rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad

House Rules (net.personality-generated)

4 messages from 4 participants · 01 May 1995 – 05 May 1995
original thread on Google Groups

L. Scott Johnson

* Additions and comments should be sent to: sjoh...@math.scarolina.edu Please include the text "house rule" in the subject line. * NOTE: Some rules are mix-n-match, some are mutually exclusive. Take what you want and ignore the rest. * Opposition to a particular house rule is marked with -INI- (instead of [INI], which indicates support). * If you want more information on a rule, e-mail the first person listed on the support line - please don't clutter the newsgroup with it. Thanks. (Chances are high that any odd rule has been hashed over too much already.) House Rules =========== Fixing what's Broken -------------------- Bringing unbalancing cards into line, making the game playable. o. Reaction cards can be played by Minions controlled by a Methuselah other than the Methuselah controlling the acting Minion, regardless of whose turn it is. [LSJ] [JHJ] [SHWT] [ASHK] -JRM- o. Action cards can always be played by the acting Minion, even if it is not the controlling Methuselah's turn. [LSJ] [JHJ] [SHWT] [ASHK] -JRM- o. Cards which cannot be used by vampires going to torpor (Pulled Fangs, Amaranth) cannot be used by a vampire burned in combat, either. [LSJ] [CSA] [JHJ] [SHWT] [ASHK] [JRM] Bonding - only one Bonding, Condition, or Threats Card may be used during a single action. [LSJ] [CSA] [JHJ] [SHWT] [JC] [JRM] only modifies the base bleed of the vampire playing it. (And will thus be cancelled if Masked) [ASHK] -JHJ- Charming Lobby - use as an action to call a vote at +1 stealth. If successful, call a vote by playing a Political Action card or by naming a vote allowed by a card in play. If the vote succeeds, the next vote will pass as well. [LSJ] [JHJ] [JC] [JRM] use as an action to call a vote at +1 stealth. If successful, a vote is called to determine whether the next vote will pass. A successful vote means the next vote called will pass automatically. [CSA] [SHWT] [ASHK] Conditioning - see Bonding. Dragon Breath Rounds - may not be used in a Zip Gun [CSA] Fame - is a unique Master, contested by the vampire exactly as a title would be contested. [JF] Malkavian Madness Network - makes it the turn of the Methuselah controlling the acting Malkavian. After the action, the original Methuselah can continue her turn. [JC] [JF] [CSA] -JRM- gives the acting Malkavian's Methuselah the remainder of the Minion Phase, in which any other Methuselah may play Reaction Cards. [HAR] Monocle of Clarity - may not refer to future questions, answers, statements, nor commands. If it invokes a relationship (p -> q), then the answerer is free to make p true without regard to her ability to make the relationship agree with her answer. Once p is true, the answerer becomes bound to make the relationship agree with her answer, if possible. [LSJ] [JHJ] [JRM] The intent of the Monocle is to divine a player's plans and intentions, not to force a player to do something against their will. [JC] [SHWT] [JRM] only allows questions which pertain to information about the current or past game position, regardless of the original intent of the card. The answerer is not committed to any course of action. [ASHK] If it cannot be played responsibly, it should not be allowed in the play group. [JC] [LSJ] [SHWT] must be answered with "Yes" or "No" [could be intuited, -lsj] [JF] [LSJ] does not bind the answerer if the answerer can demonstrate that the phrasing of the question prevents something from occuring regardless of whether the answer was Yes or No (i.e., the question must allow a perfect partition of future answerer actions). [this is an inherent quality of all Yes/No questions, so should not come up; but the rule is useful for people without computers to parse every question -lsj] [JF] [LSJ] may be removed from the game if all players not controlling the Monocle of Clarity agree that the questioner abundantly demonstrates that he is being a dick and/or formulaically unclever. [JF] Threats - see Bonding. Zip Gun - may not use Dragon Breath Rounds [CSA] Clarifications and Design Considerations ---------------------------------------- Re_vamp_ing rules that worked satisfactorily anyhow (includes wallpaper). o. An action with the (D) symbol is directed, and can only be blocked by the target Methuseleh or the target card's controller. An action without the (D) symbol is undirected and can only be blocked by the acting Methuseleh's prey or predator. An action not directed against another Methuselah is considered undirected. The presence or absence of the (D) symbol has no effect on determination of legal targets. [CSA] [LSJ] [JHJ] [ASHK] -JRM- as above, but Computer Hacking may be directed at any Methuselah. [SHWT] o. Master Out-of-Turn cards may be played whenever appropriate in lieu of you next Master Phase, as per the original rulebook. [LSJ] [JHJ] [ASHK] -SHWT- -CSA- -JRM- as above, but not during your own Master phase (Sudden Reversal). [ASHK] -SHWT- o. Definition of "same action". For the purposes of cards that prohibit the "same action", if an action defined in the rulebook (bleed, equip, recruit ally, recruit retainer, political action, hunt, encounter vampire in torpor, leave torpor) is accomplished more than once, it is considered the same action even if the target changes or a different action card is used. Likewise, any such action accomplished without a card is considered the same as the same action accomplished with an action card. [CSA] [SHWT] o. A minion may not attempt the same action more than once per turn, regardless of subsequent untapping. [LX] o. No more than one of any particular action modifier may be played or used during any particular action, even if the acting minion changes. This does not apply to minions that are not the acting minion when they play the card. [CSA] o. Combat cannot occur with a vampire in torpor. Diablerie is possible if the opposing minion is a ready vampire, otherwise nothing happens. [LSJ] [CSA] [JHJ] [JC] [SHWT] [ASHK] [JRM] o. Strike: Combat Ends resolves during normal strike resolution (still cancelling first strikes). If the opposing strike is also: End Combat, then both have their usual effect. [LSJ] [CSA] [JHJ] [JC] [SHWT] [ASHK] [JRM] o. Only Methuselehs other than the acting Methuseleh may use additional political action cards for votes. [CSA] [ASHK] -LSJ- -SHWT- Blood Bond - is a directed action. [CSA] [JHJ] Blood Rage - requires (th) not (fo). [LSJ] [CSA] [JHJ] [JC] [SHWT] [ASHK] [JRM] Chainsaw - is a melee weapon [CSA] [LX] [JC] [JF] [ASHK] [JRM] -JHJ- does 3 damage each strike. Only usable once per round. [JHJ] Cloak the Gathering - plays as printed, DTR FAQ-up notwithstanding. (That is, the +1 stealth at the top of the description is NOT bold, the rest of the description is). [JC] [LSJ] [JHJ] [SHWT] [JRM] [TOM] Concealed Weapon - does not require (ob). [LSJ] [CSA] [JHJ] [JC] [SHWT] [JF] [ASHK] [JRM] Deflection - replace the superior version with "as above, plus the reacting vampire can pay 1 blood and not be tapped by Deflection" [CSA] [ASHK] -JRM- Earth Meld - costs 1 blood from the acting vampire. [CSA] [ASHK] Elder Kindred Network - has no effect if the vote is successful. [TOM] [LSJ] [CSA] [JHJ] [JC] [SHWT] [ASHK] [JRM] Enchant Kindred - is at +1 stealth when attempting the superior version. [LSJ] [CSA] [JHJ] [JC] [SHWT] [ASHK] -JRM- Faceless Night - taps any minion who attempts to block when the action becomes blocked or when the action resolves, as appropriate. (This allows the blocker to continue to play intercept cards.) [LSJ] [CSA] [JHJ] [SHWT] only affect Minions who attempt to block *after* it is played. [JHJ] Fame - affects the controller of the card that did the damage that caused the vampire to enter torpor. If the vampire is sent to torpor by a special card, such as Day Operation, it affects the controller of that card. [CSA] [JC] -LSJ- Form of Mist - costs 1 blood from the vampire playing it. [CSA] [ASHK] Freak Drive - costs 2 blood from the acting vampire. [CSA] [ASHK] Frenzy - may be played even if you have no Minions involved in the Combat. [LSJ] [CSA] [JC] [JRM] Lextalionis - may be called when a Methuselah has gained a victory point since the start (untap) of your last turn. [LSJ] [JHJ] [CSA] [JC] [SHWT] [ASHK] -JRM- Majesty - costs 1 blood from the vampire playing it. [CSA] [ASHK] [JRM] Malkavian Dementia - returns the affected Malkavian untapped. [JF] [JHJ] -JRM- Misdirection - costs 2*X to tap X minions. [CSA] [ASHK] Obedience - costs 1 blood from the reacting vampire. [CSA] Parity Shift - may only redistribute pool up to the difference between the selected Methuselah's pool and your own pool. [LSJ] [CSA] [ASHK] [JHJ] -JC- -JRM- Rampage - is not directed (D) when used to burn a location that you control. [JF] [ASHK] [CSA] [JRM] [LSJ] [JHJ] Ritual of the Bitter Rose - can only be used when a vampire is diablerized in combat - not simpy burned. [ASHK] [LSJ] Rotschreck - hoses the vampire about to *receive* aggravated damage. [ASHK] [JHJ] [CSA] [JRM] [DTR (months with only 30 days)] -JF- -DTR (months that end with Y)- Sport Bike - is not optional. [LSJ] [CSA] [SHWT] [ASHK] -JRM- Talbot's Chainsaw - does not force it's wielder to attack with it during the controller's minion phase; it is merely an option. [JC] -JHJ- -CSA- -JRM- -SHWT- Taste of Vitae - only one of these may be played per minion per round. [LSJ] [CSA] [LX] [JHJ] [JC] [SHWT] [JF] [ASHK] [JRM] only counts blood lost to damage. [CSA] [LSJ] [LX] [SHWT] [ASHK] [JRM] is only usable at close range. [CSA] [LSJ] [SHWT] [JF] [JRM] may be used after any damage-resolution phase (between strikes), instead of only at the end of a round (after any additional strikes). (And may then be used once per damage-resolution phase) [JHJ] The 2nd Tradition - may be used by an untapped Prince/Justicar for +2 intercept. [LSJ] [CSA] [JHJ] [JC] [SHWT] [ASHK] [JRM] The 5th Tradition - may not be used to refill the acting vampire [CSA] [ASHK] [JRM] Wake with Evening's Freshness - costs 1 blood from the reacting vampire. [CSA] [ASHK] requires Thaumaturgy. [JF] -JHJ- -LSJ- -CSA- -JC- -SHWT- Game World Considerations -------------------------- Changes to make the card game feel like, or reflect the mechanics of, the "real" world (where vampires exist, of course). o. Actions by vampires in torpor can be blocked by Kindred ONLY. [LSJ] [CSA] [JHJ] [SHWT] [JRM] o. Transferring equipment from a vampire in torpor can be done by Kindred ONLY. [LSJ] [CSA] [JHJ] [SHWT] [JRM] Brujah Frenzy - may be played only on a Ready Brujah. Can only send the Acting Brujah into combat with a Ready Minion. [LSJ] [CSA] [JC] [SHWT] [ASHK] [JHJ] -JRM- Camarilla Exemplary - does not require an Ally to pay life to attempt to block. [HAR] [JHJ] -JRM- Chainsaw - begins each combat "off". Does 3 damage each strike if it began the round of combat "on". The minion holding it may use a Strike: start chainsaw to turn the chainsaw "on". Strike: start chainsaw is unaffected by Strike: dodge (or other non-attack strike). [LSJ] Chantry - may be applied during Untap, not Master phase. [LSJ] [ASHK] [JHJ] -JRM- Day Operation - does not affect the ability of Allies (Kine) to block. [SHWT] [JHJ] [LSJ] -JRM- Haven Uncovered - does not prevent its victim from being attacked in torpor. [LSJ] [SHWT] -JRM- Rotshreck - may only take into account aggravated damage that actually occurs. If the cause of the damage goes unperformed (due to Combat Ends or steal/destroy equipment with first strike, e.g.), Rotshreck may not be used. This does not apply if the damage is merely foiled (by dodge, fortitude, Merrill Molitor, Blood Rage/Fury, e.g.) [LSJ] [JHJ] [JC] is played only during damage resolution. May take into account damage occurring by means other than strikes, such as Weather Control. [CSA] may be played any time the possibility of taking aggravated damage exists. [LX] Zip Gun - is a Weapon, but not a Weapon: Gun. (It may not use ammunition). [CSA] [ASHK] ---------- [ASHK]- Alan S. H. Kwan (kw...@cs.cornell.edu) [CSA] - Curt Adams (curt...@aol.com) [HAR] - Harpua (rho...@itsmail1.hamilton.edu) [JC] - Joseph Cochran (js...@vt.edu) [JF] - Jon Ferro (fe...@chem.cmu.edu) [JHJ] - J. Hunter Johnson (jhun...@io.com) [JRM] - James R. McClure Jr., The OS/2 Apostle (jrmc...@ulkyvm.louisville.edu) [LSJ] - L. Scott Johnson (sjoh...@math.scarolina.edu) [LX] - Larrx (la...@acs.bu.edu) [SHWT]- Shane H. W. Travis (sht...@duke.usask.ca) Contributor to the list without his consent: [TOM] - Thomas R Wylie, WotC Net.Rep (aa...@cats.ucsc.edu) Necessitator of the list from general acute myopia: [DTR] - Design Team Ruling - aka Don't Tell Richard what we did to his game. -- L. Scott Johnson (sjoh...@math.scarolina.edu) Graphics Specialist and Jyhad Rulemonger.

Alan Kwan

In article <3o33og$q...@solaris.cc.vt.edu> js...@discus.ise.vt.edu (Joseph Cochran) writes: >In article <3o2ief$2...@redwood.cs.scarolina.edu>, >L. Scott Johnson <sjoh...@math.scarolina.edu> wrote: >>Talbot's Chainsaw - does not force it's wielder to attack with it during >> the controller's minion phase; it is merely an option. >> [JC] >> -JHJ- -CSA- -JRM- -SHWT- > I feel so lonely.... > > I still stick by this as a house rule, [...] I'm not against your house rule, Joseph, because the card text, _according to usual WotC rules editing standards_, is ambiguous ... On another issue, both this card and `realism' considerations would suggest that (ordinary) Chainsaw is not a Melee Weapon. However, Talbot's Chainsaw has no restrictions of `useable only once per combat'; why the ordinary Chainsaw? I'm suspecting that the Chainsaw card text is spill-over from the Shotgun card text, due to some mis-operation of some word processor or database program ... -- "Live Life with Heart." Alan Kwan kw...@cs.cornell.edu

Joseph Cochran

In article <3o6pul$s...@ask.cs.cornell.edu>, Alan Kwan <kw...@cs.cornell.edu> wrote: >I'm suspecting that the Chainsaw card text is spill-over from the >Shotgun card text, due to some mis-operation of some word processor or >database program ... Ah, yes. I personally blame cut-n-paste for half of the editing problems you see in games today. It's just too easy for someone to move a whole block over intending to change just "this" and "that" on this move and "the other" on another move, and to forget what exactly it was she was changing. Oops. Proofreaders then have a harder time, because so much of it looks the same as other parts, and then they can accidentally miss the one (usually crucial) difference. In Jyhad, it looks to be responsible for Chainsaw, Venture Justicar, half of the (D) bleed cards, and the 4/15/95 FAQ (for starters). It's a new thing that proofreaders are going to have to adjust to (and be given more time for). | If you've got a hot lead on a new | *--Joe--* | PC game, call the announce line at | js...@vt.edu | ** csi...@discus.ise.vt.edu ** | +-------------------------------------+---------------------------------- "Carnivores, oy!" -- Timon, TLK

fs...@aurora.alaska.edu

In article <3o2ief$2...@redwood.cs.scarolina.edu>, sjoh...@math.scarolina.edu (L. Scott Johnson) writes: > Monocle of Clarity - may not refer to future questions, answers, statements, > nor commands. If it invokes a relationship (p -> q), then the answerer > is free to make p true without regard to her ability to make the > relationship agree with her answer. Once p is true, the answerer becomes > bound to make the relationship agree with her answer, if possible. > [LSJ] [JHJ] [JRM] > > If it cannot be played responsibly, it should not be allowed in the > play group. > [JC] [LSJ] [SHWT] > > must be answered with "Yes" or "No" [could be intuited, -lsj] > [JF] [LSJ] > > does not bind the answerer if the answerer can demonstrate that the > phrasing of the question prevents something from occuring regardless > of whether the answer was Yes or No (i.e., the question must allow a > perfect partition of future answerer actions). [this is an inherent ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ > quality of all Yes/No questions, so should not come up; but the rule ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ > is useful for people without computers to parse every question -lsj] ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ Well, if I borrow a Monocle of Clarity and ask you, L. Scott Johnson, this question: "Is your answer to this question the same as to the yes-or-no question 'Does L. Scott Johnson agree to buy and send marion delgado a box of Jyhad boosters within 24 hours?' ?" You are going to be agreeing to send me a box of boosters, be your answer yes or no. Feel free to use "intuition" and/or "a computer to parse" this well-known simple logical trap. With my box, I should be able to repay my friend plus whatever card would constitute the boundary of usury/loansharking law. Also, not only is this not an implication relation (switch the two questions "this question" and "the question" -- it is an equivalence relation), but if it were (and you can use half of the equivalence relation as a functional implication) you would STILL be bound to agree based on the earlier rule you signed off on (make them agree). Furthermore, the rest of the people consulted did not smugly call this a non-problem, realizing as they did that it was likely (indeed it is provably true) that a non-partitioning yes/no question existed. My correcting of this error in reasoning I would call very responsible, indeed, educational, I hope. I don't want people thinking partitioning is inherent to Y/N questions, and that the problem with them is only lack of smarts or computer macho or time. Many Jyhad players (of course I exclude _me_) are smart, computer literate, and have a lot of free time. Therefore in a game, I would have a box of boosters off of ye, L. Scott Johnson. QED. I hope you don't take logical fencing like this personally. It is the same thing as playing Jyhad, I think, kind of a metagame outside the game. Mathematicaly: Q=[(Q=x)=x] to affirm or deny Q (which contains "the answer to this question is yes") affirms x. > [JF] [LSJ] > > [LSJ] - L. Scott Johnson (sjoh...@math.scarolina.edu) > [LX] - Larrx (la...@acs.bu.edu) > [SHWT]- Shane H. W. Travis (sht...@duke.usask.ca) > > Contributor to the list without his consent: > [TOM] - Thomas R Wylie, WotC Net.Rep (aa...@cats.ucsc.edu) > > Necessitator of the list from general acute myopia: > [DTR] - Design Team Ruling - aka Don't Tell Richard what we did to his game. > -- > L. Scott Johnson (sjoh...@math.scarolina.edu) > Graphics Specialist and Jyhad Rulemonger. marion delgado - inadvertent gadfly and anal-retentive logician. -- There was a swirling mass of water that lived in a quiet pond, which asked permission of its master to visit all the lands beyond. And its master allowed it to fly, so the wind swept the whirlpool across the sky. The whirlpool's mother wore a jacket she'd sewn out of dental floss. It was stolen by a monkey who sold it to an albatross. And it had the idea to fly, so the wind swept the whirlpool across the sky. (The Meat Puppets, North Pole's favorite son band!)