Announcing Effects?

I just wanted to confirm that players should announce when they are using an effect or discarding. For example, I've seen several cases where a player with Advanced Sascha Vykos out surreptitiously draws and discards cards during other players' turns with no one else knowing about it. The situation is similar with Burn Option cards and Giotto's special. This can be especially important because if everyone is paying attention to the active player, the player with Vykos can draw and discard without telling anyone about it. Since this can immensely allow a player to cycle his hand, it is critical for others to be aware if a player has managed to draw and discard a whole bunch of cards. So, is a player legally required to inform the other players when he is using the Burn Option, Advanced Vykos' special, Giotto's special, or similar effects? On a similar note, is a player required to announce if he is discarding? I think it's generally a good practice to say that you're discarding (though you don't necessarily have to broadcast exactly what it is. Others are free to look at the ashheap or ask if they wish). But I just wanted to know if the rules require an announcement. Thanks!

echia...@yahoo.com wrote: > I just wanted to confirm that players should announce when they are > using an effect or discarding. I don't think you technically need to, unless the effect is an Action or similar. It is the responsibility of the players to: a) be aware of what the cards in play allow or compel (and to ask to read the cards if they can't remember); b) to be aware of what the other players are doing; and c) to not cheat by deliberately doing things that the rules don't allow. Having said that, in my playgroup we usually do announce discards "and I transfer...and I'm discarding...um...this one. Done." Mostly, this is so that the next player knows not to proceed with their turn. We also tend to announce things like the use of Giotto's special, at least the first couple of times, so that it's clear that we're doing something legitimate and not merely cheating. But that's just us and nothing to do with any rule that I'm aware of. * lehrbuch

On Wed, 19 Jan 2005 15:17:20 +1300, lehrbuch <lehr...@gmail.com> scrawled: >echia...@yahoo.com wrote: >> I just wanted to confirm that players should announce when they are >> using an effect or discarding. > >I don't think you technically need to, unless the effect is an Action or >similar. Then how do you know when you're allowed to use your ability? say, for example, it's someone else's turn and i have giotto. that meth gets to discard first, say they tap PB Los Angeles to do so. They then get to react to that effect with their own next effect if they wish, as they are the 'acting' methuselah. You have to wait for them to finish before you get a go. and then once you get a go, and say you discard using giotto's special, they get to respond to that effect. How do they get to respond if you never announced it? salem domain:canberra http://www.geocities.com/salem_christ.geo/vtes.htm (replace "hotmail" with "yahoo" to email)

echia...@yahoo.com wrote: > I just wanted to confirm that players should announce when they are > using an effect or discarding. > > For example, I've seen several cases where a player with Advanced > Sascha Vykos out surreptitiously draws and discards cards during other > players' turns with no one else knowing about it. The situation is > similar with Burn Option cards and Giotto's special. This can be > especially important because if everyone is paying attention to the > active player, the player with Vykos can draw and discard without > telling anyone about it. Since this can immensely allow a player to > cycle his hand, it is critical for others to be aware if a player has > managed to draw and discard a whole bunch of cards. Well I can't don't know of any kind of official ruling on this, but I would say a player has to announce to the table whenever he is: acting, reacting, transferring, discarding, or using any ability of any cards he has in play. Not announcing this is dodgy. For some things like say The Barrens, people can tell if someone's used it because it will be tapped. But for other things like discarding in other people's turns, doing it without saying anything I believe should be highly frowned upon. I would ask players in a social game NOT to do it, and at a tournament, I would report it to a judge if I saw it. What they would do about is of course another matter. As Salem has pointed out, the acting Methuselah may wish to respond to your activation of the ability! (this doesn't apply in all cases to all abilities but is another reason not to allow this and a good reason to get a 'blanket' ruling covering all cases, i.e. you have to announce whenever you do basically anything).

echia...@yahoo.com wrote: > I just wanted to confirm that players should announce when they are > using an effect or discarding. Every effect should be made so that the other Methuselahs are aware of which effect is being used. > So, is a player legally required to inform the other players when he is > using the Burn Option, Advanced Vykos' special, Giotto's special, or > similar effects? Yes. > On a similar note, is a player required to announce if he is > discarding? I think it's generally a good practice to say that you're > discarding (though you don't necessarily have to broadcast exactly what > it is. Others are free to look at the ashheap or ask if they wish). But > I just wanted to know if the rules require an announcement. Typically the act of discarding is sufficient, but when it is not, it is the player who is discarding's responsibility to make the other players aware of the activity. -- LSJ (vte...@white-wolf.com) V:TES Net.Rep for White Wolf, Inc. Links to V:TES news, rules, cards, utilities, and tournament calendar: http://www.white-wolf.com/vtes/

A player should always say what they are doing, whether its just a discard or not. -- Colin "Eryx" Goodman Cambridge UK http://www.geocities.com/eryx_uk/Cambridge_by_night.html

As we quite often have new players- even players that have played for a while wont have seen the old cards or especially rare cards -I have insisted that not only do you declare you action but also read the card text out on anything other than the most common of cards. Piers