Voting ?

Oh yeah, could any replies to this one or the paralyze question be sent via e-mail, thanks! This is how I understand the voting situation. Correct me if I am wrong ANYWHERE! A vampire does a political action (using a card which is replaced at the end of the turn) at +1 stealth, which taps the acting vampire. If the action is blocked the card is burned (and then replaced! since political action cards are not replaced until the end of a POLITICAL action, but it does not say "do not replace until the end of combat"), and combat ensues. If the action is not blocked the acting methuselah gets 1 vote for the action. Then, each methuselah can also cast votes for the titles of their READY vampires (not in torpor). Then, each methuselah can cast a vote for each political action card he or she has in their hand for each vampire that they have ready that did not vote via a title (which are not replaced). For example: my predator calls a vote; I have three ready vampires, one of which is a primogen (2 tapped and one untapped - it DOESN'T matter); I have 5 political action cards in my hand; I can cast only 3 votes - 1 for the primogen, and 2 for the other two vampires (which does not tap untapped vampires). Is this how it goes? Check it all please, but the main question is can you cast as many votes as you have political cards in your hand, independent of how many vampires you have ready (even if you have ZERO vampires ready). Sam -- sam.b...@diamond.gslis.ucla.edu

In article <sam.bartels-05...@zirconia.gslis.ucla.edu>, Sam Bartels <sam.b...@diamond.gslis.ucla.edu> wrote: >Oh yeah, could any replies to this one or the paralyze question be sent >via e-mail, thanks! no. read the group like the rest of us. peasant. >This is how I understand the voting situation. Correct me if I am wrong >ANYWHERE! with glee. >A vampire does a political action (using a card which is replaced at the >end of the turn) at +1 stealth only if the political action card states that it is at stealth; currently, most (if not all) of them do. >Then, each methuselah can also cast votes for the titles >of their READY vampires (not in torpor). technically correct, but poorly worded. a methuselah may choose to gain a number of votes for each ready titled vampire he or she controls: one for primogens, two for princes, three for justicars. >Then, each methuselah can cast a >vote for each political action card he or she has in their hand for each >vampire that they have ready that did not vote via a title (which are not >replaced). wholly incorrect. untitled vampires normally have no effect on political actions at all, barring certain presence or dominate reaction cards (or action modifiers). >For example: my predator calls a vote; I have three ready >vampires, one of which is a primogen (2 tapped and one untapped - it >DOESN'T matter); I have 5 political action cards in my hand; I can cast >only 3 votes - 1 for the primogen, and 2 for the other two vampires (which >does not tap untapped vampires). to clarify your somewhat confused example: your predator calls a vote. you have a primogen and two untitled vampires ready, and five political action cards in your hand. you have six votes available, one from the primogen, and five from burning political cards in your hand. casting votes does not tap, untap, tickle, or bleach a vampire, barring certain action modifiers. >Is this how it goes? nope. read the rules. >Check it all please, but the main question is can you cast as many votes >as you have political cards in your hand, independent of how many vampires >you have ready (even if you have ZERO vampires ready). yes. go home, read the rules, and don't bother the group again until you've grown a clue; the rules on voting are fairly clear in the rules text. heckler damn newts -- "I love you, but your hair makes me want to vomit." - from the SO quote file

Sam Bartels <sam.b...@diamond.gslis.ucla.edu> wrote: >A vampire does a political action (using a card which is replaced at the >end of the turn) at +1 stealth, which taps the acting vampire. If the >action is blocked the card is burned (and then replaced! since political >action cards are not replaced until the end of a POLITICAL action, but it >does not say "do not replace until the end of combat"), and combat >ensues. If the action is not blocked the acting methuselah gets 1 vote >for the action. Then, each methuselah can also cast votes for the titles >of their READY vampires (not in torpor). Then, each methuselah can cast a >vote for each political action card he or she has in their hand for each >vampire that they have ready that did not vote via a title (which are not >replaced). For example: my predator calls a vote; I have three ready >vampires, one of which is a primogen (2 tapped and one untapped - it >DOESN'T matter); I have 5 political action cards in my hand; I can cast >only 3 votes - 1 for the primogen, and 2 for the other two vampires (which >does not tap untapped vampires). If a card in hand was used to start the political action, then that card is replaced immediately, just like any other action card. The rule is that cards are not replaced during a vote, not "during a political action." For example, cards are not replaced during a bloodhunt vote, which would not be true if the rule was "during a political action". There are several sources of votes: titled vampires, cards in hand, the edge, Ventrue Headquarters, and so on. Any and all of these can be used during a vote, even if casting those votes wouldn't change the verdict at the moment. They can be used in any order desired. When you burn a political card in hand for a vote, it is the player burning a card, not a vampire, so it doesn't matter whether you have any ready vampires. A vampire can get any votes from any number of sources, but can only use a given reaction or action modifier once. Tom Wylie rec.games.trading-cards.* Network Representative for aa...@hal.com Wizards of the Coast, Inc.

heckler (pech...@lvl-sun675.usc.edu) wrote: >In article <sam.bartels-05...@zirconia.gslis.ucla.edu>, >Sam Bartels <sam.b...@diamond.gslis.ucla.edu> wrote: >>Oh yeah, could any replies to this one or the paralyze question be sent >>via e-mail, thanks! >no. read the group like the rest of us. peasant. >>This is how I understand the voting situation. Correct me if I am wrong >>ANYWHERE! >with glee. >>A vampire does a political action (using a card which is replaced at the >>end of the turn) at +1 stealth >only if the political action card states that it is at stealth; currently, >most (if not all) of them do. I would think that someone with such a condescending attitude would be more careful. :) The political card which calls the vote is replaced immediately, just like any other action card. -- Eric Amick eam...@clark.net Columbia, MD Public key available via finger

Tom Wylie (aa...@hal.COM) wrote: > If a card in hand was used to start the political action, > then that card is replaced immediately, just like any other action card. > The rule is that cards are not replaced during a vote, not "during a > political action." For example, cards are not replaced during a bloodhunt > vote, which would not be true if the rule was "during a political action". Situation: I call Praxis Seizure, replacing the seizure in my hand. Someone uses the reaction (I can never remember the name) that cancels the vote (returning the vote card to your hand), untaps the vampire calling the vote, and prevents you from calling that same vote again this turn. Now I have 8 cards in my hand. Do I just discard a card to get to 7? Do I have to do that now or at the end of my turn? as always, thanx -ben -- "I've seen things you wouldn't believe. Attack ships on fire off the shoulder of Orion. I watched C-beams glitter in the dark near the Tann- hauser gate. All these moments will be lost in time, like tears in the rain."

matt...@utdallas.edu wrote: : Tom Wylie (aa...@hal.COM) wrote: : Situation: I call Praxis Seizure, replacing the seizure in my hand. : Someone uses the reaction (I can never remember the name) that cancels the : vote (returning the vote card to your hand), untaps the vampire calling : the vote, and prevents you from calling that same vote again this turn. : Now I have 8 cards in my hand. Do I just discard a card to get to 7? Do : I have to do that now or at the end of my turn? : as always, thanx : -ben In general, the way we play you would just put the card you pulled back on the top of your deck, since you would get the card nice time you draw anyway. However, this could be prevented by the fact that you do not re-draw the card until the action is complete (well, not complete, but at least started) since I believe you cannot draw here (i.e. drawing a stealth card and then using it to increase stealth--not sure if you can do that), and therefore the action would get taken back, you would take back your card, and never pick up the top card. Matt the Tired (Justicar)

<matt...@utdallas.edu> wrote: >Situation: I call Praxis Seizure, replacing the seizure in my hand. >Someone uses the reaction (I can never remember the name) that cancels the >vote (returning the vote card to your hand), untaps the vampire calling >the vote, and prevents you from calling that same vote again this turn. >Now I have 8 cards in my hand. Do I just discard a card to get to 7? Do >I have to do that now or at the end of my turn? I'm assuming you would immediately discard down to your hand size, but am double checking that. [ quoted text not captured ]

Matt Dworkin (mdwo...@force.stwing.upenn.edu) wrote: > : Situation: I call Praxis Seizure, replacing the seizure in my hand. > : Someone uses the reaction (I can never remember the name) that cancels the > : vote (returning the vote card to your hand), untaps the vampire calling > : the vote, and prevents you from calling that same vote again this turn. > : Now I have 8 cards in my hand. Do I just discard a card to get to 7? Do > : I have to do that now or at the end of my turn? > In general, the way we play you would just put the card you pulled back on > the top of your deck, since you would get the card nice time you draw anyway. > However, this could be prevented by the fact that you do not re-draw the > card until the action is complete (well, not complete, but at least started) But Praxis Seizure is a vote. You are supposed to replace it when you use it...and even if I waited until the voting starts, the card I'm talking about above (that I can't remember the name of) can still be used after voting is going on. [ quoted text not captured ]

Before I could do anything to stop it, matt...@utdallas.edu wrote: > But Praxis Seizure is a vote. You are supposed to replace it when you > use it...and even if I waited until the voting starts, the card I'm > talking about above (that I can't remember the name of) can still be used > after voting is going on. If memory serves (I don't have my rules with me), you don't replace political cards until the political action is finished. This means that either a) the vote was blocked, or b) the vote was completed. When you play that vote action, you don't replace the card immediately (which might let you draw another vote card). That way you have plenty of room in your hand if the voting action is cancelled. -- Arrogantly twisting the sterile canvas snoot of a | a-Henh! fully charged icing annointment utensil, he poots forth | a tiny green rosette near the summit of a dense but | Brian radiant muffin of his own design. | Wilson | We miss you, Frank! |

Any political action card used to start a political action is replaced immediately, as are any action modifiers or reactions played while it's being determined whether the action will be blocked. Only if the vote actually begins is card replacement put on hold. [ quoted text not captured ]

Before I could do anything to stop it, Tom Wylie wrote: > Any political action card used to start a political action is replaced > immediately, as are any action modifiers or reactions played while it's > being determined whether the action will be blocked. Only if the vote > actually begins is card replacement put on hold. Here in section 17.1 of the rules it says the following: "When a political card is played as an action or a call for a bloodhunt against a vampire committing diablerie, a vote is called. A vote is always yes or no. A political card always provides one vote for the Methusela playing it. Note that no cards played during a vote are replaced until after the vote. "Additional political cards can also be used by any of the other Methuselahs for votes. The actual effects of these cards are ignored. Cards used in this way are discarded to the ash heap, but, as stated, not replaced until the voting is finished." Note the reference to "additional political cards," which includes the original political card in the grouping of cards not replaced. They probably should have printed, "Do not replace until after the political action is completed" on the cards like they did with some combat cards. A vote is a vote until it's blocked, so it looks like no cards would be replaced until it's successfully blocked or successfully completed. Is there a design team ruling that says you replace the original action card immediately? My quote is from the revised rules. [ quoted text not captured ]