These two equipment cards say that they act as Unique Locations,
but are equiped as an action, and paid for by the minion.
Since the card does not say that it is not equipment, can these
be stolen by, say, Lucian's special ability?
--
L. Scott Johnson (sjoh...@math.sc.edu) | These opinions are mine and
http://www.math.sc.edu/~sjohnson | are subject to card text.
Graphics Specialist and V:tES Rulemonger. |
Location-equipments such as Palatial Estate are affected normally by
anything that affects equipment. This means you can transfer them from
one minion to another as an action, destroy them with Shattering Blow, etc.
Tom Wylie rec.games.trading-cards.* Network Representative for
aa...@cats.ucsc.edu Wizards of the Coast, Inc.
L. Scott Johnson thoughtfully stated:
: Yeah, Lucian just pockets my palatial estate while I'm not looking in
: combat. Sure.
: Rake throws one punch and all of Dartmoor comes tumbling down (what am
: I still standing faround for ?)
I agree... this seems rather bogus to me as well. Perhaps a house rule is
in order...
Ewok
--
//\\\//\\\//\\\//\\\//\\\//\\\//\\\//\\\//\\\//\\
/ Ewok Juan Burwell \
\ jmbu...@unix.amherst.edu jmbu...@amherst.edu /
\\///\\///\\///\\///\\///\\///\\///\\///\\///\\//
L. Scott Johnson (lsc...@crl.com) wrote:
: In article <4a85bp$6...@darkstar.UCSC.EDU>,
: Thomas R Wylie <aa...@cats.ucsc.edu> wrote:
: >
: >Location-equipments such as Palatial Estate are affected normally by: >anything that affects equipment. This means you can transfer them from
: >one minion to another as an action, destroy them with Shattering Blow, etc.: >: Yeah, Lucian just pockets my palatial estate while I'm not looking in
: combat. Sure.: Rake throws one punch and all of Dartmoor comes tumbling down (what am
: I still standing faround for ?)
Well, if they're to be treated as equipment, that's the way it should
work. They definitely shouldn't be treated as locations and equipment...
IMO, they should have all been done like or similiar to The Rack...
--
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
| "What is a man without the beasts? If the beasts were gone, |
| man would die from a great loneliness of spirit." |
| "Confuse, annoy, and dee-STROY!!" Call me "Nicole" and I |
| npu...@tiger.lsu.edu -- Jet...@aol.com will have to kill you. |
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
In article <4a85bp$6...@darkstar.UCSC.EDU>,
Thomas R Wylie <aa...@cats.ucsc.edu> wrote:
>
>Location-equipments such as Palatial Estate are affected normally by
>anything that affects equipment. This means you can transfer them from
>one minion to another as an action, destroy them with Shattering Blow, etc.
>
Yeah, Lucian just pockets my palatial estate while I'm not looking in
combat. Sure.
Rake throws one punch and all of Dartmoor comes tumbling down (what am
I still standing faround for ?)
--
-----
L. Scott Johnson (lsc...@crl.com) | The opinions expressed are mine
Graphics Specialist and V:tES Rulemonger | and subject to card text
In article <4a85bp$6...@darkstar.UCSC.EDU>,
Thomas R Wylie <aa...@cats.ucsc.edu> wrote:
>
>Location-equipments such as Palatial Estate are affected normally by
>anything that affects equipment. This means you can transfer them from
>one minion to another as an action, destroy them with Shattering Blow, etc.
Vast wealth says the euipment is paid with out of the Methuselahs pool.
If the euipment found duirng a Vast Wealth action is one of these
locations, how is that paid? (And if the wealthly vampire does not have enough
blood to pay for it, what then?)
(Similarly for Magic of the Smith).
If Black cat equips with one of these locations, she reduces the cost
by 1 pool. Does this mean she reduces the cost by one blood?
A vampire who diablerizes another gets any equipment on the destroyed
vampire. This now includes equipment locations?
[ quoted text not captured ]
In article <4a9gjr$3...@crl.crl.com>, lsc...@crl.com (L. Scott Johnson) wrote:
> In article <4a85bp$6...@darkstar.UCSC.EDU>,
> Thomas R Wylie <aa...@cats.ucsc.edu> wrote:
> >
> >Location-equipments such as Palatial Estate are affected normally by
> >anything that affects equipment. This means you can transfer them from
> >one minion to another as an action, destroy them with Shattering Blow, etc.
> >
>> Yeah, Lucian just pockets my palatial estate while I'm not looking in
> combat. Sure.
Perhaps he just pockets the deed. That's how I interpreted it... and how
I see Heidelburg Castle working anyway.
> Rake throws one punch and all of Dartmoor comes tumbling down (what am
> I still standing faround for ?)
*shrug* Rampage is essentially the same thing? Or could I be wrong?
Judy
In article <jcookson-081...@heyyy.dorm.umd.edu>,
[ quoted text not captured ]
No. Rampage is Rake running around for a month (taking an unblocked
action) tearing up the place. With Shattering Blow, Rake takes a single
punch in combat and levels a building (all this while maneuvering/
pressing, gaining extra strikes, and sideslipping damage).
[ quoted text not captured ]
>> Yeah, Lucian just pockets my palatial estate while I'm not looking in
>> combat. Sure.> Perhaps he just pockets the deed. That's how I interpreted it... and how
>I see Heidelburg Castle working anyway.>> Rake throws one punch and all of Dartmoor comes tumbling down (what am
>> I still standing faround for ?)>*shrug* Rampage is essentially the same thing? Or could I be wrong?
Rampage is an entire action whereas Shattering Blow is a combat strike.
Minions don't carry their estate into combat where it can be smashed.
Thomas R Wylie (aa...@cats.ucsc.edu) wrote:
: Location-equipments such as Palatial Estate are affected normally by
: anything that affects equipment. This means you can transfer them from
: one minion to another as an action, destroy them with Shattering Blow, etc.
Whoa! Tell me how that is supposed to make sense. Gilbert Duane is
sitting in his Palatial Estate, happily enjoying being pampered, when
out walks Crusher, who uses his superior speed to grab Duane from
his comfy chair, run him outside the gate, lock the door, and goes back
inside to enjoy his brand new comfy chair. Duane dejectedly looks up,
and begins to walk back to town...
I just don't see it.
Terry Wright | "There is no such force as gravity.
aa...@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca | The Earth just sucks."
Saskatoon, Saskatchewan | - Me
Canada
npu...@tiger.lsu.edu (Nicole Janine Purvis) writes:
>L. Scott Johnson (lsc...@crl.com) wrote:
>: In article <4a85bp$6...@darkstar.UCSC.EDU>,>: Thomas R Wylie <aa...@cats.ucsc.edu> wrote:
>: >
>: >Location-equipments such as Palatial Estate are affected normally by
>: >anything that affects equipment. This means you can transfer them from
>: >one minion to another as an action, destroy them with Shattering Blow, etc.>: >>: Yeah, Lucian just pockets my palatial estate while I'm not looking in
>: combat. Sure.>: Rake throws one punch and all of Dartmoor comes tumbling down (what am>: I still standing faround for ?)> Well, if they're to be treated as equipment, that's the way it should>work. They definitely shouldn't be treated as locations and equipment...
>IMO, they should have all been done like or similiar to The Rack...
Exactly. It looks like they (the designers) were going for something
that was brought into play as and action and placed on a minion.
Unfortunately, someone thought equipment was the method to accomplish this.
And grabbing that handy 'equipment' symbol has led to some problems. (Lucian,
Shattering Blow, etc.)
It should have been simply an Action: Unique Location, IMO. Actions
already are capable of bringing cards into play (Army of Rats, Blood Bond),
and since the locations in no way resemble equipment except in the
fact that the minion has to take an action to retrieve one...
Either that or introduce a new card type (since Equip/Ally/Retainer are
are the same types of cards anyhow, just add a "Minion Location" to
the list, to be "recruited" the same way - undirected at +1 stealth)
and, if warranted, add rules about transferring such equipment, as the rules
for transferring equipment were included in the basic rulebook.
To make it look like the designers thought about it longer than during their
lunch hour - have a minion burn a blood to transfer a location from another
minion (10% property sales tax, deed transfer fees, and whatnot). Or
anything else to have it behave in an interesting, *believable* fashion.
Just slapping an equipment icon on it to avoid the trouble of fashioning
reasonable game mechanics does not inspire confidence in the game design.
--
L. Scott Johnson (sjoh...@math.sc.edu) | These opinions are mine and
http://www.math.sc.edu/~sjohnson | are subject to card text.
Graphics Specialist and V:tES Rulemonger. |
In article <4a9nk6$1l...@tiger3.ocs.lsu.edu>, npu...@tiger.lsu.edu (Nicole
Janine Purvis) wrote:
> L. Scott Johnson (lsc...@crl.com) wrote:
> : In article <4a85bp$6...@darkstar.UCSC.EDU>,
> : Thomas R Wylie <aa...@cats.ucsc.edu> wrote:
> : >
> : >Location-equipments such as Palatial Estate are affected normally by
> : >anything that affects equipment. This means you can transfer them from
> : >one minion to another as an action, destroy them with Shattering Blow, etc.
> : >
>
> : Yeah, Lucian just pockets my palatial estate while I'm not looking in
> : combat. Sure.
No, he pockets the deed. The )(&$&!@$ Malkavians aren't that nuts.
> : Rake throws one punch and all of Dartmoor comes tumbling down (what am
> : I still standing faround for ?)
+1 hand v. Ventrue = destroy equipment? Now, if only he'd do that at
home, to CNN Center...
J. Andrew Lipscomb <ew...@chattanooga.net, them...@delphi.com>
PGP keys by request
Don't blame me, I voted Libertarian.
In article <4a9t1i$b...@tribune.usask.ca>, aa...@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca (Terry
Wright) wrote:
> Thomas R Wylie (aa...@cats.ucsc.edu) wrote:
> : Location-equipments such as Palatial Estate are affected normally by
> : anything that affects equipment. This means you can transfer them from
> : one minion to another as an action, destroy them with Shattering Blow, etc.
>> Whoa! Tell me how that is supposed to make sense. Gilbert Duane is
> sitting in his Palatial Estate, happily enjoying being pampered, when
> out walks Crusher, who uses his superior speed to grab Duane from
> his comfy chair, run him outside the gate, lock the door, and goes back
> inside to enjoy his brand new comfy chair. Duane dejectedly looks up,
> and begins to walk back to town...
No, he heads down to the bank, uses his superior speed to pick the lock on
Gilbert's safe deposit box, steals the deed to the property, and has the
Metro-Dade Police do the rest.
[ quoted text not captured ]
J. Andrew Lipscomb thoughtfully stated:
: No, he heads down to the bank, uses his superior speed to pick the lock on: Gilbert's safe deposit box, steals the deed to the property, and has the
: Metro-Dade Police do the rest.
But keep in mind that all of this is supposed to be happening during
*combat*. It is perfectly conceivable as a regular action (such as disputed
territory), but as a part of combat, taking someone's location seem pretty
bogus.
[ quoted text not captured ]
Ewok (jmbu...@unix.amherst.edu) wrote:
: J. Andrew Lipscomb thoughtfully stated:: : No, he heads down to the bank, uses his superior speed to pick the lock on
: : Gilbert's safe deposit box, steals the deed to the property, and has the
: : Metro-Dade Police do the rest.
: But keep in mind that all of this is supposed to be happening during
: *combat*. It is perfectly conceivable as a regular action (such as disputed
: territory), but as a part of combat, taking someone's location seem pretty
: bogus.
This reminds me of my Atog/Colossus of Sardia deck I had back when I played
M:tG more often: the picture of the scrawny l'il Atog munching the enormous
Colossus reduced me to fits of laughter.
But seriously, I think it's good that these cards are equipment, even if
they seem unrealistic in "real-life" terms as a result. Locations tend to
be more secure than equipment, particularly if they don't have the built-in
come-attack-me like Smiling Jack or the Army of Rats do. Both Rampage and
Arson are (D) and thus can be blocked easily. But equipment in combat is
vulnerable to more minions' special abilites (Lucian's, and now Darius' and
Konstantin's) and disciplines (Potence: Shattering Blow; Celerity: Fast Hands;
Animals: Canine Horde). That gives the designers freedom to make equipment
more powerful and versatile -- shame that had to come at the expense of
proofreading.
- Neil
--
nwbe...@unix.amherst.edu, lentus in umbra | nudus ara, sere nudus...
in omnibus requiem quaesivi, et nusquam inveni nisi in angulo cum libro
ew...@chattanooga.net (J. Andrew Lipscomb) writes:
>In article <4a9nk6$1l...@tiger3.ocs.lsu.edu>, npu...@tiger.lsu.edu (Nicole
>Janine Purvis) wrote:>> L. Scott Johnson (lsc...@crl.com) wrote:
>> : In article <4a85bp$6...@darkstar.UCSC.EDU>,>> : Thomas R Wylie <aa...@cats.ucsc.edu> wrote:
>> : >
>> : >Location-equipments such as Palatial Estate are affected normally by
>> : >anything that affects equipment. This means you can transfer them from
>> : >one minion to another as an action, destroy them with Shattering Blow, etc.>> : Rake throws one punch and all of Dartmoor comes tumbling down (what am
>> : I still standing faround for ?)>+1 hand v. Ventrue = destroy equipment? Now, if only he'd do that at
w/ shattering blow, as mentioned in the thread, yes.
[ quoted text not captured ]
sjoh...@math.scarolina.edu (L. Scott Johnson) wrote:
>>> : Rake throws one punch and all of Dartmoor comes tumbling down (what>>>+1 hand v. Ventrue = destroy equipment? Now, if only he'd do that at
So like the blessing of Durga Syne (steal equipment:strike) can swipe a
castle... ROCK!!!!!
~mage bob
aa...@cats.ucsc.edu (Thomas R Wylie) writes:
>L. Scott Johnson <lsc...@crl.com> wrote:>>Vast wealth says the euipment is paid with out of the Methuselahs pool.
>>If the euipment found duirng a Vast Wealth action is one of these
>>locations, how is that paid? (And if the wealthly vampire does not have enough
>>blood to pay for it, what then?)
>>(Similarly for Magic of the Smith).>The VTES versions of Magic and Wealth just say to pay the cost as normal,
>meaning you would pay the blood cost as normal; the jyhad versions whould be
>read the same way.
And if the equipment found is one of these locations (costing 2 blood), and
the acting vampire only has one blood, what happens? (I assume the Locquipment
is simply burned, but since the results for a Methuselah not being able to
pay are much more extreme, I though I'd ask).
[ quoted text not captured ]
L. Scott Johnson <sjoh...@math.scarolina.edu> wrote:
>>The VTES versions of Magic and Wealth just say to pay the cost as normal,
>>meaning you would pay the blood cost as normal; the jyhad versions whould be
>>read the same way.>And if the equipment found is one of these locations (costing 2 blood), and
>the acting vampire only has one blood, what happens? (I assume the Locquipment
>is simply burned, but since the results for a Methuselah not being able to
>pay are much more extreme, I though I'd ask).
The card would just be burned with no other effect, yes.