(LSJ) Sleeping Mind Q

If sleeping mind is played at the superior level and your prey's vampires are all tapped, can they still use forced awakening to block? Sleeping Mind's text reads:(superior) ...Minions cannot untap during this action, and tapped minions cannot block this action. Forced Awakening's text reads: only usable by a tapped vampire. This reacting vampire can attempt to block the acting minion and play reactions cards AS THOUGH UMTAPPED. If he or she fails to block the acting minion.... Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Before you buy.

In article <898r25$j5t$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>, mads...@my-deja.com wrote: > If sleeping mind is played at the superior level and your prey's > vampires are all tapped, can they still use forced awakening to block? Yes. > Sleeping Mind's text reads:(superior) > > ...Minions cannot untap during this action, and tapped minions cannot > block this action. > > Forced Awakening's text reads: > > only usable by a tapped vampire. This reacting vampire can attempt to > block the acting minion and play reactions cards AS THOUGH UMTAPPED. > If he or she fails to block the acting minion.... Sleeping Mind [SAB] - Action Modifier (dom) (1) Cards played after Sleeping Mind are still free to break these rules, as always. So while you are prevented from untapping (with Rat's Warning), for instance, you are not prevented from playing Forced Awakening/Wake with Evening's Freshness to block - since Wakes allows you to attempt to block "as if untapped", and untapped vampires can still block the action as normal. [RTR 19980707] Per the July 7th, 1998 Rules Team Ruling, the only cards that would be useful in the situation that are prohibited by Sleeping Mind are: 2nd Tradition: Domain Rats Warning Guard Dogs You may play Forced Awakening or Wake with Evening's Freshness, even though the card text seems to have been written specifically to prevent them. This was not a Rules Team Ruling that was widely agreed with at the time, but it has changed the tournament environment completely, as I don't believe I've seen one in a tournament since. Carpe Noctem. Lasombra http://members.tripod.com/~Lasombra [ quoted text not captured ]

In article <8995td$qen$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>, [ quoted text not captured ] About the forced awakenig: the blood is paided by the forced awakened vampire even if he/she just deflects (say, with a Redirection) a bleeding minion without attempting to block him? Or if he simply plays a delaying tactics? (and so on) Thanks Aemilianus, Prince of Rome [ quoted text not captured ]

On Sat, 26 Feb 2000, The Lasombra wrote: > Per the July 7th, 1998 Rules Team Ruling, the only cards that would be > useful in the situation that are prohibited by Sleeping Mind are: > > 2nd Tradition: Domain > Rats Warning > Guard Dogs A couple of *very* corner cases, which are virtually never, ever, ever going to happen (I mention them for pedantry value): - Madness Network bleed against you, and you want to untap a vampire with Alexandra. - Madness Network bleed against you, and you want to untap a Rutor's Hand vampire (since it is still in your minion phase, you just have taken all your actions). - The even more unlikely "I choose to burn my mind rape *now* option", which is really rather foolish, since that also untaps the vampire you get (see errata, if 'you' (being any arbitrary person) don't understand). -- James Coupe

On Sat, 26 Feb 2000 tetragr...@my-deja.com wrote: > About the forced awakenig: the blood is paided by the forced awakened > vampire even if he/she just deflects (say, with a Redirection) a > bleeding minion without attempting to block him? > Or if he simply plays a delaying tactics? (and so on) It's burn blood, not payment. (So a vampire with 0 blood can burn 1 blood - doing nothing to him. If it was a payment, he couldn't do it since he couldn't afford it.) However, if deflects, he doesn't block successfully. So he burns a blood. If he Delaying Tactics, he deosn't successfully block. So he burns a blood. Similarly, a Telepathic Counter to a bleed is not a block, so he would burn a blood. Ditto Surprise Influence, Dread Gaze etc. -- James Coupe

In article <8995td$qen$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>, The Lasombra <TheLa...@hotmail.com> wrote: > In article <898r25$j5t$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>, > mads...@my-deja.com wrote: > > If sleeping mind is played at the superior level and your prey's > > vampires are all tapped, can they still use forced awakening to block? > > Yes. > > > Sleeping Mind's text reads:(superior) > > > > ...Minions cannot untap during this action, and tapped minions cannot > > block this action. > > > > Forced Awakening's text reads: > > > > only usable by a tapped vampire. This reacting vampire can attempt to > > block the acting minion and play reactions cards AS THOUGH UMTAPPED. > > If he or she fails to block the acting minion.... > > Sleeping Mind [SAB] - Action Modifier (dom) (1) > Cards played after Sleeping Mind are still free to break these rules, > as always. So while you are prevented from untapping (with Rat's > Warning), for instance, you are not prevented from playing Forced > Awakening/Wake with Evening's Freshness to block - since Wakes allows > you to attempt to block "as if untapped", and untapped vampires can > still block the action as normal. [RTR 19980707] > > Per the July 7th, 1998 Rules Team Ruling, the only cards that would be > useful in the situation that are prohibited by Sleeping Mind are: > > 2nd Tradition: Domain > Rats Warning > Guard Dogs > > You may play Forced Awakening or Wake with Evening's Freshness, even > though the card text seems to have been written specifically to prevent > them. > > This was not a Rules Team Ruling that was widely agreed with at the > time, but it has changed the tournament environment completely, as I > don't believe I've seen one in a tournament since. > > If that's the case then the minor version of Sleeping Mind seems to be more useful. Sleeping Mind (minor) ...Choose a tapped vampire. The chosen vampire cannot attempt to block this action. I guess this version would stop any more block attempts by the tapped vampire..(he can play wakes/forced awakes and react but cannot block) [ quoted text not captured ]

The Lasombra wrote: > mads...@my-deja.com wrote: > > If sleeping mind is played at the superior level and your prey's > > vampires are all tapped, can they still use forced awakening to block? > > Yes. Correct. > > Sleeping Mind's text reads:(superior) > > > > ...Minions cannot untap during this action, and tapped minions cannot > > block this action. > > > > Forced Awakening's text reads: > > > > only usable by a tapped vampire. This reacting vampire can attempt to > > block the acting minion and play reactions cards AS THOUGH UMTAPPED. > > If he or she fails to block the acting minion.... > > Sleeping Mind [SAB] - Action Modifier (dom) (1) > Cards played after Sleeping Mind are still free to break these rules, > as always. So while you are prevented from untapping (with Rat's > Warning), for instance, you are not prevented from playing Forced > Awakening/Wake with Evening's Freshness to block - since Wakes allows > you to attempt to block "as if untapped", and untapped vampires can > still block the action as normal. [RTR 19980707] Correct. The statement on Sleeping Mind that "tapped vampires cannot block" is true in general, whether Sleeping Mind is played or not. That truth doesn't prohibit Waking in general, nor does it prohibit Waking when superior Sleepin Mind is played. -- LSJ (vte...@wizards.com) V:TES Net.Rep for Wizards of the Coast. Links to revised rulebook, rulings, errata, and tournament rules: http://www.wizards.com/VTES/rules.asp

James Coupe wrote: > On Sat, 26 Feb 2000 tetragr...@my-deja.com wrote: > > About the forced awakenig: the blood is paided by the forced awakened > > vampire even if he/she just deflects (say, with a Redirection) a > > bleeding minion without attempting to block him? > > Or if he simply plays a delaying tactics? (and so on) > > It's burn blood, not payment. (So a vampire with 0 blood can burn 1 blood > - doing nothing to him. If it was a payment, he couldn't do it since he > couldn't afford it.) Correct. > However, if [he] deflects, he doesn't block successfully. So he burns a blood. > If he Delaying Tactics, he deosn't successfully block. So he burns a > blood. Similarly, a Telepathic Counter to a bleed is not a block, so he > would burn a blood. Ditto Surprise Influence, Dread Gaze etc. Correct. [ quoted text not captured ]