2nd Tradition vs. Daring the Dawn

Can a vampire play a Second Tradition (just to untap) when the acting minion is performing an unblockable action via Daring the Dawn (for instance)?. Greetings, Damnans

>===== Original Message From Damnans <damna...@ono.com> ===== >Can a vampire play a Second Tradition (just to untap) when the acting >minion is performing an unblockable action via Daring the Dawn (for >instance)?. No. 2nd tradition requires a block attempt. -- LSJ (vte...@white-wolf.com) V:TES Net.Rep for White Wolf, Inc. Links to revised rulebook, rulings, errata, and tournament rules: http://www.white-wolf.com/vtes/ ------------------------------------------------------------ Get your FREE web-based e-mail and newsgroup access at: http://MailAndNews.com

On Sat, 14 Jul 2001 07:04:00 -0400, LSJ <vte...@MailAndNews.com> wrote: >>===== Original Message From Damnans <damna...@ono.com> ===== >>Can a vampire play a Second Tradition (just to untap) when the acting >>minion is performing an unblockable action via Daring the Dawn (for >>instance)?. > >No. 2nd tradition requires a block attempt. > How is there all of a sudden, a rule that prohibits TRYING to block an action you are not capable of blocking? (be it daring the dawn or you dont play enough intercept)

In message <3b50ce2f...@news.flrtn1.occa.home.com>, Jack Crow <no...@nowhere.com> writes >How is there all of a sudden, No. > a rule that prohibits TRYING to block an >action you are not capable of blocking? The action is unblockable. Thus, you cannot attempt a block. The rules prohibit you from doing that which you are prohibited from doing. -- James Coupe PGP Key: 0x5D623D5D EBD690ECD7A1F She twirled a lock of hair around her forefinger and smiled B457CA213D7E6 faintly. "Actually, I'd settle for a small Greek." 68C3695D623D5D

"James Coupe" <ja...@zephyr.org.uk> wrote > > The action is unblockable. Thus, you cannot attempt a block. Yes, but could you not attempt to block but fail *because* it's an unblockable action? For example, playing Forced Awakening against a Day Operation just to cycle it out of your hand... After all, failing to block and being incapable of blocking are two different animals. I've always thought this was legal... shows you how many intercept decks I play. Cheers, WES

In message <9iqpj...@enews3.newsguy.com>, Wes <gh...@NOSPAMmnsi.net> writes >> The action is unblockable. Thus, you cannot attempt a block. > >Yes, but could you not attempt to block but fail *because* it's an >unblockable action? No. You cannot attempt to block it because it is unblockable. All options regarding the block are off. Since 2nd Tradition *requires* a block attempt, that's off too. >For example, playing Forced Awakening against a Day Operation just to cycle >it out of your hand... After all, failing to block and being incapable of >blocking are two different animals. That's entirely different. FA does not requires a block attempt and could, instead, be used to play Deflection or somesuch. It allows you to "block normally" - in this case, not at all. Were FA to say "You must attempt to block", it would be prohibited [ quoted text not captured ]

On Sat, 14 Jul 2001 20:45:23 -0400, "Wes" <gh...@NOSPAMmnsi.net> wrote: >"James Coupe" <ja...@zephyr.org.uk> wrote >> >> The action is unblockable. Thus, you cannot attempt a block. > >Yes, but could you not attempt to block but fail *because* it's an >unblockable action? Nope. You can't attempt to do things you are forbidden from doing. Since you can't block an unblockable action, you can't even try. See also the difference between equipping with a .44 at 1 pool, and equipping with a .44 at 2 pool. The first case is illegal, and you can't even try it. The second case permits you to oust yourself, since you are CAPABLE of completing the action; it's just a dumb idea to. >For example, playing Forced Awakening against a Day Operation just to cycle >it out of your hand... After all, failing to block and being incapable of >blocking are two different animals. Forced Awakening doesn't require you to attempt to block, or you wouldn't be able to play Forced/Redirection. Its burn-blood effect takes effect because you HAVE failed to block -- but you can also fail without making the attempt in the first place. >I've always thought this was legal... shows you how many intercept decks I >play. Also note, for comparison, the 2nd Tradition/Eagle's Sight "gotcha". If someone cross-table takes an action and your vampire is tapped, you may not untap with 2nd Tradition and attempt to block, because you can't block the action; and you can't play Eagle's Sight to gain the opportunity to block because you're tapped and only untapped vampires may play reaction cards. Anneke gets around it because she ALWAYS has the opportunity to block, but even she wouldn't be able to play the card against a Day Op. -- Derek "be dirty. that will wake me up." -- name withheld to protect the guilty