawing makes library size a limitation for combo decks, such a card takes all of that edge away. Good decks would suddenly shrink in half or 2/3, with everything being lowered proportionately in the deck, so that it would come up more often, yet be without fear of decking oneself. Not a good idea to print such a card. I expect WotC will do it with the next (if ever) expansion. [ quoted text not captured ]

: A Toreador may take a (d) action to put an entrancement counter on a : minion. Entranced vampires pay one blood to attempt to block any : toreador you control. Burn the counter on an ally to tap it. Minions can : only have one entrancement counter, which can be burned as a -1 stealth : action. : : A toreador gets -1 intercept against an entranced vampire, and may not : block entranced allies. How about: If a Toreador attempts to block an entranced minion, burn the entrancement counter; the minion gains +1 hand damage in the ensuing combat. (Jilted lover, anyone?) -- Kevin Donnelly----------------------------------------------------- Protector of Damsels in Distress, Lover of Ladies Fair, Tech Student "Never tell me the odds!" -- Han Solo gt2...@prism.gatech.edu vap...@prism.gatech.edu

>> >This sounds a little _too_ Mag-ick-y to me... Feldon's Cane, anyone? > >> It sure is, but I have seen many other cardgames with this type of card. >And many other cardgames are substandard. And many other cardgames use >Courier for their font. This point is unimportant. >For a card [game] to be good, it must be jodged on its own merit from >within its own paradigm. Breaking from this idea leads to games with >shoddy cohesiveness, a lack of flavor, flaws in gameplay, and other >problems. The trouble here is that a Combat deck go to fast. To actually kill your prey on 90 cards you have to use an bleed or vote deck to do it good. Remember that there is a rule about how small the decksa actually can be. A 60 card deck is not permitted in vampire.

staffan.bengtsson (staffan....@mailbox.swipnet.se) wrote: : Remember that there is a rule about how small the decksa actually can be. : A 60 card deck is not permitted in vampire. Forty cards is the hard minimum, is it not? With an upper limit of 40+10*# of players starting the game? Such a card as discussed in this thread would add a simplicity to deck construction allowing very trim S&B killing machines, something which doesn't need much help being lethal, at least to a couple people at a given game. -Wallpaper Paste for all those useless cards

staffan.bengtsson wrote: > > >And many other cardgames are substandard. And many other cardgames use > >Courier for their font. This point is unimportant. > > >For a card [game] to be good, it must be jodged on its own merit from > >within its own paradigm. Breaking from this idea leads to games with > >shoddy cohesiveness, a lack of flavor, flaws in gameplay, and other > >problems. > > The trouble here is that a Combat deck go to fast. To actually kill your prey on > 90 cards you have to use an bleed or vote deck to do it good. I've found that this isn't really true for me... i've had 90 card combat decks that can kill my prey (and, on good days, my prey's prey, etc., recurse as required) without much trouble; only one of my decks has ever forced me to withdraw on a regular basis, and it was a Toreador/Ventrue vote deck. > Remember that there is a rule about how small the decksa actually can be. > A 60 card deck is not permitted in vampire. Refer to the V:TES rulebook, page 4: "Each player must have at least twelve cards in her crypt and forty cards in her library. Each player may add up to ten cards to her library for each player in the game." So a sixty card deck is not permitted only if you're playing solitaire.

Dave Green (dc...@faraday.clas.Virginia.EDU) wrote: : staffan.bengtsson (staffan....@mailbox.swipnet.se) wrote: : : Remember that there is a rule about how small the decksa actually can be. : : A 60 card deck is not permitted in vampire. : Forty cards is the hard minimum, is it not? With an upper : limit of 40+10*# of players starting the game? This is correct. For official (DCI) tournaments, library size is allowed to range from 60 to 90 cards, regardless of th number of players. -- L. Scott Johnson (vte...@regency.wizards.com) Official VtES Net.Rep for Wizards of the Coast. (*) - Subject to review by Rules Team

> > >> Tremere: > > >How about: Tap this card to give a Tremere +1 stealth on the current > > >non-directed action. > > > > AH, Alright! > > > > >> Flaw: > > >If this card is tapped, all Tremere you control have -1 stealth. > > > > It feels like the suspicius thoughts about Tremere yes... > > I like it. > > Works for me. > As a tremere player I don't think this card is a good idea. On principle I like the idea of the class of cards but. The Tremere don't need anything like this. Most other clans are getting powers useful or cool to them. However, this just is basically fillerpaper. I liked most of the others, don't get me wrong, but I would like to see a balance NETSET. Can we try to think up a new one.

L. Scott Johnson wrote: > For official (DCI) tournaments, library size is allowed to range > from 60 to 90 cards, regardless of th number of players. > True, but the number of players at a table is always 4-5. Robert -- ...................................................................... :The opinions expressed here are strictly my own delusional ramblings: :and do not reflect the opinions of The Walt Disney Company. : : : :Robert Goudie robert...@studio.disney.com: :LA Tourny Info -> http://www.cs.ucr.edu/~ezix/other/rg/vtourn_1.html: :....................................................................: :Da pony run, he jump he pitch. He t'row my master in da ditch. : :He died and da jury wondered why. Da verdict was the blue tail fly.: :....................................................................:

Robert Goudie wrote: > > L. Scott Johnson wrote: > > > For official (DCI) tournaments, library size is allowed to range > > from 60 to 90 cards, regardless of th number of players. > > > True, but the number of players at a table is always 4-5. Hurm. Maybe I'm not being clear: A "normal" (non-tourney) 4-player game allows deck size to range from 40 to 80. A "normal" (non-tourney) 4-player game allows deck size to range from 40 to 90. Tournament rules up the minimum size (to 60), and fix the maximum size regardless of the number of players (raising the largest deck size in the 4-player games to 90, while leaving the largest deck size in the 5-player game the same, at 90 also). [ quoted text not captured ]

L. Scott Johnson wrote: > > A "normal" (non-tourney) 4-player game allows deck size to range > from 40 to 90. ---------------------------^^^^^^^^ 5-player, of course (stinking cut-n-paste bliss!) [ quoted text not captured ]