rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad

7/7 Playtested!

6 messages from 5 participants · 20 July 1998
original thread on Google Groups

Rmtc...@aol.com

Woe!!! 7/7 play tested. I finally had the chance to do it, I play tested the new errata. And I must say there is a very apparent upgrade in combat decks... actually to be more accurate, combat decks are virtually unstoppable, no kidding! Here's the break down: The players I played with didn't want me to identify them for fear they would be lynched by some of the other players here (Denver), so I will simply refer to them as wuss A, B, and C--- hahaha. Inside Joke :-) We all took a little time to build decks we were thing about since the errata was issued. And I was expecting, as is usually the case here, that we would all have original concepts for our decks utilizing the latest deck design. I was dead wrong. Only Player A stood out of the rest with a presence political deck. The rest of us had combat decks... and it was no coincidence! Like myself, the other players didn't want to play bleed decks with the new rulings because they have no "directable" ability now and thus loose their threatening nature to anyone other than their prey. I played a basic brainless Bruhah Bum Rushing deck with lots of Immortal Grapples-- and well, all the other combat decks were doing the same thing! Player B had a Losombra Deck, and Player C a larger Vamp Bruhah Deck than mine. Immediately whenever Player A pulled out a Prince from his crypt he got spanked by one of my vamps with an IM no matter how many Majestys he had. The Larger Bruhah deck attempted to use larger combos but It fell easily as my second pray against my simple combos with more vamps to spare. With some simple location intercept, I had a chance to block and do the inevitable trump combo: Agg punch then a Rotschek. Free Rotscheks are awsome with only a tiny bit of potence. The Losombra deck kept trying those silly Thoughts Betrayed as if Bruhah ever need to use stike cards to get those Torn Signposts, Death of my Conscious, etc, etc, etc. The game was torrid with BumRush-Ambush-HavenUn/IM/Pop!!! ... another vamp gets cole cocked. The new agg rule actually made the potence power delivery system just one step higher because it could deliver the heavy points better than anyone else. As was our deal, since I won I got to carry on with my deck while everyone else had to do something completely different. I just made one modification-- I actually made my deck Card Limited to 6 by putting in some psychs to replace those IMs and uped my additional strikes and dodges. The next two games I won the same way with the final one literally me against everyone else. Whew, with just a simple amount of tactics, you can abuse the current rulings like no other. Here's why (As quickly illustrated by our play test): 1. Gone are the weenie decks. No vote pushing or "zip" defense make them work too hard for their place in the winning market. This increases combat deck power because one of the very awsome upsets to them is the lack of large vampires to do their combat combos on. (No reason to use half a dozen cards wiping out a 2 cap vampire if you were expecting large vampires for the deck) Now combat decks can safely expect vampires to be larger for they can do almost nothing without disciplines, thus they must have size. 2. Political Decks will have to have presence. And as illustrated by player A, that will require putting more eggs in one basket. Once again, this increases the power of combat decks for the same reason illustrated above. 3. Bleed decks are weaker than ever. Combat decks will be able to threaten your decks, where ever they are at. But not bleed decks, you just can't influence anyone like you used to with the style of your deck. This once again puts those fun combatants as numuro uno. 4. Additional party fun for combat. Yep, we all know that return to innocense is combat deck friendly now, but has anyone noticed just how much fame is completely silly now? I was able to drop a fame about every other turn and it became a new way to literally "bleed" my target. Drop the fame, bum rush, smack and wow-- I get to hit them for 3 pool just for being a happy combat deck. Pulled fangs is actually one more advantage, you just have to give it that second thought. You see, pulled fangs was the previous fear when that opponent had some way of preventing damage (Be it flak jacket, leather jacket, or fortitude) but now that is no such worry for those who want to pounce! I'll admit, I shouldn't have been criticizing the new errata without trying it first. But is there anyone out in 7/7 land who hasn't noticed this yet? Dave the Romantic Prince of Denver -----== Posted via Deja News, The Leader in Internet Discussion ==----- http://www.dejanews.com/rg_mkgrp.xp Create Your Own Free Member Forum

CPilh...@bhak12.ac.at

In article <6ouat1$sei$1...@nnrp1.dejanews.com>, Rmtc...@aol.com wrote: > Woe!!! 7/7 play tested. > > I finally had the chance to do it, I play tested the new errata. And I > must say there is a very apparent upgrade in combat decks... actually to > be more accurate, combat decks are virtually unstoppable, no kidding! > Here's the break down: > > The players I played with didn't want me to identify them for fear they > would be lynched by some of the other players here (Denver), so I will > simply refer to them as wuss A, B, and C--- hahaha. Inside Joke :-) (snipped) > > I'll admit, I shouldn't have been criticizing the new errata without > trying it first. > But is there anyone out in 7/7 land who hasn't noticed this yet? > So what? Do you like the rules and do you intend to play with them? Or will your group decide to not incorporate them in your friendly games? We are definitely not going to use them until our current league ends (which will be in November). This is because a long time ago we decided to play each season with consistant rules. And as every player is willing to play with the league-rules when playing friendly, the 7/7-issue will be decided in late November. -Carl [ quoted text not captured ]

LSJ

Rmtc...@aol.com wrote: > Prince from his crypt he got spanked by one of my vamps with an IM no > matter how many Majestys he had. The Larger Bruhah deck attempted to Well, yeah. But what about Skin of Steel, Elysium: Arboretum, Mercy for the Weak(!?), Obedience, etc.? > much fame is completely silly now? I was able to drop a fame about > every other turn and it became a new way to literally "bleed" my target. > Drop the fame, bum rush, smack and wow-- I get to hit them for 3 pool Fame is unique. > just for being a happy combat deck. Pulled fangs is actually one more > advantage, you just have to give it that second thought. You see, > pulled fangs was the previous fear when that opponent had some way of > preventing damage (Be it flak jacket, leather jacket, or fortitude) but > now that is no such worry for those who want to pounce! ? The damage from PF can still be prevented by Flak Jacket, and now it can be prevented by damage prevention cards as well. -- L. Scott Johnson (vte...@wizards.com) VTES Net.Rep for Wizards of the Coast. Searchable database of official card text, errata, and rulings: http://deckserver.net/cgi-deckserver/rulemonger.cgi/powersearch

rmtc...@my-dejanews.com

In article <6ov1t6$ssu$1...@nnrp1.dejanews.com>, CPilh...@bhak12.ac.at wrote: > In article <6ouat1$sei$1...@nnrp1.dejanews.com>, > Rmtc...@aol.com wrote: > > Woe!!! 7/7 play tested. > So what? Do you like the rules and do you intend to play with them? > Or will your group decide to not incorporate them in your friendly > games? > > We are definitely not going to use them until our current league ends > (which will be in November). This is because a long time ago we > decided to play each season with consistant rules. And as every player > is willing to play with the league-rules when playing friendly, the > 7/7-issue will be decided in late November. > > -Carl Sorry. To clarify, I like them less now than ever. Dave the Romantic Prince of Denver -----== Posted via Deja News, The Leader in Internet Discussion ==----- [ quoted text not captured ]

Rmtc...@aol.com

In article <35B335...@wizards.com>, LSJ <vte...@wizards.com> wrote: > Rmtc...@aol.com wrote: > > just for being a happy combat deck. Pulled fangs is actually one more > > advantage, you just have to give it that second thought. You see, > > pulled fangs was the previous fear when that opponent had some way of > > preventing damage (Be it flak jacket, leather jacket, or fortitude) but > > now that is no such worry for those who want to pounce! > > ? The damage from PF can still be prevented by Flak Jacket, > and now it can be prevented by damage prevention cards as well. That's my point exactly. If you were a combat deck coming in close for the punch, one of the very few fears was that the opponent would prevent your damage and pull your fangs. But with no fear of torpor, that's much less significant now. [ quoted text not captured ]

PDB6

RmtcDave wrote: "actually to be more accurate, combat decks are virtually unstoppable, no kidding!" Umm, no. Combat decks always were and still are incredibly easy to defeat with very easy to employ and common defenses. Skin of Steel. Obedience. S:CE. Elisium. The reduction in power of IG, Pulled Fangs, and TB have slowed combat decks down even more. Don't get me wrong--combat decks are still perfectly viable and competetive, but hardly "unstoppable". "Immediately whenever Player A pulled out a Prince from his crypt he got spanked by one of my vamps with an IM no matter how many Majestys he had." The 7/7 rulings had no bearing on this. IG screwed S:CE all along, and still does. If you expect to see IG, playing with Majesty is idiocy. Skin. Of. Steel. "With some simple location intercept, I had a chance to block and do the inevitable trump combo: Agg punch then a Rotschek. Free Rotscheks are awsome with only a tiny bit of potence." You can only use Rotschreck on your opponents turn and only once per time around the table, and at the cost of other (probably more useful) master cards. What does Potence have to do with Rotschreck? "The Losombra deck kept trying those silly Thoughts Betrayed as if Bruhah ever need to use stike cards to get those Torn Signposts, Death of my Conscious, etc, etc, etc." Thoughts Betrayed exists to give the Tremere a chance against S:CE, not to give the Lasombra a chance against the Brujah. Besides, the Lasombra have access to just as much potence as the Brujah, as well as Shadow Step that prevents the Brujah from IGing them... "The game was torrid with BumRush-Ambush-HavenUn/IM/Pop!!! ... another vamp gets cole cocked. The new agg rule actually made the potence power delivery system just one step higher because it could deliver the heavy points better than anyone else." Rush decks were always perfectly viable, and the 7/7 rules made them a bit weaker than before. IG is less effective. Pulled Fangs is less effective. TB is less effective. I fail to see how the new Aggro rules made Pot/Pro better. It is now _harder_ to burn with aggro damage. "1. Gone are the weenie decks. No vote pushing or "zip" defense make them work too hard for their place in the winning market." Umm, no. This is completely incorrect. Weenie (Pre/Dom) bleed decks are still perfectly competetive. Weenie vote decks are also completely viable. You apparently werent trying hard enough. "2. Political Decks will have to have presence." Incorrect. You can make many perfecly acceptable vote decks without any presence at all. It requires Bribes, table talk, princes, or Justicar votes. In no way difficult to do. "3. Bleed decks are weaker than ever. Combat decks will be able to threaten your decks, where ever they are at. But not bleed decks, you just can't influence anyone like you used to with the style of your deck. This once again puts those fun combatants as numuro uno." This is just idiocy. Bleed decks are still the basic and most effective deck style in the game. If you are afraid of Rush decks, use good combat defense. Obedience. Skin of Steel. "4. Additional party fun for combat. Yep, we all know that return to innocense is combat deck friendly now, but has anyone noticed just how much fame is completely silly now? I was able to drop a fame about every other turn and it became a new way to literally "bleed" my target." Fame is unique. Has been for years. Ok, now Fame allows a combat deck to effectively bleed for a bit each turn, but it costs a Master card and multiple actions, and is still less effective than just bleeding. "Pulled fangs is actually one more advantage, you just have to give it that second thought. You see, pulled fangs was the previous fear when that opponent had some way of preventing damage (Be it flak jacket, leather jacket, or fortitude) but now that is no such worry for those who want to pounce!" Oh, yes. That makes it _much_ better than when it burned a vampire every time it was played. Peter D Bakija PD...@aol.com "To this vast wasteland we will set a flame This is the beginning of our burning farm" -Shonen Knife