Rulin's plz...

a few questions we have among our playin circle: 1. the g00d question: juss how the hell does rot work...? we constantly argue on the ways it could be played, so if it could be fully clairified that would be SUPER. 2. playin the same card in the same action/combat: which types can u do this? 3. if a card (such as fata morgana) increases bleed and stealth can u use only the stealth and ignore the extra bleed in order to increase the stealth of an action (such as form of mist or bonding) 4. bloodhunts: are they table votes only (ie, no cards can be played) and what effects can be used (such as relinquish'n the edge)? 5. should dinges always lose? **plz answer YES to this one...juss to erk him** 6. first strike: if a combat ends is played after or before, does combat then end or does the first strike go thru? 7. can we use more then ten fingers? thank u fer all rulin's made, cynical and not moth dly...@abc.ksu.ksu.edu

dly...@ksu.ksu.edu (Moth) writes: >a few questions we have among our playin circle: > >1. the g00d question: juss how the hell does rot work...? we constantly >argue on the ways it could be played, so if it could be fully clairified that >would be SUPER. Rotschreck may only be played when a vampire attempts to inflict aggravated damage on his opponent in combat. And it may only be played when it is not your turn (since it is a MOoT). Combat ends (before strikes are resolved, as usual for Combat Ends) and the vampire who attempted to inflict aggravated damage is placed in Torpor and is tapped if he wasn't tapped already. The Rotschreck card is placed on the victim vampire. One the victim vampire's methuselah's next untap phase, thr Rotschreck card is burned instead of untapping the victim vampire. Official card text (errata): Should be read as follows: "Play on a vampire that attempts to inflict aggravated damage. Combat ends, and that vampire goes into torpor. During the vampire's controller's next untap phase, burn this card instead of untapping the vampire." [RTR] >2. playin the same card in the same action/combat: which types can u do this? The same minion may not play the same action modifier or reaction card twice during the same action. Combat cards are unaffected. Master-Out-Of-Turn are not directly affected, but cannot be played in multiples by the same Methuselah by their very nature (you can't play more than one between your turns.) More than one minion may play the same reaction card or action modifier. Action modifiers are typically only played by the acting minion, so to play more than one, you would have to change the acting minion (via Mask of a Thousand Faces, e.g.). Some action modifiers do not have to be played by the acting minion, and can be played by any other minion (even tapped ones) controlled by the Methuselah whose turn it is. Cloak the Gathering (superior) is the classic example. > >3. if a card (such as fata morgana) increases bleed and stealth can u use >only the stealth and ignore the extra bleed in order to increase the stealth >of an action (such as form of mist or bonding) No. You cannot choose to only use part of a card's effect (except for Anarch Troublemaker - which can choose to tap just one minion instead of two). And, you cannot play a +bleed modifier on a non-bleed action. >4. bloodhunts: are they table votes only (ie, no cards can be played) and >what effects can be used (such as relinquish'n the edge)? Bloodhunts are not actions, so Action Modifiers and Reaction cards cannot be played. Votes from PAs, the Edge, Titled vampires, and Locations in play (Ventrue HeadQuarters, Mausoleum Venice, Oxford University <sure>, and Powerbase: Rome) are all allowed. >6. first strike: if a combat ends is played after or before, does combat >then end or does the first strike go thru? Strike: Combat Ends (as well as Strike: Dodge) will beat a first strike. -- L. Scott Johnson (sjoh...@math.sc.edu) | Any sufficiently advanced bug is http://www.math.sc.edu/~sjohnson | indistinguishable from a feature. Graphics Specialist and V:tES Rulemonger. | -- Kulawiec

On 31 Jan 1996, Moth wrote: > a few questions we have among our playin circle: > > 3. if a card (such as fata morgana) increases bleed and stealth can u use > only the stealth and ignore the extra bleed in order to increase the stealth > of an action (such as form of mist or bonding) No you can not the bleed is the action which is what it gives you the stealth for > 4. bloodhunts: are they table votes only (ie, no cards can be played) and > what effects can be used (such as relinquish'n the edge)? Bloodhunts are voteable by any card that can cast a vote But remeber you can't draw a card until the votes are over so the cards you have are your votes. Yes you can use the edge and your minions if they have voting abilities. But be aware that if you call a blood hunt and cannot vote you lose period the end you must have a vote and calling the bloodhunt does not give you a vote. > 6. first strike: if a combat ends is played after or before, does combat > then end or does the first strike go thru? First strike goes through before dodge and such. Cause it is first strike which means it happens first before all others. Unless a card stats other wise. > moth > dly...@abc.ksu.ksu.edu Methuselah Midnght

Midnght <mid...@web2.calweb.com> writes: >> 4. bloodhunts: are they table votes only (ie, no cards can be played) and >> what effects can be used (such as relinquish'n the edge)? >Bloodhunts are voteable by any card that can cast a vote But remeber you >can't draw a card until the votes are over so the cards you have are your >votes. Yes you can use the edge and your minions if they have voting >abilities. But be aware that if you call a blood hunt and cannot vote you >lose period the end you must have a vote and calling the bloodhunt does >not give you a vote. Well, you can use any card that you can play - but this excludes Reaction cards and Action Modifiers (since those can only be played during an action, and the blood hunt vote is *not* an action). A vote's success is never dependent on whether the player who called the vote actually voted or not. A vote succeeds if it has more votes in favor than it has against. Tied votes fail. If I call a blood hunt, and abstain from voting, the blood hunt may still succeed the other methuselahs cast more votes in favor than they do in opposition. Period. The End. >> 6. first strike: if a combat ends is played after or before, does combat >> then end or does the first strike go thru? >First strike goes through before dodge and such. Cause it is first strike >which means it happens first before all others. Unless a card stats other >wise. Technically this is true for Dodges (resolving after a first strike), but since the Dodge undoes the effects of the first strike (making it like the first strike never happened), it's easier to say that the Dodge resolves first. This is explicitly stated in both the Jyhad Rulebook and the VtES Rulebook, as well as many RTRs and FAQs. As for the S:CE, this resolves before anything else, including first strikes and dodges - again as explicitly stated in both rulebooks and many RTRs and FAQs. [ quoted text not captured ]

In article <Pine.BSF.3.91.960202111013....@web2.calweb.com> Midnght <mid...@web2.calweb.com> writes: >> 6. first strike: if a combat ends is played after or before, does combat >> then end or does the first strike go thru? >First strike goes through before dodge and such. Cause it is first strike >which means it happens first before all others. Unless a card stats other >wise. All Dodges are considered First Strike, S:CE stops combat before any strike resolution.

L. Scott Johnson <sjoh...@math.scarolina.edu> wrote: >>3. if a card (such as fata morgana) increases bleed and stealth can u use >>only the stealth and ignore the extra bleed in order to increase the stealth >>of an action (such as form of mist or bonding) >No. You cannot choose to only use part of a card's effect (except for >Anarch Troublemaker - which can choose to tap just one minion instead >of two). Remember that it's only most of the standardized effects (bleed modifiers, stealth, etc.) that have the only-if-you-can restriction. In general, you can play a card or effect whether or not it can do everything intended. For example, if Cryptic Mission tapped the subject minion, you could play it even if the minion was already tapped. >And, you cannot play a +bleed modifier on a non-bleed action. This is simply one of the standard only-if-you-can rules. Tom Wylie rec.games.trading-cards.* Network Representative for aa...@cats.ucsc.edu Wizards of the Coast, Inc.

On 2 Feb 1996, L. Scott Johnson wrote: > >> 6. first strike: if a combat ends is played after or before, does combat > >> then end or does the first strike go thru? > >First strike goes through before dodge and such. Cause it is first strike > >which means it happens first before all others. Unless a card stats other > >wise. > > Technically this is true for Dodges (resolving after a first strike), > but since the Dodge undoes the effects of the first strike (making > it like the first strike never happened), it's easier to say that > the Dodge resolves first. This is explicitly stated in both the > Jyhad Rulebook and the VtES Rulebook, as well as many RTRs and FAQs. Hmmm tha's really open for debate. Being that the rule book states First strike: The strike of a minion with first strike is resolved before the strike of the opposing minion. where as Dodge: the dodge strike card deals no damage but it negates the effest of the opponents strike that round. So it is looked at as such in my book. First strike is resolved before the strike of the opposing minon plain and simple. You have 3 blood the First strike does 4 blood you go to torpor before your dodge strike card is resolved. Now this is not to say that could you withstand the blow you have 5 blood and the first strike does 4 damage. Then your dodge comes around. Then by the rules of the dodge card You negate the damage. The key here is when the cards are played and if you can withstand the blow If you go to torpor from first strike your dodge fails just like life. You die simple the end. No dodge happens. This is my opinion and not that of wotc whom probably don't see it this way. Methuselah Midnght [ quoted text not captured ]

In article <4f3e57$k...@darkstar.UCSC.EDU>, aa...@cats.ucsc.edu (Thomas R Wylie) wrote: > L. Scott Johnson <sjoh...@math.scarolina.edu> wrote: > >>3. if a card (such as fata morgana) increases bleed and stealth can u use > >>only the stealth and ignore the extra bleed in order to increase the stealth > >>of an action (such as form of mist or bonding) > >No. You cannot choose to only use part of a card's effect (except for ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ > >Anarch Troublemaker - which can choose to tap just one minion instead > >of two). Disagree with your interpretation, see below... > Remember that it's only most of the standardized effects (bleed modifiers, > stealth, etc.) that have the only-if-you-can restriction. In general, > you can play a card or effect whether or not it can do everything > intended. For example, if Cryptic Mission tapped the subject minion, > you could play it even if the minion was already tapped. My slant on the rules is contrary to that. For both game play and game history reasons already discussed, "cycling" runs contrary to a good game. Let us change your Cryptic Mission example to another example: Jar the Soul, which does tap the subject. In this example, there is a valid target, a minion. Thus, even if the target is already tapped, attempting to tap it maybe redundant but it satisifes the card text in that there is a target. > >And, you cannot play a +bleed modifier on a non-bleed action. > This is simply one of the standard only-if-you-can rules. Yes. IMHO, the playing of a card is dependant on being able to satisfy part of the card. Elaborate, you say? Well, maybe if this thread continues... :) "I can send and receive e-mail even over the Internet"-aol commercial @#$@#$@#$@#$@#$@#$@#$@#$@#$@#$@#$@#$@#$@#$@#$@#$@#$@#$@#$@#$@#$@#$@#$ # Adrian Sullivan sull...@cslab.uwlax.edu Spoutingly yours 8^) # $ GAT/CS/O/WS R+++* tv&--- b++(+++)&+ t X++&-- 5->? e+*>++++ PS+&-+ @ # PE&++&- C(+++)$ UX+>+++$ N++(+) K+>++++ w---$>? M++$ r(+) y*+? 3.1# @#$@#$@#$@#$@#$@#$@#$@#$@#$@#$@#$@#$@#$@#$@#$@#$@#$@#$@#$@#$@#$@#$@#$