Gustav Breidenstein (LSJ)

Gustav Breidenstein Ventrue Capacity: 10 Group: 4 Camarilla Prince of Berlin: Gustav may tap during a referendum to gain 5 additional votes. +1 bleed. Just a query regarding his special. You may tap a previously tapped vampire if an effect would force you to (See Brujah Debate). This does not mean that you can tap Gustav during a political action he has taken, to gain an additional 5 votes, correct?

[ quoted text not captured ] IANLSJ, but "tap to" isn't the same as "tap". When you "tap to" produce an effect, you need to be untapped and to tap. An effect like Deep Song ("tap a ready vampire and enter combat) will tap the vampire you enter combat with, but will work if he is already tapped. Orpheus -- "Cynicism isn't maturity. Callousness isn't strength. Pretending you don't care so you don't have to try isn't "winning" What you do with your life matters." Luther Manning.

[ quoted text not captured ] Thought so too, but someone is arguing with me....

Blooded Sand wrote: > On Nov 27, 11:28 am, "Orpheus" <orpheus...@NOSPAMfree.fr> wrote: >> Blooded Sand wrote: >>> Gustav Breidenstein >>> Ventrue >>> Capacity: 10 >>> Group: 4 >>> Camarilla Prince of Berlin: Gustav may tap during a referendum to >>> gain 5 additional votes. +1 bleed. >> >>> Just a query regarding his special. >> >>> You may tap a previously tapped vampire if an effect would force you >>> to (See Brujah Debate). This does not mean that you can tap Gustav >>> during a political action he has taken, to gain an additional 5 >>> votes, correct? >> >> IANLSJ, but "tap to" isn't the same as "tap". When you "tap to" >> produce an effect, you need to be untapped and to tap. An effect >> like Deep Song ("tap a ready vampire and enter combat") will tap the >> vampire you enter combat with, but will work if he is already tapped. >> >> Orpheus > > Thought so too, but someone is arguing with me.... Kill him. Nobody should dare argue with the dreaded Blooded Sands !! ;) [ quoted text not captured ]

[ quoted text not captured ] Nah, wanna feed him my new combo idea. Carlak and Dmitra, with Mary Anne for backup. Can you say BLOAT?

Blooded Sand <sand...@gmail.com> wrote: > You may tap a previously tapped vampire if an effect would force you > to (See Brujah Debate). This does not mean that you can tap Gustav > during a political action he has taken, to gain an additional 5 votes, > correct? If you give him Inscription+Rutor's Hand, or a Temptation, then you can untap him during his own action in order to use his special. Just saying.. Happy Thanksgiving everyone! :)

Orpheus wrote: > Blooded Sand wrote: >> Gustav Breidenstein >> Camarilla Prince of Berlin: Gustav may tap during a referendum to gain >> 5 additional votes. +1 bleed. >> >> You may tap a previously tapped vampire if an effect would force you >> to (See Brujah Debate). This does not mean that you can tap Gustav >> during a political action he has taken, to gain an additional 5 votes, >> correct? > > IANLSJ, but "tap to" isn't the same as "tap". When you "tap to" produce an > effect, you need to be untapped and to tap. An effect like Deep Song ("tap a > ready vampire and enter combat) will tap the vampire you enter combat with, > but will work if he is already tapped. Correct.

[ quoted text not captured ] I understand why all of the above other examples are correct, but I didn't think it applied here. So Gustav has 5 additional votes during each referendum, as long as he's ready? If he's untapped, he'll have to tap to do it, but if he's already tapped, no problem. Cool.

[ quoted text not captured ] No. When you "tap to" produce an effect, like Gustav does, you need to be untapped in order to tap. He has to tap "to" get the five additional votes. If he's tapped already, he can't tap "to" get five votes. In contrast to an effect like Deep Song, which doesn't say "tap to". Deep Song can be used to "tap a vampire and enter combat with him or her" against an already-tapped vampire.

On Nov 27, 6:36 am, Jozxyqk <jfeue...@eecs.tufts.edu> wrote: > Blooded Sand <sandm...@gmail.com> wrote: > > You may tap a previously tapped vampire if an effect would force you > > to (See Brujah Debate). This does not mean that you can tap Gustav > > during a political action he has taken, to gain an additional 5 votes, > > correct? > > If you give him Inscription+Rutor's Hand, or a Temptation, then you can > untap him during his own action in order to use his special. Or even whackier, CI to Toreador then graverob Alexandra and you can use Alexandra's special to do it.

[ quoted text not captured ] Yeah, to follow your logic, I can tap the Barrens over and over to get infinite discards whenever I want them. Or if I control the edge, I can tap Using the Advantage over and over to get infinite pool during my untap... Or Momentum's Edge for infinite pool if I have a victory point.

[ quoted text not captured ] or, tap him TWICE (or more, depending on your setup) during a referendum called by a different one of your vampires to gain 10 (or more) votes.... -- salem (replace 'hotmail' with 'gmail' to email) "In *my* Assamite deck, this would pwn you in teh FAEC, so shut up." "Thats only cos u've never sene mi Gionavvi PUNCHnMUCNH u asshat." - James Coupe

Salem <kell...@hotmail.com> wrote: > XZealot wrote: > > On Nov 27, 6:36 am, Jozxyqk <jfeue...@eecs.tufts.edu> wrote: > >> Blooded Sand <sandm...@gmail.com> wrote: > >> > You may tap a previously tapped vampire if an effect would force you > >> > to (See Brujah Debate). This does not mean that you can tap Gustav > >> > during a political action he has taken, to gain an additional 5 votes, > >> > correct? > >> > >> If you give him Inscription+Rutor's Hand, or a Temptation, then you can > >> untap him during his own action in order to use his special. > > > > Or even whackier, CI to Toreador then graverob Alexandra and you can > > use Alexandra's special to do it. > or, tap him TWICE (or more, depending on your setup) during a referendum > called by a different one of your vampires to gain 10 (or more) votes.... Nope. His ability says "During". That means once.

[ quoted text not captured ] sorry I had been confused by the one word answer earlier

[ quoted text not captured ] The earlier answer was --- quote --- But "tap to" isn't the same as "tap". When you "tap to" produce an effect, you need to be untapped and to tap. An effect like Deep Song ("tap a ready vampire and enter combat) will tap the vampire you enter combat with, but will work if he is already tapped. --- endquote --- Which, although briefer than the second, is a good bit longer than one word. Confirming that the answer was correct is not a one-word answer to your query. It is a one-word acknowledgment that the answer given to your query is correct. My longer answer says the same thing as the original answer.

[ quoted text not captured ] Argh. Because the sentence was written slightly differently to normal ('during' not being the first word), i didn't notice the 'during x do y' template. Ah well. [ quoted text not captured ]