frenzy cards - who are they played "on"

Apologies if this has been asked before, but I wasn't able to find anything on a google search. Several cards now have the ability to cancel a frenzy card played "on" a vampire. My question is, what constitutes "played on" a vampire? It seems like it's reasonable to make a "common sense" judgement on most (if not all) of the current cards, but is there a hard and fast rule? If I'm in combat and I play Drawing Out the Beast, that prevents you from doing some stuff and gives you +1 hand damage. That affects your vampire and you can play a reflex that cancels frenzy to stop it. If I play Devil Channel: Hands to do agg damage, even though it affects your vampire (adversely!), it doesn't *directly* affect him, and so I believe it can only be cancelled by a Tranquility (or can be cancelled by the methuselah that controls the Akunanse that's using DC:H). But what about something like Devil Channel: Throat. This is a frenzy card that cancels a blocking attempt and taps the blocking minion. Using WoD logic, I believe this card is considered to be directly affecting the acting minion, and only cancellable by him. Simply going from card text, I think it's impossible to tell if it frenzies the acting minion or frenzies the blocking minion. Could it be cancelled by a reflex that cancels frenzy? More generally, is there an easy way to tell when a card is "played on" an opposing/blocking minion, and when it's "played on" the minion that's playing it?

Chris Berger wrote: > Apologies if this has been asked before, but I wasn't able to find > anything on a google search. Several cards now have the ability to > cancel a frenzy card played "on" a vampire. My question is, what > constitutes "played on" a vampire? > > It seems like it's reasonable to make a "common sense" judgement on > most (if not all) of the current cards, but is there a hard and fast > rule? If I'm in combat and I play Drawing Out the Beast, that prevents > you from doing some stuff and gives you +1 hand damage. That affects > your vampire and you can play a reflex that cancels frenzy to stop it. Correct. > If I play Devil Channel: Hands to do agg damage, even though it affects > your vampire (adversely!), it doesn't *directly* affect him, and so I > believe it can only be cancelled by a Tranquility (or can be cancelled > by the methuselah that controls the Akunanse that's using DC:H). Correct. D-C: Hands does not affect the opposing minion. > But what about something like Devil Channel: Throat. This is a frenzy > card that cancels a blocking attempt and taps the blocking minion. > Using WoD logic, I believe this card is considered to be directly > affecting the acting minion, and only cancellable by him. Simply going > from card text, I think it's impossible to tell if it frenzies the > acting minion or frenzies the blocking minion. Could it be cancelled ? For Devil-Channel: Throat, where the case is ambiguous as to which minion it is being played on, the ambiguity is clarified by explicit card text: "Frenzy (played on this acting vampire)." > by a reflex that cancels frenzy? More generally, is there an easy way > to tell when a card is "played on" an opposing/blocking minion, and > when it's "played on" the minion that's playing it? If the frenzy card targets/selects/chooses/affects the minion when played, then it is being played on the minion. If explicit card text specifies on which minion the card is played, use the explicit card text. -- That is my story, be it bitter or be it sweet. Keep a little and let a little come back to me. LSJ (vtesr...@TRAPwhite-wolf.com) V:TES Net.Rep (remove spam trap to reply) http://www.white-wolf.com/vtes/

LSJ wrote: > > ? > For Devil-Channel: Throat, where the case is ambiguous as to > which minion it is being played on, the ambiguity is clarified > by explicit card text: "Frenzy (played on this acting vampire)." > Sorry, that's what I get for not having the actual card text in front of me - just being confused by the interaction from seeing the card at pre-release. As far as DC: Hands and Drawing Out the Beast, on the one hand, I can see how they are logically different, but on the other hand, it doesn't seem as if DotB actually *selects* your vampire, and both cards certainly *affect* him. But those kinds of cases are pretty much solvable by common sense, and the way that we play it by default seems to be in line with the correct way, so I guess that's enough for me. I presume that ambiguous cases in the future will always have specific card text, now that there are several effects that care about who is targetted by the frenzy.