[LSJ] Of Noble Blood

Can the target Of Noble Blood be a non-Camarilla vampire? And if so, do they gain the vote for being a Primogen? And what was the reasoning behind not being able to target title vampires with the card? Was it too abusive? Seems like wallpaper now... Chris -- chris <www.vtesinla.org> (A V:TES site in development) ultimate disc - V:TES - hockey v:ekn prince of torrance, ca

The Lasombra wrote: > [snip answers - thanks!] > > And what was the reasoning behind not being able to target titled > > vampires with the card? > > You can play Of Noble Blood on vampires that you do not control. > Without that restriction, Judah makes all the princes, justicars, > and inner circle members that oppose him into primogen so that > they lose their titles and the benefits derived therefrom. > > > Was it too abusive? > > Absolutely. Hmmm... More abusive than Mind Rape, even with errata? More abusive than Command of the Harpies, or Wrath of the Inner Circle, or Fear of Mekhet? One of the few cards for Primogen, reduced to wallpaper. Sad. Chris > > > Seems like wallpaper now... > > Indeed. [ quoted text not captured ]

In article <39D15AB3...@vtesinla.org>, Chris Shorb <chr...@vtesinla.org> wrote: > Can the target Of Noble Blood be a non-Camarilla vampire? No. See section 10 of the online rulebook, quoted here: "A vampire must belong to the appropriate sect to receive a title. Only Camarilla vampires can become Primogen, Princes, Justicars, or Inner Circle members. " http://www.white-wolf.com/vtes/rulebook.html > And what was the reasoning behind not being able to target titled > vampires with the card? You can play Of Noble Blood on vampires that you do not control. Without that restriction, Judah makes all the princes, justicars, and inner circle members that oppose him into primogen so that they lose their titles and the benefits derived therefrom. > Was it too abusive? Absolutely. > Seems like wallpaper now... Indeed. Carpe Noctem. Lasombra http://members.tripod.com/~Lasombra Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Before you buy.

On Tue, 26 Sep 2000 21:53:53 -0700, Chris Shorb <chr...@vtesinla.org> wrote: >The Lasombra wrote: >> > Was it too abusive? >> >> Absolutely. > >Hmmm... More abusive than Mind Rape, even with errata? More abusive >than Command of the Harpies, or Wrath of the Inner Circle, or Fear of >Mekhet? One of the few cards for Primogen, reduced to wallpaper. Sad. HELL yes. Mind Rape: temporary, if you even get it through. Command of the Harpies - must pass a vote AGAINST a vampire with votes, not an easy task. Wrath of the Inner Circle - requires an IC member, no cookie! Fear of Mekhet - targets ONLY Justicars or IC members, while Princes are the most common. Contrast with Of Noble Blood: without errata, would target ANY vampire, cost one blood, be a +1 stealth action, and remove a minimum of 1 vote. It's not that the card sucks - it's that Primogen suck. =) -- Derek "Ignorance more frequently begets confidence than does knowledge." - C. Darwin, 1871

Chris Shorb wrote: > > Can the target Of Noble Blood be a non-Camarilla vampire? And if so, do No. [10] > they gain the vote for being a Primogen? And what was the reasoning > behind not being able to target title vampires with the card? Was it > too abusive? Seems like wallpaper now... No reason was given, but I suspect that both original intent and the unexpected power level were both factors leading to the errata. -- LSJ (vte...@white-wolf.com) V:TES Net.Rep for White Wolf, Inc. Links to revised rulebook, rulings, errata, and tournament rules: http://www.white-wolf.com/vtes/

> Contrast with Of Noble Blood: without errata, would target ANY > vampire, cost one blood, be a +1 stealth action, and remove a minimum > of 1 vote. > > It's not that the card sucks - it's that Primogen suck. =) Theme deck? Bunch of Primogen, bunch of Of Noble Blood, and hit any prince or justicar that comes out with Command of the Harpies or Wrath of the Inner Circle? (And any IC with Justicar Retribution)? It'd suck, I know, but it'd be...well...different... Xian -- I'd tell the world and save my soul, But rain falls down and I feel cold. A cold that sleeps within my heart, It tears the earth and sun apart. --_Shellshock_, New Order www.waste.org/~xian

On Wed, 27 Sep 2000 10:53:10 -0500, "Xian" <xi...@waste.org> wrote: >> Contrast with Of Noble Blood: without errata, would target ANY >> vampire, cost one blood, be a +1 stealth action, and remove a minimum >> of 1 vote. >> >> It's not that the card sucks - it's that Primogen suck. =) > >Theme deck? Bunch of Primogen, bunch of Of Noble Blood, and hit any prince or >justicar that comes out with Command of the Harpies or Wrath of the Inner >Circle? (And any IC with Justicar Retribution)? If I had more than one Of Noble Blood, I'd try it. =) Although here would be a suitable crypt for that deck: Crypt: (12 cards) [Min: 16, Max: 24, Avg: 5.00] 1 Anvil (Brujah, 6, CE do PO pr th, Primogen) 1 Brachah (Brujah, 5, CE fo PR) 1 Elisabetta Romano (Tremere, 6, do pt qu th, Primogen) 1 Gideon Fontaine (Ventrue, 3, PR) 1 Jazz Wentworth (Ventrue, 5, do fo PR) 1 Judah (Nosferatu, 6, an do PO, Primogen) 1 Mariana Gilbert (Toreador, 4, ce PR) 1 Nakova, Advocate (Ventrue, 6, FO po, Primogen) 1 Ramiel DuPre (Toreador, 5, au ce do PR) 1 Ranjan Rishi (Ventrue, 5, DO fo PR) 1 Rigby, Vanguard (Brujah Antitribu, 5, au CE po PR) 1 Violette Prentiss (Ventrue, 4, do PR) >It'd suck, I know, but it'd be...well...different... It might not suck totally. You have four Primogen in this crypt, so they can just sit and take +1 stealth actions to make more Primogen out of your superior-PRE guys. Use Minion Tap abusively on the superior-PRE guys to drop them down to 1/2, and Effective Management/Info Highway to get as many of them out as you possibly can. You'll have vote lock so hopefully nobody will get diablerized even once they go to torpor. Judicious use of BO and Voter Cap will gain you pool, reload your Minion Tapped guys, and help you pass the Harpies and Justicar Retribution. (only an IC member can call Wrath of the IC.) Now add damage votes and Majesty. Will fall over to +1 intercept or a grabby Rush deck, of course. OK, it might suck totally. I think the problem with Primogen is that they can't take any sort of cool actions by themselves, can't call any cool votes, and basically are no different than any other non-Prince, non-Justicar Kindred except that woo, they have one vote. And one vote isn't very much when you're wanting to stop Stinky Gideon with Five in Favor, even if everyone at the table has one. It's cool to have one, but it's really a side issue when selecting a crypt, I think. I think eventually we ought to print some vote cards that are usable by "primogen, prince, or justicar". =) That'd be in any THIRD new expansion, however, so... -shrug- [ quoted text not captured ]

"Derek Ray" wrote: [snip] A better choice might be: > 1 Elisabetta Romano (Tremere, 6, do pt qu th, Primogen) 1 Astrid Thomas (Tremere, 7 au DO po TH, Primogen, all Tremere vote with her) Xian

In article <g074tsk5p342s99f0...@4ax.com>, Derek Ray <lor...@yahoo.com> wrote: > On Wed, 27 Sep 2000 10:53:10 -0500, "Xian" <xi...@waste.org> wrote: > > >> Contrast with Of Noble Blood: without errata, would target ANY > >> vampire, cost one blood, be a +1 stealth action, and remove a minimum > >> of 1 vote. > >> > >> It's not that the card sucks - it's that Primogen suck. =) > > > >Theme deck? Bunch of Primogen, bunch of Of Noble Blood, and hit any prince or > >justicar that comes out with Command of the Harpies or Wrath of the Inner > >Circle? (And any IC with Justicar Retribution)? > > If I had more than one Of Noble Blood, I'd try it. =) > > Although here would be a suitable crypt for that deck: > > Crypt: (12 cards) [Min: 16, Max: 24, Avg: 5.00] > 1 Anvil (Brujah, 6, CE do PO pr th, Primogen) > 1 Brachah (Brujah, 5, CE fo PR) > 1 Elisabetta Romano (Tremere, 6, do pt qu th, Primogen) > 1 Gideon Fontaine (Ventrue, 3, PR) > 1 Jazz Wentworth (Ventrue, 5, do fo PR) > 1 Judah (Nosferatu, 6, an do PO, Primogen) > 1 Mariana Gilbert (Toreador, 4, ce PR) > 1 Nakova, Advocate (Ventrue, 6, FO po, Primogen) > 1 Ramiel DuPre (Toreador, 5, au ce do PR) > 1 Ranjan Rishi (Ventrue, 5, DO fo PR) > 1 Rigby, Vanguard (Brujah Antitribu, 5, au CE po PR) > 1 Violette Prentiss (Ventrue, 4, do PR) > > >It'd suck, I know, but it'd be...well...different... > > It might not suck totally. You have four Primogen in this crypt, so > they can just sit and take +1 stealth actions to make more Primogen > out of your superior-PRE guys. Use Minion Tap abusively on the > superior-PRE guys to drop them down to 1/2, and Effective > Management/Info Highway to get as many of them out as you possibly > can. You'll have vote lock so hopefully nobody will get diablerized > even once they go to torpor. Judicious use of BO and Voter Cap will > gain you pool, reload your Minion Tapped guys, and help you pass the > Harpies and Justicar Retribution. (only an IC member can call Wrath > of the IC.) Now add damage votes and Majesty. Will fall over to +1 > intercept or a grabby Rush deck, of course. Card text: Of Noble Blood (Dark Sovereigns) 1 blood -- Action Requires a ready Primogen. +1 stealth action. Choose a <Camarilla> vampire with a capacity above 5 {who does not have a title}. Put this card on that vampire. The vampire is now a Primogen of his or her clan. Not usable on Caitiff. Since you can only do it at a vamp over cap 5, it's what makes the card really useless :( None of the vamps above are higher than 5 and not having a title...so you'd need lots of skills cards. [ quoted text not captured ]