I have a few questions which I couldn't seem to find the answers to in the
FAQ's/House Rules I have grabbed from this newsgroup over the past couple of
months:
1.) There are a few political cards which call for change of seating
(Dramatic Upheaval is one of them I believe). After a change in seating has
taken place, does the order in which the players take their turns change? Can
someone's turn actually be skipped? Or does the order of play remain as it
was originally with only the predator/prey relationships changing?
2.) Some people in the group I play with have expressed concerns that a few
of the cards are too powerful. We recently decided to try no cards limits and
used the "house rules" put out on the net by Curt Adams, that OS2 Apostle dude
and a few others. Things seemed to work great, but some of the players had
reservations about:
a.) Ventrue Headquarters
Some in the group said it was way too good and should cost a pool
to use. I think it is not that good because it can be burned, so already has
a limitatation. There was nothing in the house rules about it.
b.) Elysium : The Arboretum
Again, some in the group thought it was way too powerful and that it
should cost a pool to use. I think it can both be burned and nuked via a
political action so isn't that good.
Just wondering what other people thought about these cards. Oh, I'll squeeze
in another quick question:
Is Aching Beauty (cost 1 pool to block) cumulative with Archon (cost 1 pool to
block) or not?
Thanks in advance for any info.
Chris Campo
In article <ccampo.36...@powergrid.electriciti.com>,
Chris Campo <cca...@powergrid.electriciti.com> wrote:
>1.) There are a few political cards which call for change of seating
>(Dramatic Upheaval is one of them I believe). After a change in seating has
>taken place, does the order in which the players take their turns change? Can
>someone's turn actually be skipped? Or does the order of play remain as it
>was originally with only the predator/prey relationships changing?
The order changes in as much as play will still proceed clockwise (or
counterclockwise if Reversal of Fortunes has been successful). This
may have the virtual effect of "skipping" someones turn.
It is still whoever's turn it was before the rearrangement. When she
finishes her turn, it will then be the player on her left's turn,
regardless of who was on her left before the rearrangement.
>
>2.) Some people in the group I play with have expressed concerns that a few
>of the cards are too powerful. We recently decided to try no cards limits and
>used the "house rules" put out on the net by Curt Adams, that OS2 Apostle dude
>and a few others. Things seemed to work great, but some of the players had
>reservations about:
>
> a.) Ventrue Headquarters
> Some in the group said it was way too good and should cost a pool
>to use. I think it is not that good because it can be burned, so already has
>a limitatation. There was nothing in the house rules about it.
And it is unique. If it's that good, put one in your deck to counter.
>
>b.) Elysium : The Arboretum
> Again, some in the group thought it was way too powerful and that it
>should cost a pool to use. I think it can both be burned and nuked via a
>political action so isn't that good.
And it is unique. If it's so good, put one in your deck.
>
>Just wondering what other people thought about these cards. Oh, I'll squeeze
>in another quick question:
>
>Is Aching Beauty (cost 1 pool to block) cumulative with Archon (cost 1 pool to
>block) or not?
Cumulative.
--
-----
L. Scott Johnson (lsc...@crl.com) | The opinions expressed are mine
Graphics Specialist and Jyhad Rulemonger | and subject to card text
cca...@powergrid.electriciti.com (Chris Campo) wrote:
>I have a few questions which I couldn't seem to find the answers to in the
>FAQ's/House Rules I have grabbed from this newsgroup over the past couple of
>months:
>>1.) There are a few political cards which call for change of seating
>(Dramatic Upheaval is one of them I believe). After a change in seating has
>taken place, does the order in which the players take their turns change? Can
>someone's turn actually be skipped? Or does the order of play remain as it
>was originally with only the predator/prey relationships changing?
>>2.) Some people in the group I play with have expressed concerns that a few
>of the cards are too powerful. We recently decided to try no cards limits and
>used the "house rules" put out on the net by Curt Adams, that OS2 Apostle dude
>and a few others. Things seemed to work great, but some of the players had
>reservations about:
>
> a.) Ventrue Headquarters
> Some in the group said it was way too good and should cost a pool
>to use. I think it is not that good because it can be burned, so already has
>a limitatation. There was nothing in the house rules about it.
>>b.) Elysium : The Arboretum
> Again, some in the group thought it was way too powerful and that it
>should cost a pool to use. I think it can both be burned and nuked via a
>political action so isn't that good.
>
>>Just wondering what other people thought about these cards. Oh, I'll squeeze
>in another quick question:
>
>Is Aching Beauty (cost 1 pool to block) cumulative with Archon (cost 1 pool to
>block) or not?
>>Thanks in advance for any info.
>Chris Campo
I'd have to disagree about any card being called too powerful. As you
stated the locations can be burned. Also, contesting makes the card just
as useless.
Aching Beauty: I'm not sure and would like to know the answer as well.
Eric
[ quoted text not captured ]
^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Well, the answer is yes! Aching Beauty is cummulative with Archon.
Combine this with Camarilla Exemplary and you'll have somebody that just
won't get blocked very often. Sure works well with Toreador (kind of a
roundabout way of solving their lack of stealth problem.)
---------
Paul Schaaf
sch...@u.washington.edu
cca...@powergrid.electriciti.com (Chris Campo) wrote:
>I have a few questions which I couldn't seem to find the answers to in
the
>FAQ's/House Rules I have grabbed from this newsgroup over the past couple
of
>months:
>
>1.) There are a few political cards which call for change of seating
>(Dramatic Upheaval is one of them I believe). After a change in seating
has
>taken place, does the order in which the players take their turns change?
Can
>someone's turn actually be skipped? Or does the order of play remain as
it
>was originally with only the predator/prey relationships changing?
The seating change will change the order or turns as well. After the
acting player finishes, the player to his left will go. One table
restructure can make it a long time between one player's turn, if he gets
moved from acting player's prey to acting player's predator. If two people
are doing table restructures, they can theoretically deny anybody else the
chance to ever take a turn. (which could, theoretically, make them very
unpopular :-)
>
>2.) Some people in the group I play with have expressed concerns that a
few
>of the cards are too powerful. We recently decided to try no cards
limits and
>used the "house rules" put out on the net by Curt Adams, that OS2 Apostle
dude
>and a few others. Things seemed to work great, but some of the players
had
>reservations about:
Interesting that you'd mention James and me, as we probably disagree about
more rulings than any other set of people on that list :-) I think it's
great that L. Scott Johnson's work, and all the participants' advice,
helps you have better games. That's what we all did it for.
>
> a.) Ventrue Headquarters
> Some in the group said it was way too good and should cost a
pool
>to use. I think it is not that good because it can be burned, so already
has
>a limitatation. There was nothing in the house rules about it.
It's a very good card, and about as obligatory in a Ventrue vote deck as a
card will get. It's only 3 votes once a turn, however, and it can be
burnt. Since it's unique, it certainly doesn't break the game.
>b.) Elysium : The Arboretum
> Again, some in the group thought it was way too powerful and
that it
>should cost a pool to use. I think it can both be burned and nuked via a>political action so isn't that good.
Elysium is powerful, but, as you point out, fairly vulnerable too. I
think the Elysium's remarkable power is important as providing anybody a
defense against brutal combat decks. The elimination by a vote means the
Elysium is hard to abuse, as if you're winning, the Elysium will typically
be voted away. It's also one of the rare cards that encourage decks to
have multiple tricks up their sleeve (in this case, encouraging combat
decks to have some votes).
>Is Aching Beauty (cost 1 pool to block) cumulative with Archon (cost 1
pool to
>block) or not?
>
Yep. Plus they are both stackable. Stealth isn't the only way to make a
bleed unblockable.
Curt Adams (curt...@aol.com)
In article <3tt99s$e...@newsbf02.news.aol.com>, curt...@aol.com
(CurtAdams) wrote:
> cca...@powergrid.electriciti.com (Chris Campo) wrote:
> >I have a few questions which I couldn't seem to find the answers to in
> the
> >FAQ's/House Rules I have grabbed from this newsgroup over the past couple
> of
> >months:
> >
> >1.) There are a few political cards which call for change of seating
> >(Dramatic Upheaval is one of them I believe). After a change in seating
> has
> >taken place, does the order in which the players take their turns change?
> Can
> >someone's turn actually be skipped? Or does the order of play remain as
> it
> >was originally with only the predator/prey relationships changing?
>
> The seating change will change the order or turns as well. After the
> acting player finishes, the player to his left will go. One table
> restructure can make it a long time between one player's turn, if he gets
> moved from acting player's prey to acting player's predator. If two people
> are doing table restructures, they can theoretically deny anybody else the
> chance to ever take a turn. (which could, theoretically, make them very
> unpopular :-)
Focusing on the change of seating (and reverse play cards) theoretically
you could deny anyone a turn past the first. A friend and I tried this
tactic once when we were going through a theme deck phase. We designed
decks which were very similar (different vampires to avoid contesting), we
had the change on play cards some other voting cards (parity shift, KRC,
ect.) and lots of bleed (little or no stealth is needed as they get no
vampires), and we took it in one day and played it in a seven player game
(it is a good idea NOT to tell any one before hand, they refuse to play).
The first turn we both got vampires out and one other player also got a
vampire out (a 2 pointer), the next turn we got another vampire out and
changed seating, third turn we each voted for a prince and change play
order then got into bleeds we held the edge for the rest of the game. The
other players got three turns (we slipped up). Most of them left and
played other games until they were needed. We got seven victory points
between us, however, at one point of time someone has to be choosen as the
victor, unfortunately it was not me. It is a very successful stratagy and
hard to stop. It is however not a good way to remain popular (we were
trashed the next game when we changed decks) and should be only tried once
in every group if at all.
Peter.
--
Peter Gordon WILSMORE, cs95...@cs.uwa.edu.au