Reaction Questions

Greets, If I play a WWEF as a reaction, and then play a superior Deflection, does the vampire stay untapped (as per Deflection text)? If an enemy tries to bleed me, can I only play reactions to the action, or can I play reactions after any action modifiers have been played? For example, I have a vamp with DOM, and my opponent bleeds me with Arika (+2 bleed); she does this with a Govern the Unaligned (+2 bleed). At this point, can I wait to play a Deflection to see if Arika plays Conditioning? If she does not play Conditioning (or any other booster), can I still deflect after she states that she is no longer modifying the action? Essentially, what I want to know is when EXACTLY it is legal to play reactions, taking into account action modifiers by acting minions. I would like to play my deflection after my predator beefs up the bleed to ghastly levels, but I want to make sure it is legal. Cheers, Jason

In article <7Thl5.351997$52.1...@news2.mts.net>, "Jason Mowat" <jmo...@attglobal.net> wrote: > Greets, > > If I play a WWEF as a reaction, and then play a superior Deflection, does > the vampire stay untapped (as per Deflection text)? The (superior) deflection reads "...do not tap this vampire"; so, if your deflecting vamp was already tapped, he remains tapped. > > If an enemy tries to bleed me, can I only play reactions to the action, or > can I play reactions after any action modifiers have been played? For > example, I have a vamp with DOM, and my opponent bleeds me with Arika (+2 > bleed); she does this with a Govern the Unaligned (+2 bleed). At this > point, can I wait to play a Deflection to see if Arika plays Conditioning? > If she does not play Conditioning (or any other booster), can I still > deflect after she states that she is no longer modifying the action? > Essentially, what I want to know is when EXACTLY it is legal to play > reactions, taking into account action modifiers by acting minions. I would > like to play my deflection after my predator beefs up the bleed to ghastly > levels, but I want to make sure it is legal. Until the action resolves, as long as the acting minion modifies his action you can legally react after (or before) every act modifier he or she plays. Hope this help. Regards Emiliano, Prince of Rome > > Cheers, > Jason > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Before you buy.

In article <7Thl5.351997$52.1...@news2.mts.net>, "Jason Mowat" <jmo...@attglobal.net> wrote: > Greets, > > If I play a WWEF as a reaction, and then play a superior Deflection, does > the vampire stay untapped (as per Deflection text)? No, because WWEF does not untap your vampire, but rather, this tapped vampire may block and play reaction cards as if untapped for the duration of this action. > If an enemy tries to bleed me, can I only play reactions to the action, or > can I play reactions after any action modifiers have been played? For > example, I have a vamp with DOM, and my opponent bleeds me with Arika (+2 > bleed); she does this with a Govern the Unaligned (+2 bleed). At this > point, can I wait to play a Deflection to see if Arika plays Conditioning? > If she does not play Conditioning (or any other booster), can I still > deflect after she states that she is no longer modifying the action? > Essentially, what I want to know is when EXACTLY it is legal to play > reactions, taking into account action modifiers by acting minions. I would > like to play my deflection after my predator beefs up the bleed to ghastly > levels, but I want to make sure it is legal. You may play reaction cards by and untapped vampire in response to any action modifiers you predator may play. So therefore, you may play a deflection in response to your predators boosting of his bleed, even if you have already declined to block. Comments Welcome, Norman S. Brown Jr. X_Zealot Archon of the Swamp [ quoted text not captured ]

A few weeks ago, I saw this happen. The Malkavian was bleeding and asked "are you blocking?" Other Meth said, "No" So the Malk thought he was in and laid down Conditioning. The other Meth lays down deflection and the argument was on, lol. The Malk player stated " I already got through for one pool." The other Meth said "bleeding, see the card! You are still bleeding me!" I sided with the Malk player because I don't think you should have to ask, "Are you bOuNcInG? (in whiny nerd voice, of course)" Where's the surprise element...and the fun? I feel that if you say "no" to blocking a bleed action, you should not have any chance (save a Master out of Turn or reduce bleed cards) to do anything to stop it. I can see this is going to be another annoying timing loophole. Perhaps another exhausting re-write with the words "attempting to bleed" would clear it up. Jeff Prince of Cleveland "OOKLA, ARIEL, RIDE!" Thundarr, the Barbarian

Trut...@webtv.net (Jeffrey Moore) wrote in <14678-39...@storefull-147.iap.bryant.webtv.net>: [ quoted text not captured ] When you decline to block, that's all you're declining. If you're free to play a bleed-reduction reaction like Telepathic Counter, you're free to play a redirection reaction like Deflection. There is no timing loophole or issue. Refer to rulebook section 6.2 ut infra for details on the action and blocking process. It is legal to play non-blocking related reaction cards after declining a block but before the resolution of the action. Deflection is not any different from Delaying Tactics or Telepathic Counter. gomi -- There are enough people who have a brain-cell to their credit and yet still disagree with me that I don't feel any need to argue with morons. -- M. Lorton

On Mon, 21 Aug 2000 18:17:13 -0400 (EDT), Trut...@webtv.net (Jeffrey Moore) wrote: > I sided with the Malk player because I don't think you should have to >ask, "Are you bOuNcInG? (in whiny nerd voice, of course)" Where's the "Are you bouncing?" "Up the bleed and find out." >surprise element...and the fun? I feel that if you say "no" to That is the surprise. "Surprise, Mr. Bleeder... it's not me anymore." Where's the fun in the bleeder always having a hideous advantage? Answer: none. Everyone plays the fastest bleed deck they can and whoever gets lucky wins. Booooring. Not like saying "I'm not blocking" with an untapped minion with Dominate isn't totally obvious. >blocking a bleed action, you should not have any chance (save a Master >out of Turn or reduce bleed cards) to do anything to stop it. I can see Gee, let's make the Presence and Dominate bleed decks even more powerful than they were before. Right now there's a balance - you can drop the nuke, but they can bounce it. But if they decide not to block, you can drop the nuke and they can't go back and block. >this is going to be another annoying timing loophole. Perhaps another >exhausting re-write with the words "attempting to bleed" would clear it Perhaps you not exhausting yourself attempting to think would clear it up as well. No, I correct myself - it's patently obvious you DON'T think. -- Derek Jack-Booted Thug of Atlanta

Thanks douche! lol, Always nice to hear from ol' fascist jack boot wearing poser, Derek. Kinda rude there fella, lol. Just stating an opinion on another aspect of Jyhad that I disagree on. Funny how you personally take so much offense to my rants. It's ok to be whiny and nerdy, really. Believe me, I am SO in the "KILL THE HIGH BLEEDERS" camp, but I don't think that's how deflection was designed to work. Look at Redirection, it says "attempting". If you lost pool, the minion not only attempted but was successful. So why would you be able to play a redirection? Why isn't it worded like deflection or telepathic misdirection, i.e. "bleeding"? Telepathic counter is different and HAS to be played AFTER a bleed in the same way fotitude cards have to be played after damage is done 'cause you can't predict what amounts you will lose. Hey, that's the way I feel about it. Jeff Prince of Cleveland "EEENIK-CHOCK!" Apache Chief

Jeffrey Moore wrote: > Look at Redirection, it says "attempting". If you lost pool, the > minion not only attempted but was successful. So why would you be able > to play a redirection? Redirection is played before you've lost pool. But you don't lose pool the moment you say "I don't block" - the acting methuselah still gets to play action modifiers (like Conditioning) and the target Methuselah still gets to play reaction cards (like Telepathic Counter or Deflection), and other Methuselah still get to play reactions (like Ignis Fatuus). > Why isn't it worded like deflection or > telepathic misdirection, i.e. "bleeding"? The two phrasings are equivalent. Many examples of equivalent phrasings being used whe they "should" be identical can be found. > Telepathic counter is > different and HAS to be played AFTER a bleed in the same way fotitude Telepathic Counter can be played at any time during the bleed. [6.2] It cannot be played after the bleed (after losing pool). > cards have to be played after damage is done 'cause you can't predict > what amounts you will lose. Hey, that's the way I feel about it. Damage prevention effects can only be used if you have pending damage to prevent - and they must be used before you handle that damage (pay a blood to heal or to prevent destruction or whatever). [6.4.6] -- LSJ (vte...@white-wolf.com) V:TES Net.Rep for White Wolf, Inc. Links to revised rulebook, rulings, errata, and tournament rules: http://www.white-wolf.com/vtes/

On Tue, 22 Aug 2000 11:51:28 -0400 (EDT), Trut...@webtv.net (Jeffrey Moore) wrote: >Thanks douche! lol, Always nice to hear from ol' fascist jack boot >wearing poser, Derek. Kinda rude there fella, lol. Just stating an I enjoy being rude. It brings me much amusement, especially under specific circumstances - such as being rude to fools. >opinion on another aspect of Jyhad that I disagree on. Funny how you >personally take so much offense to my rants. It's ok to be whiny and I'm not taking offense, I just think you're a damned fool. =) And I couldn't resist the opportunity to point it out one more time. =) >nerdy, really. Believe me, I am SO in the "KILL THE HIGH BLEEDERS" >camp, but I don't think that's how deflection was designed to work. >Look at Redirection, it says "attempting". If you lost pool, the >minion not only attempted but was successful. So why would you be able However, you don't lose pool until the action is completely finished. This means after all action modifiers have been played, and all reactions have been played to those action modifiers. Per the rules, the reacting Methuselah always has the opportunity to play a card AFTER the acting Methuselah plays a card. >to play a redirection? Why isn't it worded like deflection or >telepathic misdirection, i.e. "bleeding"? Telepathic counter is because "attempting to bleed" more accurately describes the action, and Sabbat was printed after Jyhad/V:TES? >different and HAS to be played AFTER a bleed in the same way fotitude >cards have to be played after damage is done 'cause you can't predict >what amounts you will lose. Hey, that's the way I feel about it. Actually, you can play Telepathic Counter on a person bleeding you for 2 (with Social Charm, say) and they can still play an action modifier like Aire of Elation to increase the bleed. It's a two-way street. The action isn't done until both players are finished playing cards. You can even play TC at superior on a person bleeding you for 1 (making the current action a bleed for -1), and they can add superior Conditioning to it to make it a total bleed of 2. Love and Kisses, [ quoted text not captured ]

In article <15511-39...@storefull-144.iap.bryant.webtv.net>, Jeffrey Moore <Trut...@webtv.net> writes >If you lost pool, the >minion not only attempted but was successful. So why would you be able >to play a redirection? 1.6.1.5 on Sequencing, in the V:TES Rules PDF. Once they have played Conditioning, a new sequencing phase opens whereby they can play more cards, and then you can. -- James Coupe | PGP Key 0x5D623D5D | ja...@zephyr.org.uk (New e-mail) "Who'd have ever predicted the moment would come when I find myself grateful they've kept women dumb? She's an innocent maiden but then so am I, that's why it's possible I could get by."