Angry Assamites

We've got an Angry Assamite player who wants some rules clarifications: 1) Can you Bum's Rush, Ambush, Use the contract to attack a vampire in torpor to inflict damage to burn it ? 2) Can an Assamite block a vampire attempting to bring itself out of torpor ?

> 1) Can you Bum's Rush, Ambush, Use the contract to attack a vampire in > torpor to inflict damage to burn it ? No, you cannot. The only thing another vampire can do to a vamp in torpor is Rescue or Diablerize. I could not find in the rulebook where it states this explicitely (as I believe it did in the old rulebooks by stating someting along the lines of "a vampire cannot encounter another vampire in torpor except to...". > 2) Can an Assamite block a vampire attempting to bring itself out of torpor > ? Yes, if the Assamite has the requisite intercept. Sorrow

De Nada <a...@media.net> wrote in message news:lggv5.1085$oz2.1...@nnrp2.sbc.net... > We've got an Angry Assamite player who wants some rules clarifications: > > 1) Can you Bum's Rush, Ambush, Use the contract to attack a vampire in > torpor to inflict damage to burn it ? > No. Vampires in torpor cannot be the target of most actions unless explicitly permitted. Haven Uncovered is not one of them [RTR19941109], and by analogy I suspect that other "attack a minion" actions would not be among the few exceptions (Cryptic Mission, for example [RTR19970425]). > 2) Can an Assamite block a vampire attempting to bring itself out of torpor > ? > Yes, the Assamite may block a self-rescue/Rapid Healing/etc, but although the Assamite would have the "opportunity" to commit diablerie, he is forbidden to actually do so by card text, so the acting minion survives (although remaining in torpor to be disposed of by Sacrificial Lamb ... heh!) Not An LSJ Mark Shanewood who's trying to make Assamites work too

In article <wtgv5.48101$o4.78...@newsrump.sjc.telocity.net>, "Sorrow" <cbo...@apdi.net> wrote: > > 1) Can you Bum's Rush, Ambush, Use the contract to attack a vampire > > in torpor to inflict damage to burn it ? > >No, you cannot. The only thing another vampire can do to a vamp >in torpor is Rescue or Diablerize. I could not find in the rulebook >where it states this explicitely (as I believe it did in the old >rulebooks by stating someting along the lines of "a vampire cannot >encounter another vampire in torpor except to...". 6.5.2 would help. "Vampires in torpor cannot enter combat." The Assamite player will want to play with either Sacrificial Lamb to burn the vampires in torpor, or The Embrace, as The Embrace doesn't have the restriction against diablerie in its card text. > > 2) Can an Assamite block a vampire attempting to bring > > itself out of torpor ? > > Yes, if the Assamite has the requisite intercept. Yes. The Assamite could not commit diablerie though, so the acting vampire would simply return to torpor tapped, without paying the blood for attempting to leave torpor. Still 6.5.2 "If the blocker is a vampire, he gets the opportunity to diablerize the acting vampire (see Diablerie, sec. 6.5.5). If he chooses not to, or if he is an ally, then the action simply fails (the acting vampire remains in torpor and no cost is paid)." Carpe Noctem. Lasombra http://members.tripod.com/~Lasombra Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Before you buy.

"Mark & Kathy ShaneWood" <shan...@tcinternet.net> wrote: > De Nada <a...@media.net> wrote: > > 1) Can you Bum's Rush, Ambush, Use the contract to attack a vampire > > in torpor to inflict damage to burn it ? > > > No. Vampires in torpor cannot be the target of most actions unless > explicitly permitted. Vampires in torpor are legal targets for actions (that target "minions" or "vampires") by default. Vampires in torpor cannot be engaged in combat, however. Effects that initiate combat cannot be directed at vampires in torpor, and combat will end immediately when one of the combatants is not ready (e.g., in torpor). > Haven Uncovered is not one of them [RTR19941109], and Haven Uncovered's effect of starting combat cannot be used if the target is in torpor, correct. > by analogy I suspect that other "attack a minion" actions would > not be among the few exceptions. If by "attack" you mean the standard meaning of "enter combat with", then correct. > (Cryptic Mission, for example [RTR19970425]). Cryptic Mission can target a vampire in torpor, since card text doesn't specify that the target must be ready. > > 2) Can an Assamite block a vampire attempting to bring itself out of > torpor > > ? > > > Yes, the Assamite may block a self-rescue/Rapid Healing/etc, but although > the Assamite would have the "opportunity" to commit diablerie, he is > forbidden to actually do so by card text, so the acting minion survives > (although remaining in torpor to be disposed of by Sacrificial Lamb ... > heh!) Correct. -- LSJ (vte...@white-wolf.com) VTES Net.Rep for White Wolf, Inc. Links to revised rulebook, rulings, errata, and tournament rules: http://www.white-wolf.com/vtes/ [ quoted text not captured ]

> >Assamites in the VTES game cannot diablerize because of card text. >An Embraced vampire does not have that card text. >An Embraced vampire of any clan can commit diablerie. > >The only reason an Assamite cannot commit diablerie in the card game is >text on the card. There is nothing in the rules to say that Assamites >cannot commit diablerie. One of the printed Assamite vampires could Clan Impersonate to something else and still not be able to commit diablerie. An Assamite with Derange (*makes* it Malkavian Anti, not just *pretend*) on it could still not diablerize. Likewise, a non-Assamite vamp could Clan Impersonate into an Assamite and still be able to diablerize. Could an Assamite with Seeds of Corruption on it then be able to diablerize? Googolly Moogolly? -Mike

In article <8pk5u6$3e3$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>, The Lasombra <TheLa...@hotmail.com> wrote: > An Assamite player will want to play with either Sacrificial Lamb > to burn the vampires in torpor, or The Embrace, as The Embrace > doesn't have the restriction against diablerie in its card text. "Timothy Bateman" <fa...@spiritone.com> replied in email: Actually, I know from playing the Assamites that the The Embraced vampire cannot diablerize, unless the vampire that embraced it is something other than an Assamite. Embraced vampires are automatically the clan of their sire, and inherit those traits. Assamites cannot diablerize. ----------------------------- Which is of course completely wrong. Assamites in the VTES game cannot diablerize because of card text. An Embraced vampire does not have that card text. An Embraced vampire of any clan can commit diablerie. The only reason an Assamite cannot commit diablerie in the card game is text on the card. There is nothing in the rules to say that Assamites cannot commit diablerie. See the Rules Team Ruling quoted here: From http://www.white-wolf.com/VTES/rulings.html "Assamites Assamites cannot commit diablerie because of card text. If an Assamite changes clans, he still cannot commit diablerie. An Assamite without such text would be able to Diablerize. [TOM 19960618]" An Embrace will not have that card text, and is able to commit diablerie. [ quoted text not captured ]

In article <Z4Dw5.11562$SN6.3...@news4.giganews.com>, "Mike Ooi" <sh...@texas.net> wrote: > Could an Assamite with Seeds of Corruption on it then be able > to diablerize? No. Read from the LSJ quoted below: http://www.white-wolf.com/VTES/rulings.html "Seeds of Corruption [AH] - Action (tha) (2) "Special ability" includes all non-sect, non-title text. (note that this only means that the affected vampire cannot do anything that he is allowed to do only by special ability - not that he can now overcome some special restriction. Assamites still cannot commit diablerie, for example) [LSJ 19970801]" [ quoted text not captured ]