[LSJ]: Advanced Beckett + Events + Temptation.......

Got a ruling question based on a game situtation from yesterday. Here is the germane part of the set-up Player A: - Advanced Beckett is in play, with 4 blood remaining - 3 Gehenna Events are in play which have active "do not replace" clauses - 5 Gehenna Events are in play which have been replaced, either because they lacked the "DNR" clause or the replacement criteria were met. - Player A has 12 cards in hand. Player B: - Has a Temptation on Beckett with 5 counters Player B takes control of Beckett during his turn (While Beckett is ready, you have +X hand size, where X is the number of Gehenna cards in play. If Beckett leaves the ready region, discard your hand.) We assumed that as control transferred.... - Beckett did not leave "the ready region".....so Player A does not discard his hand. - Player A no longer controls Beckett, so he discards 8 cards, leaving him with 4. - Player B controls Beckett and draws 8 cards. When Player B's turn ended, control of Beckett returned to Player A who drew 8 cards, while Player B discarded 8 cards. ?????? Question Begins ????? There was some discussion about the nature of "the ready region" - is there one ready region, or one for each player? Looking at the rulebook, sec 2.3 Play Area, it seems as if each player has a discrete ready region (therefore there are 5 ready regions in a full game). If this is the case, as transfer of Beckett occurred, players should be discarding their hands, not just the number of Gehenna cards in play. When I checked the newsgroup, I couldn't find a definitive explanation. It seems like most of us (including LSJ) use "the ready region" (implying a single region) and "your ready region" (implying more than one) interchangably. So, which should it be (and can we use consistent language????) Thanks in advance. D.

Darby Keeney wrote: > Player A: > - Advanced Beckett is in play, with 4 blood remaining > - 3 Gehenna Events are in play which have active "do not replace" > clauses > - 5 Gehenna Events are in play which have been replaced, either > because they lacked the "DNR" clause or the replacement criteria were > met. > - Player A has 12 cards in hand. > > Player B: > - Has a Temptation on Beckett with 5 counters > > Player B takes control of Beckett during his turn (While Beckett is > ready, you have +X hand size, where X is the number of Gehenna cards in > play. If Beckett leaves the ready region, discard your hand.) > > We assumed that as control transferred.... > - Beckett did not leave "the ready region".....so Player A does not > discard his hand. > - Player A no longer controls Beckett, so he discards 8 cards, leaving > him with 4. > - Player B controls Beckett and draws 8 cards. > > When Player B's turn ended, control of Beckett returned to Player A who > drew 8 cards, while Player B discarded 8 cards. Correct. > ?????? Question Begins ????? > > There was some discussion about the nature of "the ready region" - is > there one ready region, or one for each player? Both. > Looking at the rulebook, sec 2.3 Play Area, it seems as if each player > has a discrete ready region (therefore there are 5 ready regions in a > full game). If this is the case, as transfer of Beckett occurred, > players should be discarding their hands, not just the number of > Gehenna cards in play. > > When I checked the newsgroup, I couldn't find a definitive explanation. > It seems like most of us (including LSJ) use "the ready region" > (implying a single region) and "your ready region" (implying more than > one) interchangably. So, which should it be (and can we use > consistent language????) The terms appropriate to the concept being used is used. -- That is my story, be it bitter or be it sweet. Keep a little and let a little come back to me. LSJ (vtesr...@TRAPwhite-wolf.com) V:TES Net.Rep (remove spam trap to reply) http://www.white-wolf.com/vtes/

I don't see why player A should discard down to 4 cards, let me explain: When player B takes control of Beckett player A finds himself with 12 cards in his hand and only a handsize of 7 (as the gehenna cards don't changes the hand size) he then have to discard down to 7 cards??

[ quoted text not captured ] The cards a player is not replacing count against her hand size (otherwsie, she'd draw up to replace them). So A's effective hand size is 4.

Well, because the discard has to do with controlling Beckett and the number of Gehenna cards in play, not with the do not replace effect of the Gehenna cards. You get "+X hand size, where X is the number of Gehenna cards in play" if you control Advanced Beckett. What I don't get is why player A would have to discard the 8 cards? Quoting LSJ: >> There was some discussion about the nature of "the ready region" - is >> there one ready region, or one for each player? > Both. I imagine "the ready region" as one big region subdivided into several "your ready region"s for each of the 5 players. If this is the case, then Beckett has left "Player A's ready region" but not "the ready region" so player A really shouldn't discard his increased hand size due to Beckett's effect?

Antonio Touriño wrote: > Well, because the discard has to do with controlling Beckett and the > number of Gehenna cards in play, not with the do not replace effect of > the Gehenna cards. You get "+X hand size, where X is the number of > Gehenna cards in play" if you control Advanced Beckett. > > What I don't get is why player A would have to discard the 8 cards? Because A no longer controls Beckett, so doesn't get the +8 hand size modifier. He had 7 + 8 - 3 = 12 cards. He lost control of Beckett, and therefore has an effective hand size of 7 - 3 = 4 cards. He discards down to 4. > Quoting LSJ: > >> There was some discussion about the nature of "the ready region" - is > >> there one ready region, or one for each player? > > Both. > > I imagine "the ready region" as one big region subdivided into several > "your ready region"s for each of the 5 players. If this is the case, > then Beckett has left "Player A's ready region" but not "the ready > region" so player A really shouldn't discard his increased hand size > due to Beckett's effect? He's not "discarding his whole hand", which he would do if Beckett was burned. But he doesn't get Beckett's hand size bonus any more, since he no longer controls Beckett.