Repeat actions, Bleed vs. GtU

Okay...I realize that there has been a massive rules team ruling which I will quote below, but I want to make absolutely certain whether or not there is a difference between something that came up last night. Vampire A bleeds, is blocked, and (I believe) uses majesty to S:CE and untap. Vampire A then uses Govern the Unaligned to bleed again, at +2 (of course). I believe that this is the same action, as GtU states "D *bleed* at +2" (my emphasis added). So, on to the RTR: An action type is any type of action defined by the rulebook: * Bleed * Hunt * Employ (Retainer) * Recruit (Ally) * Equip (incl. transferring equipment) * Call a vote * Leave Torpor * Rescue (from Torpor) * Diablerize (in Torpor) Additionally, each action card (by name) that is used to take an action not listed above is its own type (by name). And, each card in play that provides an action not listed above is its own type (by name). Bum's Rush, Ambush, and the attack allowed by a Haven Uncovered are all different types of actions. So, I contend that GtU is an action of type "bleed," and cannot be used to repeat after a regular bleed... Confirmation/crushing defeat? Xian

Xian wrote: > > Okay...I realize that there has been a massive rules team ruling which I > will quote below, but I want to make absolutely certain whether or not there > is a difference between something that came up last night. > > Vampire A bleeds, is blocked, and (I believe) uses majesty to S:CE and > untap. Vampire A then uses Govern the Unaligned to bleed again, at +2 (of > course). I believe that this is the same action, as GtU states "D *bleed* > at +2" (my emphasis added). > > So, on to the RTR: > An action type is any type of action defined by the rulebook: > * Bleed > [...] > > So, I contend that GtU is an action of type "bleed," and cannot be used to > repeat after a regular bleed... > > Confirmation/crushing defeat? Confirmation. You quoted the answer: GtU is a bleed action, therefore its action type is "bleed", since "bleed" is a type of action defined in the rulebook. -- L. Scott Johnson (vte...@wizards.com) Official VtES Net.Rep for Wizards of the Coast. (*) - Subject to review by Rules Team

In article <6jc6mg$6...@epx.cis.umn.edu>, Xian <xi...@waste.org> wrote: >Vampire A bleeds, is blocked, and (I believe) uses majesty to S:CE and >untap. Vampire A then uses Govern the Unaligned to bleed again, at +2 (of >course). I believe that this is the same action, as GtU states "D *bleed* >at +2" (my emphasis added). You are correct. A bleed is a bleed, regardless of its 'standard' (cardless) vs. carded (GtU&c.) nature. >So, on to the RTR: Note that, while the RTR defines type of action for things such as Obedience & whatnot, No Repeat Actions is a DCI rule, not an established Rules Team thingy. But you probably already know that. >Confirmation/crushing defeat? Confirmed. LSJTangent: Can Forgotten Labyrinth (not usable on bleeds) be used on Superior Govern the Unaligned? It's not a bleed, but does the inferior version's bleed nature somehow contaminate the whole card? gomi -- go ahead, wreck your life: that might be good who can say what's wrong or right? nobody can

Gomi no Sensei wrote: > In article <6jc6mg$6...@epx.cis.umn.edu>, Xian <xi...@waste.org> wrote: > >Vampire A bleeds, is blocked, and (I believe) uses majesty to S:CE and > >untap. Vampire A then uses Govern the Unaligned to bleed again, at +2 (of > >course). I believe that this is the same action, as GtU states "D *bleed* > >at +2" (my emphasis added). > > You are correct. A bleed is a bleed, regardless of its 'standard' > (cardless) vs. carded (GtU&c.) nature. > > >So, on to the RTR: > > Note that, while the RTR defines type of action for things such as > Obedience & whatnot, No Repeat Actions is a DCI rule, not an established > Rules Team thingy. But you probably already know that. Obedience, Change of Target, etc. depend on specific actions, not action types. the RTR quoted by Xian only defines "action type", which is only used by the DCI NRA rule (and not by any particular cards). > >Confirmation/crushing defeat? > > Confirmed. > > LSJTangent: Can Forgotten Labyrinth (not usable on bleeds) be used > on Superior Govern the Unaligned? It's not a bleed, but does the inferior > version's bleed nature somehow contaminate the whole card? The superior version doesn't contaminate the whole card. Forgotten Labyrinth can be used on a superior Govern the Unaligned action. [ quoted text not captured ]

The below is almost exactly right. There is one minor incorrect point, which LSJ seems to have skimmed over. > > Okay...I realize that there has been a massive rules team ruling which I > will quote below, but I want to make absolutely certain whether or not there > is a difference between something that came up last night. > > Vampire A bleeds, is blocked, and (I believe) uses majesty to S:CE and > untap. Vampire A then uses Govern the Unaligned to bleed again, at +2 (of > course). I believe that this is the same action, as GtU states "D *bleed* > at +2" (my emphasis added). > > So, on to the RTR: > An action type is any type of action defined by the rulebook: > * Bleed > * Hunt > * Employ (Retainer) > * Recruit (Ally) > * Equip (incl. transferring equipment) > * Call a vote > * Leave Torpor > * Rescue (from Torpor) > * Diablerize (in Torpor) > > Additionally, each action card (by name) that is used to take > an action not listed above is its own type (by name). > And, each card in play that provides an action not listed > above is its own type (by name). > Bum's Rush, Ambush, and the attack allowed by a Haven Uncovered > are all different types of actions. > Here we are. Actually, each instance of a card in play provides an action of its own type by instance (and not by name). That is, if you have 2 Haven Uncovered's on a single vampire, the same minion may take 2 actions to enter combat with the vampire through HU. > So, I contend that GtU is an action of type "bleed," and cannot be used to > repeat after a regular bleed... > Of course, your conclusion on GtU was obviously correct. -Chris -----== Posted via Deja News, The Leader in Internet Discussion ==----- http://www.dejanews.com/ Now offering spam-free web-based newsreading