Bizzare Vote Deck

This is a deck that I have been playing for a while now. Any comments would be appreciated. Crypt (12) 1 Igo the Hungary 2 Delilah Easton 3 Chandler 3 Gideon Fontaine 4 Daliyah 5 Zebulon 6 Rake 7 Carlotta 8 Anson 9 Ingrid Rossler 10 Queen Anne 11 Etrius Total 69 5.75 average Masters (33) Obfuscate 3 Protean 3 Dominate 3 Presence 2 Minion Tap 3 Blood Doll 5 Info Highway 2 Elysium the arboretum 2 Elysium the palace... 1 Elder Library 1 Uptown HG 1 Society HG 1 Zoo HG 1 Heidelburg Castle 1 Inbase Discotek 1 KRCG News Radio 1 Auspex (6) Telepathic Counter 6 Dominate (5) Govern the Unaligned 5 Obfuscate (12) Cloak of the Gathering 8 Lost in the Crowds 2 Faceless Night 2 Presence (11) Bewitching Oration 2 Enchant Kindred 3 Majesty 5 Voter Captivation 1 Protean (12) Earth Control 5 Earth Meld 7 Equipment (10) Flak Jacket 4 Saturday Night Special 2 Submachine Gun 2 Palatial Estates 2 Votes (27) Autarkis Persecution 3 Ancient Influence 1 Banishment 1 Disputed Territory 3 Domain Challenge 3 KRC 3 Praxis Solomon 1 PS Brussels 2 PS Berlin 1 PS Frankfurt 2 PS Glasgow 1 PS Paris 2 PS Stockholm 2 Regaining the Upper... 2 Others (16) WWEF 6 2nd Tradition 5 4th Tradition 4 5th Tradition 1 Deck Size 132 (a little large but more useful in a huge group game) A bit bizzare with 5 disciplines running around but it usually works out in the end. Any comments would be helpful. Jeff

Why do you need three dominate master cards if you only have five cards requiring that skill (gov the un.)? My advice would be either get rid of all but one of the masters or include some other minor helpful dominate cards, especially defelction, obedience, grave robbing, etc. Bleed bounce has always worked well in my vote decks, I would also recommend adding tel. misdirections, if any of your vamps has superior auspex (I can't remember off-hand). Overall this looks like a good deck even though it is huge. . .a fragment of the book of nod would help you cycle through your cards quicker (if you have one that is) Let us know how your crazy votin' deck fares, huh?

James Cotsios <j...@qadrant.com.au> wrote: >Just a quick question, >Allies can be equiped with Equipment. As far as I know allies >are minions so can equip. Someone in my group said they saw a >Vampire Q&A in some magazine that contradicted, saying that >minions cannot have equipment. I understand retainers cannot be >equipped but minions? > Jim > email: j...@qadrant.com.au Allies can get equipment and block. There are exceptions such as Hell Hounds that say they can take no actions and only block. REF

In article <311B06...@qadrant.com.au>, James Cotsios <j...@qadrant.com.au> wrote: >Just a quick question, > >Allies can be equiped with Equipment. As far as I know allies >are minions so can equip. Someone in my group said they saw a >Vampire Q&A in some magazine that contradicted, saying that >minions cannot have equipment. I understand retainers cannot be >equipped but minions? Yes, allies can equip, unless the card prevents this (like the Hellhound). On a related note: Can a Hellhound receive equipment from another minion via the Heidelburg Castle? This would seem to be a loophole that could be used to give equipment to the Hound, which could have easily been soved by just writing "the Hellhound cannot have equipment"on the Hellhound card... -Elfholme P.S. I hate that castle.... -- ****************************************************************************** This bit of wisdom has been brought to you by: Mark Havener Lord of elfh...@netcom.com Wood Elf King (and Jyhad player extraordinaire!) ******************************************************************************

James Cotsios (j...@qadrant.com.au) wrote: : Just a quick question, : Allies can be equiped with Equipment. As far as I know allies : are minions so can equip. Someone in my group said they saw a : Vampire Q&A in some magazine that contradicted, saying that : minions cannot have equipment. I understand retainers cannot be : equipped but minions? : Jim : email: j...@qadrant.com.au The magazine, I believe, is none other than the most recent Inquest... In that Q&A, the first question asked if allies could get equipment. The answer they gave was [give or take an unimportant word] "No, allies cannot use equipment. Only vampires and minions may use equipment." The other answers [save possibly for the one that says you can only play skill cards on -your- -controlled- vampires] all seemed okay, but the interpretations of minion and vampire must be wrong... -- --------------------------------------------------------------------------- | "What is a man without the beasts? If the beasts were gone, | | man would die from a great loneliness of spirit." | | "Confuse, annoy, and dee-STROY!!" Call me "Nicole" and I | | npu...@tiger.lsu.edu -- Jet...@aol.com will have to kill you. | ---------------------------------------------------------------------------

aa...@cats.ucsc.edu (Thomas R Wylie) writes: >Mark Havener <elfh...@netcom.com> wrote: >>On a related note: Can a Hellhound receive equipment from another minion >>via the Heidelburg Castle? This would seem to be a loophole that could >>be used to give equipment to the Hound, which could have easily been >>soved by just writing "the Hellhound cannot have equipment"on the >>Hellhound card... >Yes, hellhounds can receive equipment via Heidelburg Castle. They can >also receive equipment via playing Zip Gun. Basically, the intention was not Actually, there's still no way for a Hellhound to get equipped, as it may have slipped your mind, Heidelburg (berg?) is only usable between vampires AFAIK. At least, that's what my copy says... This was an issue in a game we played where someone wanted to give their Renagade Garou a flamethrower. *shudder* >Tom Wylie rec.games.trading-cards.* Network Representative for >aa...@cats.ucsc.edu Wizards of the Coast, Inc. -Scott - No, the other one. -- / "If you're so special, then | Scott Danby, USC Class o' 95 \ | why aren't you dead?" | da...@scf.usc.edu | \ the Breeders, IJWGA | X-phile, Mistie, Tzimisce, Loyal Arachnid /

Mark Havener <elfh...@netcom.com> wrote: >On a related note: Can a Hellhound receive equipment from another minion >via the Heidelburg Castle? This would seem to be a loophole that could >be used to give equipment to the Hound, which could have easily been >soved by just writing "the Hellhound cannot have equipment"on the >Hellhound card... Yes, hellhounds can receive equipment via Heidelburg Castle. They can also receive equipment via playing Zip Gun. Basically, the intention was not to let hellhounds have equipment, ever. It was just that they couldn't take actions: they couldn't do D-bleeds, couldn't go after cards that let themselves be burned as actions (like Pentex Subversion), and so on. Being "unable" to have equipment is simply the most visible result of being unable to take actions. [ quoted text not captured ]

Scott Danby <da...@nunki.usc.edu> wrote: >>Yes, hellhounds can receive equipment via Heidelburg Castle. They can >>also receive equipment via playing Zip Gun. Basically, the intention was not >Actually, there's still no way for a Hellhound to get equipped, as it may >have slipped your mind, Heidelburg (berg?) is only usable between vampires >AFAIK. At least, that's what my copy says... Sigh... Gimme an R! "R!" Gimme an F! "F!" Gimme an T! "T!" Gimme an C! "C!" What does that spell? "RTFC!" What did Tom forget to do? "RTFC!" "Read the card! Read the card! Yaaaay!" [ quoted text not captured ]

> >Actually, there's still no way for a Hellhound to get equipped, as it may > >have slipped your mind, Heidelburg (berg?) is only usable between vampires > >AFAIK. At least, that's what my copy says... What about with the Succubus Club? If the club was out could you trade something so that your hellhound got a gun or sportbike? Also if you had the Secubus club out and one of your vamps had some equipment could you trade it with yourself to move it to another minion? Olethros

Thomas R Wylie (aa...@cats.ucsc.edu) wrote: : Sigh... : : Gimme an R! "R!" : Gimme an F! "F!" : Gimme an T! "T!" : Gimme an C! "C!" : : What does that spell? "RTFC!" : What did Tom forget to do? "RTFC!" From his above cheer, it looks like he forgot how to spell. : "Read the card! Read the card! Yaaaay!" And yes, it certainly would help. -James

Doh! Sorry folks, for even asking this question without reading the card in question myself. Someone tried to use HC to give his dog a gun, and I ass/u/me'd he knew what the card did (don't use it myself...equipment's for wimps... ;) ). I will have to Rush his vamps first in our next game, for putting me in this position... Color me embarassed, -Elfholme In article <4fkf59$2...@darkstar.ucsc.edu>, Thomas R Wylie <aa...@cats.ucsc.edu> wrote: > >Mark Havener <elfh...@netcom.com> wrote: >>On a related note: Can a Hellhound receive equipment from another minion >>via the Heidelburg Castle? This would seem to be a loophole that could >>be used to give equipment to the Hound, which could have easily been >>soved by just writing "the Hellhound cannot have equipment"on the >>Hellhound card... > >Yes, hellhounds can receive equipment via Heidelburg Castle. They can >also receive equipment via playing Zip Gun. Basically, the intention was not >to let hellhounds have equipment, ever. It was just that they couldn't >take actions: they couldn't do D-bleeds, couldn't go after cards that let >themselves be burned as actions (like Pentex Subversion), and so on. Being >"unable" to have equipment is simply the most visible result of being unable >to take actions. > > >Tom Wylie rec.games.trading-cards.* Network Representative for >aa...@cats.ucsc.edu Wizards of the Coast, Inc. > -- [ quoted text not captured ]

In article <4fkh54$c...@nunki.usc.edu>, da...@nunki.usc.edu (Scott Danby) wrote: > Actually, there's still no way for a Hellhound to get equipped, as it may Concealed Weapon (played disciplineless) and Zip Gun are two ways that I can think of, even if Heidelberg can't be used. Ack! It's a hell hound with a .44!! I still think that if you have 2 Hell Hounds, they should be able to take a simultaneous action to recruit another Hell Hound. They're breeding! Judy

Thomas R Wylie (aa...@cats.ucsc.edu) wrote: : Gimme an R! "R!" : Gimme an F! "F!" : Gimme an T! "T!" : Gimme an C! "C!" : What does that spell? "RTFC!" Actually, it spells RFTC... <grin> : What did Tom forget to do? "RTFC!" : "Read the card! Read the card! Yaaaay!" Gimme an P! "P!" Gimme an T! "T!" Gimme an F! "F!" Gimme an P! "P!" What does that spell? "PTFP!" What does tht stand for? "Proofread The Followup Post! What _else_ did Tom forget to do? "PTFP!" "Proof the followup! Proof the followup! Yaaaay!" Muchas Smileys; Shane H.W. Travis | Galbraith's Law of Human Nature: Faced with the tra...@duke.usask.ca | choice between changing one's mind and proving Saskatoon, Saskatchewan | that there is no need to do so, almost everybody | gets busy on the proof.

On Sat, 10 Feb 1996, Mark Havener wrote: > >Just a quick question, > > > >Allies can be equiped with Equipment. As far as I know allies > >are minions so can equip. Someone in my group said they saw a > >Vampire Q&A in some magazine that contradicted, saying that > >minions cannot have equipment. I understand retainers cannot be > >equipped but minions? > That means they didn't even played the game :) > > On a related note: Can a Hellhound receive equipment from another minion > via the Heidelburg Castle? This would seem to be a loophole that could > be used to give equipment to the Hound, which could have easily been > soved by just writing "the Hellhound cannot have equipment"on the > Hellhound card... Heidelburg Castle doesn't work for allies :( It's stated in the card:"transfer blood, retainers & equipment between 2 ready vampires." That leaves Allies out. Don't ask me why :) > > P.S. I hate that castle.... Don't say that... I love it :) Can you imagine if you have this card in play and you get Charnas on you? It'd be almost useless :) The lady thunder gives a fine solution to the Charnas problem too (it takes the Malks to spoil Tremere's fun (: ), and even if she gets the imp, she can toss it to another guy (with the castle), make him preform a bleed (or other damaging but easily blockable action) and voilla :) It's a shame about allies, though... I don't have more than 1 flak jacket in my deck, but I'd like to equip Muddles with it every time he goes to work :) David Pontes 8[

In article <4fnpac$c...@gw.dgii.com> jam...@gw.digibd.com (James Puzzo) writes: >Thomas R Wylie (aa...@cats.ucsc.edu) wrote: >From his above cheer, it looks like he forgot how to spell. >: "Read the card! Read the card! Yaaaay!" >And yes, it certainly would help. Net reps don't need this kind of abuse. Tyranid Tim left rec.miniatures.warhammer because of continuous attacks over big price increases and the like. Other posts have been more harsh and some have decidedly unfriendly tone. I for one like seeing what Tom has to pass along from WoTC even if I know the answer is sometimes wrong.

Daniel Hoffman (dhof...@cris.com) wrote: [ quoted text not captured ] Agreed. Although WotC's lack of concern for its customers in general makes me angry, Tom is (no offense) naught but a messenger of them here. He tells us what the rules team does or what other sections of WotC is doing [even if he does have some part in it]. He does not deserve this treatment. I think a lot of people take for granted the fact that he is here at all. WotC doesn't HAVE to have a netrep for this topic, especially considering that J/VTES isn't their best-selling game. I'm not saying that everyone should lep up and shake Tom's hand for what he does, especially when he doesn't seem to care about what would seem like an insignificant detail but actually has an impact on the game [case in point:Disguised Weapon discussions recently], but cut the man some slack folks. I'm good with cards, but Tom probably has to keep track of so many [probably all the magic cards with errata, plus all the VTES cards, and their old Jyhd counterparts and all THEIR errata], that it's no wonder he makes a mistake now and then. Hell, a group of us played with Dark Sovereigns for almost a week without ever noticing that you couldn't use Heidelburg Castle on a vamp in torpor. Nobody's perfect. [ quoted text not captured ]

elfh...@netcom.com (Mark Havener) wrote: > On a related note: Can a Hellhound receive equipment from another minion > via the Heidelburg Castle? This would seem to be a loophole that could > be used to give equipment to the Hound, which could have easily been > soved by just writing "the Hellhound cannot have equipment"on the > Hellhound card... I was concerned about this as well, but then realized that the HC transfer is restricted to two ready vampires, so no problem. --- Eric Pettersen pe...@cgl.ucsf.edu (NeXTmail capable)

In article <4fsv83$c...@gw.dgii.com> jam...@gw.digibd.com (James Puzzo) writes: >I do NOT appreciate your singling my post out as abusive from a cast of >thousands which actually had that intent. Okay, sorry about making you feel I singled out your post. I had written a better comment about some other post but my reader hung and my post got lost and I couldn't find the original post so I just picked a different post and wrote a shorter comment. I tried to say other posts were more harsh and some were just unfriendly. I didn't think your post was posted in a friendly way.

Daniel Hoffman (dhof...@cris.com) wrote: : In article <4fnpac$c...@gw.dgii.com> jam...@gw.digibd.com (James Puzzo) writes: : >Thomas R Wylie (aa...@cats.ucsc.edu) wrote: : : >From his above cheer, it looks like he forgot how to spell. : : >: "Read the card! Read the card! Yaaaay!" : : >And yes, it certainly would help. : : Net reps don't need this kind of abuse. Tyranid Tim left : rec.miniatures.warhammer because of continuous attacks over big price : increases and the like. Other posts have been more harsh and some have : decidedly unfriendly tone. I for one like seeing what Tom has to pass along : from WoTC even if I know the answer is sometimes wrong. I'm sorry that you thought that my post was a "harsh" response. Could you explain how either of my two sentences convey a sense of malice? I have seen malicious posts on this group... I do not believe that mine was one of them. I like Jyhad. And I do like the fact that Tom does pass along information from the official source. You will note that I do NOT complain about the game, or the company. I do NOT complain about Tom's involvement in this group. All I said were two things: Looks like he forgot how to spell. Someone else posted a much longer analysis of this mistake, something which certainly was meant to point out the mistake and to "rub it in" a little bit. Tom asked a question, I answered. That's all. No malicious intent. Tom drew attention to the mistake by making his "cheer" such a prominent part of his message. I do not even suggest (as in the other post) that Tom does not check his own messages before he sends them. Why single me out, and not others? My second sentence: "Yes, it certainly would help.". Again, Tom is NOT acting in am official capacity in this message, he is poking fun at himself and speaking as a member of a small community. I affirmed this fact in a non accusatory way. I too feel that Tom (and WoTC) takes quite a bit of abuse on this group, and it is not fair for us to berate Tom for taking time to help us out and to do his job in the best way he knows how. But if there are _valid_ concerns, and _valid_ arguments, why can we not voice them? I do NOT appreciate your singling my post out as abusive from a cast of thousands which actually had that intent. -James

Daniel Hoffman (dhof...@cris.com) wrote: : In article <4fsv83$c...@gw.dgii.com> (James Puzzo) writes: : >I do NOT appreciate your singling my post out as abusive from a cast of : >thousands which actually had that intent. : Okay, sorry about making you feel I singled out your post. I had written a : better comment about some other post but my reader hung and my post got lost : and I couldn't find the original post so I just picked a different post and : wrote a shorter comment. I tried to say other posts were more harsh and : some were just unfriendly. I didn't think your post was posted in a : friendly way. I would appreciate it if, in future, directed attacks of any kind were taken off-line. For those who never got to see my initial post and only saw your rebuttal, I am probably painted as an accusatory pig. I'm glad you have apologized, but please be aware of what singling out a post signifies. That post is your example of the abusive behavior describe. If you _really_ "wanted" to respond to a different post and couldn't find it, I really would rather that you had simply made your response WITHOUT singling out ANY posts. Perhaps it was a mistake in judgement - in which case, I understand. I have been known to make them myself. Sorry that you saw my post as unfriendly... -James

Hi Jim, On Fri, 9 Feb 1996, James Cotsios wrote: > Just a quick question, > > Allies can be equiped with Equipment. As far as I know allies > are minions so can equip. Someone in my group said they saw a > Vampire Q&A in some magazine that contradicted, saying that > minions cannot have equipment. I understand retainers cannot be > equipped but minions? > Well, vampires are also minions, so that would make equipment pretty useless.... You are correct, allies (and vampires) can have equipment. Algustas *****We have no eternal allies, and we have no perpetual enemies. Our interests are eternal and pertpetual, and those interests it is our duty to follow.***** Lord Palmerston, to House of Commons, 1848.

npu...@tiger.lsu.edu (Nicole Janine Purvis) wrote: >James Cotsios (j...@qadrant.com.au) wrote: >: Just a quick question, > The magazine, I believe, is none other than the most recent Inquest... >In that Q&A, the first question asked if allies could get equipment. The >answer they gave was [give or take an unimportant word] "No, allies >cannot use equipment. Only vampires and minions may use equipment." The >other answers [save possibly for the one that says you can only play >skill cards on -your- -controlled- vampires] all seemed okay, but the >interpretations of minion and vampire must be wrong... I am a relatively new player and was somewhat confused about that myself. I was under the impression that a Minion referred to ALL creatures, vamps or otherwise. And what is the difference between an Ally and a Retainer? -BUZZ [DISCLAIMER: the opinion(s) expressed in this article are entirely that of the poster, and in no way reflect that of The Walt Disney Company.]

philli...@corp.disney.com (Buzz) wrote: >n > I am a relatively new player and was somewhat confused about that >myself. I was under the impression that a Minion referred to ALL >creatures, vamps or otherwise. And what is the difference between an >Ally and a Retainer? >-BUZZ >[DISCLAIMER: the opinion(s) expressed in this article are entirely >that of the poster, and in no way reflect that of The Walt Disney >Company.] Minions does indeed refer to vampires and allies. Basically independant entities capable of taking actions and/or blocking. Ally is a minion recruited by a vampire that is controlled by the Meth. Retainers are recruited by a minion and stay attached to the minion. Retainers cannot act independantly and merlley supply some advantage or mod to the controling minion. Rory

I heard one of my friends express the difference very succinctly. Retainers are just "living equipment" of a minion. chick...@msn.com

Buzz <philli...@corp.disney.com> wrote: >> The magazine, I believe, is none other than the most recent Inquest... >>In that Q&A, the first question asked if allies could get equipment. The >>answer they gave was [give or take an unimportant word] "No, allies >>cannot use equipment. Only vampires and minions may use equipment."... > I am a relatively new player and was somewhat confused about that >myself... Probably because their statement is incorrect. All minions can use equipment, and "minions" includes allies as well as vampires. >And what is the difference between an Ally and a Retainer? Basically, allies can function independently (as vampires can), whereas retainers are always attached to a particular vampire or ally, much like equipment is. [ quoted text not captured ]