Obeah combat monsters

Looking at one of the Obeah cards I had an idea and I would like to know you're opinion on this one. Anesthetic Touch [BL] Cardtype: Combat Discipline: Obeah/Auspex Only usable at close range. [aus] Strike: dodge. [obe] Strike: make a hand strike. Combat ends immediately after the resolution of this strike. [OBE] As [obe] above, with First Strike. So if I get this right not only does it work with IG which we already knew but is the damage preventable card text states that combat ends after the handstrike so this means no option for prevention right?? Perhaps I'm not the first who thought of this so if I'm copying someone else's idea I'm sorry but an obeah potense deck isn't unimaginable. Anesthetic touch disarm tickle you for 1 and you go to torpor without you're arms now this sounds scarry. let me know what you think. Emile

Emile Bosman wrote: > Looking at one of the Obeah cards I had an idea and I would like to > know you're opinion on this one. > > Anesthetic Touch [BL] > Cardtype: Combat > > Discipline: Obeah/Auspex > > Only usable at close range. > [aus] Strike: dodge. > [obe] Strike: make a hand strike. Combat ends immediately after the > resolution of this strike. > [OBE] As [obe] above, with First Strike. > > > So if I get this right not only does it work with IG which we already > knew but is the damage preventable card text states that combat ends > after the handstrike so this means no option for prevention right?? > Ehm, isn't preventionstep included in strikeresolution? Sten During

Sten During wrote: > Emile Bosman wrote: > > Anesthetic Touch [BL] > > So if I get this right not only does it work with IG which we already > > knew but is the damage preventable card text states that combat ends > > after the handstrike so this means no option for prevention right?? > > Ehm, isn't preventionstep included in strikeresolution? Yes, yes it is. AT's damage can be prevented as normal. -- LSJ (vte...@white-wolf.com) V:TES Net.Rep for White Wolf, Inc. Links to V:TES news, rules, cards, utilities, and tournament calendar: http://www.white-wolf.com/vtes/

> Anesthetic touch disarm tickle you for 1 and you go to torpor without > you're arms now this sounds scarry. I'm not sure about this. Yes, it has been touted as the ULTIMATE COMBAT COMBO...EVER!!!, but surely the following has to be taken into consideration: Disarm only works at the end of a round of combat where more damage is inflicted by one vampire onto another at close range. Anaesthetic touch ends combat immediately. Does this mean that all combat events end as combat ends? i.e. do you in fact get to the end of a "round" of combat, since AT effectively jams on the breaks to stop combat at the strike phase? Of course, this is just my view, but I would far rather see this that a spate of Salubri + potence masters rushing with Nose of the Hound! DH

hamdamcwa wrote: > > > Anesthetic touch disarm tickle you for 1 and you go to torpor without > > you're arms now this sounds scarry. > > I'm not sure about this. Yes, it has been touted as the ULTIMATE > COMBAT COMBO...EVER!!!, but surely the following has to be taken into > consideration: > > Disarm only works at the end of a round of combat where more damage is > inflicted by one vampire onto another at close range. Anaesthetic > touch ends combat immediately. Does this mean that all combat events > end as combat ends? i.e. do you in fact get to the end of a "round" of > combat, since AT effectively jams on the breaks to stop combat at the > strike phase? The round cannot continue past the end of combat. It must end at least when combat does (if not before, say if another round starts). [ quoted text not captured ]

ebo...@hotmail.com (Emile Bosman) wrote in message news:<cbf416fb.02041...@posting.google.com>... [ quoted text not captured ] The Salubri. Obeah. Powerful. If you take the Salubri and their discipline each on their own, they don't seem that impressive. This all changes when you build a clever combat deck, and other players' combat decks with Assamites, Brujah, Gangrel, Tzimisce, etc. get pounced into Torpor on a regular basis. You don't need Potence, you don't even need any out-of-clan discipline, just Fortitude, Obeah and a bit of Auspex. The Basic combo is Vitae Block (*up* to 3 blood!), Anesthetic Touch and a Pulled Fangs to round it up. Matthias is the vampire of choice, all 3 in-clans at superior, with a hefty special against Baali and Setites, along with the very strong +1 intercept built in. What a bargain. Put him 4 times in your deck, make sure you bring him as first vampire into your controlled region. Even when he is not tooled up with any equipment or master cards, he is a formidable blocker, sending weenies to torpor (VB+AT[+PF if necessary]), and surviving against all kinds of strikes. He should only be worried about long range unpreventable attacks (Blood Sweat anyone?). However, he has Unfliching Persistance at his disposal: maneuver *and* prevent 1 damage later. Perfect. You can play as many as you want, you can prevent environmental damage, what more do you want? Matthias gets scary when he is tooled up with a *Depravity*, Guardian Angel, Leather Jacket, IR Goggles, some Ghoul Retainer. *Then* others should worry. You'd say, it takes time to build up, equip actions can be blocked, etc. Well yes. But: Repulsion is the card which saves the day against casual blockers with +1 intercept. Always have 3-4 in your deck. *Always*. If they block, they get a major kick in the ass. VB and AT should take care of most. Especially as they lack some blood for their combat cards. AT makes sure you will most likely not get harmed, while their chances of going into torpor are quite good. Vamps with 3 blood left and no means of prevention, dodge or SCE are put in torpor, if you include Pulled Fangs, you can torporize vamps with 4 blood left. If you already have a Depravity, you are king. Ghoul retainer are another option, but you'll have to use AT at the normal level. Who cares? Guardian Angel, Flak Jacket, Leather Jacket and a plethora of Unflinching Persistance. Ghoul Retainer are cool if they dodge, they still recieve the damage. And if you used AT at normal, combat ends after they take the damage nonetheless. You are worried about IG? You don't need to. AT works even under that dreaded monster card. S:CE and Prevention is the only thing that saves from the VB-AT combo. Well, be persistent, eventually you'll catch them with no useful cards in hand. Key to a successful Matthias deck is blocking. You'll want to block every single action your prey and predator attempt. Use Sight Beyond Sight, Sports Bike and the like to tool Matthias up for the task. Use plenty of Forced Awakenings. About 15 in a 90 card deck will work wonders. After blocking every little thing, your enemies will be wary, and you can bluff them even if you have no FA in your hand. Use Eagle Sight if your prey attemps D-actions against anyone. This makes sure your prey doesn't get VPs while you keep on blocking. Good timing, and a few support vampires (Rufina Soledad, Giulano Vincenzi) make sure you keep pressure upon your prey and bleed every turn. If you feel cocky, you can even bring the other Salubri Blanche Hill and Miriam Benyona. However, you'll need a good Blood Support in form of Club Zombie, Palatial Estate, The Rack, and a couple of Blood Dolls. Powerbase Montreal is always a good addition. Your blocking capability should make sure that you keep those locations in your controlled region. There are some things you should be aware of. You'll have consider High-Stealth Bleed-Vote. (Protect Thine Own called by Arika is *the nightmare*.) All the various steal-decks can hose you. Some carefully played DI can save your Matthias' ass. Have some Heidelberg Castles in your deck, so others can't bring it for their Mind Rape or Temptation tactics, and you can save precious blood and equipment if all things go wrong. Use Pulse of the Canaille for extra bleed-bite and Nose of the Hound to get rid of those OBF guys. They like being rushed... One or two Spirit Marionette can also help make more fun and less minions to beat up. Think of it. One last funny thing: Rejoice when someone on your table plays Eurobrujah (or any Princes) and *Anathema*! Once the Anathema'ed vamp is at 3 blood, Nose of the Hound him, play Vitae Block for 3, burn him immediatly and without any chance of saving him from the fate! Managed to do that 2 times. :) If anybody is interested in a decklist, let me know. Carl

carl.pi...@chello.at (Carl Pilhatsch) wrote in message news:<e7883b0c.02041...@posting.google.com>... -snip- > > If you feel cocky, you can even bring the other Salubri Blanche Hill > and Miriam Benyona. However, you'll need a good Blood Support in form > of Club Zombie, Palatial Estate, The Rack, and a couple of Blood > Dolls. Powerbase Montreal is always a good addition. Your blocking > capability should make sure that you keep those locations in your > controlled region. > -snip- Why use those when you have renewed vigor?

>> If you feel cocky, you can even bring the other Salubri Blanche Hill >> and Miriam Benyona. However, you'll need a good Blood Support in form >> of Club Zombie, Palatial Estate, The Rack, and a couple of Blood >> Dolls. Powerbase Montreal is always a good addition. Your blocking >> capability should make sure that you keep those locations in your >> controlled region. >> >-snip- > >Why use those when you have renewed vigor? Because you can't renew your own vigor. I suppose you can use Renewed Vigor if you do indeed plan to bring out multiple Salubri, but then you have to put multiple copies of Matthias *and* Blanche, and you have to deal with the Scarce penalty. If you choose to just use Matthias, you have to figure out some other means of getting him blood. Halcyan 2

Halcyan 2 wrote: > >> If you feel cocky, you can even bring the other Salubri Blanche Hill > >> and Miriam Benyona. However, you'll need a good Blood Support in form > >> of Club Zombie, Palatial Estate, The Rack, and a couple of Blood > >> Dolls. Powerbase Montreal is always a good addition. Your blocking > >> capability should make sure that you keep those locations in your > >> controlled region. > >> > >-snip- > > > >Why use those when you have renewed vigor? > > Because you can't renew your own vigor. > > I suppose you can use Renewed Vigor if you do indeed plan to bring out multiple > Salubri, but then you have to put multiple copies of Matthias *and* Blanche, > and you have to deal with the Scarce penalty. Scarce penalty not that big of a deal with Minion Tap and Renewed Vigor

[ quoted text not captured ] Yes, but then you have to center your deck around Matthias and Blanche and pack your crypt full of them. The original person he was responding to seems to imply just focusing on Matthias (and not as much on Blanche), so as I pointed out, Renewed Vigor might not be as feasible. In addition, bloat is possible with the Salubri but it is still much more unwieldy. You have to bring out both Matthias *and* Blanche (unless you want to get out Miriam and Instruct her), paying the scarce penalty (for a total of 16 pool). It may take quite some time to get them both out, and then you still have all the problems that 5th Tradition bloat decks have. Getting blocked, etc. With traditional 5th/MT bloat decks, you can get out a Prince and immediately start bloating (since he can 5th himself). But with the Salubri, you need to get two out. And doing so takes several turns and brings you down to 14 pool, which may be problematic if you're being preyed on by a bleed deck. Halcyan 2

Carl Pilhatsch <carl.pi...@chello.at> schrieb in im Newsbeitrag: e7883b0c.02041...@posting.google.com... > The Salubri. Obeah. Powerful. > > If you take the Salubri and their discipline each on their own, they > don't seem that impressive. This all changes when you build a clever > combat deck, and other players' combat decks with Assamites, Brujah, > Gangrel, Tzimisce, etc. get pounced into Torpor on a regular basis. > > You don't need Potence, you don't even need any out-of-clan > discipline, just Fortitude, Obeah and a bit of Auspex. > > The Basic combo is Vitae Block (*up* to 3 blood!), Anesthetic Touch > and a Pulled Fangs to round it up. Matthias is the vampire of choice, > all 3 in-clans at superior, with a hefty special against Baali and > Setites, along with the very strong +1 intercept built in. What a > bargain. > > > If anybody is interested in a decklist, let me know. > > Carl i never tought i would write this but this deck is really good, although it is a bit to slow and doesn´t have enough intercept. stefan

halc...@aol.com (Halcyan 2) wrote in message news:<20020419145527...@mb-dh.aol.com>... > >> Because you can't renew your own vigor. Right, but in theory, you could do it with another, say, 5 cap and not a Salubri to circumvent the scarce penalty. > >> > >> I suppose you can use Renewed Vigor if you do indeed plan to bring out > multiple > >> Salubri, but then you have to put multiple copies of Matthias *and* > Blanche, > >> and you have to deal with the Scarce penalty. > > > >Scarce penalty not that big of a deal with Minion Tap and Renewed Vigor > > > Yes, but then you have to center your deck around Matthias and Blanche and pack > your crypt full of them. The original person he was responding to seems to > imply just focusing on Matthias (and not as much on Blanche), so as I pointed > out, Renewed Vigor might not be as feasible. I focus on both, with 4 copies of each. ;) Blanche Hill has the wonderful hunt-untap special. In conjuction with a Blood Doll perfect. > > In addition, bloat is possible with the Salubri but it is still much more > unwieldy. You have to bring out both Matthias *and* Blanche (unless you want to > get out Miriam and Instruct her), paying the scarce penalty (for a total of 16 > pool). It may take quite some time to get them both out, and then you still > have all the problems that 5th Tradition bloat decks have. Getting blocked, > etc. With traditional 5th/MT bloat decks, you can get out a Prince and > immediately start bloating (since he can 5th himself). But with the Salubri, > you need to get two out. And doing so takes several turns and brings you down > to 14 pool, which may be problematic if you're being preyed on by a bleed deck. > If I wanted a bloat deck, I'd have built it completely different. This deck described wants to block *all*, and have supreme table control. I just wanted to point out that the Salubri have very good combat potential. Renewed Vigor just doesn't fit into this deck, though it's a cool card. Do other people play the Salubri with combat/intercept as well? Carl

>If I wanted a bloat deck, I'd have built it completely different. This >deck described wants to block *all*, and have supreme table control. I >just wanted to point out that the Salubri have very good combat >potential. >Renewed Vigor just doesn't fit into this deck, though it's a cool >card. >Do other people play the Salubri with combat/intercept as well? Salubri intercept sounds like a nifty concept, it's just that it doesn't seem like you'd ever get out more than 2 or 3 vampires. Most likely, you'd just end up with Matthias (heavily tooled up) and/or Blanche Hill. And having so few minions and relying on Matthias to block all actions leaves you particularly vulnerable to Seduction, Elder Impersonation, and Call of the Hungry Dead (then again, maybe different metagame where you are). Halcyan 2

halc...@aol.com (Halcyan 2) wrote in message news:<20020419142210...@mb-dh.aol.com>... [ quoted text not captured ] That was my point, he says that if you use the other Salubries then you need blood suport, and what better blood suport than renewed vigor when you have salubries. And anyway, he wasn´t planing on using just 12 Mathias was he?

Halcyan 2 wrote: [ quoted text not captured ] I'm trying out (without much success) a deck with five Salubri (3 Matthias and 2 Blanche Hill) combined with a pair each of Tegyrius Vizier and Lazverinus, filling up to 12 with three lowcap basic fortitude cannonfodder. Add in a few Bangh Nakh, Sengir Dagger, Kalis Fang, Depravity and the combatcards to prevent damage, maneouver and prolong combat. Renewed Vigor usually makes me see all the four large vamps but the main problem is ousting, even with Pulse for bleeding. The combat part works like a marvel though :) Deck needs trimming as I almost always end up in the end-duel with my prey. Sten During

wb...@hotmail.com (Daz) wrote in message news:<b57b2dc9.02042...@posting.google.com>... [ quoted text not captured ] 4 Matthias, 4 Blanche Hill and 1 Miriam Benyona. And IMO, Blood Dolls tend to be better in this type of deck than Minion Taps and Renewed Vigors. After all, I don't want my vamps to be minion-tapped down to 1 or 2 blood, and then, by sheer bad luck, have no prevention or AT in hand. That kind of sucks. The deck is intercept-combat, so I want my vamps ready all the time. :) Carl

"Anarch Troublemaker" <a9505...@spamunet.univie.ac.at> wrote in message news:<3cc12a85$0$21416$3b21...@news.univie.ac.at>... [ quoted text not captured ] Thanks. Yes, it is indeed vulnerable to things like seduction and Elder Impersonation. That's why some DI's are now included, just in case... :) Protect Thine Own is "The Killer" for this deck, but hey, you can't have defenses against everything, can you? ;) Carl