Hand size and directed action questions

1) Raptors (Sup, -1 hand size per) and Aura Reading (Sup, hand size is 9), which has precedence in combat? If the opposing minion had a raptor and I played aura perception would my hand size be 8 or 9? guessing 8 but I was unsure when the timing of raptor came into play. I would WWEF would also affect Aura Reading the same way? 2) I was looking through the Sabbat War rulebook last night and I was looking for information on directed actions specifically. I know that (D) action bleed can only affect your prey or predator, but what about other (D) actions such as such as Bum's Rush or (D)actions targeting yourself? I didn't think Bum Rush was limited, but I trying to find a ruling supporting it. Just a Thought, Justin -- Justin Lacey Tzimisce Historian of Charlotte Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/

kindred_historian wrote: > > 1) Raptors (Sup, -1 hand size per) and Aura Reading (Sup, hand size is > 9), which has precedence in combat? If the opposing minion had a Neither. Both apply. Base hand size is reset from 7 to 9, and the -1 modifier still applied (making the hand size 8). > raptor and I played aura perception would my hand size be 8 or 9? > guessing 8 but I was unsure when the timing of raptor came into play. 8 is correct. > I would WWEF would also affect Aura Reading the same way? Any card you are not replacing counts against your hand size, yes. [LSJ 03-AUG-1998] > 2) I was looking through the Sabbat War rulebook last night and I was > looking for information on directed actions specifically. I know that > (D) action bleed can only affect your prey or predator, but what about > other (D) actions such as such as Bum's Rush or (D)actions targeting > yourself? I didn't think Bum Rush was limited, but I trying to find a > ruling supporting it. Bleeds are always directed, and can only target one's prey by default. All actions (those labelled as "(D)" and those not labelled as "(D)") can target any legal target as given by the rules and card text, with the overriding consideration that one can never bleed oneself and one minion cannot enter combat with another controlled by the same methuselah. Any action ("(D)" or not) that targets oneself is undirected. Any action ("(D)" or not) that targets a single other player is directed. Any action that targets multiple players is undirected. -- LSJ (vte...@white-wolf.com) VTES Net.Rep for White Wolf, Inc. Links to revised rulebook, rulings, errata, and tournament rules: http://www.white-wolf.com/vtes/ [ quoted text not captured ]

> > 1) Raptors (Sup, -1 hand size per) and Aura Reading (Sup, hand size is > > 9), which has precedence in combat? If the opposing minion had a > > Neither. Both apply. Base hand size is reset from 7 to 9, and the -1 > modifier still applied (making the hand size 8). > > > raptor and I played aura perception would my hand size be 8 or 9? > > guessing 8 but I was unsure when the timing of raptor came into play. > > 8 is correct. > Both apply. hmm... so if a blocking minion had 7 raptors on and you had a hand size of seven, then you could still play an aura perception before range was determined? Thanks, Justin -- Justin Lacey Tzimisce Historian of Charlotte [ quoted text not captured ]

kindred_historian <jbl...@hotmail.com> wrote: > Both apply. hmm... so if a blocking minion had 7 raptors on and you > had a hand size of seven, then you could still play an aura perception > before range was determined? No. Raptors do not wait until range to reduce your hand size. Aura Reading cannot be played until you are in combat, at which time your hand size is 0 (7 minus 7). -- LSJ (vte...@white-wolf.com) VTES Net.Rep for White Wolf, Inc. Links to revised rulebook, rulings, errata, and tournament rules: http://www.white-wolf.com/vtes/ [ quoted text not captured ]

kindred_historian wrote: > > 1) Raptors (Sup, -1 hand size per) and Aura Reading (Sup, hand size is > 9), which has precedence in combat? If the opposing minion had a raptor Neither. Both apply. Base hand size is reset from 7 to 9, and the -1 modifier still applied (making the hand size 8). > and I played aura perception would my hand size be 8 or 9? guessing 8 > but I was unsure when the timing of raptor came into play. I would WWEF 8 is correct. > would also affect Aura Reading the same way? Any card you are not replacing counts against your hand size, yes. [LSJ 03-AUG-1998] > 2) I was looking through the Sabbat War rulebook last night and I was > looking for information on directed actions specifically. I know that > (D) action bleed can only affect your prey or predator, but what about > other (D) actions such as such as Bum's Rush or (D)actions targeting > yourself? I didn't think Bum Rush was limited, but I trying to find a > ruling supporting it. Bleeds are always directed, and can only target one's prey by default. All actions (those labelled as "(D)" and those not labelled as "(D)") can target any legal target as given by the rules and card text, with the overriding consideration that one can never bleed oneself and one minion cannot enter combat with another controlled by the same methuselah. Any action ("(D)" or not) that targets oneself is undirected. Any action ("(D)" or not) that targets a single other player is directed. Any action that targets multiple players is undirected. -- LSJ (vte...@white-wolf.com) V:TES Net.Rep for White Wolf, Inc. [ quoted text not captured ]

I know that > > (D) action bleed can only affect your prey or predator, but what about > > other (D) actions such as such as Bum's Rush or (D)actions targeting > > yourself? I didn't think Bum Rush was limited, but I trying to find a > > ruling supporting it. > > Bleeds are always directed, and can only target one's prey by default. by default, yes... but doesn't the card text "D" allow you to target any methuselah, overriding the default???? it isn't just a reminder that bleeding your prey is directed, is it? if this is the case, where is the rulebook rule that explains that? we've always used hacks to target across the table... did it change by specific ruling? i can't find it in clarifications, etc. help. this really changes things... -spin, gunga din [ quoted text not captured ]

spin...@my-deja.com wrote: > I know that > > > (D) action bleed can only affect your prey or predator, but what > about > > > other (D) actions such as such as Bum's Rush or (D)actions > > > targeting yourself? I didn't think Bum Rush was limited, but I > > > trying to find a ruling supporting it. > > > > Bleeds are always directed, and can only target one's prey by > > default. > by default, yes... but doesn't the card text "D" allow you to target > any methuselah, overriding the default???? it isn't just a reminder that > bleeding your prey is directed, is it? if this is the case, where is > the rulebook rule that explains that? we've always used hacks to Yes. 6.2.2 (right around that big "(D)" symbol on page 28). A better question would be "where is the rulebook rule that imparts to (D) symbols the ability to alter the list of legal targets of an action?" There used to be errata to that effect (which applied only to (D) symbols on bleed actions and not, for example, to the (D) symbol on Army of Rats). But that errata was dropped in RTR 07-JUL-1998. -- LSJ (vte...@white-wolf.com) VTES Net.Rep for White Wolf, Inc. Links to revised rulebook, rulings, errata, and tournament rules: http://www.white-wolf.com/vtes/ Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/

> > > Bleeds are always directed, and can only target one's prey by > > > default. > > by default, yes... but doesn't the card text "D" allow you to target > > any methuselah, overriding the default???? it isn't just a reminder > that > > bleeding your prey is directed, is it? if this is the case, where is > > the rulebook rule that explains that? we've always used hacks to > > Yes. 6.2.2 (right around that big "(D)" symbol on page 28). > > A better question would be "where is the rulebook rule that imparts > to (D) symbols the ability to alter the list of legal targets of > an action?" no kidding. you're so right it hurts. also see 6.1.6. the "D" was always seen as "direct this action;" look at the non-bleed actions like bum's rush and you'll see how we came up with this stupidity. but the new rulebook makes it abundantly clear. it is just a reminder that the action will probably be targeted. i like it already. -spinal tap =-0=0-= /-/- [ quoted text not captured ]