Awakened and missing something

Ouch! I think i was missing something about the revised rules on cards. I read that the Wake with the evening is not replaced until the next Mathuselah's playing the Wake untap phase. Does it still works this way? If it does, why the Wake was so changed? Because with the Forced Awak around there was too many untaps around? Thanks to anyone who can answer. Tetra. Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Before you buy.

On Thu, 17 Feb 2000 21:46:09 GMT, tetragr...@my-deja.com wrote: >Ouch! >I think i was missing something >about the revised rules on cards. >I read that the Wake with the evening >is not replaced until the next Mathuselah's playing the Wake >untap phase. Til your own next untap, right. >Does it still works this way? If it does, why Yep. >the Wake was so changed? Because with the Forced Awak around >there was too many untaps around? Nope. But the problem with Wake was that you could cycle it from your hand at any point ("i Wake and fail to generate enough intercept to block" or just "i don't block"), and since there was no combat, you just replaced immediately - making the card zero-cost. Now, the card has a cost. There was much debate about this recently as well, if you want to eyeball dejanews. -- Derek Deafness never kept composers from hearing the music. It only stopped them hearing the distractions.

In article <3798C485E6CC83F3.0A594907...@lp.airnews.net>, [ quoted text not captured ] Thanks for the explanations. Just to express my personal opinion: i don't agree with such reinterpretation of the Wake. Anyway, it's simpler now to trick minions with Sleeping Mind, since the Wake as it is now its far less useful than before, and it was one of the few defences against the "Sleeping" deck. But surely this was already well debated on the forum. Still happy to know some opinions. [ quoted text not captured ]

Derek Ray wrote: > > On Sat, 19 Feb 2000 14:29:17 GMT, tetragr...@my-deja.com wrote: > > > > >Thanks for the explanations. > >Just to express my personal opinion: > >i don't agree with such reinterpretation of the Wake. > >Anyway, it's simpler now to trick minions > >with Sleeping Mind, since the Wake as it is > >now its far less useful than before, and it > >was one of the few defences against the "Sleeping" deck. > > It still is, since it does not untap the minion, but allows the minion > to act AS IF untapped. This, too has been specifically ruled upon, > which is a good thing since Misdirection/SM otherwise would be just > TOTALLY heinous instead of mostly. Actually it makes SM wallpaper. -- Gary J. Weiner \ "We've got a blind date with Destiny...and webm...@hatrack.net \ it looks like she's ordered the lobster." http://www.hatrack.net \ -The Shoveler, "Mystery Men" "Hang Your Web With Us!"\

On Sun, 20 Feb 2000, Gary J. Weiner wrote: > Actually it makes SM wallpaper. SM was ludicrously stupid in the first place, however. You were always supposed to be able to tap/be tapped in V:TES and survive if you could pull a Wake, be it from your taking your own actions or from a Misdirection etc. -- James Coupe

[ quoted text not captured ] I don't think the inferior form was that bad. It isn't unreasonable for one tapped vamp to unable to play wakes/etc. and block. There are cards that have similar effects. The superior form is, as you say, just stupid. Misdirection/Sleeping mind is an almost guaranteed kill strategy. Unfortunately, instead of thinking of something interesting, the card was made into more VTES wallpaper. [ quoted text not captured ]

On Sun, 20 Feb 2000 10:21:52 -0500, "Gary J. Weiner" <webm...@hatrack.net> wrote: >Derek Ray wrote: >> >> It still is, since it does not untap the minion, but allows the minion >> to act AS IF untapped. This, too has been specifically ruled upon, >> which is a good thing since Misdirection/SM otherwise would be just >> TOTALLY heinous instead of mostly. > >Actually it makes SM wallpaper. Guess you've never tried to bleed through an ANI untap deck - Nossie OR Gangrel OR Tzimisce. If I use either, I generally include both Seduction and Sleeping Mind in my decks - a few more Seductions, but plenty of SM as well. Especially since it also stops 2nd tradition, which I assume you don't see much of either. [ quoted text not captured ]

"Gary J. Weiner" wrote: > James Coupe wrote: > > Gary J. Weiner wrote: > > > Actually it makes SM wallpaper. > > > > SM was ludicrously stupid in the first place, however. You were always > > supposed to be able to tap/be tapped in V:TES and survive if you could > > pull a Wake, be it from your taking your own actions or from a > > Misdirection etc. > > I don't think the inferior form was that bad. It isn't unreasonable for > one tapped vamp to unable to play wakes/etc. and block. There are cards > that have similar effects. The inferior form of Sleeping Mind is unaffected by the 7/7 clarification. The named (tapped) vampire still cannot block, even if he Wakes. > The superior form is, as you say, just stupid. Misdirection/Sleeping > mind is an almost guaranteed kill strategy. > > Unfortunately, instead of thinking of something interesting, the card > was made into more VTES wallpaper. Something interesting such as... ? (The RT had come under fire before for "coming up with something interesting" - the problem is that interesting is typically not easy to remember. See the 7/7 errata on Tomb of Ramses and Return to Innocence.) -- LSJ (vte...@wizards.com) V:TES Net.Rep for Wizards of the Coast. Links to revised rulebook, rulings, errata, and tournament rules: http://www.wizards.com/VTES/rules.asp