Legacy of Pander decks

(TO REPLY VIA E-MAIL, STRIP 'XYXYX' FROM THE ADDRESS) I've noticed that Legacy of Pander is a fairly highly in-demand card. I assume its popoularity is based on the idea of having a political deck with lots of Pander weenies that starts passing vote after vote of LoP under the user can basically pass any vote he likes. Is this the idea? If so, how does it work? How do you start getting LoP passed? I would assume opponents with voting vampires would see this coming and tend to vote it down, even if it's your Grandpreditor or Grandprey. Anyone have a deck to post that's worked well for them? Fred

In article <fred_sXYXY...@netcom.com>, Frederick Scott <fred_...@netcom.com> writes >I've noticed that Legacy of Pander is a fairly highly in-demand card. I >assume its popoularity is based on the idea of having a political deck >with lots of Pander weenies that starts passing vote after vote of LoP >under the user can basically pass any vote he likes. Is this the idea? > Yes. >If so, how does it work? How do you start getting LoP passed? Speed. Weenies with Presence. > I would >assume opponents with voting vampires would see this coming and tend >to vote it down, even if it's your Grandpreditor or Grandprey. And? I get out a vampire first turn. Your voting vampire will take 2. I pass it unopposed. QED. -- James Coupe (Prince of Mercia, England) Vampire: Elder Kindred Network http://madnessnetwork.hexagon.net http://www.obeah.demon.co.uk

(TO REPLY VIA E-MAIL, STRIP 'XYXYX' FROM THE ADDRESS) James Coupe <ve...@obeah.demon.co.uk> writes: >In article <fred_sXYXY...@netcom.com>, Frederick Scott ><fred_...@netcom.com> writes >>I've noticed that Legacy of Pander is a fairly highly in-demand card. I >>assume its popoularity is based on the idea of having a political deck >>with lots of Pander weenies that starts passing vote after vote of LoP >>under the user can basically pass any vote he likes. Is this the idea? > >Yes. > >>If so, how does it work? How do you start getting LoP passed? > >Speed. Weenies with Presence. Hmmm. I assume you have to use skill cards to get the presense, seeing as how there are only 2 Panders with presense. Then what? Bewitching Oration? >>I would ssume opponents with voting vampires would see this coming >>and tend to vote it down, even if it's your Grandpreditor or Grandprey. > >And? I get out a vampire first turn. Your voting vampire will take 2. >I pass it unopposed. QED. Sounds to me like you pretty much want to have an LoP in your opening hand, particularly if you're towards the end of the line in player order, lest someone else get a voting vampire out by the second turn. Otherwise, you might not quite swing the first vote with just the vote card and 2 votes from Bewitching Oration. So how many LoPs does it take to have a viable deck? And how effective is this in comparison to more conventional political decks? Fred

In article <fred_sXYXY...@netcom.com>, Frederick Scott <fred_...@netcom.com> writes >>>If so, how does it work? How do you start getting LoP passed? >> >>Speed. Weenies with Presence. > >Hmmm. I assume you have to use skill cards to get the presense, seeing as >how there are only 2 Panders with presense. Then what? Bewitching Oration? > Yes, and duplication of the vampires. Also, the little Caitiff with presence can be useful to pass the vote, though she won't contribute to its utility. It's very, very possible. Don't forget, all you are going to need is to pull it off once, quickly, then by the end of your second turn you have five votes available, most likely (four pander and the one you use to call a vote). And then call another. And another. Oh, and don't forget an Info Highway, too. >>>I would ssume opponents with voting vampires would see this coming >>>and tend to vote it down, even if it's your Grandpreditor or Grandprey. >> >>And? I get out a vampire first turn. Your voting vampire will take 2. >>I pass it unopposed. QED. > >Sounds to me like you pretty much want to have an LoP in your opening hand, That's kind of the point. If LoP passes FAST, you won't remove it from the table. They keep throwing more down, and getting more vampires out. >particularly if you're towards the end of the line in player order, lest >someone else get a voting vampire out by the second turn. That's what the BewOra and Awe are for. > Otherwise, you >might not quite swing the first vote with just the vote card and 2 votes >from Bewitching Oration. This is true. However, you have to watch out for a) drawing votes out with other votes - a Con Agi, say or b) Cryptic Rider if you *don't* fail their other votes. > >So how many LoPs does it take to have a viable deck? > About 7 to 9 seems to be working okay at the moment. >And how effective is this in comparison to more conventional political >decks? Devastatingly so. I've not yet seen it fail to sweep a table, as I recall. Don't get me wrong - there *are* holes to be exploited in the deck. Intercept it has a hard time dealing with, and very, very fast rush (the three capacity rush decks seen on here) might stand a chance. If you can secure the ability to vote *down* votes then there is also that possibility. Contesting the vampires in your deck is possible - keep working decks round pander vampires, so that you gain lots of votes too. A weenie Pander bleed deck might be fun. A pander combat deck, with Unaccpetable Appearance, Jimmy Dunn and Beast and weenie !Nos has been mentioned. You get votes and kill him, at the same time. A few well- timed Delaying Tactics will help you, because of the "not this vote again for the rest of the turn" clause. However, these holes can be difficult to exploit. Fast rush and intercept have their own problems, and if sitting cross-table from the LoP deck, they are going to have to deal with their own predator and prey first. Many of the other decks end up narrowing your focus overly so. [ quoted text not captured ]

I have been working on a LoP deck now for several months. The absolute key to the deck is the second round. You must be calling the LoP vote in this turn before any other voters have a chance. In my 60 card deck there are 17 LoP and one Deal with the devil just in case. I use most of the Panders with Fredrick the Weak and another low cap Pre Sabbat vamp. Remember, a Pander does not have to call the vote. Only a Sabbat vampire. This way you can bring out a Sabbat with Presence on turn one and call the LoP on turn two. THEN when you bring out the Panders in the following turns the voting now becomes easy. I have had over 60 table votes with the Pander clan. That is a blast. Even with the highly tuned deck it still only works about 1/2 the time due to people burning vote cards, Direct Intervention, intercept, delaying tactics. All in all a fun deck. Hope this helps. Todd Banister Prince of Atlanta Frederick Scott <fred_...@netcom.com> wrote in message news:fred_sXYXY...@netcom.com... > (TO REPLY VIA E-MAIL, STRIP 'XYXYX' FROM THE ADDRESS) > > James Coupe <ve...@obeah.demon.co.uk> writes: > > >In article <fred_sXYXY...@netcom.com>, Frederick Scott > ><fred_...@netcom.com> writes > >>I've noticed that Legacy of Pander is a fairly highly in-demand card. I > >>assume its popoularity is based on the idea of having a political deck > >>with lots of Pander weenies that starts passing vote after vote of LoP > >>under the user can basically pass any vote he likes. Is this the idea? > > > >Yes. > > > >>If so, how does it work? How do you start getting LoP passed? > > > >Speed. Weenies with Presence. > > Hmmm. I assume you have to use skill cards to get the presense, seeing as > how there are only 2 Panders with presense. Then what? Bewitching Oration? > > >>I would ssume opponents with voting vampires would see this coming > >>and tend to vote it down, even if it's your Grandpreditor or Grandprey. > > > >And? I get out a vampire first turn. Your voting vampire will take 2. > >I pass it unopposed. QED. > > Sounds to me like you pretty much want to have an LoP in your opening hand, > particularly if you're towards the end of the line in player order, lest > someone else get a voting vampire out by the second turn. Otherwise, you > might not quite swing the first vote with just the vote card and 2 votes > from Bewitching Oration. > > So how many LoPs does it take to have a viable deck? > > And how effective is this in comparison to more conventional political > decks? > > Fred

James Coupe wrote: > In article <fred_sXYXY...@netcom.com>, Frederick Scott > <fred_...@netcom.com> writes > >Hmmm. I assume you have to use skill cards to get the presense, seeing as > >how there are only 2 Panders with presense. Then what? Bewitching Oration? > > Yes, and duplication of the vampires. Also, the little Caitiff with > presence can be useful to pass the vote, though she won't contribute to > its utility. Caitiff cannot call the vote, so your Caitiff cannot use Presence to help pass the vote you call. (Only Sabbat vampires can call the vote.) -- LSJ (vte...@wizards.com) VTES Net.Rep for Wizards of the Coast. Links to revised rulebook, rulings, errata, and tournament rules: http://www.wizards.com/VTES/VTES_Rules.html