LSJ: questions

since i didn't receive an answer from lsj in my above thread i will repeat my question. it was basically about non-camarilla vampires. are all vampires that are not camarilla regarded non-camarilla vampires? or only those that have the text "non-camarilla"? are sabbat vampires therefore affected by closed session and camarilla segregation? can they play covenant of blood? and a last question: do action modifiers like bewitching oration or reaction cards like dread gaze give votes to the vampire using them or to the controlling methuselah? thanks -- __________________________________________________ lt. cmdr. pallando of g.a.b. black ice team G.A.B. was started to fight Bad Traders. Check out our website: http://www.gabtraders.com/ Join if you like.

Well I'm not LSJ but I can give some help here: > since i didn't receive an answer from lsj in my above thread i will repeat > my question. > > it was basically about non-camarilla vampires. are all vampires that are not > camarilla regarded non-camarilla vampires? or only those that have the text > "non-camarilla"? Non-camarilla are all vampires not belonging to the sect. Card text on the Giovanni etc. should be Independant instead of Non-Camarilla. So, Non-Camarilla are the Sabbat and Giovanni, Assamites, Setites and Ravnos. And yes they can play Covenant of Blood and are all effected by Closed session. > are sabbat vampires therefore affected by closed session and camarilla > segregation? can they play covenant of blood? > > and a last question: do action modifiers like bewitching oration or reaction > cards like dread gaze give votes to the vampire using them or to the > controlling methuselah? These give the votes to the Vampire playing them. > > thanks You're welcome. Tim Eijpe > __________________________________________________ > lt. cmdr. pallando of g.a.b. black ice team > G.A.B. was started to fight Bad Traders. Check out our website: > http://www.gabtraders.com/ Join if you like. > > -- PROPHECY OF GEHENNA: On The First Day Of Gehenna The Shrieking Wind Shall Be Silent And When A Black Sun Hangs From A Somber Sky Caine's Sleeping Children Shall Once Again Arise Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Before you buy.

On Wed, 31 May 2000, Tim Eijpe wrote: > > cards like dread gaze give votes to the vampire using them or to the > > controlling methuselah? > > These give the votes to the Vampire playing them. Who then give their votes to their controlling Methuselah. 6.3.3 -- James Coupe | PGP Key 0x5D623D5D "I know my ex-boyfriend lies. Oh, he does it every time. It's just his permanent disguise, yeah, yeah, but he's drop dead gorgeous."

In article <Pine.SOL.4.21.000531...@red.csi.cam.ac.uk>, James Coupe <ja...@zephyr.org.uk> wrote: > On Wed, 31 May 2000, Tim Eijpe wrote: > > > cards like dread gaze give votes to the vampire using them or to the > > > controlling methuselah? > > > > These give the votes to the Vampire playing them. > > Who then give their votes to their controlling Methuselah. > > 6.3.3 > > -- > James Coupe | PGP Key 0x5D623D5D Ok. So if a Player A plays a Closed Session and Player B has Sabbat minions, Player B is excluded from the voting process. Correct? Can Player B play Dread Gaze with one of his/her minions to affect the vote? or just to play it if it doesn't affect the vote? Michael Eichler > > "I know my ex-boyfriend lies. Oh, he does it every time. It's just his > permanent disguise, yeah, yeah, but he's drop dead gorgeous." > > -- Worry comes from the belief you are powerless. (So get in there and kick some butt!) [ quoted text not captured ]

In article <8h2tj0$20b$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>, Ramsteiner <ramst...@my-deja.com> wrote: > In article <Pine.SOL.4.21.000531...@red.csi.cam.ac.uk>, > James Coupe <ja...@zephyr.org.uk> wrote: > > On Wed, 31 May 2000, Tim Eijpe wrote: > > > > cards like dread gaze give votes to the vampire using them or to > the > > > > controlling methuselah? > > > > > > These give the votes to the Vampire playing them. > > > > Who then give their votes to their controlling Methuselah. > > > > 6.3.3 > > > > -- > > James Coupe | PGP Key 0x5D623D5D > > Ok. So if a Player A plays a Closed Session and Player B has Sabbat > minions, Player B is excluded from the voting process. Correct? > > Can Player B play Dread Gaze with one of his/her minions to affect the > vote? or just to play it if it doesn't affect the vote? If player B only has Sabbat/Independant Vampires, yes. Player B can then not play any vote-enhancing action modifiers as his Vampires cannot participate in the referendum. Wereas if he/she would control, say a prince and a cardinal, the prince could vote. Tim Eijpe (hi) > > Michael Eichler > > > > "I know my ex-boyfriend lies. Oh, he does it every time. It's just > his > > permanent disguise, yeah, yeah, but he's drop dead gorgeous." > > > > > > -- > Worry comes from the belief you are powerless. > (So get in there and kick some butt!) > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. > -- PROPHECY OF GEHENNA: On The First Day Of Gehenna The Shrieking Wind Shall Be Silent And When A Black Sun Hangs From A Somber Sky Caine's Sleeping Children Shall Once Again Arise [ quoted text not captured ]

Ramsteiner <ramst...@my-deja.com> wrote: > James Coupe <ja...@zephyr.org.uk> wrote: > > On Wed, 31 May 2000, Tim Eijpe wrote: > > > > cards like dread gaze give votes to the vampire using them or > > > > to the controlling methuselah? > > > > > > These give the votes to the Vampire playing them. > > > > Who then give their votes to their controlling Methuselah. [6.3.3] > > Ok. So if a Player A plays a Closed Session and Player B has Sabbat > minions, Player B is excluded from the voting process. Correct? No. Player B can still burn the Edge or burn a political action card or cast the vote gained from City Gangrel Connections or Powerbase: Rome, for instance, since none of these are cast by minions. She can also influence the voting process by playing Delaying Tactics, Pulling Strings, Kindred Coercion (to cancel or change votes), or tap Demonstration or burn a blood from Quentin. The only restriction (from Closed Session) is the the Sabbat (and Independent) vampires cannot cast votes. > Can Player B play Dread Gaze with one of his/her minions to affect the > vote? or just to play it if it doesn't affect the vote? A vampire can play Dread Gaze even if he cannot cast the votes he gains. In this case, the Sabbat vampire(s) could gain votes with Dread Gaze - they are simply prohibited from casting those (or any other) votes. -- LSJ (vte...@white-wolf.com) VTES Net.Rep for White Wolf, Inc. Links to revised rulebook, rulings, errata, and tournament rules: http://www.white-wolf.com/vtes/ [ quoted text not captured ]

pallando wrote: > > since i didn't receive an answer from lsj in my above thread i will repeat > my question. > > it was basically about non-camarilla vampires. are all vampires that are not > camarilla regarded non-camarilla vampires? or only those that have the text > "non-camarilla"? All vampires that are not Camarilla vampires are non-Camarilla vampires. From the rulebook, regarding the "Independent" clanmembers' card text: * The term "Non-Camarilla" is slightly misleading, since the Sabbat vampires are "Non-Camarilla" as well, and the Independent vampires are as much "Non-Sabbat" as they are "Non-Camarilla". > are sabbat vampires therefore affected by closed session and camarilla > segregation? can they play covenant of blood? Yes. Yes. > and a last question: do action modifiers like bewitching oration or reaction > cards like dread gaze give votes to the vampire using them or to the > controlling methuselah? To both. The controlling Methuselah is considered to cast all the votes that her minions cast. -- LSJ (vte...@white-wolf.com) V:TES Net.Rep for White Wolf, Inc. [ quoted text not captured ]