Gangrel Newsletter July 2001

Contents Section 1.0 Welcome Section 1.1 Feral Whispers Section 1.2 Talking point Section 1.3 Vampire of the month Section 1.4 Card of the Month Section 1.5 Deck of the Month Section 1.6 Ritual Challenge Section 1.7 Conclusion ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Section 1.0 WELCOME Come, brother, sit by my fire and listen to our tales of old. We are Gangrel and we are the beast. Hmmm... I have a worry. I’ll tell you, things are gonna be very different as a result of one card in Final Nights. Us Gangrel are going to be amongst the clans most affected by it, and it is going to be either very good or very bad for us. The more I think about it, the more I worry about exactly how things are going to change in the upcoming months. What am I talking about? Check out card of the month and see what I mean. Also a new competition this month – enjoy. Enjoy! ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Section 1.1 FERAL WHISPERS Well, the results of last month’s competition are… nobody entered, so I win. Hurrah! I’d like to thank members of the academy, etc etc. I had a nice prize lined up to. Ah well, I get to keep it. No letters either. Feel free to comment either to the group or to my email address: dave...@hotmail.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Section 1.2 TALKING POINT A Bluffer’s Guide to Table Dealing, part one... Well, this is speculative, but I have given a lot of thought around the way the game works lately, and have come to a few conclusions which I will be writing up over the next few newsletters. Hopefully, this fabulous part-work will form an invaluable reference guide that the whole family can enjoy. ;) Part 1 - Feel the Deal When it comes to playing, your passage to victory is typically a lot smoother if you actively go and seek table deals. A good player is typically a confident player. He is in control of his cards, pays attention to the table, and gives off “I am a good player” vibes. He knows this, but the rest of the table won’t, especially when you meet a new crowd for the first time, and it is just not done to go around saying “I’m gonna beat you coz I am a great player, far better than you amateurs”. You have to do it subtly. VTES is predominantly a sociable game, where interaction between players is encouraged, so it is easy to demonstrate to other players that you are in control, and therefore a force to be reckoned with. The best way to do this is by actively seeking sensible deals – for example “I won’t bleed you next turn if you don’t block this action” or “You can borrow my Rumour Mill if you want, but I’ll have to ask you to help me out with the next vote”. By offering table deals, this demonstrates you are a good player. In being a good player, you win more games. In winning more games, you become more confident. In being more confident, you offer more table deals. Etc. Although dealing is to be encouraged, remember a few points: 1) Don’t be stupid. Don’t offer deals that will help your predator oust you unless you absolutely positively have to. 2) Deal often, but little. The more comfortable people get dealing with you, the more credible you become, so when you REALLY need some help, it gives you a little more bargaining power. So try to get involved with other peoples play as often as possible by offering Votes, Stealth, Intercept, or by jiggering with Combat if you can. The more you add to play outside of your turn, the higher your table credibility will be. 3) Spread it around. Deal with everyone on the table. Obviously, your preferred dealee should be your Grand Predator or Grand Prey. However, if either your predator or prey are particularly powerful, it could help to deal with them (helping them a lot) or dealing with anyone else AGAINST them (to fight off a common enemy). Either way, try not to show favouritism unless there is a clear target. 4) Pick on the unpopular kid. Sneak Bleed. Power Vote. Nasty Rush. Weenie Anything. All these decks are very unpopular, and usually get the whole table’s attention. Wherever these decks appear, the people either side just groan. Deal all around the table to make sure that the threat is neutralised and that you are considered a safe bet to deal with. 5) Golden Rule. There are actually two parts to the Golden Rule. The first is Stick to Your Deals. Whenever you cut a deal, keep it. If you break a deal, it could take some time before people forget it. If it’s with your regular playgroup, it is not so bad, since they can always get you next time or whatever. However, at a tournament you only have 3 or 4 games to last it out. You will almost certainly be playing with the same folks in later games and they will remember. The taint of “deal breaker” can also mean people take seemingly unprovoked actions against you if you look like you are on the rise. 6) The second part of the Golden Rule is If You Are Going to Break A Deal, Don’t Get Caught! Claim it was an accident, or you forgot, or you had to. Try and bring the other person down. However, remember that this newsletter does NOT recommend deal breaking at all. Honest! More next time. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Section 1.3 VAMPIRE OF THE MONTH Haakon Mortensen Clan: Gangrel Antitribu Capacity: 8 Ability: During your untap phase, you can move 1 blood from Haakon to any Gangrel or Gangrel-Antitribu in your uncontrolled region. Haakon can take an action to move 1 blood from the blood bank to any untapped vampire. Artist(s): Christopher Shy Disciplines : Superior Animalism Superior Fortitude Superior Protean Haakon is a Gangrel Methusula’s dream. If he is used in conjunction with the Ecoterrorists, the Zoo Hunting Ground, and maybe the Twisted Forest, you will never have to pay for a vampire ever again! Up to three blood transferred to vampires each turn, which also becomes a great source of blood gen later in the game. This really IS a special! The skills too are excellent for us country gangrels – a perfect fit in fact, which gives far better options for a !Gangrel / Gangrel deck, especially using Genevive, Monique, and Luther. He is on a par with Gitane St Claire, who is one of my favourite Gangrels, and he costs about the same too. Cost, in fact, is one of only two dowsides I can see to him, and the reason why he might not appear in every deck I make: he costs 8 pool and has no votes. For 1 pool more, you could buy Ingrid Rossler, who also has 2 votes and an equally cool special, as well as Dominate. 1 Less buys you Gitane who is the same without the skills. It seems, therefore, that you are paying solely for that special. It does seem worth it, but it is a little costly. Also, he is not a Gangrel, he is a !Gangrel. This means either a clan impersonation, or you may have to do without some of the really useful stuff (Backways for stealth, Ritual Challenge for punch, no Dog Pack or Rengade Garou). This means you could loose some focus. Nonetheless, I expect he will be a big hit amongst Gangrel lovers. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Section 1.4 CARD OF THE MONTH King of the Mountain Type(s): Combat Discipline: Fortitude Blood Cost: 2 Rarity: Common Artist(s): Brian LeBlanc Card Text: Basic Prevent all damage from the opposing minion's strike. If the strike was made with a melee weapon, that weapon is destroyed. Superior Play after range is determined and before strikes are chosen. If the opposing minion inflicts damage with a hand strike this round (even if the damage is prevented), he or she takes an equal amount of damage during strike resolution as well Well, this changes everything. Fortitude now has a chance to become an offensive discipline! The superior of this could revolutionise combat in that environmental damage and weapons become more important in the game. What do I mean? Well, this one, single, common card means that all those with rush decks using potence or protean hand strikes facing a Fortitude Heavy deck will be screwed unless they are able to pack damage prevention to cover the hits back! Brujah and !Brujah can’t, Nossies and !Nossies (on the whole) can’t, !Gangrel can’t, but Gangrel can, so most rush decks could be railroaded by this card. It also causes even more trouble for those who use Melee Weapons. Anybody trying an attack with Kalis Fang, the Sengir Dagger, the Crimson Sentinal, or the Sword of Judgement has to be very careful with the inferior, or expensive hardware bites the big one. Of course, it still depends who you are rushing, but most Ventrue or !Ventrue (two of the most popular clans at the moment in my area) have Fortitude in spades, giving the player choosing them a huge advantage – votes, unblockable (Big) bleeds, and now anti Rush. The Tremere also have quite a few bigger vamps with Fortitude, as do the Assamites, and of course the Ravnos have always had plenty of Fortitude. Most interestingly, Aabt Kindred all have Fortitude at basic – how about weenie Setites with anti combat! So what can be done? Well, for the Gangrel, it means that you just pack a few more Skin of Rocks, just in case (to deal with any damage coming back). But for the other clans… I can certainly seeing a rise in Euro-Brujah Frisbee decks using Thought Betrayed to get around vampires using this card (loose 3 blood from the Sewer Lid, or 2 from the prevention card!). The Nossies and some !Gangrel can use animalism to use environmental damage such as Carrion Crows, or retainer damage via Murder of Crows or Wolf companions. However, all these options upset the card balance in a tightly focussed rush deck. The big downside to the card for its user is the cost: 2 blood is not easy to deal with on a regular basis. However, there is nothing to stop you using a Taste of Vitae… ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Section 1.5 DECK OF THE MONTH This is sort of a comedy deck, designed to thwart all but the Assamites or the Tremere… Deck Name: Hit me... harder... again... again!!! Crypt: (12 cards) [Min: 23, Max: 35, Avg: 7.25] 2 Badger (ani FOR pot PRO, Gangrel, 6) 1 Camille Devereux (ani FOR PRO, Gangrel, 5) 2 Emerson Bridges (DOM FOR pot PRE, Ventrue, 8, Prince) 1 Ingrid Rossler (ANI dom FOR PRO, Gangrel, 9, Prince) 1 Jan Pieterzoon (DOM FOR pot pre, Ventrue, 7) 1 Nakova (FOR pot, Ventrue, 6, Primogen) 2 Suhailah (FOR OBF pot ser, Ventrue, 9, Prince) 2 Timothy Crowley (ani dom FOR PRE, Ventrue, 7, Prince) Library: (90 cards) Master (14 cards) 4 Blood Doll 1 Creepshow Casino 1 Direct Intervention 2 Hostile Takeover 1 Island of Yiaros 3 Potence 1 Sudden Reversal 1 Ventrue Headquarters Minion (76 cards) 6 Archon 3 Bewitching Oration 4 Conditioning 1 Cryptic Rider 3 Deflection 5 Disarm 1 Disputed Territory 4 Drawing Out the Beast 3 Govern the Unaligned 3 Graverobbing 6 Immortal Grapple 3 Kine Resources Contested 6 King of the Mountain 1 Kiss of Ra, The 2 Parity Shift 1 Praxis Seizure: Berlin 1 Praxis Seizure: Glasgow 5 Second Tradition: Domain, The 3 Skin of Rock 5 Skin of Steel 3 Taste of Vitae 3 Unflinching Persistence 1 Ventrue Justicar 3 Voter Captivation A silly idea: become an Archon, attack a vampire, Draw out the Beast if they have Animalism, or not but keep it close. Then Grapple. Then prevent. Then King of the Mountain. Then Disarm. Then, if you can, Graverob! A silly deck, but it might work… especially against Rush decks! ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Section 1.6 RITUAL CHALLENGE (or COMPETITION CORNER) What is the most damage a named vampire can do, in a single strike turn, using a maximum of one of any particular card (e.g. only one Increased Strength, not 20)? Answers to the usual address. I have a prize for the first person to produce a correct answer, giving an explanation of how they got to that figure! Extra disciplines are aloud, but remember – a maximum of 90 cards in a deck, and the vampire will have to pay any blood costs (so no good it the combo needs 30 blood to play… unless, of course, they can pay it!). Best of luck. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Section 1.7 CONCLUSION Thanks for reading. As before, any comments or ideas, feel free to post, or mail to me at dave...@hotmail.com. Any abuse, mail to ghoulsbe...@hotmail.com. See y’all David Hammond UGPOW

On 18 Jul 2001 07:15:05 -0700, dave...@hotmail.com (hamdamcwa) wrote: >Section 1.6 > >RITUAL CHALLENGE (or COMPETITION CORNER) > >What is the most damage a named vampire can do, in a single strike >turn, using a maximum of one of any particular card (e.g. only one >Increased Strength, not 20)? > >Answers to the usual address. I have a prize for the first person to >produce a correct answer, giving an explanation of how they got to >that figure! Extra disciplines are aloud, but remember – a >maximum of 90 cards in a deck, and the vampire will have to pay any >blood costs (so no good it the combo needs 30 blood to play… >unless, of course, they can pay it!). Multiple questions. First, what's a single strike turn? Is that one strike, or one round of combat, or one combat, or...? Second, does using, say, one Potence skill card count? Woops, wait, you DID say extra disciplines were allowed. OK, so does the vampire have the extra blood from the increased capacity, or just the increased capacity? Third, does using the Crimson Sentinel with X number of soul counters on it that I've received from X dead Embraces that someone kept rescuing for free with Humanitas/Catacombs count? (in this case, X = 1000 or more... I'm guessing "no" due to the lack of a potential upper limit on X =) Fourth, how about Clan Impersonation? =) And since now it takes actions to set up, what if I had a Rack in play during the actions I take to set things up, and was gaining from it to make sure my vampire is full during the actual 'strike'? Or is the CI just considered to be "on" the vampire from some previous incarnation, with no blood spent? Or do I have to be partially empty from the CI? -- Derek

> RITUAL CHALLENGE (or COMPETITION CORNER) > What is the most damage a named vampire can do, in a single strike > turn, using a maximum of one of any particular card (e.g. only one > Increased Strength, not 20)? Assuming Superior Potence Torn Signpost 3 HD Increased strength +2 Fists of Death +3 HD (1 blood) Death of my Conscience, burning 5 cards for +10 HD Undead Strength +2 HD (though, I could swear that there is a POT strike that does 3) For 4 blood, a strike for 20 HD My answer, anyways... :p Sorrow --- If you're frightened of dying and... and you're holding on, you'll see devils tearing your life away. But if you've made your peace, then the devils are really angels, freeing you from the earth.

> > RITUAL CHALLENGE (or COMPETITION CORNER) > > What is the most damage a named vampire can do, in a single strike > > turn, using a maximum of one of any particular card (e.g. only one > > Increased Strength, not 20)? > Assuming Superior Potence This should have gone to David, sorry... Sorrow --- "Are they dead?" - Pugsly "Does it matter?" - Wednesday

In message <tlc8kh6...@corp.supernews.com>, Sorrow <cbo...@apdi.net> writes >Undead Strength +2 HD (though, I could swear that there >is a POT strike that does 3) Pushing the Limit -- James Coupe PGP Key: 0x5D623D5D EBD690ECD7A1F She twirled a lock of hair around her forefinger and smiled B457CA213D7E6 faintly. "Actually, I'd settle for a small Greek." 68C3695D623D5D

> > RITUAL CHALLENGE (or COMPETITION CORNER) > > What is the most damage a named vampire can do, in a single strike > > turn, using a maximum of one of any particular card (e.g. only one > > Increased Strength, not 20)? > > Assuming Superior Potence > > Torn Signpost 3 HD > Increased strength +2 > Fists of Death +3 HD (1 blood) Fists of Death only adds +2, sorry. Forgot Fire in the Blood +1 HD (1 blood) > Death of my Conscience, burning 5 cards for +10 HD You can only burn a Maximum of 4 cards per Death of My Conscience played, so +8 HD > Undead Strength +2 HD (though, I could swear that there > is a POT strike that does 3) Pushing the Limit +3 HD > > For 4 blood, a strike for 20 HD -- sorry it didn't work though. 6 blood cost, for a single strike of 19. I would of course start with a Lazverinus Clan Impersonated to Toreador Antitribu with the Art of Pain, Depravity, Two Vicissitude skill cards (if allowed), and one Chimerstry skill card. Lazverinus +2 by himself (now Torn Signpost unnecessary) Art of Pain +2 Depravity +1 Burn a Vial of Garou Blood for +1 Shadow of the Wolf for +1 on the additional strike (2 blood) - inf pro Body Arsenal +1 (2 blood) - sup vic Horrid Form +1 (1 blood) - inf vic Imposing Phantasm +1 (1 blood) - inf chim Mythic Form +1 (3 blood) - inf protean Increased strength +2 - sup pot Fists of Death +2 (1 blood) - sup pot Fire in the Blood +1 (1 blood) - inf pot Death of my Conscience, burning 4 cards for +8 (3 blood) - sup pot Pushing the Limit +3 (1 blood) - sup pot 3+2+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+2+2+1+8+3= 28 damage from a second strike in a round. 27 without the Shadow of the Wolf. 28 damage costs 15 blood. 27 damage costs 13 blood. Lose 2 damage and ignore all of the blood cost by doing the same with Dragos and a few more skill cards. Carpe Noctem. Lasombra http://www.TheLasombra.com

"The Lasombra" <thela...@hotmail.com> wrote in message news:QKs57.209686$lq1.52...@typhoon.austin.rr.com... > > > RITUAL CHALLENGE (or COMPETITION CORNER) > > > What is the most damage a named vampire can do, in a single strike > > > turn, using a maximum of one of any particular card (e.g. only one > > > Increased Strength, not 20)? > > > Lazverinus +2 by himself (now Torn Signpost unnecessary) Wouldn't Torn Signpost set his base to 3...then it be bumped up by +2? Similar to adding a Pulse to Ozmo, for 4 total bleed.

James Coupe <ja...@zephyr.org.uk> wrote in message news:<0Im9f2ct...@gratiano.zephyr.org.uk>... > In message <tlc8kh6...@corp.supernews.com>, Sorrow <cbo...@apdi.net> > writes > >Undead Strength +2 HD (though, I could swear that there > >is a POT strike that does 3) > > Pushing the Limit you guys aren't being at all creative (ok... a little troll, a little beat my one round damage (possiable) total.) Cameron

On Thu, 19 Jul 2001 03:46:56 GMT, "The Lasombra" <thela...@hotmail.com> wrote: >I would of course start with a Lazverinus Clan Impersonated to Toreador >Antitribu with the Art of Pain, Depravity, Two Vicissitude skill cards (if >allowed), and one Chimerstry skill card. Only one of each card, per his rules. =) >Lazverinus +2 by himself (now Torn Signpost unnecessary) >Art of Pain +2 >Depravity +1 >Burn a Vial of Garou Blood for +1 >Shadow of the Wolf for +1 on the additional strike (2 blood) - inf pro >Body Arsenal +1 (2 blood) - sup vic >Horrid Form +1 (1 blood) - inf vic >Imposing Phantasm +1 (1 blood) - inf chim >Mythic Form +1 (3 blood) - inf protean >Increased strength +2 - sup pot >Fists of Death +2 (1 blood) - sup pot >Fire in the Blood +1 (1 blood) - inf pot >Death of my Conscience, burning 4 cards for +8 (3 blood) - sup pot >Pushing the Limit +3 (1 blood) - sup pot > >3+2+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+2+2+1+8+3= 28 damage from a second strike in a round. >27 without the Shadow of the Wolf. > >28 damage costs 15 blood. >27 damage costs 13 blood. > >Lose 2 damage and ignore all of the blood cost by doing the same with Dragos >and a few more skill cards. Of course, Laz doesn't have 13 blood to do it with... and I'm not sure whether or not he gets the blood from his skill cards' capacity, as that wasn't clarified yet. I prefer: Angus, the Unruled, with the following skill cards: Potence and Vicissitude, inherently striking with 2 strength. Gangrel Revel in play for +1 Ritual Challenge on Angus for +1 Shadow of the Wolf (2 blood) for +1 on 2nd strike Fire in the Blood (1 blood) for +1 Fists of Death (1 blood) for +2 Torn Signpost for +1 Increased Strength for +2 Depravity for +1 Death of my Conscience (3 blood), discarding 4 unique skill cards, +8 Opposing vampire plays DotB inferior for +1 Inner Essence to reduce cost of a card Horrid Form (free via Inner Essence) for +1 burn a Vial of Garou Blood for +1 Mythic Form (3 blood) for +1 Intercepting diablerie with Deadliest Sin for +2 Dodge to get to 2nd strike and make Shadow of the Wolf viable Pushing the Limit as the actual strike for +3 I count it as 29 points of damage, costing 10 blood, which he can pay for without assuming any blood from skill cards. If he GETS blood from skill cards, I will add a CHI skill card and Imposing Phantasm for an extra +1. If allowed, I could also assume that the opposing minion was Ambrosius, and include one Trap, while playing Fire in the Blood on the first round. I then play each of the combat cards on the 4th round, and every 3rd round of combat thereafter, and my last combat card would be Shadow of the Wolf (the only card in the mix specifying "this round"). This would add up to.. hmm.. there are 8 other cards, so the first 3 rounds, then 3x7 more means that I have 24 rounds of combat, and therefore have +25 strength. I lose the Deadliest Sin and DotB damage, however, as Ambrosius can neither play the card nor commit diablerie; so I see a single strike for 51 costing 10 blood, which would totally fail to even affect Ambrosius as I can't afford to pay for any Claws. And each card used only once. -- Derek I have discovered a truly wonderful proof of Fermat's Last Theorem, but unfortunately this .signature is too small to contain it.

On Thu, 19 Jul 2001 01:33:26 -0400, Derek Ray <lor...@yahoo.com> wrote: >If allowed, I could also assume that the opposing minion was >Ambrosius, and include one Trap, while playing Fire in the Blood on >the first round. I then play each of the combat cards on the 4th >round, and every 3rd round of combat thereafter, and my last combat >card would be Shadow of the Wolf (the only card in the mix specifying >"this round"). Missed one thing; I would also include one Song of Serenity, to be played on Ambrosius in the first round so I don't go to torpor during the Trap. Forgot to include that in the posting. [ quoted text not captured ]

"The Lasombra" <thela...@hotmail.com> wrote > > Lazverinus +2 by himself (now Torn Signpost unnecessary) > Art of Pain +2 > Depravity +1 > Burn a Vial of Garou Blood for +1 > Shadow of the Wolf for +1 on the additional strike (2 blood) - inf pro > Body Arsenal +1 (2 blood) - sup vic > Horrid Form +1 (1 blood) - inf vic > Imposing Phantasm +1 (1 blood) - inf chim > Mythic Form +1 (3 blood) - inf protean > Increased strength +2 - sup pot > Fists of Death +2 (1 blood) - sup pot > Fire in the Blood +1 (1 blood) - inf pot > Death of my Conscience, burning 4 cards for +8 (3 blood) - sup pot > Pushing the Limit +3 (1 blood) - sup pot Well then... I guess I'll just play this here Majesty. Cheers, WES

>If allowed, I could also assume that the opposing minion was >Ambrosius, and include one Trap, while playing Fire in the Blood on >the first round. I then play each of the combat cards on the 4th >round, and every 3rd round of combat thereafter, and my last combat >card would be Shadow of the Wolf (the only card in the mix specifying >"this round"). > >This would add up to.. hmm.. there are 8 other cards, so the first 3 >rounds, then 3x7 more means that I have 24 rounds of combat, and >therefore have +25 strength. I lose the Deadliest Sin and DotB >damage, however, as Ambrosius can neither play the card nor commit >diablerie; so I see a single strike for 51 costing 10 blood, which >would totally fail to even affect Ambrosius as I can't afford to pay >for any Claws. And each card used only once. To deal with the blood cost, you can always add Clan Impersonation + Ankara Citadel. (Alternatively, Disputed Territory the Ankara from someone else). I've actually thought of something similar, with the Fire in the Blood. A while ago I was thinking about the max amount of damage one could do with a single strike (no limit on cards). It pretty much amounted to: 1 Cailean (of course you have 12 in your crypt) 1 Clan Impersonation 1 Ankara Citadel 1 Trap 87 Fire in the Blood Have Cailean Clan Impersonate to Tremere and equip with the Ankara. Get in a fight, play Trap and Fire in the Blood the first round. Trap keeps giving presses and every three turns or so play another Fire in the Blood. And most importantly, use Cailean's special to keep at long range (so you don't really strike till the end). Alternatively, you can add a single Burning Wrath for a more spectacular finish. And you could technically take out the Clan Impersonate and Ankara if you have another Methusaleh willing to help get it for you. Cheers, Halcyan 2

> Section 1.6 > > RITUAL CHALLENGE (or COMPETITION CORNER) > > What is the most damage a named vampire can do, in a single strike > turn, using a maximum of one of any particular card (e.g. only one > Increased Strength, not 20)? > > Answers to the usual address. I have a prize for the first person to > produce a correct answer, giving an explanation of how they got to > that figure! Extra disciplines are aloud, but remember – a > maximum of 90 cards in a deck, and the vampire will have to pay any > blood costs (so no good it the combo needs 30 blood to play… > unless, of course, they can pay it!). > > Best of luck. Right, I've already had a flurry of mails on this, so I'd better clarify the terems... When I say "Single Strike Turn", I mean a turn WITHOUT additional strikes, or presses. It does allow Pre-range stuff, it allows Pre-Strike stuff, and it allows Environmental stuff plus retainers. The highest figure I've had so far was 666, but that used additional strikes. It amused me a lot, though, so I might post it up anyway. Oh, and a hint (since many folk are still way off) - You're forgetting Masters and weapons. Hope this helps everyone! DH

"The Nosferatu Stuff" <roans...@yahoo.com> wrote: >"The Lasombra" <thela...@hotmail.com> wrote in message >news:QKs57.209686$lq1.52...@typhoon.austin.rr.com... >> > > RITUAL CHALLENGE (or COMPETITION CORNER) >> > > What is the most damage a named vampire can do, in a single strike >> > > turn, using a maximum of one of any particular card (e.g. only one >> > > Increased Strength, not 20)? >> > >> Lazverinus +2 by himself (now Torn Signpost unnecessary) > >Wouldn't Torn Signpost set his base to 3...then it be bumped up by +2? >Similar to adding a Pulse to Ozmo, for 4 total bleed. Yes. -- LSJ (vte...@white-wolf.com) V:TES Net.Rep for White Wolf, Inc. Links to revised rulebook, rulings, errata, and tournament rules: http://www.white-wolf.com/vtes/ ------------------------------------------------------------ Get your FREE web-based e-mail and newsgroup access at: http://MailAndNews.com

This is the best I can do... (I sent this via Email yesterday morning) (assumptions: You have Visit to the Capuchin in play with all it's counters, an Elder Library, a Ventrue, and The Mad Cronicler... ie your hand size is 13 at the time the combat) Further I am going to compute this for first round... using Ecstatic Agony and assuming second round makes this really tricky, and Fire in the Blood makes the answer nigh infinite (assuming Calilean plays Fire and Trap, then sets the round at long, playing Fire in the Blood every three rounds. In a 90 card deck, he would have nigh-infinite strength on round 250. I don't think this is what you were looking for) Lazvernius, the Thrall of Lambach - +2 Strength Assume Lazvernius is Legendary (2 additional votes) Assume Lazvernius is Depraved: +1 Str Assume Lazvernius has a Protean Master Skill card and is full blooded (ie 11 blood) Lazvernius is equipped with Bang Nok - Tigers Claws (+2 str). Lazvernius is Clan Impersonated to Toreador Antitribu and has the Art of Pain (+2 Str) Assume a haven uncovered is already on the other minion. Lazvernius does the action and announces Uncontrollable Rage (+2 str, 12 card hand now, Laz has 9 blood) Before Range is Determined: Death of my Conscious (burn 4 cards, hand now down to 7 cards, +8 str, laz now has 6 blood) Increased Strength (+2 str to the potence strike) Fists of Death (+2 str, Laz now has 5 blood) Fire in the Blood (+1 str, Laz now has 4 blood) Torn Signpost (Sets Base str at 3) Tap Island of Yiaros (+4 str) King of the Mountain (Opponent will take damage equal to strike, Laz now at 2 blood) Strike: Pushing the limit (+3 str, Laz now has 1 blood) Twisting the Knife (1 additional damage, Laz now at 0 blood) Damage from Laz: Base strength (3 from signpost) Lazvernius (+2 str) Uncontrolable Rage (+2 str) Depravity (+1 str) Art of Pain (+2 str) Death of Consc (+8 str) Island of Yiaros (+4 str) Fire/Fists (+3 str) Bang Nok (+2 str) Push Limit/Increase Str (+5 str) Twisting Knife (1 dam) Assuming that the opponent did all above, minus Laz (could use a +1 str minion of which there are billions), island, Rage, Depravity, and Art of Pain) Damage from Laz: 33 Damage from King of the Mountain: 23 Total Damage from one strike during strike resolution in the first round... 56 Matt PS: If you count press step damage you could add Pulled Fangs and Drawing out the Beast for more badness. NOTE: I missed the opponent using Drawing out the Beast on you, and/or the blocking a diabolary via the Deadliest Sin. The thing I like most about my solution is only one master skill card and the vamp is only 11 capacity.

> Right, I've already had a flurry of mails on this, so I'd better > clarify the terems... > > When I say "Single Strike Turn", I mean a turn WITHOUT additional > strikes, or presses. It does allow Pre-range stuff, it allows > Pre-Strike stuff, and it allows Environmental stuff plus retainers. > > The highest figure I've had so far was 666, but that used additional > strikes. It amused me a lot, though, so I might post it up anyway. > > Oh, and a hint (since many folk are still way off) - You're forgetting > Masters and weapons. > > Hope this helps everyone! I should also mention that I originally intended it to the the First turn of combat. Someone has sent me a total of over 1200 that comes in a subsequent turn, and also juiced it that both vampires were standing at the end of the round! Wow. However, to avoid it going "silly", can we stick to a first round, no additional strikes. DH

dave...@hotmail.com (hamdamcwa) wrote in message news:<9e10847c.01071...@posting.google.com>... [ quoted text not captured ] Hi I thought I would share my thoughts about this. I'll start with Ezmeralda. She has ANI, CHI, dom, FOR, PRE and tha. I'll add a Hand of Conrad so she has POT. I'll also add various Skill Cards so she has vic, obt, pro, ser. She gets a Wolf Companion, a Murder of Crows, a Ghoul Retainer, a Bang Nakh, an Assault Rifle. She Clan Impersonates to Ventrue, I bring Island of Yiaros in Play. Clan Impersonate to Toreador Antitribu, get Art of Pain, Regent and at last Depravity (you get to keep the retainers you already have, do you?). Play Ablative Skin. Play Mark of Damnation on target minion. I then Play a giants blood to get to full blood capacity (wish at this poiint is 15). Then you block a diablerie attempt by The deadliest Sin. Damage is as follows: Torn Signpost for 3 Base Damage Bang Nakh with Mass reality +4 Depravity +1 Fire in the Blood (1 blood) +1 Fists of Death (1 blood) +2 Increased Strength +2 Death of my Conscience (3 Blood), discarding 4 cards +8 Horrid Form (free via Inner Essence) +1 Imposing Phantasm (1 Blood) +1 Mythic Form (3 Blood) +1 The deadliesr Sin +2 Weather Control (ignore Damage for the first ablative Counter) +1 Carrion Crows +2 Wolf Companion +1 Murder of Crows +1 Ghoul Retainer using the Assault Rifle with Dragon breath rounds +6 Shade +1 opposing Minion has Mark of Damnation on him +1 Tap Island of Yiaros +4 Art of Pain +2 Pushing the Limit (for 1 Blood) +3 Twisting the Knife (yes, twisting the knife!) +1 This amount to 49 points of damage. If I want, I can add Drawing out the beast and Pulled Fangs for +1 each, but that is after Strike resolution damage an d does not count I think. And I can Play King of the Mountain, construct an nearly equal damaging opposing Vampire (I lose the Unique parts, of course, but should be able to go to 35 or 40) and add his damage with a Meele Waepon to mine ... And I can add an Blood of Acid to double that. Both cost 2 blood, wich I can pay for after the giants blood. Of course she may be going to torpor afterwards ... but there is always Flesh of Marble :-) Michael Deflize

On Thu, 19 Jul 2001, Derek Ray wrote: > If allowed, I could also assume that the opposing minion was > Ambrosius, and include one Trap, while playing Fire in the Blood on > the first round. I then play each of the combat cards on the 4th > round, and every 3rd round of combat thereafter, and my last combat > card would be Shadow of the Wolf (the only card in the mix specifying > "this round"). > > This would add up to.. hmm.. there are 8 other cards, so the first 3 > rounds, then 3x7 more means that I have 24 rounds of combat, and > therefore have +25 strength. I lose the Deadliest Sin and DotB > damage, however, as Ambrosius can neither play the card nor commit > diablerie; so I see a single strike for 51 costing 10 blood, which > would totally fail to even affect Ambrosius as I can't afford to pay > for any Claws. And each card used only once. > Instead of Ambrosius, try facing Nigel, operating under Ex Nihilo. Deadliest Sin and DotB come back, with DotB at superior. Yes, that deals damage to you each round, but you can play Undead Persistence to deal with that. Even better, you can set Angus up with Masochism beforehand, and now you get a counter every turn, with wich to play even more combat cards. In fact, with appropriate discipline cards, you should be able to play every combat card that doesn't a) end combat, b) cause agg damage to any participant, or c) provide a mandatory press. There's easily 90 combat cards that fit that description, so any card that doesn't provide at least +3 strength is now no longer efficient. The necessary cards are: Trap Fire in the Blood Masochism Undead Persistance These require POT and FOR. The most efficent way to get them, while allowing access to as many other combat cards as possible is... Ian Forestal Potence Fortitude This leaves 83 cards for Trap extension, thus giving a strength value of (83 * 3) + 1 + 1 (DotB) = 251 points (since no strike card provides more than +3 to damage dealt, the optimum strike time is the last round of the Trap) Marc Gabriele

<Cut> > > Section 1.4 > > CARD OF THE MONTH > King of the Mountain > > Type(s): Combat > Discipline: Fortitude > Blood Cost: 2 > Rarity: Common > Artist(s): Brian LeBlanc > > Card Text: > Basic > Prevent all damage from the opposing minion's strike. If the strike > was made with a melee weapon, that weapon is destroyed. > > Superior > Play after range is determined and before strikes are chosen. If the > opposing minion inflicts damage with a hand strike this round (even if > the damage is prevented), he or she takes an equal amount of damage > during strike resolution as well <Cut> > It also causes even more trouble for those who use Melee Weapons. > Anybody trying an attack with Kalis Fang, the Sengir Dagger, the > Crimson Sentinal, or the Sword of Judgement has to be very careful > with the inferior, or expensive hardware bites the big one. Don't be fooled. It's hand damage only. Weapon cards, deal weapon strikes. This card only enhances the use of melee weapons in Pot rush (making Torn Sign a little less useful). It's much less of a hit to lose a weapon that cost you one or nothing over taking massive hitback. > > Section 1.5 > > DECK OF THE MONTH > > This is sort of a comedy deck, designed to thwart all but the > Assamites or the Tremere… > > Deck Name: Hit me... harder... again... again!!! > > Crypt: (12 cards) [Min: 23, Max: 35, Avg: 7.25] > 2 Badger (ani FOR pot PRO, Gangrel, 6) > 1 Camille Devereux (ani FOR PRO, Gangrel, 5) > 2 Emerson Bridges (DOM FOR pot PRE, Ventrue, 8, Prince) > 1 Ingrid Rossler (ANI dom FOR PRO, Gangrel, 9, Prince) > 1 Jan Pieterzoon (DOM FOR pot pre, Ventrue, 7) > 1 Nakova (FOR pot, Ventrue, 6, Primogen) > 2 Suhailah (FOR OBF pot ser, Ventrue, 9, Prince) > 2 Timothy Crowley (ani dom FOR PRE, Ventrue, 7, Prince) 2 Badger and no Raven with Camille already in the deck? You're mixing Jyhad and Vampire anyway. Just my thoughts. Vince

> Section 1.6 > > RITUAL CHALLENGE (or COMPETITION CORNER) > > What is the most damage a named vampire can do, in a single strike > turn, using a maximum of one of any particular card (e.g. only one > Increased Strength, not 20)? > > Answers to the usual address. I have a prize for the first person to > produce a correct answer, giving an explanation of how they got to > that figure! Extra disciplines are aloud, but remember – a > maximum of 90 cards in a deck, and the vampire will have to pay any > blood costs (so no good it the combo needs 30 blood to play… > unless, of course, they can pay it!). ----- Original Message ----- From: Norman S. Brown, Jr. To: dave...@hotmail.com ; x_ze...@bellsouth.net Sent: Thursday, July 19, 2001 11:47 AM Subject: Gangrel Newsletter- Update v2.0 Dave, I have to say that your challenge is interesting. Try this on for size. There is a Island of Yarious in Play that I control. Lazvernius comes into play and I play Legendary Vampire on him the next round (+2 votes). Lazvernus (+2 hand damage)has clan impersonated to Lasombra. He puts political struggle on Leandro and the next round he beats Leandro into torpor with a Burning Wrath. I amaranth and refill. I burn the Political Struggle (+4 votes). I place a Regent card on him (4 votes). I then put an Exstatic Agony on him (+X hand damage = to the amount received the previous turn. Next Round I put a Masochism on him. Next Round I play Depravity (+1 hand damage). Next Round I put a Shadow of the Beast on him. Next Round I put a Bang-Nak on him (+2 damage).During my preys turn, Beast, who my prey controls, attempts to diablerize one of my vampires. I play the Deadliest Sin (+2 hand damage +2 intercept). Beast plays Forgotten Labyrinth (+3 stealth). Lazvernius catches him with a Spirits Touch (+1 Intercept and +1 manuever) Round 1 of Combat Lazvernius plays Trap. Lazvernius plays Torn Signpost.Lazvernius plays Mythic Form (+1 hand damage) Lazvernius plays Fists of Death (+2 hand damage). Lazvernius plays Fire in the Blood at Superior (+1 Cumulative hand damage each round). Lazvernius plays Death of My Conscience and discards 4 cards (+8 strength). Lazvernius plays Increased Strength (+2 to potence strikes). Lazvernius maneuvers to long with Unflinching Persistance. Beast hits Lazvernius with a Thrown Sewer Lid. Lazvernius Prevents on with Unflinching Persistance. Round 2 of Combat Excstatic Agony gives Lazvernius +3 strength. Fire in the Blood increases to +2 damage. Lazvernius plays Zip Gun and maneuvers to long. Lazvernius prevents the damage from the Zip Gun with Resilience Round 3 of Combat Fire in the blood increases to +3 damage Lazvernius plays Form of the Ghost to Maneuver to long. Round 4 of Combat Fire in the Blood increases to +4 damage. Lazvernius maneuvers to long with the Spirit’s Touch maneuver Round 5 of Combat Fire in the Blood increases to +5 damage/ Lazvernius maneuvers to long with a Fake out. Round 6 of Combat Fire in the Blood increases to +6 damage Lazvernius maneuvers to long with the Shadow of the Beast. Round 7 of Combat Fire in the Blood increases to +7 damage Lazvernius maneuvers with Quick Meld Round 8 of Combat Fire in the Blood increases to +8 damage Lazvernius doesn’t maneuver. Beast hits him with a Pushing the Limit for 5 Lazvernius plays Throw Gate at inferior for 3 Lazvernius tastes for 2 Lazvernius play a Undead Persistance to prevent going to torpor. Round 9 Fire in the Blood increases to +9 damage Excstatic Agony gives Lazvernius +8 strength. Beast maneuvers to long with a Swallowed by the night Beast hits Lazvernius with a Sacrament of Carnage for 3 Round 10 Fire in the Blood increases to + 10 damage. Excstatic Agony gives Lazvernius +11 strength. Lazvernius doesn’t maneuver Beast dodges with a Fade from View. Round 11 Fire in the Blood increases to + 11 damage. Lazvernius doesn’t maneuver Beast dodges with a dodge. Round 12 Fire in the Blood increases to + 12 damage. Lazvernius doesn’t maneuver Beast dodges with a Preternatural Evasion. Round 13 Fire in the Blood increases to + 13 damage. Lazvernius doesn’t maneuver Beast dodges with a Side Strike. Round 14 Fire in the Blood increases to + 14 damage. Lazvernius doesn’t maneuver Beast dodges with a Side Slip. Round 15 Fire in the Blood increases to + 15 damage. Lazvernius doesn’t maneuver Beast dodges with a Stutter Step. Round 16 Fire in the Blood increases to + 16 damage. Lazvernius doesn’t maneuver Beast dodges with a Vampiric Speed. Round 17 Fire in the Blood increases to + 17 damage. Lazvernius doesn’t maneuver Beast hits Lazvernius for 2 Lazvernius taps the Island of Yiarous to hit Beast with an Undead Strength for 63 points of damage. Fire in the Blood increases to + 17 damage. Excstatic Agony gives Lazvernius +11 strength. a Island of Yiarous with 10 votes Legendary Vampire (+2 votes) Political Struggle (+4 votes) Regent (4 Votes) the Deadliest Sin (+2 hand damage) Mythic Form (+1 hand damage) Fists of Death (+2 hand damage) Death of My Conscience and discards 4 cards ` (+8 strength). Increased Strength (+2 to potence strikes). Undead Strength (+2 damage hand strike) Lazvernius has built in +2 strength Torn Signpost sets hands to 3 Bang Nak for +2 Depravity for +1 Lazvernus then plays King of the Mountain and Beast takes another 2. Lazvernius pays for it with 2 Masochism counters. for a grand total of 65. Comments Welcome, Norman S. Brown, Jr. XZealot Archon of the Swamp

mic...@atrapoesis.de (Michael Deflize) wrote in message news:<fd08373d.01071...@posting.google.com>... [ quoted text not captured ] add a legendary vampire to get +2 hand damage from the island of yiaros cameron

> 1 Cailean (of course you have 12 in your crypt) > > 1 Clan Impersonation > 1 Ankara Citadel > 1 Trap > 87 Fire in the Blood Just for fun, I did the math. The combat would end in round 261, with Cailean striking with hands for 11485 damage.

Alright, not that the rules are laid out, and we are getting silly on this one....My origional was pretty close to Matts so I'll just build off of this: > (assumptions: You have Visit to the Capuchin in play with all it's counters, > an Elder Library, a Ventrue, and The Mad Cronicler... ie your hand size is > 13 at the time the combat) > > Lazvernius, the Thrall of Lambach - +2 Strength > Assume Lazvernius is Legendary (2 additional votes) Lazvernius is also Regent, for an additional +1 vote. > Assume Lazvernius is Depraved: +1 Str > Lazvernius is Clan Impersonated to Toreador Antitribu and has the Art of > Pain (+2 Str) > Assume you are blocking Basil's diablerie action, and poor Basil has a superior mark of damnation on him.(+3 STR) > Before Range is Determined: > Death of my Conscious (burn 4 cards, hand now down to 7 cards, +8 str, laz > now has 6 blood) > Increased Strength (+2 str to the potence strike) > Fists of Death (+2 str, Laz now has 5 blood) > Fire in the Blood (+1 str, Laz now has 4 blood) > Torn Signpost (+2 STR) > Tap Island of Yiaros (+6 str) > Strike: Pushing the limit (+3 str, Laz now has 3 blood) > Twisting the Knife (1 additional damage, Laz now at 2 blood) My Laz also would have to have disciplines for the following: Carrion crows, SUP. (+2) Drawing out the beast(+1) Imposing Phantasm(+1 has 1 blood) Mass Reality(+2 Laz) Need to burn a blood tears(3 blood) Thoughts Betrayed (+1) Shade(+1) Murder of Crows(+2) Wolf Companion(+1) Mythic Form(+1 Las has no blood) Play inner essence(gain 1 blood) Dagon's Call (+1 STR +1 damamge) Burn your vial of garou blood(+1 STR) Uhm..add a weather control Body Arsenal(+1 STR) Horrid Form(+1 STR) And you need a Ritual Challenge(+1 STR) Don't forget to pull the fangs for an additional +1 Oh, and your ghoul Retainer shoots him with an assault rifle, that was holding dragon breaths rounds.(for 9, don't for get your mass reality!) I don't think you should assume the other guy is going to hit you for a bunch, cause there is no way to know for sure. Just add that to my total if you want. Total damge 64. Uhm, if you imagine that they hit you for a bunch and you king of the mountain it's even more...I imagine you could afford to pay for all this stuff after you had that many skill cards on good old Laz. [ quoted text not captured ]

In message <a1e26d99.01071...@posting.google.com>, Cameron <orcao...@hotmail.com> writes >you guys aren't being at all creative (ok... a little troll, a little >beat my one round damage (possiable) total.) Oh, I can be far more creative. They've missed the obvious permanent. (Which would probably require another permanent to bring into play first.) (Bear in mind my initial stab at the 'what's the most hand damage you can get in a combat?' quiz, when most people were levelling out at around 200 or so, with Increased Strength and such, for an additional hint.) [ quoted text not captured ]

"hamdamcwa" <dave...@hotmail.com> wrote > > Oh, and a hint (since many folk are still way off) - You're forgetting > Masters and weapons. > > Hope this helps everyone! Tsk tsk, the answer to your question has no upper limit. Ladies and gentlemen, I give you the Crimson Sentinel with X soul counters, where X = the answer reflecting whatever clever poster has presented the best solution so far. I ween. Har dee har har har. Oh, and it's a melee weapon, so keep increasing that strength, folks. - Jason Bell (Oh yeah? Infinity plus 1, so there)

"Matt Latham" <sv...@chartermi.net> wrote [ quoted text not captured ] How exciting. I can do more damage in the first round with Smudge, the Ignored (before diablerie). Crimson Sentinel with 11,485 soul counters. Cheers. - Jason Bell

"Jason Bell" <Jason...@mail.com> wrote [ quoted text not captured ] Whatever, you suck at V:tES, I could do more damage with Igo the Hungry carrying the Crimson Sentinel with 11,486 soul counters. - Jason Bell

You have made 1 mistake. Ecstatic Agony(far as I can tell) gives you +X STR each round, only for that round. It doesn't specifically state that it lasts for the entire combat, and the amount added 'each round' is only equal to the amount of damage inflicted the round before. Aaron "XZealot" <X_Ze...@bellsouth.net> wrote in message news:d2f8d37b.01071...@posting.google.com... [ quoted text not captured ]

"The Nosferatu Stuff" <roans...@yahoo.com> wrote in message news:<A0g67.10096$bU6.1...@typhoon.mw.mediaone.net>... > You have made 1 mistake. Ecstatic Agony(far as I can tell) gives you +X STR > each round, only for that round. It doesn't specifically state that it > lasts for the entire combat, and the amount added 'each round' is only equal > to the amount of damage inflicted the round before. > My bad.

"XZealot" <X_Ze...@bellsouth.net> wrote in message news:d2f8d37b.01072...@posting.google.com... [ quoted text not captured ] But I will say that using Political struggle on leandro is genius. Wish I had thought of that. Then again, I figure if, by round 17, you should be able to go a little more then a grand total of 65. Maybe you should have played darkness within on the first turn, and sucked all the blood off the opposing minion. Aaron

"XZealot" <X_Ze...@bellsouth.net> a écrit dans le message news: d2f8d37b.01072...@posting.google.com... [ quoted text not captured ] It was damn fun to read though =)) Just a thing : Fire in the blood is stackable !! play 7 of those babies on the first round, combat end with earthmeld, then play Telepathic tracking for 17 strength on the second round. Now, immortal, prevent your opponent's punch and aggravate your 17 damage with wolf claws. time for a little taste of vitae... Et voilà =) reyda

> > How exciting. I can do more damage in the first round > > with Smudge, the Ignored (before diablerie). > > Crimson Sentinel with 11,485 soul counters. > Whatever, you suck at V:tES, I could do more damage > with Igo the Hungry carrying the Crimson Sentinel with > 11,486 soul counters. You both suck. I can do more damage with Hasina, a Pot skill card, Pushing the Limit and the Crimson Sentinal with 11,484 counters. So there! Sorrow --- I keep telling them that I think they're out to get me. They ask me if I feel remose and I answer, "Why of course! There's so much more I could have done if they'd let me!" So it's Rorschach and Prozac and everything is groovy