LSJ - scarce & contesting

Hi ! I control Myriam, and My predator control Matthias. When i put blanche into play, i pay 6 pool since she moves from the uncontrolled region to the ready region. My predator then influences out Myriam, paying 9 pool and contesting with me. When i yield, he has Myriam back. What happens ? does he have to pay 6 pool because Matthias and Blanche are in play ? or is a contested card out-of-play but not technically "uncontrolled" ? thank you ! reyda

reyda <true_...@hotmail.com> skrev i diskussionsgruppsmeddelandet:3d6de2eb$0$20040$79c1...@nan-newsreader-03.noos.net... [ quoted text not captured ] Dont tell me that this actuially happened! /henrik isaksson

In message <3d6de2eb$0$20040$79c1...@nan-newsreader-03.noos.net>, reyda [ quoted text not captured ] The scarce rule says: " When a Methuselah moves a vampire marked "scarce" from her uncontrolled region to the ready region, she burns 3 pool for every other vampire in play of the same clan." The important point is that it's referencing the uncontrolled *region*. The contesting rule states: " If more than one copy of a unique card is brought into play, that means control of the card is being contested. For the duration of the contest, all copies of the contested card are turned facedown and are out of play. " Nothing about this actually moves the card to the uncontrolled *region*. -- James Coupe PGP 0x5D623D5D Don't just clap. What's the use of that? EBD690ECD7A1FB457CA2 You there, gorgeous creature. 13D7E668C3695D623D5D Stop...that...bus!

Henrik Isaksson wrote: :: reyda <true_...@hotmail.com> skrev i :: diskussionsgruppsmeddelandet:3d6de2eb$0$20040$79c14f64@nan- :: newsreader-03.noos.net... ::: Hi ! ::: ::: I control Myriam, and My predator control Matthias. When i put ::: blanche into play, i pay 6 pool since she moves from the ::: uncontrolled region to the ready region. My predator then ::: influences out Myriam, paying 9 pool and contesting with me. When ::: i yield, he has Myriam back. What happens ? does he have to pay 6 ::: pool because Matthias and Blanche are in play ? or is a contested ::: card out-of-play but not technically "uncontrolled" ? ::: :: :: Dont tell me that this actuially happened! :: :: /henrik isaksson if you really want to know, it never happened =) A really close situation has happened once , though, and proved me that one shouldn't undersestimate the whole "Scarce" thing. Here's the story : I was playing a Giovanni Fighting deck with Krassimir as a guest star (yes he has necro and dom). As soon as i my prey discarded a Lapse on his first discard, i realized he was playing some sort of Trujah deck. I was lucky enough to have Krassimir in my opening crypt, so i influenced him as any wise predator would have done =) My prey first had Nu out, and paid the 3 pool. My first offensive move was to rush multiple rush Nu and put him down to 1 blood. He had no other choice than influence his other True brujah, Synesios. He paid 6 pool for this. I was short on rush, so at least he could minion tap Synesios a bit and called whatever vote and then bewitching + voter cap to gain about 7 pool back and put Nu on his feet. I don't remember how this mess ended, if i recall correctly, i won this game due to my grandprey calling a Banishment on Synesios, because at this point he Ph34r3d the awful Free States Rant that were in the Trujah deck (-we all supposed it at least) But yes, he paid a grand total of 9 pool to be able to playhis deck ! Thank you Krassimir =)

James Coupe wrote: :: In message <3d6de2eb$0$20040$79c1...@nan-newsreader-03.noos.net>, :: reyda <true_...@hotmail.com> writes: ::: I control Myriam, and My predator control Matthias. When i put ::: blanche into play, i pay 6 pool since she moves from the ::: uncontrolled region to the ready region. My predator then ::: influences out Myriam, paying 9 pool and contesting with me. When ::: i yield, he has Myriam back. What happens ? does he have to pay 6 ::: pool because Matthias and Blanche are in play ? or is a contested ::: card out-of-play but not technically "uncontrolled" ? :: :: The scarce rule says: :: :: " When a Methuselah moves a vampire marked "scarce" from her :: uncontrolled region to the ready region, she burns 3 pool for every :: other vampire in play of the same clan." :: :: The important point is that it's referencing the uncontrolled :: *region*. :: :: The contesting rule states: :: :: " If more than one copy of a unique card is brought into play, that :: means control of the card is being contested. For the duration of :: the contest, all copies of the contested card are turned facedown :: and are out of play. " :: :: Nothing about this actually moves the card to the uncontrolled :: *region*. Excellent. This is exactly what i wanted to know . I assume you're right, like most of the time =)

[ quoted text not captured ] It is not controlled, but that doesn't matter for the scarce rule, which specifically states that the cost is paid when the vampire is moved from the "uncontrolled region". [BL 3.7] [CE 7] A contested vampire is not in the uncontrolled region. -- LSJ (vte...@white-wolf.com) V:TES Net.Rep for White Wolf, Inc. Links to V:TES news, rules, cards, utilities, and tournament calendar: http://www.white-wolf.com/vtes/

LSJ wrote: :: reyda wrote: ::: ::: Hi ! ::: ::: I control Myriam, and My predator control Matthias. When i put ::: blanche into play, i pay 6 pool since she moves from the ::: uncontrolled region to the ready region. My predator then ::: influences out Myriam, paying 9 pool and contesting with me. When ::: i yield, he has Myriam back. What happens ? does he have to pay 6 ::: pool because Matthias and Blanche are in play ? or is a contested ::: card out-of-play but not technically "uncontrolled" ? :: :: It is not controlled, but that doesn't matter for the scarce rule, :: which specifically states that the cost is paid when the vampire :: is moved from the "uncontrolled region". [BL 3.7] [CE 7] :: :: A contested vampire is not in the uncontrolled region. thank you =)

"reyda" <true_...@hotmail.com> wrote in message news:<3d6de2eb$0$20040$79c1...@nan-newsreader-03.noos.net>... [ quoted text not captured ] No, by Scarce definition: you pay the "penalty" when you bring a scarce vampire _from_the_uncontroled_region_ to the controled region. When you contest, the vampire remains on the controled region, although it's uncontrolled by the contest. After you yield Miriam, your predator's Miriam is again controled by him without paying the scarce "penalty". .- Luis Duarte (Portugal) - - - Powerbase:Lisbon-[http://planeta.clix.pt/vampire]

James Coupe wrote: > In message <3d6de2eb$0$20040$79c1...@nan-newsreader-03.noos.net>, reyda > <true_...@hotmail.com> writes: > >I control Myriam, and My predator control Matthias. When i put blanche into > >play, i pay 6 pool since she moves from the uncontrolled region to the ready > >region. My predator then influences out Myriam, paying 9 pool and contesting > >with me. When i yield, he has Myriam back. What happens ? does he have to > >pay 6 pool because Matthias and Blanche are in play ? or is a contested card > >out-of-play but not technically "uncontrolled" ? > > The scarce rule says: > > " When a Methuselah moves a vampire marked "scarce" from her > uncontrolled region to the ready region, she burns 3 pool for every > other vampire in play of the same clan." > > The important point is that it's referencing the uncontrolled *region*. > > The contesting rule states: > > " If more than one copy of a unique card is brought into play, that > means control of the card is being contested. For the duration of the > contest, all copies of the contested card are turned facedown and are > out of play. " > > Nothing about this actually moves the card to the uncontrolled *region*. > > -- And correct me if I am wrong, but the scarce doesn't trigger when a vamp is brought into play via Soul Gem, or SUP Possession, or Daemonic Poss, right? chris chris shorb <www.vtesinla.org> (A V:TES site in development) prince of torrance, california Ultimate Disc - Hockey - Vampire the Eternal Struggle Ebay page <http://members.ebay.com/aboutme/vtessingles/>

In message <3D745B97...@vtesinla.org>, Chris Shorb <chr...@vtesinla.org> writes: >And correct me if I am wrong, but the scarce doesn't trigger when a vamp is >brought into play via Soul Gem, or SUP Possession, or Daemonic Poss, right? Correct - since scarce only triggers on movement from the uncontrolled region, and none of these do. A card like "Reverse Banishment" (hypothetically speaking) would trigger scarce - since it's any movement from uncontrolled to ready, not just transferring out. [ quoted text not captured ]