Trap: example please...

I've heard a couple of Trap explanations, but I have a feeling that I'm not going to totally understand it until someone gives me a good example of it. If I am understanding it correctly it is a VERY powerful card... A press anytime any methuselah plays any card??? Well, an example would be greatly appreciated. Btw: I was excited also to have a look at a V:TES Trap, only to find that the card text had barely been changed. :(

np...@umich.edu (Neil Paananen) wrote: >I've heard a couple of Trap explanations, but I have a feeling that I'm not going >to totally understand it until someone gives me a good example of it. If I am >understanding it correctly it is a VERY powerful card... A press anytime any >methuselah plays any card??? Well, an example would be greatly appreciated. > It can be a powerful card, but it pays to understand how it works before you try to use it. Here's an example of a Trap sprung on me: Black Cat, armed with a magnum, intercepts Sir Walter Nash's action. Nash is unarmed. BC has 5 blood and Nash has 7 blood at the beginning of combat. Nash's Methuselah declines to play pre-maneuver cards, but BC's Methuselah plays Trap. Now neither Methuselah may play any new cards for the next three rounds of combat. Note, however, that cards *already* played remain effective. Round 1: BC uses the magnum to maneuver to long range. Nash strikes with fist; BC uses the magnum. BC remains at 5 blood, and Nash is down to 5 blood. Trap provides BC with a press to continue combat. Round 2: Neither vampire maneuvers. Nash strikes with fist; BC uses the magnum. BC is down to 4 blood and Nash is down to 3 blood. Trap provides BC with a press to continue combat. Round 3: Neither vampire maneuvers. Nash strikes with fist; BC uses the magnum. BC is down to 3 blood and Nash is down to 1 blood. Trap provides BC with a press to continue combat. Cards may be played (including another Trap) as of the beginning of Round 4. Round 4: Neither vampire maneuvers. Nash plays Majesty, ending combat. I was lucky BC's Methuselah did not have a Manstopper Rounds at the beginning of combat (he had some in his library). If he did, he could have played it on BC before springing the Trap, and Nash would have gone to torpor. As you can see, Trap is especially powerful in a weapons deck because it deprives your opponent of all strike cards for three rounds of combat. You could, for example, arm a 3-blood vampire with a bastard sword and easily send bigger vampires with only 4 or 5 blood right to torpor, without seriously caring what happens to your own. You do even better with a flak jacket. I suppose, with the right cards, Trap would also work with a potence deck--say, if you play Torn Signpost or its equivalent before the Trap. It is important to remember that the acting vampire has first dibs on playing pre-maneuver cards. As a result, Trap is even more effective when played by an acting vampire, as it precludes any plays whatsoever by the reacting vampire. If you are the reacting vampire and want to play Trap, be sure to allow your opponent to decline to play pre-maneuver cards before springing the Trap. Of course, playing Trap when the target has the means to hit back is not necessarily wise (magnum slugfests are costly, and often help spectator Methuselahs more than the participants). Also, it is of no particular benefit to use Trap on someone with a Hawg, who can use it for a press to end combat notwithstanding the press to continue provided free by the Trap. Hope this helps. Good luck! Bruce Goldstein bru...@access.digex.net

In article <48t17u$4...@news3.digex.net>, baa01308 <bru...@access.digex.net> wrote: : np...@umich.edu (Neil Paananen) wrote: : >I've heard a couple of Trap explanations, but I have a feeling that I'm not going : >to totally understand it until someone gives me a good example of it. If I am : >understanding it correctly it is a VERY powerful card... A press anytime any : >methuselah plays any card??? Well, an example would be greatly appreciated. : > : It can be a powerful card, but it pays to understand how it works before you try to : use it. Here's an example of a Trap sprung on me: : : Black Cat, armed with a magnum, intercepts Sir Walter Nash's action. Nash is : unarmed. BC has 5 blood and Nash has 7 blood at the beginning of combat. Nash's : Methuselah declines to play pre-maneuver cards, but BC's Methuselah plays Trap. : Now neither Methuselah may play any new cards for the next three rounds of combat. : Note, however, that cards *already* played remain effective. Well, this is not how Trap works. Trap does not restrict the playing of cards by Meths during the combat. Instead it gives a press to continue combat until 3 consecutive rounds occur where neither Meth plays a card. That means there will be 4 presses (because the round where the Trap was played counts as a round where a card was played.) So when 3 consecutive rounds occur without withr Meth playing cards, then the Trap presses stop. Whenever a Meth plays a card, the counter for Tap presses resets to 0. So if BC and Nash hit each other for 4 rounds and do nothing else, then the Trap stops providing presses. But if BC and Nash hit each other for 3 rounds, and then BC plays an additional strike card in the fourth round of combat, there will be another 3 rounds of the Trap providing presses. The upshot of the trap is that in most cases the combat goes on until someone is in torpor, or until someone plays a press to counter the Trap's press to continue. This is not always the case, but most times I have seen it work that way. Any card played by either vamp during the combat resets the press counter, whether it is a manuever card, a damage prevention card, a strike card, and additional strike card...whatever. Sorry this is a little rambling. The point is that all the Trap does is provide a series of presses to continue combat. It does not limit or restrict the cards that either Meth/vamp can play. But if cards are played, then it increases the number of presses to continue that the Trap provides. These presses to continue can be countered by either Meth/vamp, and if there are no more presses to continue, then the combat ends. I hope this helps. stephen beaulieu hi...@mail.utexas.edu

baa01308 <bru...@access.digex.net> writes: >Now neither Methuselah may play any new cards for >the next three rounds of combat. DO WHAT? And where may I ask are you getting this can not play any cards from? Last time I read my traps they said combat has an automatic press to continue combat for three roundsafter the last card was played by any Meth No where have I ever read into it that no Meth could play cards during this time Care to let me know what makes you think this? Thanks Stu -- "Peekaboo." -- Garibaldi's password, "Eyes"

It was also my understanding that a S:CE would end a trap regardless of the round. Errol

dsa...@prism.gatech.edu (Stuart J. Pieloch) writes: >baa01308 <bru...@access.digex.net> writes: >>Now neither Methuselah may play any new cards for >>the next three rounds of combat. >DO WHAT? >And where may I ask are you getting this > can not play any cards >from? Last time I read my traps they said combat has an automatic >press to continue combat for three roundsafter the last card was >played by any Meth >No where have I ever read into it that no Meth could play >cards during this time >Care to let me know what makes you think this? It is an easy interpretation of the admittedly ambiguous text on trap: Trap Combat Combat automatically has a press, only usable to continue combat each round. This continues until 3 rounds of combat pass with no cards being played by any Methuselah. Only usable before range is determined on the first round. Artist: Jeff Rebner 3 rounds *with no cards being played*. WotC made a ruling that explained the card a little better, but that doesn't remedy the ambiguity present in the card text. -- L. Scott Johnson (sjoh...@math.sc.edu) | These opinions are mine and http://www.math.sc.edu/~sjohnson | are subject to card text. Graphics Specialist and V:tES Rulemonger. |